Westchester Community College issues-

Those who are saying that SJU can't possibly be blamed for this aren't looking at the full situation.
We don't know to what degree Thomas's transcript was tampered with. But in the case of Jamell Walker, one of the kids at Florida A&M, they forged a whole transcript. He took 1 class the whole time he was at WCC, and they said he graduated with an associates degree!

If it's that type of situation with Keith, then you're damn right its the staff's fault. Not the compliance office, but the coaches. You cannot possibly recruit a player for 6+ months, speak to the people around him, talk to his coaches and family, and not know that the guy isn't taking any classes.
I would buy it if the assistant coach changed an F in World Civ to a B, to pass the kid through the clearinghouse. There's no way SJU could know that.
But if he's like Walker, and wasn't taking classes the whole time he was in community college, then the SJU coaches needed to see that, regardless of what they were being told.
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And how are the coaches supposed to know this? When they sit down with coaches or administrators at WCC do you think Lavin asks about his transcript and how classes have been going for Thomas and they reply, "Well we've actually been forging all of this and he has never stepped foot in a classroom." Are we supposed to hire PI's for every recruitment to make sure we aren't dealing with crooks like these at every turn?
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At some point, you ask him what classes he's taking?! How they are going, and what he wants to major in! etc. If you're recruiting a kid you should be able to tell he's at least enrolled in classes at his school! If he was skipping classes occasionally or getting special help, then I'd agree. It's hard for SJU to know that. But being registered for 1 class his entire two years at WCC??
If that's what happened to Keith, like it did with Walker, then you're damn right the staff at SJU should've had a wiff of what was going on.
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I am at the point of sitting at my desk laughing when thinking about this. We can disagree on if the staff is at all culpable but man we must have the crummiest luck. Here I am talking to some casual fans last week about a kid who had 30 rebounds in 2 or 3 games last year at CC and how pumped I am to see a glass eater on the team.. OF COURSE...he went to some chop shop program.
 
I am confused by Lavin's comments below. Why are we providing moral support to Thomas? Is he saying that Thomas is being treated unfairly here?

QUEENS, N.Y. (Oct. 29, 2014) - Keith Thomas has been ruled academically ineligible to compete for the St. John's men's basketball team during the 2014-15 season. The University has learned that Thomas does not meet the academic standards required by the NCAA for transfers.

"Academic integrity is treated very seriously at St. John's University and we are committed to maintaining high academic standards for all of our student-athletes," said Director of Athletics Chris Monasch. "Our athletic compliance office recently became aware of information that triggered an additional review of Thomas' academic credentials at Westchester Community College. Our assessment and decision are in accordance with University and NCAA policies."

"We share Keith's disappointment and as a basketball family will provide moral support during this challenging time in his life. Keith clearly has a bright future in basketball and is determined to ultimately further his education," said head coach Steve Lavin.

Thomas was a 2013-14 NJCAA All-American honorable mention at Westchester Community College. The 6-foot-8 forward from Mount Vernon, N.Y. led all Division I junior college players with 15.7 rebounds per game and averaged 15.3 points in 32 appearances.
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Moral support bc he was about to play for a big-time program and almost got away with it.. In all seriousness though I want to know the details before I indict KT. For all we know he may have gone to 3-4 classes and thought he was doing enough.
 
I am confused by Lavin's comments below. Why are we providing moral support to Thomas? Is he saying that Thomas is being treated unfairly here?

QUEENS, N.Y. (Oct. 29, 2014) - Keith Thomas has been ruled academically ineligible to compete for the St. John's men's basketball team during the 2014-15 season. The University has learned that Thomas does not meet the academic standards required by the NCAA for transfers.

"Academic integrity is treated very seriously at St. John's University and we are committed to maintaining high academic standards for all of our student-athletes," said Director of Athletics Chris Monasch. "Our athletic compliance office recently became aware of information that triggered an additional review of Thomas' academic credentials at Westchester Community College. Our assessment and decision are in accordance with University and NCAA policies."

"We share Keith's disappointment and as a basketball family will provide moral support during this challenging time in his life. Keith clearly has a bright future in basketball and is determined to ultimately further his education," said head coach Steve Lavin.

Thomas was a 2013-14 NJCAA All-American honorable mention at Westchester Community College. The 6-foot-8 forward from Mount Vernon, N.Y. led all Division I junior college players with 15.7 rebounds per game and averaged 15.3 points in 32 appearances.
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Its Lavin-speak, I wouldn't read in to it to much.
 
It took the program 24-36 hrs to investigate and declare Thomas academically ineligible - clearly an arduous, almost impossible task to perform, say, last spring.
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Unless there were red flags-I have no idea if there were or weren't-why would they investigate?
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When you run a program that has already been rocked by last-minute eligibility issues and you recruit a kid with a checkered past, you best make sure that there is not so much as a hair out of place with this player, his transcript or the program he's coming from.
 
It took the program 24-36 hrs to investigate and declare Thomas academically ineligible - clearly an arduous, almost impossible task to perform, say, last spring.
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Unless there were red flags-I have no idea if there were or weren't-why would they investigate?
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When you run a program that has already been rocked by last-minute eligibility issues and you recruit a kid with a checkered past, you best make sure that there is not so much as a do as a hair out of place with this player, his transcript or the program that he's coming from.
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Not if you desperately need the kid you don't
 
It took the program 24-36 hrs to investigate and declare Thomas academically ineligible - clearly an arduous, almost impossible task to perform, say, last spring.
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Unless there were red flags-I have no idea if there were or weren't-why would they investigate?
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When you run a program that has already been rocked by last-minute eligibility issues and you recruit a kid with a checkered past, you best make sure that there is not so much as a hair out of place with this player, his transcript or the program he's coming from.
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FWIW I agree that they should have for all of the reasons that you mention, but its clear why they didn't: No other options.
 
1. Now there's more playing time next year to offer to Diallo.
2. Stop recruiting Montero........save your resources for other players.
 
1. Now there's more playing time next year to offer to Diallo.
2. Stop recruiting Montero........save your resources for other players.
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Montero's eligibility status will become common knowledge very soon, if it hasn't already.
 
If you are going to offer someone a schloarship, esp someone with a checkered past, wouldnt you check this stuff out ahead of time? Just a horrible job by STJ . Horrible.
 
I like how innocuous this sounded 4 days ago. Next thing you know our starting PF is ineligible. One thing I'll say against the staff is that if it was so apparent he was a non-qualifier(which it was if it took this little time to rule him out), then it shouldn't have been THAT difficult to sniff around and realize this was a rotten apple.
 
I like how innocuous this sounded 4 days ago. Next thing you know our starting PF is ineligible. One thing I'll say against the staff is that if it was so apparent he was a non-qualifier(which it was if it took this little time to rule him out), then it shouldn't have been THAT difficult to sniff around and realize this was a rotten apple.
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It's such a bad job that's it's almost commical. What a jo ke . Typical STJ, it's impossible to even think that they wouldnt check this stuff out ahead of time. I'm furious.
 
I like how innocuous this sounded 4 days ago. Next thing you know our starting PF is ineligible. One thing I'll say against the staff is that if it was so apparent he was a non-qualifier(which it was if it took this little time to rule him out), then it shouldn't have been THAT difficult to sniff around and realize this was a rotten apple.
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It's such a bad job that's it's almost commical. What a jo ke . Typical STJ, it's impossible to even think that they wouldnt check this stuff out ahead of time. I'm furious.
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It's not almost comical, it IS comical. I was saying 20 mins ago that I'm laughing at my desk, mostly a nervy laugh bc I could see where this was heading. And wouldn't you know, 1 min after I post, word comes down that he is out.
 
I like how innocuous this sounded 4 days ago. Next thing you know our starting PF is ineligible. One thing I'll say against the staff is that if it was so apparent he was a non-qualifier(which it was if it took this little time to rule him out), then it shouldn't have been THAT difficult to sniff around and realize this was a rotten apple.
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It's such a bad job that's it's almost commical. What a jo ke . Typical STJ, it's impossible to even think that they wouldnt check this stuff out ahead of time. I'm furious.
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It's not almost comical, it IS comical. I was saying 20 mins ago that I'm laughing at my desk, mostly a nervy laugh bc I could see where this was heading. And wouldn't you know, 1 min after I post, word comes down that he is out.
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Other fans, and other schools must sit back and say- Wow things could be worse, we could be STJ.
 
For those of you that don't want to take chances like this in recruiting, I say: We had 6 years like that with Norm Roberts. The only players he recruited that were academic issues were Kitchen (and I believe his issues started after he enrolled here), and Thomas (which, the knee injury hurt more then the year he sat out). Yet, we all complained about us not being in on any of the big boys, with Harrington only being concerned with running a clean program and nothing more, etc.

It's been my feeling for a few years now, that we can not both "play it clean" and "win." So, it's time for us as fans to decide what we want. Do we want to take risks and try to win, or play it safe, and always be a middling program? I choose to take the risks, but I understand those who feel the other way. Don't think we can have both, though.
 
I don't know why this would surprise anyone given our head recruiter's track record of bringing in players who turn out to have eligibility issues (or other issues that result in early departures).
 
@zsmart3: source says bc NJCAA rules, Thomas still has eligibility for another year at Westchester. 2 years NAIA and 1 year div.1.

@zsmart3: b/che was granted Hardship after suffering broken hand as a freshman, Thomas still has one year of eligibility remaining. Can return 2 WCC
 
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