SJU Transfer Targets/Possibilities

[Moose]

Everyone who is on board the Aidan train. Check out some YouTube clips of him. Lot of interviews with him on the Overtime channel there. He says multiple times he's a stretch 4 or 3. So for those clammoring for a big man not sure he feels that's where he wants to be on the court. 

Maybe he needs to change his stance. Maybe Mack didn't want him at 3/4. Clips are clips but he always looked overpowering and explosive but still seemed smooth. 

 

[gman]

I am really curious as to why some on here want the staff to go after Igiehon?

If it was posted that CMA and staff were going after a transfer who played 18 college games, averaging 1.8 pts and 1.4 rebs, this board would be going crazy. What is the fascination with Igiehon, is it his high school ranking? I am not being funny, I just don't understand it.




 

Sterling, I get your point, but if staff chooses to perform diligence on him, should we not trust them? Many here extol staff’s ability to recognize potential. Perhaps they’ll pass, but if they pursue him I am ok with that.

I'd feel better if he was an under the radar HS kid.  The staff hasn't done well so far with Jucos and transfers. 

With that said, injuries seemed to have hurt his development.  If he is healthy I don't have an issue with it.  He isn't a true 4/5, but we have done fine with those hybrid 3/4s in the past.

 

[MCNPA]

I’d really prefer a true 5 offensively. Doesn’t have to be a plodder at 7’2”, but a guy like Nate Watson who really gets it done down low.  It’s time we had a guy who has some offense in the post.  It’s what I’d prefer to see here at sju.  

 

[monte]

I never understood the "don't you trust the staff???" mindset when it comes to recruiting. Of course we all trust the staff, but that doesn't mean we're not all entitled to our own opinions about recruits. Especially when the opinion is based on actually seeing the kid play, as Panther has. I'd venture a guess that Panther has seen more high school talent play then CMA or anyone on the staff has, so as far as I'm concerned he's at least as qualified as they are to have a valid opinion on the talent level of these kids. Maybe even more so. In addition, none of this is an exact science. I'm still not convinced that this staff has any more of a good eye for talent then any other good staff. They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. Same as any other staff. So, I for one don't subscribe blindly to "well if he's good enough for the staff....". Having said all that, if the staff feels that Aiden can add some valuable minutes off the bench, and can develop over the next few years, then I'm fine with them kicking the tires on him. Keeping in mind, as Panther and others have said, that at this point he doesn't seem to be the answer to our low post problems. 

 

[Amaseinyourface]

I never understood the "don't you trust the staff???" mindset when it comes to recruiting. Of course we all trust the staff, but that doesn't mean we're not all entitled to our own opinions about recruits. Especially when the opinion is based on actually seeing the kid play, as Panther has. I'd venture a guess that Panther has seen more high school talent play then CMA or anyone on the staff has, so as far as I'm concerned he's at least as qualified as they are to have a valid opinion on the talent level of these kids. Maybe even more so. In addition, none of this is an exact science. I'm still not convinced that this staff has any more of a good eye for talent then any other good staff. They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. Same as any other staff. So, I for one don't subscribe blindly to "well if he's good enough for the staff....". Having said all that, if the staff feels that Aiden can add some valuable minutes off the bench, and can develop over the next few years, then I'm fine with them kicking the tires on him. Keeping in mind, as Panther and others have said, that at this point he doesn't seem to be the answer to our low post problems. 

Pretty much agree but a big difference is you, me, or Panther’s job isn’t on the line when it comes to evaluating.

 

[monte]

I never understood the "don't you trust the staff???" mindset when it comes to recruiting. Of course we all trust the staff, but that doesn't mean we're not all entitled to our own opinions about recruits. Especially when the opinion is based on actually seeing the kid play, as Panther has. I'd venture a guess that Panther has seen more high school talent play then CMA or anyone on the staff has, so as far as I'm concerned he's at least as qualified as they are to have a valid opinion on the talent level of these kids. Maybe even more so. In addition, none of this is an exact science. I'm still not convinced that this staff has any more of a good eye for talent then any other good staff. They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. Same as any other staff. So, I for one don't subscribe blindly to "well if he's good enough for the staff....". Having said all that, if the staff feels that Aiden can add some valuable minutes off the bench, and can develop over the next few years, then I'm fine with them kicking the tires on him. Keeping in mind, as Panther and others have said, that at this point he doesn't seem to be the answer to our low post problems. 

Pretty much agree but a big difference is you, me, or Panther’s job isn’t on the line when it comes to evaluating.


Agreed, but that doesn't mean that we're not all entitled to opinions. Opinions which are sometimes contrary to what the staff thinks, and sometimes correct. 
 

 

[lawmanfan]

 Agreed, but that doesn't mean that we're not all entitled to opinions. Opinions which are sometimes contrary to what the staff thinks, and sometimes correct. 
 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_Expertise
 

 

[MainMan]

 They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. 

"Some hits" include two possible first-team ALL BE players next year including the leading candidate for POY - neither of whom were blue-chip recruits. 
So despite Toro, I'm more than cool with their talent eval. 

 

[panther2]

I never understood the "don't you trust the staff???" mindset when it comes to recruiting. Of course we all trust the staff, but that doesn't mean we're not all entitled to our own opinions about recruits. Especially when the opinion is based on actually seeing the kid play, as Panther has. I'd venture a guess that Panther has seen more high school talent play then CMA or anyone on the staff has, so as far as I'm concerned he's at least as qualified as they are to have a valid opinion on the talent level of these kids. Maybe even more so. In addition, none of this is an exact science. I'm still not convinced that this staff has any more of a good eye for talent then any other good staff. They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. Same as any other staff. So, I for one don't subscribe blindly to "well if he's good enough for the staff....". Having said all that, if the staff feels that Aiden can add some valuable minutes off the bench, and can develop over the next few years, then I'm fine with them kicking the tires on him. Keeping in mind, as Panther and others have said, that at this point he doesn't seem to be the answer to our low post problems. 
 

Monte, one thing I will say is that before the Pandemic, every game that I went to, Coach Anderson or a member of his staff was there. They have been very diligent in their recruiting. I was not questioning the staff at all. I don't even know if they are interested in Igiehon. My point was that some posters are still talking about Igiehon as if he is a top 50 recruit. The last time I saw him play in person, was a game at Xavier when Mullin was still our coach. He did not impress me. Unlike Julian, nothing that he has done in the past two years has changed my opinion.

Again, my original response had absolutely nothing to do with our staff, all of whom I respect. They have built a foundation for St Johns basketball and I believe that under the guidance of Coach Anderson, we will continue to get better.

 

[beast of the east]

Everyone who is on board the Aidan train. Check out some YouTube clips of him. Lot of interviews with him on the Overtime channel there. He says multiple times he's a stretch 4 or 3. So for those clammoring for a big man not sure he feels that's where he wants to be on the court. 

Maybe he needs to change his stance. Maybe Mack didn't want him at 3/4. Clips are clips but he always looked overpowering and explosive but still seemed smooth. 

I once read Bobby Knight's position on coaching, that it is the coach's job to put players on the floor in places where they will be successful.   It's subject to broad interpretation, but because Mack has had success may not mean he really understands that.

So much of basketball success is above the neck.  Sometimes a change of scenery, especially a new coach, can do wonders for a kid.   I'm pretty confident that not many coaches would have gotten the productivity out of Earlington that we've seen, or Caraher in 2019-20 at this level.   Most kids have got to know a coach has full confidence in him in order for him to perform at a high level.  Anderson seems to have done that here, and perhaps if Aidan's problem isn't an inherent lack of ability, he may do better here.

That being said, listening to staff during this past season's chalktalks, they have a great idea of the type of players they are looking for.   I'm not sure Aidan would fit the bill or not.   Would leave it up to them to pursue if they felt it could be a win here.

One thing is for certain - our roster needs improvement.   

 

[lawmanfan]

Not going to repost my long-ish early-season post on this, but suffice it to say that there is just a fundamental difference between someone who does this for a living and whose job depends on it and someone who's a fan of the game.  And that's especially true when the person who does it for a living has actually been pretty darn good at it for a long, long time. 

Another relevant point is that the job of player evaluation is not only to see what is there to be seen, but to see what could come to be with proper development.  In our house you can look at Julian (3 star) and Wusu (2 star) for examples.  You can also look around the country (specifically at bigs) for other players who the fans were not excited about but gee whiz after 4 years turned into something (Moses Wright, Mamu, Nate Watson, Theo John, Tyrique Evans - the list goes on). 

No coach is going to bat 1.000 on every recruit, and that's especially true when you are in the early stages of a program and you have to reach a bit to fill some holes.  But until proven otherwise, I'll trust the staff's judgment on recruiting and figure that 95% of what goes on here is just background noise.

 

[beast of the east]

Not going to repost my long-ish early-season post on this, but suffice it to say that there is just a fundamental difference between someone who does this for a living and whose job depends on it and someone who's a fan of the game.  And that's especially true when the person who does it for a living has actually been pretty darn good at it for a long, long time. 

Another relevant point is that the job of player evaluation is not only to see what is there to be seen, but to see what could come to be with proper development.  In our house you can look at Julian (3 star) and Wusu (2 star) for examples.  You can also look around the country (specifically at bigs) for other players who the fans were not excited about but gee whiz after 4 years turned into something (Moses Wright, Mamu, Nate Watson, Theo John, Tyrique Evans - the list goes on). 

No coach is going to bat 1.000 on every recruit, and that's especially true when you are in the early stages of a program and you have to reach a bit to fill some holes.  But until proven otherwise, I'll trust the staff's judgment on recruiting and figure that 95% of what goes on here is just background noise.

It also depends a lot on the situation a player is in.    Julian is really developing into something special, but if he played for Villanova, he likely would not have started as a freshman and blossomed as a sophomore.   Obviously could have thrived there, but the situation was right for him.   Same with Posh.     We are in such dire need of talented bigs, that a player who is currently not getting an opportunity to be a top 3 player on another roster, could potentially come here and transform our team.

Agree that people who do this for a living eat and breathe this stuff on a high level 24/7.   As a fan, it's easier to watch and listen and enjoy, and maybe even learn a little along the way. 

 

[Amaseinyourface]

 They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. 

"Some hits" include two possible first-team ALL BE players next year including the leading candidate for POY - neither of whom were blue-chip recruits. 
So despite Toro, I'm more than cool with their talent eval. 

This might sound like excuses, but I look at his “misses” a little differently. Toro was a one year investment late in the recruiting game to fill a need. Didn’t hit, but I don’t necessarily knock him for it. Same with Sears the year before- spring hire and needed to fill holes, no real commitment or downside. Again he didn’t hit be we “washed our hands”’so to speak. Mggriff was a late signee and was one of the only point guards available to a team who needed a point guard. I can totally understand why he brought him in, and either way, labeling him a miss at this point might be premature.

I say all that to explain why I am very excited about Omar Stanley. Unlike Toro and Sears, Stanley is a four year investment. And CMA chose to fill his last available scholarship with a low ranked player who’s not in our backyard. That right there tells me how confident he must be in his evaluation of him.

 

[paultzman]

Not going to repost my long-ish early-season post on this, but suffice it to say that there is just a fundamental difference between someone who does this for a living and whose job depends on it and someone who's a fan of the game.  And that's especially true when the person who does it for a living has actually been pretty darn good at it for a long, long time. 

Another relevant point is that the job of player evaluation is not only to see what is there to be seen, but to see what could come to be with proper development.  In our house you can look at Julian (3 star) and Wusu (2 star) for examples.  You can also look around the country (specifically at bigs) for other players who the fans were not excited about but gee whiz after 4 years turned into something (Moses Wright, Mamu, Nate Watson, Theo John, Tyrique Evans - the list goes on). 

No coach is going to bat 1.000 on every recruit, and that's especially true when you are in the early stages of a program and you have to reach a bit to fill some holes.  But until proven otherwise, I'll trust the staff's judgment on recruiting and figure that 95% of what goes on here is just background noise.

 

Of course we are all entitled to express opinions on a fan board and  God knows I express mine. I know Panther a fair amount of time and certainly respect his expertise. It is clear that Aiden I merits vetting and Panther may very well be right on this one. That said, I also have great faith in Van judging recruits’  fit and upside and support his and CMA’s ultimate decision. This is not blind faith. I have only seen Aidan several times on line in games, so really have no strong opinion either way. I thus choose to let staff make their best judgment. If they are wrong, so be it.

 

[paultzman]

https://twitter.com/verbalcommits/status/1372586427502968837?s=21

 

[monte]

I never understood the "don't you trust the staff???" mindset when it comes to recruiting. Of course we all trust the staff, but that doesn't mean we're not all entitled to our own opinions about recruits. Especially when the opinion is based on actually seeing the kid play, as Panther has. I'd venture a guess that Panther has seen more high school talent play then CMA or anyone on the staff has, so as far as I'm concerned he's at least as qualified as they are to have a valid opinion on the talent level of these kids. Maybe even more so. In addition, none of this is an exact science. I'm still not convinced that this staff has any more of a good eye for talent then any other good staff. They've had some  hits, but they've also had some misses. Same as any other staff. So, I for one don't subscribe blindly to "well if he's good enough for the staff....". Having said all that, if the staff feels that Aiden can add some valuable minutes off the bench, and can develop over the next few years, then I'm fine with them kicking the tires on him. Keeping in mind, as Panther and others have said, that at this point he doesn't seem to be the answer to our low post problems. 


 

Monte, one thing I will say is that before the Pandemic, every game that I went to, Coach Anderson or a member of his staff was there. They have been very diligent in their recruiting. I was not questioning the staff at all. I don't even know if they are interested in Igiehon. My point was that some posters are still talking about Igiehon as if he is a top 50 recruit. The last time I saw him play in person, was a game at Xavier when Mullin was still our coach. He did not impress me. Unlike Julian, nothing that he has done in the past two years has changed my opinion.

Again, my original response had absolutely nothing to do with our staff, all of whom I respect. They have built a foundation for St Johns basketball and I believe that under the guidance of Coach Anderson, we will continue to get better.

I did not mean to make it sound like I was questioning the staff's work ethic or eye for talent. Both have been exemplary. But again, it's not an exact science and you and others may see something that the staff does not see, for better or worse.  We've all seen kids who get passed over by a lot high level schools with great coaches, that one coach may feel differently about and be willing to take a chance on. Of course both Champagnies  come to mind, but there are countless others. Not going to go down my long list of ex players who I did not think could play at this level, and who I was correct about. I also completely missed the boat on Ponds and Alvarado, to name  two, both of whom I watched in HS and both of whom far exceeded my expectations. I trust the staff, but that doesn't mean that we're all not entitled to our opinion about kids. 

 

[fuchsia]

When was the last time we had a big who was enough of a low post offensive threat and physically solid to the point that we knew opposing bigs were going to be dead tired from fighting for position at the end of the game and our other players could exploit that fatigue?

 

[IDRAFT]

When was the last time we had a big who was enough of a low post offensive threat and physically solid to the point that we knew opposing bigs were going to be dead tired from fighting for position at the end of the game and our other players could exploit that fatigue?

Bob Zawoluk?
 

 

[lawmanfan]

Not going to repost my long-ish early-season post on this, but suffice it to say that there is just a fundamental difference between someone who does this for a living and whose job depends on it and someone who's a fan of the game.  And that's especially true when the person who does it for a living has actually been pretty darn good at it for a long, long time. 

Another relevant point is that the job of player evaluation is not only to see what is there to be seen, but to see what could come to be with proper development.  In our house you can look at Julian (3 star) and Wusu (2 star) for examples.  You can also look around the country (specifically at bigs) for other players who the fans were not excited about but gee whiz after 4 years turned into something (Moses Wright, Mamu, Nate Watson, Theo John, Tyrique Evans - the list goes on). 

No coach is going to bat 1.000 on every recruit, and that's especially true when you are in the early stages of a program and you have to reach a bit to fill some holes.  But until proven otherwise, I'll trust the staff's judgment on recruiting and figure that 95% of what goes on here is just background noise.


 

Of course we are all entitled to express opinions on a fan board and  God knows I express mine. I know Panther a fair amount of time and certainly respect his expertise. It is clear that Aiden I merits vetting and Panther may very well be right on this one. That said, I also have great faith in Van judging recruits’  fit and upside and support his and CMA’s ultimate decision. This is not blind faith. I have only seen Aidan several times on line in games, so really have no strong opinion either way. I thus choose to let staff make their best judgment. If they are wrong, so be it.



 

 

[lawmanfan]

Paultz I agree 100%. There would be little point to the site if not as a place for people to share their info and opinions.

Also, in case there's any question, my post was most certainly not intended as a shot at Panther, who has valuable insight that most of us (including me) do not.  

OTOH not all opinions are created equal and most certainly the same ones don't need to be shared over and over again (or overshared if you prefer).