Nuri Leaving

 New updates:

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/basketball/lindsey_leaves_sju_Eh6MNi5yITSPyOad2EmzuL


“What I said to the team today at practice is that when you’re playing with a short bench you have to play smarter because the margin for error is that much finer,’’ Lavin told The Post. “Obviously we were already thin.


Lavin said the remaining players “missed their teammate and their friend,’’ but went through a workmanlike practice.
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Who is Robbins to say he was the second-most talented player on the team? What kind of writer says that.
 
 New updates:

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/college/basketball/lindsey_leaves_sju_Eh6MNi5yITSPyOad2EmzuL


“What I said to the team today at practice is that when you’re playing with a short bench you have to play smarter because the margin for error is that much finer,’’ Lavin told The Post. “Obviously we were already thin.


Lavin said the remaining players “missed their teammate and their friend,’’ but went through a workmanlike practice.
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Who is Robbins to say he was the second-most talented player on the team? What kind of writer says that.
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He also wrote that Lindsey was the team's leading scorer. Does he actually believe what he types?
 
Maybe Dunlap doesn't have the chops to be anything but a top assistant. Today you have to cater to gigantic egos to kids who have never been subject to any form of discipline their entire lives. Lavin seemed to elevate the confidence of last year's group.

Lindsay bagging it after 9 games is crazy. I couldn't see him doing that if Lavin were here. 
 
Maybe Dunlap doesn't have the chops to be anything but a top assistant. Today you have to cater to gigantic egos to kids who have never been subject to any form of discipline their entire lives. Lavin seemed to elevate the confidence of last year's group.

Lindsay bagging it after 9 games is crazy. I couldn't see him doing that if Lavin were here. 
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I agree, I also don't think they lose the N'Eastern or Detroit games with Lav on the sidelines.
 
One positive in all of this - the scholly chart should be able to be balanced out much quicker. That will help 3-4 years down the line. Most of us know this, but I want it out there to get one good outcome posted on our Eeyore thread.
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How does this help balance out the schollie situation-we had 4 fr 1 soph and 2 jr and Nuri was our only soph? :unsure:  
 
Maybe Dunlap doesn't have the chops to be anything but a top assistant. Today you have to cater to gigantic egos to kids who have never been subject to any form of discipline their entire lives. Lavin seemed to elevate the confidence of last year's group.

Lindsay bagging it after 9 games is crazy. I couldn't see him doing that if Lavin were here. 
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Anyone who has spent time coaching in the NBA at any level I'm sure has been exposed to dealing with gigantic egos. Then again as an NBA assistant, his biggest job was probably checking handgun licenses at the door.
 
Maybe Dunlap doesn't have the chops to be anything but a top assistant. Today you have to cater to gigantic egos to kids who have never been subject to any form of discipline their entire lives. Lavin seemed to elevate the confidence of last year's group.

Lindsay bagging it after 9 games is crazy. I couldn't see him doing that if Lavin were here. 
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Anyone who has spent time coaching in the NBA at any level I'm sure has been exposed to dealing with gigantic egos. Then again as an NBA assistant, his biggest job was probably checking handgun licenses at the door.
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:pinch: shots fired. no pun intended
 
Sorry about that Moose, I knew one of them was a surprise. I also never realized they were all together. Could you elaborate on why you think all 3 of them going to the same place was bad? I mean I can infer obvious reasons, but I don't know enough about this.

I also love Lavin. I wanted him to be our coach and I think hes the best. He is perfect for NYC and this school. I just have a lot of questions about the rest of the staff. It seems all they have done is prohibited us from getting some recruits bc of HS ties, and not done a great job recruiting. Without Lavin they don't seem to have any clue what is going on.

I will try and find LJSA's earlier post. 
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Your pretty much inviting the NCAA to look at the 3 kids when they are all in the same place. It just was not smart at all. No way to slice it.
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Why?
 
Cappy and others said it well - things are not bleak; most schools have transfers and issues;

We should not ebb and flow emotionally and so easily; reality = this is a period of transition and with it comes confusion, disappointment, unexpected stuff;

There is so much good stuff going on in this process (e.g. process means taking time) why add so much negativity adn negative speculation.

The kids still here are talented; similar ones will join them; we will be very competitive over the next few years BUT this year, after the predicament Lavin was put in (having to recuirt so many so soon and re-establish goodwill ties), give all of us a break.

all the best
 
 Lindsey had it in his mind that he would spend one year here and then leave for the NBA. That was all the talk before hand and Lindsey pretty much confirmed it. He proclaimed himself on his twitter as SJU's starting PG long before he even got here. Once he got, he started realizing he wasn't George Gervin and that the refs werent going to treat him like it was street ball. Other schools wised-up because he really can drive to the hoop and they closed down his lanes after a game or two and he was rendered totally ineffective.

What we were left with is a shooting guard that shoots like Chris Dudley at the line and from he outside. Lindsey subsequently lost minutes to Phil Greene who wasnt turning the ball over, has a nice jumper and wasn't handing opposing teams 12 points In fast-breaks on terrible turnovers and walks every game.

I think Nuri had the ability to be quite good, but the gap between how good he is right now and how good he thinks he is, is like the grand canyon. Nuri needs 2-3 years here before even considering a jump to the NBA. He subsequently blames everybody including Dunlap, Lavin's absence and the coaching being "too robotic" as to why he isnt as good as he thinks he is.

The kid doesn't want to learn how to play real ball like footwork, shooting-form, defense. He thinks he was born-ready ala Lenny Cooke and we know how that worked out. Fwiw, I saw a LOT of Lenny Cooke in HS as well as a lot of other players like DeMarr Johnson, Korleone Young and scores of others twice as good as Nuri that didn't make the league. Heck, Dwight Hardy and Marcus Hatten aren't in the NBA and are light years ahead of Nuri.

Bottom line is that the kid is delusional and chose to abandon his team putting himself ahead of everything. Sad part about it is that he's just another dope with some fools in his ear who is doing himself a massive disservice by choosing to leave because he was actually learning how tough D1 ball is and how much work he needs to do to be a pro.

Tired of kid's like this. I don't think he deserves a "free pass" here on the boards. He deserves all the criticism he gets. His past tragedies have nothing to do with the dumb and selfish choices he's making now. Good for Phil Greene though. He's already better than Lindsey and will get exponentially better with this season under his belt as our starting PG.

Lavin needs to get back in the office soon though and right this ship. We have a bright future, but we need a BIG recruiting haul this 2012 class and we're waaaay behind the 8-ball with Lindsey now leaving. We need at least 2 big men and 2 guards if not 1 or 2 more, and we only have one wing on board. Need Lavin back with his health questions behind him otherwise it will be a ton harder. Recruits need to know he's 100% and ready to roll. It's THE most important thing right now. I know he needs some time to recover, and I'm a clinician so I know fully how these things work. If he doesn't truly have complications and it is a stamina issue, he needs to come back sooner rather than later. The team is struggling without him, and the 2012 recruiting class has no chance unless he comes back to full strength and soon. Need to bring guys like Gathers back in the fold and may be at risk of losing other kids if it is viewed that our coach is not going to be here in full capacity.

P.S. moose, it's no secret that you're talking about Tony Chiles. He was the Nuri guy and I'm assuming th Rise guy. How about a swap for Barry Rohrrsen? ;-)     
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COMPLETELY agree with MCNPA's post. You hit it right on the money.
2012 needs to be a monster recruiting haul, and the one way we ensure that happens - and consequently that the program gets back on track - is if Lavin is back and going 100%.


I also think you and Moose are right re: Chiles.
 
Why be negative? Because in less than 4 months, the wheels have fallen off this season. Three ineligibles, two of which de-committed, and the third with a pro baseball contract. My fear is that if Garrett doesn't play this season, then goes out and shows great promise in his first minor league, there will be great pressure on him to give up basketball, and he probably will.

Then a guy that we were ravings about a couple of weeks ago quits before we even get to the Big East Schedule. Lavin may not be back anytime soon, and the team is disgruntled and short handed.

Oh yea, and we overcharge for on campus refreshments during games.

Cappy and others said it well - things are not bleak; most schools have transfers and issues;

We should not ebb and flow emotionally and so easily; reality = this is a period of transition and with it comes confusion, disappointment, unexpected stuff;

There is so much good stuff going on in this process (e.g. process means taking time) why add so much negativity adn negative speculation.

The kids still here are talented; similar ones will join them; we will be very competitive over the next few years BUT this year, after the predicament Lavin was put in (having to recuirt so many so soon and re-establish goodwill ties), give all of us a break.

all the best
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Sorry about that Moose, I knew one of them was a surprise. I also never realized they were all together. Could you elaborate on why you think all 3 of them going to the same place was bad? I mean I can infer obvious reasons, but I don't know enough about this.

I also love Lavin. I wanted him to be our coach and I think hes the best. He is perfect for NYC and this school. I just have a lot of questions about the rest of the staff. It seems all they have done is prohibited us from getting some recruits bc of HS ties, and not done a great job recruiting. Without Lavin they don't seem to have any clue what is going on.

I will try and find LJSA's earlier post. 
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Your pretty much inviting the NCAA to look at the 3 kids when they are all in the same place. It just was not smart at all. No way to slice it.
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Why?
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I know why you do it to keep them close but also there are tons of schools in the area to pick from. You send them all to 1 school where there are just 5 kids in the class and 3 are trying to get eligible who are all from different places- CA, NV, and OH and they all get straight A's? Just seems too perfect. I would have split them up.

I know you mentioned that this was the first time RISE players were rejected. But exactly what players have gone thru there that are noteworthy? When I first heard of RISE I googled it and if anything there were some questionable things from years ago during the NCAA crackdown on diploma mills. 

Also remember the Pelle interview with Zags from the Summer? Pelle had no clue what he was taking classes for. That didn't give me the warm and fuzzies.
 
Thanks guys. I knew Pelle was in Philly, I didn't realize Sampson and Amir were. I thought they were on campus? I knew Pelle and Amir were academic questions long before summer, but I had thought Sampson was a bit if a surprise, no? Either way, things look bad.

Moose, would you care to elaborate on the connection between Nuri and the Rise 'scandal' or is it just people trying to blame our staff for more things? As someone who doesn't know the inner workings of the program, Coach Lavin has made us a national figure and brought attention back into our program. The guys is recovering from cancer, and it is insane to expect him to put SJU bball over his life. It is unfortunate that kids feel that way. Lavin isnt going anywhere so idk how kids for the future or kids already here are judging on him missing time now.

I would be really curious to know the others take, ie, Moe, Sir'Dom etc. It has to be frustrating that they came in with all these expectations of what would happen and its been everything but. I feel bad for those guys since they have done eevrything asked of them and all could have played anywhere they wanted.

I am also curious as to Lavin's take. I trust Lavin, (the staff idk about). The staff has not proved themselves to me really.
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And in only one short year SJU is once again the laughingstock of the BE. Tough to blame this one on Roberts with the way Lavin chased players like Lawrence and Q (and who knows about Polee) we could have used out and wound up with barely a half a team. Frankly if he weren't sick I'd be calling for somebody new. Another year of season tickets down the tubes. I'm just so sick of this crap........
 
Why be negative? Because in less than 4 months, the wheels have fallen off this season. Three ineligibles, two of which de-committed, and the third with a pro baseball contract. My fear is that if Garrett doesn't play this season, then goes out and shows great promise in his first minor league, there will be great pressure on him to give up basketball, and he probably will.

Then a guy that we were ravings about a couple of weeks ago quits before we even get to the Big East Schedule. Lavin may not be back anytime soon, and the team is disgruntled and short handed.

Oh yea, and we overcharge for on campus refreshments during games.

 
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The wheels are coming off? Really?

This team was going to win 11 games with Lindsey. It might win the same number without him. If it wins 2 less games, does it matter?

You've subtracted a selfish, one-dimensional player who could not adjust to actually playing team basketball. It's opened up minutes for Phil Greene, who is already a better all-around player than Nuri and who has a much higher ceiling (IMHO). You have freed the entire team from the burden of having to defer to Nuri and look for him at the expense of their own opportunities.

If the staff adds two players by the end of the month, his departure doesn't even hurt your depth in any significant way.

Of course, I was never one who raved about Lindsey. If anything I refrained from clobbering him on the board because the kids do read this site. However, now that he's gone I can't really feel badly about subtracting a selfish one-dimensional quitter and giving his time and valuable experience to better players. They are still going to take their lumps this year, but with a few reinforcements they will also still be very good next year.

Other than that, I agree with almost all of Marcus' post. The one thing I agree with Lindsey on is that the team is too robotic. I have chalked that up to having a bunch of freshmen trying to learn a complicated system and thinking too much, with the added pressure of having to keep Nuri happy by looking for him whenever possible. I'm sure that once the staff is comfortable that they have learned the system that things will open up some more, and frankly I think that subtracting Nuri will help since he fits into a system like sand fits into gears.
 
Thanks guys. I knew Pelle was in Philly, I didn't realize Sampson and Amir were. I thought they were on campus? I knew Pelle and Amir were academic questions long before summer, but I had thought Sampson was a bit if a surprise, no? Either way, things look bad.

Moose, would you care to elaborate on the connection between Nuri and the Rise 'scandal' or is it just people trying to blame our staff for more things? As someone who doesn't know the inner workings of the program, Coach Lavin has made us a national figure and brought attention back into our program. The guys is recovering from cancer, and it is insane to expect him to put SJU bball over his life. It is unfortunate that kids feel that way. Lavin isnt going anywhere so idk how kids for the future or kids already here are judging on him missing time now.

I would be really curious to know the others take, ie, Moe, Sir'Dom etc. It has to be frustrating that they came in with all these expectations of what would happen and its been everything but. I feel bad for those guys since they have done eevrything asked of them and all could have played anywhere they wanted.

I am also curious as to Lavin's take. I trust Lavin, (the staff idk about). The staff has not proved themselves to me really.
Click to expand...
 

And in only one short year SJU is once again the laughingstock of the BE. Tough to blame this one on Roberts with the way Lavin chased players like Lawrence and Q (and who knows about Polee) we could have used out and wound up with barely a half a team. Frankly if he weren't sick I'd be calling for somebody new. Another year of season tickets down the tubes. I'm just so sick of this crap........
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This just goes to show how some of you attempt to get out of the blocks before the gun is sounded.... gunjumpers. Some of you were ready to jump ship around this time last season, and again during our losing streak in late-January. We all saw how that turned out. You chastised Polee when he left and now you have the audacity to mention his name in some form of positive compacity. Wow! LOL

This season was gonna be trying with Lindsey. Quite frankly, with the addition of Garrett and Cummings then I think we'll be on par to probably win the same amount of games even with Lindsey. This is gonna hurt in the short-term, but I don't think it will in the long-term. 
 
Why be negative? Because in less than 4 months, the wheels have fallen off this season. Three ineligibles, two of which de-committed, and the third with a pro baseball contract. My fear is that if Garrett doesn't play this season, then goes out and shows great promise in his first minor league, there will be great pressure on him to give up basketball, and he probably will.

Then a guy that we were ravings about a couple of weeks ago quits before we even get to the Big East Schedule. Lavin may not be back anytime soon, and the team is disgruntled and short handed.

Oh yea, and we overcharge for on campus refreshments during games.

 
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The wheels are coming off? Really?

This team was going to win 11 games with Lindsey. It might win the same number without him. If it wins 2 less games, does it matter?

You've subtracted a selfish, one-dimensional player who could not adjust to actually playing team basketball. It's opened up minutes for Phil Greene, who is already a better all-around player than Nuri and who has a much higher ceiling (IMHO). You have freed the entire team from the burden of having to defer to Nuri and look for him at the expense of their own opportunities.

If the staff adds two players by the end of the month, his departure doesn't even hurt your depth in any significant way.

Of course, I was never one who raved about Lindsey. If anything I refrained from clobbering him on the board because the kids do read this site. However, now that he's gone I can't really feel badly about subtracting a selfish one-dimensional quitter and giving his time and valuable experience to better players. They are still going to take their lumps this year, but with a few reinforcements they will also still be very good next year.

Other than that, I agree with almost all of Marcus' post. The one thing I agree with Lindsey on is that the team is too robotic. I have chalked that up to having a bunch of freshmen trying to learn a complicated system and thinking too much, with the added pressure of having to keep Nuri happy by looking for him whenever possible. I'm sure that once the staff is comfortable that they have learned the system that things will open up some more, and frankly I think that subtracting Nuri will help since he fits into a system like sand fits into gears.
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Re the "robotics club";

I think that's purely a result of all the kids needing to learn a new system. If you recall early last season their were games where we looked lost offensively, we ran the weave-motion constantly without ever getting off a shot. Eventually the guys will be able to play more instinctively in this system .. but right now they're all thinking too much. It's natural for this to happen when you try to install so many new parts.
 
Thanks guys. I knew Pelle was in Philly, I didn't realize Sampson and Amir were. I thought they were on campus? I knew Pelle and Amir were academic questions long before summer, but I had thought Sampson was a bit if a surprise, no? Either way, things look bad.

Moose, would you care to elaborate on the connection between Nuri and the Rise 'scandal' or is it just people trying to blame our staff for more things? As someone who doesn't know the inner workings of the program, Coach Lavin has made us a national figure and brought attention back into our program. The guys is recovering from cancer, and it is insane to expect him to put SJU bball over his life. It is unfortunate that kids feel that way. Lavin isnt going anywhere so idk how kids for the future or kids already here are judging on him missing time now.

I would be really curious to know the others take, ie, Moe, Sir'Dom etc. It has to be frustrating that they came in with all these expectations of what would happen and its been everything but. I feel bad for those guys since they have done eevrything asked of them and all could have played anywhere they wanted.

I am also curious as to Lavin's take. I trust Lavin, (the staff idk about). The staff has not proved themselves to me really.
Click to expand...
 

And in only one short year SJU is once again the laughingstock of the BE. Tough to blame this one on Roberts with the way Lavin chased players like Lawrence and Q (and who knows about Polee) we could have used out and wound up with barely a half a team. Frankly if he weren't sick I'd be calling for somebody new. Another year of season tickets down the tubes. I'm just so sick of this crap........
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Bobre- If he wasn't sick, I don't think a lot of this would be happening. Calling for a coaches head after the best season in the last decade because 3 of the ,unheard of 9 recruits he had coming in, didn't qualify academically is a bit misguided.

I get the frustration, we all are frustrated. And Lavin should shoulder some of this, no doubt, but somebody new? Come on man!
 
Notes

- I have to admit I love when things like this happen. Yes, it's bad for the sad sack team I inexplicably root for one sport other than horseracing that I care at all about, but on the other hand is the delicious thrill of Schadenfreude I feel reading these threads. It's like cracking the top layer of trash at the garbage dump on a steamy August afternoon and inhaling huge breaths of the toxic slime that lies just beneath the surface. My favorite line so far has been: tough to blame Beteljuice for this one. I have to agree, it'd be hard to pin this on the assistant coach at Florida.

- Used to be when players transferred it was the fault of the incompetent staff. Now when they transfer it's because they're spineless quitters. So that's a step in the right direction, because we have a staff that recruits spineless quitters. No wait, that's not right, it's because we have a supremely competent staff that won't take guff from pampered nancy boys. That's right, I said it, pampered nancy boys. I don't care how many family members he's had murdered, he's a prima donna. And he's been a disappointment since the preseason let's face it, and 8 games is all a genyious needs to see to know whether a player is any good at all. Just like when I watched Cedric Jackson's first 8 games, I could tell he was an NBA player. So good riddance Nuri. Nice name BTW, Nuri. Good lord.

Same for those other guys Pelle and Sampson. Sure when we recruited them they were great and part of an amazing recruiting class but know what? Now that they're not here we're better off without them. They're not that good and their attitude stinks. This is addition by subtraction. Good riddance to bad rubbish. De gustibus est. Baby, bath water. And so on.

- It's been noted that we might need a scapegoat and that a good one might be Tony Chiles. I agree. His ankle's already messed up so throwing him under the bus won't do much more damage. However ultimately the blame for this falls on Sloan Kettering. If they'd removed the great and powerful prostate when the disease was first found we wouldn't be in this mess. So I'm afraid no more donations to cancer research from me until this team starts winning some games.
 
Bobre you are out of your mind!!! We are so fortunate to have Lavin as our coach. Give the guy a break!!! In collegebasketball s__t happens. It occurs in many scholls not just SJU. We have to look at the long range future of SJU basketball and not focus on this year. Believe me, LAVIN is the man!!!!! 
 
One positive in all of this - the scholly chart should be able to be balanced out much quicker. That will help 3-4 years down the line. Most of us know this, but I want it out there to get one good outcome posted on our Eeyore thread.
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How does this help balance out the schollie situation-we had 4 fr 1 soph and 2 jr and Nuri was our only soph? :unsure:  
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 I'm looking from the Lavs recruiting starting point, which has now been revised again.

Originally - 3 available for 2012 class...now 6 available for '12 recruits.

Sign 3-4 players (fits in w/ now tighter timeline).... 2-3 left for '13 recruits.

Sign 2-3 players...2-3 left for '14 recruits (+1 added by me - odds of attrition)

This can smooth out the scholly clump we would have been facing, plus allow selective focus on top talents.
 
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