Mullin

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[quote="austour" post=281266][quote="L J S A" post=281212][quote="Dan V" post=281191]Or maybe Alford thinks Grace is going to get busted in the whole FBI investgation so he let him go early to save his own a**.[/quote]

Grace was in the military for 20 years. He has stated that because of that background he has too much integrity to cheat.[/quote]

There's plenty of folks lacking integrity in the military so him saying it doesn't mean it' so.[/quote]

It’s not categorical. It depends. Integrity is an individual attribute —not an occupational one.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=281495]Paultz, sometimes I wonder if you're secretly Matt A, St. Jean, Mullin, or Goff. Either that or you can tolerate a lot more failure than I can...in a good way. I agree, let's wait and see what the roster looks like and what big we get. That being said, it's pretty clear that Mullin desperately needs a real assistant. That can't be spun into "just wait and see" IMO. Again, he's solidly on the hot seat according to every major college hoops pundit and it's obvious to everyone who isn't biased. There's smoke coming from the windows and there are some in denial of the fire inside the building. Imagine going up to a person watching smoke billowing from the windows of an office building and saying "there's no fire...it's just your imagination". They'd look at you cock-eyed. Mullin gets one more year to show he can have even mild success. I just think fans have seen this movie before and it usually doesn't end as nicely as you seem to imply it will.

Caraher is a good get but I'm not letting that cloud next year's importance or the obvious absence of a solid big transfer and lack of big man development.[/quote]
Frankly I was never a big fan of hiring Chris, but interested in seeing him succeed. Next season to me is very important. I just don’t believe in droning on about the staff shortcomings at this point & will leave that to you.
 
[quote="Paultzman" post=281415]Who are we are we kidding? Easy to say “get two” but we are not being inundated with big prospects. Was told Femi apparently wanted a place where he could display his offensive skills to maximize his chances of earning $$ somewhere professionally. Our guard oriented approach was not appealing to him apparently. It is not like bigs are lining up at our door. Get a serviceable player who can rebound, set picks and do the dirty work. If not, tough season awaits imo.[/quote]

Funny you say that as I was thinking to myself, I said self, the need for multiple bigs is not as severe as some make it out to be purely because of the nature of the system. I don't see them switching to inside out no matter who comes along, unfortunately.

Keita will likely be able to replace Owens rebounding and defense while being a little short on the offensive production, Dixon will probably replace Ahmed's offense while being a little short on the rebounding side (he did average close to 5 per game at SF). The only other upgrade is the potential of Greg Williams. Sure the returnees will mature and improve, so will everyone else's.

I guess my cynicism is based on the fact that the last place team in the BE replaced 2 starters with players who are not marked improvements over their predecessors and didn't add much else, if Diakite, Roberts and Earlington are the projects everyone says they are. If they are then combined they can probably replace Kassoum and Amar. ;)

The only real hope I see to be a really good team is Shamorie becoming a Hatten/Hardy type of force who can take over games completely and will the team to wins, and besides two games last year I didn't see Shamorie, as great as he is, as that type of player. Otherwise I see a struggle to get to .500 in conference, and potentially contending for the bubble.
 
[quote="austour" post=281499][quote="Paultzman" post=281415]Who are we are we kidding? Easy to say “get two” but we are not being inundated with big prospects. Was told Femi apparently wanted a place where he could display his offensive skills to maximize his chances of earning $$ somewhere professionally. Our guard oriented approach was not appealing to him apparently. It is not like bigs are lining up at our door. Get a serviceable player who can rebound, set picks and do the dirty work. If not, tough season awaits imo.[/quote]

Funny you say that as I was thinking to myself, I said self, the need for multiple bigs is not as severe as some make it out to be purely because of the nature of the system. I don't see them switching to inside out no matter who comes along, unfortunately.

Keita will likely be able to replace Owens rebounding and defense while being a little short on the offensive production, Dixon will probably replace Ahmed's offense while being a little short on the rebounding side (he did average close to 5 per game at SF). The only other upgrade is the potential of Greg Williams. Sure the returnees will mature and improve, so will everyone else's.

I guess my cynicism is based on the fact that the last place team in the BE replaced 2 starters with players who are not marked improvements over their predecessors and didn't add much else, if Diakite, Roberts and Earlington are the projects everyone says they are. If they are then combined they can probably replace Kassoum and Amar. ;)

The only real hope I see to be a really good team is Shamorie becoming a Hatten/Hardy type of force who can take over games completely and will the team to wins, and besides two games last year I didn't see Shamorie, as great as he is, as that type of player. Otherwise I see a struggle to get to .500 in conference, and potentially contending for the bubble.[/quote]

I also have Ponds a shade below Hatten/ Hardy much to the chagrin of a few posters. But as has been pointed out to me both Hardy and Hatten were older than Ponds is even now. Ponds also has Clark and Simon which is honestly better than anything Hatten got to play with though Hardy had a better team. I am betting on Ponds and Mullin to finish around 500 in BE and to win around 20 and get in as 8th seed.
 
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[quote="Paultzman" post=281497][quote="Mike Zaun" post=281495]Paultz, sometimes I wonder if you're secretly Matt A, St. Jean, Mullin, or Goff. Either that or you can tolerate a lot more failure than I can...in a good way. I agree, let's wait and see what the roster looks like and what big we get. That being said, it's pretty clear that Mullin desperately needs a real assistant. That can't be spun into "just wait and see" IMO. Again, he's solidly on the hot seat according to every major college hoops pundit and it's obvious to everyone who isn't biased. There's smoke coming from the windows and there are some in denial of the fire inside the building. Imagine going up to a person watching smoke billowing from the windows of an office building and saying "there's no fire...it's just your imagination". They'd look at you cock-eyed. Mullin gets one more year to show he can have even mild success. I just think fans have seen this movie before and it usually doesn't end as nicely as you seem to imply it will.

Caraher is a good get but I'm not letting that cloud next year's importance or the obvious absence of a solid big transfer and lack of big man development.[/quote]
Frankly I was never a big fan of hiring Chris, but interested in seeing him succeed. Next season to me is very important. I just don’t believe in droning on about the staff shortcomings at this point & will leave that to you.[/quote]

I appreciate your honesty about the Mullin hire. I didn't meet one fan at the time of the hire that was optimistic about hiring a completely inexperienced coach. What gave me and others hope was recruiting over the coaching deficiency by the hiring of Slice and Matt. I believed that Matt would excel at the transfer game as he did at Iowa State and Slice would work all the local talent and high level preps as he did at Pitt and Kentucky. When, in the summer of 2016 that duo and Mullin has a falling out, recruiting talent to cover the staff's inexperience became a long shot and it shows in our difficulty in maintaining relationships with some of the top talent because, as has been mentioned here 100 times, Matt cannot do it all and Mitch Richmond obviously has not filled the void left by Slice. Without reconfiguring roles on the staff or adding someone like Rice this staff will have a very difficult time moving from the bottom 5 to the top 5 five where NCAA consideration becomes automatic. I agree we have no choice but to wait and see and have passed the baton to young Mike Zaun to point out the coaching deficiencies in the 4th year because frankly many of us older fans have bigger and more important issues in our lives than worrying about if Mullin gets it or not.
 
Cooley was seen at T.F. Green Airport at 5 a.m. Monday morning. It was yet another reminder that there’s no offseason when it comes to recruiting. The first of two April AAU evaluation periods is scheduled for this coming weekend.

“Recruiting is an everyday process,” said Cooley. “It’s like oxygen. You can’t recruit, you can’t breathe.
 
[quote="Tom in Salem" post=281509]Cooley was seen at T.F. Green Airport at 5 a.m. Monday morning. It was yet another reminder that there’s no offseason when it comes to recruiting. The first of two April AAU evaluation periods is scheduled for this coming weekend.

“Recruiting is an everyday process,” said Cooley. “It’s like oxygen. You can’t recruit, you can’t breathe.[/quote]

2018 recruiting class rankings (according to 247):
#14 Nova
#18 Providence
#29 Georgetown
#35 Creighton
#45 DePaul
#53 Seton Hall
#54 Xavier
#72 St. John's
#97 Marquette
#139 Butler

Cooley certainly doing an excellent job in all aspects. Best part of those rankings is that the top 3 (4?) coaches aren't going anywhere anytime soon. Actually, I'd say nobody in the conference will be leaving the next couple years unless they're fired.
 
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[quote="Tom in Salem" post=281509]Cooley was seen at T.F. Green Airport at 5 a.m. Monday morning. It was yet another reminder that there’s no offseason when it comes to recruiting. The first of two April AAU evaluation periods is scheduled for this coming weekend.

“Recruiting is an everyday process,” said Cooley. “It’s like oxygen. You can’t recruit, you can’t breathe.[/quote]

He was only there that early because you can't get anywhere from Providence, you need to connect. Add's 1-2 hours to any trip. ;)
 
Recruiting rankings are always a little skewed because volume counts especially in the 247. That being said Nova, Prov, and Gtown really knocked it out of the park. Bulter, Hall, and us are counting on our transfers and RS to make the biggest impact.

Still I hate finishing last in the big east and then having the 8th best class.
 
[quote="JohnnyFan" post=281515]Cooley stays hungry. Lives and breathes every aspect of the job.[/quote]


I respect that immensely, plus a very very good fundamental coach.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=281502][quote="Paultzman" post=281497][quote="Mike Zaun" post=281495]Paultz, sometimes I wonder if you're secretly Matt A, St. Jean, Mullin, or Goff. Either that or you can tolerate a lot more failure than I can...in a good way. I agree, let's wait and see what the roster looks like and what big we get. That being said, it's pretty clear that Mullin desperately needs a real assistant. That can't be spun into "just wait and see" IMO. Again, he's solidly on the hot seat according to every major college hoops pundit and it's obvious to everyone who isn't biased. There's smoke coming from the windows and there are some in denial of the fire inside the building. Imagine going up to a person watching smoke billowing from the windows of an office building and saying "there's no fire...it's just your imagination". They'd look at you cock-eyed. Mullin gets one more year to show he can have even mild success. I just think fans have seen this movie before and it usually doesn't end as nicely as you seem to imply it will.

Caraher is a good get but I'm not letting that cloud next year's importance or the obvious absence of a solid big transfer and lack of big man development.[/quote]
Frankly I was never a big fan of hiring Chris, but interested in seeing him succeed. Next season to me is very important. I just don’t believe in droning on about the staff shortcomings at this point & will leave that to you.[/quote]

I appreciate your honesty about the Mullin hire. I didn't meet one fan at the time of the hire that was optimistic about hiring a completely inexperienced coach. What gave me and others hope was recruiting over the coaching deficiency by the hiring of Slice and Matt. I believed that Matt would excel at the transfer game as he did at Iowa State and Slice would work all the local talent and high level preps as he did at Pitt and Kentucky. When, in the summer of 2016 that duo and Mullin has a falling out, recruiting talent to cover the staff's inexperience became a long shot and it shows in our difficulty in maintaining relationships with some of the top talent because, as has been mentioned here 100 times, Matt cannot do it all and Mitch Richmond obviously has not filled the void left by Slice. Without reconfiguring roles on the staff or adding someone like Rice this staff will have a very difficult time moving from the bottom 5 to the top 5 five where NCAA consideration becomes automatic. I agree we have no choice but to wait and see and have passed the baton to young Mike Zaun to point out the coaching deficiencies in the 4th year because frankly many of us older fans have bigger and more important issues in our lives than worrying about if Mullin gets it or not.[/quote]

Wrong thread for this but I was enthusiastic about the hire at the point of hire, but also aware of the obviously higher risk of failure that goes with lack of experience.

Out of the gate we all thought that Matt and Slice were great hires that would bring high octane recruiting. The whole notion that we had lifted A great recruiter from Kentucky's staff seemed too good to be true.

I never understood the hire of Richmond into special assistant category. It was created by Lavin for Keady, and Lavin left money on the table to pay for Keady, a 6 time national coach of the year and mentor to Steve. It was a benevolent act by lavin to Keady as Keady had lost his wife and the change of life worked out great for him. That being said he appeared to bring some value (not 400k worth but oh well)

I think without an AD, the board was only too willing to give Mullin the budget he asked for to facilitate success. Fill keadys slot with mitch - sure. Hire Matt A. , no brainer. Pay slice a crazy guaranteed salary to pry him.awa from Kentucky- well, that was the digging deep part.

By midsrason #1, it was apparent something was wrong. Slice appeared to have hijacked in game coaching and he and Mullin hardly spoke on the bench if at all. We all know subsequently what happened and it was well chronicled that Matt and Slice were at odds too. Toxic hire and had to exit.

That debacle and failure to rehire something should focus attention on the role Mitch plays. He appears publicly invisible. He is not vocal or animated on the bench, and doesn't appear to be on the recruiting trail but i don't know. Maybe he is a big factor at practice but that's a ton of money for a practice coach.

That being said to me recruiting is 80% of college coaching and we haven't nailed any huge hs recruit since Ponds. Simon was a great transfer add, and clark owens also solid. Since then we haven't made big noise.

Time is running short. To me, the prospect for year 5 is a lot more important that year 4. Even if we dance, its likely as a low at large seed and early exit. But it would set the stage for growth if we have big time talent coming in the following year.

Anton Goff is a great guy, but is he strong enough to actually tell Mullin what to do in terms of staffing? If he fired Mitch or demanded he be replaced, would Chris balk or walk? 400k could buy a lot of coach, if that's what Mitch brings. At some point soon, greg will get HC opportunities. He and Matt are millenials and could leave at any point.

Bottom line is time is running short to build an impressive roster for 2019-20.
 
I don't think it's "harping" or "perseverating" to constantly bring up the clear failures of the staff. The notion on here seems to be 75% "just shut up and hope for the best with blind faith in Mullin and co.". I don't think that's a smart way to run a program. I'm merely trying to balance the debate somewhat and show that there's another side to "wait and see". I don't think we have to wait any longer to see real problems which have been documented over 3 years. It's not a tiny sample. I do think we have to wait until this season to determine if Mullin will ever work long-term, but I don't think we have to wait to point out clear flaws that are obvious i.e. no assistant hired, lack of big development, recruiting failure, etc. I'm exhausted of moving goalposts to make every year seem "successful" while constantly changing the definition to make the failure easier to swallow. I'm from the mindset where if things are not working after you get a big enough sample size, it's time to cut the cord. If I'm a brutally honest betting man, I don't think Mullin will ever work for us without major staff overhaul to help him but I will give him next year to prove to us that he apparently didn't need any help. Fingers crossed.
 
Give it a rest Mike Zaun. You made your point a ridiculous amount of times already. We get your point of view. And if you are gonna bash the staff over and over then keep it in the mullin thread. Not in a thread welcoming a player that wants to play for this staff
 
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Mike Zaun, I felt similarly to you under Steve Lavin. While I felt strongly that Lavin should be fired prior to his last season, I was driven nuts by the "just let it play out" manta on this board. At the time, aside from Tony Chiles, the staff had essentially stopped recruiting and we were flirting with a return to embarrassment via the Keith Thomas parking lot transcript exchange.

That said, at the risk of sounding hypocritical, I think it is premature to bail on CM and staff. It's getting close and, no doubt, we are at a crossroads with our immediate need for size. However, Chris is definitely here through the upcoming season and, regardless of frustration, we all want it to be a success. If he chooses not to make a change to the staff and the season goes poorly, I would imagine there is a reasonable chance he resigns.

I have said it myself, if we completely strikeout on an impact big man this spring, I will become much more critical. The current signs are not good, but let's wait to see the final 2018-19 roster. Dare I say....."Just let it play out".
 
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[quote="Eric" post=281562]Give it a rest Mike Zaun. You made your point a ridiculous amount of times already. We get your point of view. And if you are gonna bash the staff over and over then keep it in the mullin thread. Not in a thread welcoming a player that wants to play for this staff[/quote]

+10000!!!!
 
[quote="Paultzman" post=281497]
[the fire inside the building. Imagine going up to a person watching smoke billowing from the windows of an office building and saying "there's no fire...it's just your imagination". They'd look at you cock-eyed. Mullin gets one more year to show he can have even mild success. I just think fans have seen this movie before and it usually doesn't end as nicely as you
Frankly I was never a big fan of hiring Chris, but interested in seeing him succeed. Next season to me is very important. I just don’t believe in droning on about the staff shortcomings at this point & will leave that to you.[/quote]

The Honorable Paultzman pretty much sums up my position.

I favored hiring one of the Hurley brothers after Lavin was canned but St. John's chose to hire Chris Mullin so as a fan of St. Johns basketball I hope he succeeds. IMO any coach deserves 4 years to be judged.

It is commical that a handful of the posters on this site repetitively post the same opinions each day after day as though their opinion matters.
 
It is true that MZ is very repetitive. But, he makes some valid points. Recruiting has been mediocre. And the lack of a grad transfer big and an assistant bothers me a lot.
 
[quote="richard A Steinfeld" post=281572]It is true that MZ is very repetitive. But, he makes some valid points. Recruiting has been mediocre. And the lack of a grad transfer big and an assistant bothers me a lot.[/quote]

I guess the only thing to keep us all sane is that the only thing that matters is whether or not this program is improving, and ultimately whether we win or not.

Those that think the upcoming season is do or die, and there are a lot of you, are misguided in my opinion. Unless the wheels totally fall off, he will be back for a season 5.

Mullin appears to be resolute in terms of doing things his way, so to continually and repetitively bash him day in and day out for the same things only drives the poster over the edge and annoys the hell out of the rest of us. Several posters have become crazed over this, but it doesn't help your sanity or ours to constantly vent.

Simple. We win or we don't, and pretty soon (whatever that measure is - one, two, or even 3 seasons). If that doesn't happen, back to square one and a new coach, and we are all getting too old for that. again. and again. and again.
 
[quote="otis" post=281570][quote="Paultzman" post=281497]
[the fire inside the building. Imagine going up to a person watching smoke billowing from the windows of an office building and saying "there's no fire...it's just your imagination". They'd look at you cock-eyed. Mullin gets one more year to show he can have even mild success. I just think fans have seen this movie before and it usually doesn't end as nicely as you
Frankly I was never a big fan of hiring Chris, but interested in seeing him succeed. Next season to me is very important. I just don’t believe in droning on about the staff shortcomings at this point & will leave that to you.[/quote]

The Honorable Paultzman pretty much sums up my position.

I favored hiring one of the Hurley brothers after Lavin was canned but St. John's chose to hire Chris Mullin so as a fan of St. Johns basketball I hope he succeeds. IMO any coach deserves 4 years to be judged.

It is commical that a handful of the posters on this site repetitively post the same opinions each day after day as though their opinion matters.[/quote]

Apologize for the repetition especially in the wrong thread, should've done it under Mullin. I disagree that fan opinions don't matter. They do...it can mean the difference between being a regular season ticket holder every year and donating money. Also affects attendance.
 
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