2023-24 Rankings
- Thread starter ADORAZ
- Start date
I actually think if we win 3/4 that week against Michigan and 3 solid Charleston opponents then we'll be ranked, but won't be easy. Maybe it's a good thing we won't have a giant numbered target on our backs for 4 major games in one week.
I see everyone on Twitter saying we're #29, but we're tied at #28 (link from the previous page). Doesn't matter but hey one spot closer (unless the AP recently changed their system and now do tiebreakers?). Regardless though I agree about the end of the season.
guinness77
Well-known member
It’s really nice to have some reasonable expectations coming into a season for once.
Just did a quick search and I can't find anything about the AP changing their system to include a tiebreaker, so we're #28 (for Zach or anyone else publishing articles who listed us on Twitter at #29 - AP link to the poll is on the previous page).
In the past there have actually been weeks where a ranked team faced the same numbered ranked team. There have also been weeks where two teams were tied at #25, and both were ranked #25 (so that week had 26 ranked teams).
That aside, these rankings are just for fun especially preseason. In a way I definitely like having more reasonable expectations to start the season given this group hasn't proven anything yet. Let the team earn a ranking.
In the past there have actually been weeks where a ranked team faced the same numbered ranked team. There have also been weeks where two teams were tied at #25, and both were ranked #25 (so that week had 26 ranked teams).
That aside, these rankings are just for fun especially preseason. In a way I definitely like having more reasonable expectations to start the season given this group hasn't proven anything yet. Let the team earn a ranking.
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St. John’s Receives Votes in Preseason Associated Press Poll - St. John's University Athletics
Entering its first season under Hall of Fame coach Rick Pitino , the St. John's men's basketball team has received 47 votes in the Associated Press (AP)...
SJUDave
Well-known member
I mean it's 29 when you count from 25 and where the name is located on their list...regardless they don't put 28 or T-28 or 29 next to you name so lets win big and get 25 and higher put there!
I mean, just saying we're #28 (or tied for #28). As mentioned when two teams tie for #25 they're both listed as #25 and there are 26 ranked teams for that week. Ultimately it means nothing, yes, but just correcting because everyone on Twitter said #29 initially. ESPN for instance lists us in front of UCLA (#28 when you count) because the order is irrelevant when teams are tied.
Agree about winning big of course, we'll have plenty of opportunities all season to get a number by our team.
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Yep and the AP #1 preseason team hasn't won the National Championship since UNC in 2008-9. Plus, we know UConn was just outside the rankings last preseason.
Sometime over the next couple weeks I'll compile all the computer rankings and see our average. Probably will be pretty off from the final results, especially with this new roster, but will be interesting to see how accurate they are.
Rutgers is #59 in KenPom and St. John's is #60, so those results could hint at where we're at. Really smart to scrimmage them.
So glad we'll finally have our first real data points this week. We already know the AP people have us tied at #28, so let's see what the computers predict. More at the bottom.
Computer Rankings:
Bart Torvik / T-Rank: #53 (11/5/23)
Evan Miya: #49 (11/5/23)
Hasla Metrics: #32 (11/5/23)
ESPN / BPI: ?? - won't load for me past #50, but we're 8th in Big East (10/27/23)
Versus Sports Simulator: #66 (10/27/23)
KenPom / Pomeroy: #60 (10/15/23)
The Resource Nexus: #36 (9/18/23)
AVERAGE: #49 (not including ESPN/BPI's unknown which would take us past #50)
Sources:
evanmiya.com
I'm sure I'm missing some so please feel free to add if you find any, but basically the computers see us as a bubble team (>#49- likely wrong side of the bubble) while the AP people see us as a 7/8 seed (tied at #28 so could go either way). Also worth noting that some who incorporate analytics, such as Lunardi, have us just barely in the field.
Pretty big computer vs. human difference but I assume most computer models aren't accounting for Rick Pitino. Obviously could also be tons of flaws given nearly the entire roster is new, so I personally think we'll finish around what the AP predicts (7/8 seed). I'll say we finish #33 in NET and go dancing as a 9 seed.
Computer Rankings:
Bart Torvik / T-Rank: #53 (11/5/23)
Evan Miya: #49 (11/5/23)
Hasla Metrics: #32 (11/5/23)
ESPN / BPI: ?? - won't load for me past #50, but we're 8th in Big East (10/27/23)
Versus Sports Simulator: #66 (10/27/23)
KenPom / Pomeroy: #60 (10/15/23)
The Resource Nexus: #36 (9/18/23)
AVERAGE: #49 (not including ESPN/BPI's unknown which would take us past #50)
Sources:
T-Rank - Customizable College Basketball Tempo Free Stats - T-Rank
T-Rank College Basketball Ratings and Rankings. And fun.
barttorvik.com
EvanMiya CBB Analytics
Advanced college basketball analytics, home of the Bayesian Performance Rating
evanmiya.com
I'm sure I'm missing some so please feel free to add if you find any, but basically the computers see us as a bubble team (>#49- likely wrong side of the bubble) while the AP people see us as a 7/8 seed (tied at #28 so could go either way). Also worth noting that some who incorporate analytics, such as Lunardi, have us just barely in the field.
Pretty big computer vs. human difference but I assume most computer models aren't accounting for Rick Pitino. Obviously could also be tons of flaws given nearly the entire roster is new, so I personally think we'll finish around what the AP predicts (7/8 seed). I'll say we finish #33 in NET and go dancing as a 9 seed.
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There is no algorithm that can predict this kind of overhauled team. Pitino can start five 5th year seniors and pull a top 30 recruit off the bench. He’s got a projected second round draft pick at SF off the bench and another SF who was just named a top 20 SF in the country off the bench. How do you even make sense of that?So glad we'll finally have our first real data points this week. We already know the AP people have us tied at #28, so let's see what the computers predict. More at the bottom.
Computer Rankings:
Bart Torvik / T-Rank: #53 (11/5/23)
Evan Miya: #49 (11/5/23)
Hasla Metrics: #32 (11/5/23)
ESPN / BPI: ?? - won't load for me past #50, but we're 8th in Big East (10/27/23)
Versus Sports Simulator: #66 (10/27/23)
KenPom / Pomeroy: #60 (10/15/23)
The Resource Nexus: #36 (9/18/23)
AVERAGE: #49 (not including ESPN/BPI's unknown which would take us past #50)
Sources:
T-Rank - Customizable College Basketball Tempo Free Stats - T-Rank
T-Rank College Basketball Ratings and Rankings. And fun.barttorvik.comEvanMiya CBB Analytics
Advanced college basketball analytics, home of the Bayesian Performance Rating
I'm sure I'm missing some so please feel free to add if you find any, but basically the computers see us as a bubble team (>#49- likely wrong side of the bubble) while the AP people see us as a 7/8 seed (tied at #28 so could go either way). Also worth noting that some who incorporate analytics, such as Lunardi, have us just barely in the field.
Pretty big computer vs. human difference but I assume most computer models aren't accounting for Rick Pitino. Obviously could also be tons of flaws given nearly the entire roster is new, so I personally think we'll finish around what the AP predicts (7/8 seed). I'll say we finish #33 in NET and go dancing as a 9 seed.
The range of outcomes is wild here. If this team makes the Sweet 16 it will look obvious with so much experience and a hall of fame coach.
I think we struggle early with some very high moments mixed in. Then get it together late January and become a very tough out for the tournaments.