Syracuse molestation allegation

I don't think you can presume guilt or innocence based on whether or not he asked his brother. The pedophile convinces the victim he is doing nothing wrong, lavishes him with attention and gifts, (and sometimes alcohol). There is a slow revelation on the part of the abused that he was subjected to something horrific.

Again, I haven't made a judgment yet, and it really doesn't matter. Authorities will sort it all out.

I found the article by Jason Whitlock to be very interesting and though I have no knowledge of the players in this "scandal" I have serious reservations about the veracity of the charges being made against Fine by the "brothers", who as Jason points out-if one of the brothers was being abused for so long why would he tell his younger brother to become a ball boy also.
http://msn.foxsports.com/collegebas...e-story-irresposible-reporting-by-espn-112111
 
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 http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/7286347/otl-audio-tape-syracuse-orange-assistant-bernie-fine-wife-admits-worries-abuse
 
Well, little by little more and more comes out. Certainly doesn't look good for Fine or Syracuse now.
Interesting to see how Boeheim will respond later in the investigation.
 
Well, little by little more and more comes out. Certainly doesn't look good for Fine or Syracuse now.
Interesting to see how Boeheim will respond later in the investigation.
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Boeheim is as guilty as Paterno.
 
 There seem to be just enough holes in every accusar's story, for lingering doubt to help Fine and Syracuse here criminally.

That being said, Fine and Boeheim are not exactly "man of the year" candidates, are they? It's clear something vicious was going on there.
 
 There seem to be just enough holes in every accusar's story, for lingering doubt to help Fine and Syracuse here criminally.

That being said, Fine and Boeheim are not exactly "man of the year" candidates, are they? It's clear something vicious was going on there.
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I don't believe that this is a criminal issue with regard to Davis and/or Lang as I think the statute of limitations has expired.
 
The inaction and neglect that is reported with respect to the Syracuse University matter is worse than Penn State because (i) the molestation allegedly took place while on basketball trips (plural) (ii) the alleged victim was a minor whose care was entrusted to SU, and (iii) the Syracuse University after becoming aware of the allegations had it's attorneys investigate the allegations.

My understanding is that the "report" by SU's attorneys represented nothing more than a "circle the wagon -- deny, deny" report that only focused on the interests of SU and not the children allegedly molested. Please understand that the last sentence was not a shot at the attorneys but rather the SU administrators that directed the attorneys to focus solely on the issue of civil liability and not the issue of the alleged victims.

Below is a damming video with article against Mr. And Mrs. Fine which appeared on ESPN. I am at a loss to believe that anyone who listens to Mrs. Fine's comments in the below audio can question whether Fine did what his accuser says.

ESPN video reports damming admissions by Fine:
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...sistant-bernie-fine-wife-admits-worries-abuse
 
Laurie Fine ain't exactly looking to good here either. She not only turned a blind eye to what was going, but (if true) she had sex with the kid???????????? WTF? 
 
The inaction and neglect that is reported with respect to the Syracuse University matter is worse than Penn State because (i) the molestation allegedly took place while on basketball trips (plural) (ii) the alleged victim was a minor whose care was entrusted to SU, and (iii) the Syracuse University after becoming aware of the allegations had it's attorneys investigate the allegations.

My understanding is that the "report" by SU's attorneys represented nothing more than a "circle the wagon -- deny, deny" report that only focused on the interests of SU and not the children allegedly molested. Please understand that the last sentence was not a shot at the attorneys but rather the SU administrators that directed the attorneys to focus solely on the issue of civil liability and not the issue of the alleged victims.

Below is a damming video with article against Mr. And Mrs. Fine which appeared on ESPN. I am at a loss to believe that anyone who listens to Mrs. Fine's comments in the below audio can question whether Fine did what his accuser says.

ESPN video reports damming admissions by Fine:
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...sistant-bernie-fine-wife-admits-worries-abuse
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Thank you for the insight my friend. Is this a potential criminal matter or has statute expired?
 
I have some issues with this whole Bernie Fine thing.

But the main one is one I have had with a number of the alleged victims of "abuse" from priests who say the abuse started or happened when they were 18-28 years old.

Forgive me for a second, but if one is not mentally or physically incompetent how in the world is it "abuse", it might be harassment if someone "attempts" it, but, please, if you or I had a priest or Bernie Fine come on to us when we were 24 years old, we'd surely know what to do to stop it.

Now I know this Davis character says it started when he was 12, and if true, that does take on a different complexion, but still, now when Davis goes away to College and turns 18, 19, 20 years old, Bernie cannot force him to be "abused", unless there was a gun, a knife, some physical threat, I mean you get up and you leave and say "don't ever let that happen again', or "keep your $5,000"!!!!! 

I went to Catholic grammar school, high school, college and law school, was an alter boy for 6 years, had Xaverian brothers in High School, who we all knew some of them were gay, and never once did I or any of my friends come close to being abused.

I know that is totally anecdotal, and I am NOT saying there was not abuse, but give me a break, if any sane and physically able young man could not stop a priest, a brother, or a Bernie Fine, from molesting them when they were 14 years old, but especially when they were 28 years old, I don't get it. I had friends at Regis High School, who had a priest come on to them on a ski trip upstate NY, and each of them in their own way told this guy to leave them alone. They were High School freshmen.

I know of a neighbor who was a freshmen track star at Fordham in the 1950's who had a priest touch his leg and sit too close to him, he slapped his hand, and that priest never came near him again over the next four years.

At what age is it not molestation or abuse?

All of the sudden at 28 years old Davis says Fine stopped molesting him, I don't buy that part of his story for a second. If it was still happening when Davis was 28 it was something else, but it was not molestation.
 
I have some issues with this whole Bernie Fine thing.

But the main one is one I have had with a number of the alleged victims of "abuse" from priests who say the abuse started or happened when they were 18-28 years old.

Forgive me for a second, but if one is not mentally or physically incompetent how in the world is it "abuse", it might be harassment if someone "attempts" it, but, please, if you or I had a priest or Bernie Fine come on to us when we were 24 years old, we'd surely know what to do to stop it.

Now I know this Davis character says it started when he was 12, and if true, that does take on a different complexion, but still, now when Davis goes away to College and turns 18, 19, 20 years old, Bernie cannot force him to be "abused", unless there was a gun, a knife, some physical threat, I mean you get up and you leave and say "don't ever let that happen again', or "keep your $5,000"!!!!! 

I went to Catholic grammar school, high school, college and law school, was an alter boy for 6 years, had Xaverian brothers in High School, who we all knew some of them were gay, and never once did I or any of my friends come close to being abused.

I know that is totally anecdotal, and I am NOT saying there was not abuse, but give me a break, if any sane and physically able young man could not stop a priest, a brother, or a Bernie Fine, from molesting them when they were 14 years old, but especially when they were 28 years old, I don't get it. I had friends at Regis High School, who had a priest come on to them on a ski trip upstate NY, and each of them in their own way told this guy to leave them alone. They were High School freshmen.

I know of a neighbor who was a freshmen track star at Fordham in the 1950's who had a priest touch his leg and sit too close to him, he slapped his hand, and that priest never came near him again over the next four years.

At what age is it not molestation or abuse?

All of the sudden at 28 years old Davis says Fine stopped molesting him, I don't buy that part of his story for a second. If it was still happening when Davis was 28 it was something else, but it was not molestation.
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I don't know about you, but I haven't heard about to many victims who've claimed that the abuse started after the age of 18.
 
The inaction and neglect that is reported with respect to the Syracuse University matter is worse than Penn State because (i) the molestation allegedly took place while on basketball trips (plural) (ii) the alleged victim was a minor whose care was entrusted to SU, and (iii) the Syracuse University after becoming aware of the allegations had it's attorneys investigate the allegations.

My understanding is that the "report" by SU's attorneys represented nothing more than a "circle the wagon -- deny, deny" report that only focused on the interests of SU and not the children allegedly molested. Please understand that the last sentence was not a shot at the attorneys but rather the SU administrators that directed the attorneys to focus solely on the issue of civil liability and not the issue of the alleged victims.

Below is a damming video with article against Mr. And Mrs. Fine which appeared on ESPN. I am at a loss to believe that anyone who listens to Mrs. Fine's comments in the below audio can question whether Fine did what his accuser says.

ESPN video reports damming admissions by Fine:
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...sistant-bernie-fine-wife-admits-worries-abuse
Click to expand...

Penn St. is much worse.
They saw the rape and ignored it.
 
The age on consent for sexual consent varies from state to state. In NYS the age is 17. If the abuse beins before the age of consent, and continues beyond, there is a psychology between the perpetrator and the victim that allows this to continue. The guil that many older teens carry into adulthood was that they were somehow contributors to the abuse, when often times the abuser did things like ply a kid with alcohol lavish them with moeny or gifts, or other things to maintain control over them.

Sexual Molestation of a child by definition cannot begin past the age of consent, but some states have statutes for minors over the age of consent that require the adult to be within x years of the consenting minor.

At what age is it not molestation or abuse?
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I don't know about you, but I haven't heard about to many victims who've claimed that the abuse started after the age of 18.
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 Had this surfaced in August, no ACC 4 you Syracuse!

Even now, their move to the ACC is likely to be without Jim Boeheim as this seems to be unfolding under his watch.
 
Dead man walking............but never underestimate the power of Syracuse's great communications and broadcasting school whose graduates have successfully managed to under exploit and diminish literally dozens of player scandals with basketball players over the past 30 years; and, with exerience of the administration to repeatedly pump out public denials [after careful legal investigation by our in house review board in concert with the Syracuse police department etc................Billy Bob will be playing in tonight's game against whomever]. The have become among the best at it.
To put some perspective on the kids involved, think about the chance for a 9 year old to become the batboy for the Yankees; however, in Syracuse, the ball boy job is much bigger than that. Bernie, in Syracuse, is not like Joe Gerardi, he is more like Mickey Mantle or Willie Mays. He's a king and he is powerful. It's hard to really understand till you live in a place like Syracuse or Gainsville, or Athens, or, even South Bend..
Mrs. Fine's comments tell the story of a true lack of respect for moral obligations. Penn State fired the AD and the President. This situation calls for that and more now that Mrs. Fine has spoken unwittingly and candidly,'off the record'..
 
I think the wife is just as bad as him in this case. What a crazy story 
 
I think the wife is just as bad as him in this case. What a crazy story 
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She might be worse. It seems she:

1) Witnessed abuse and did nothing
2) At least partially blamed Davis by saying "....you trusted someone you shouldn't have.."
3) Had sex with Davis knowing full well he had been abused by her husband

Disgraceful(if true)!
 
Mrs. Fine's seeming complicity does change this case in my mind.

I know here in NJ, some of the litigation involving priests allegedly "started" close to the age of consent.

I understand the psychology involved with abuse that starts at a young age and continues thereafter, i.e., after 16, 17 or 18 but the cases I have a real problem with are the ones where the "abuse" starts at 16/17 and allegedly goes on into the 20's and here in Fine's case into the age of 28, that is still an issue with me. Even if Davis' began at 12 (who knows if it did) why does he let go on to the age of 28? Why did it stop then?

There was a guy who wrote a play about priest abuse who said it started at 17 and went on into his 30's, I just don't buy that. Sorry. Of all the Catholic church cases it has been estimated by independent sources that a high percentage of the lawsuits have been completely unfounded but with sleazy lawyers and willing liars the church has been socked with tons of judgments. Don't get me wrong they deserve a lot of blame for how it was handled.

I am jumping to a huge conclusion here, but BF sounds to me like he has sexual orientation issues, and "hooked up" with the wrong characters who see a "payday" in the making. Just my opinion, we'll see.

Now, the incidents of true sexual abuse happen in all walks of life and all types of settings, boy scouts, ministers, rabbis, priests, coaches, dentists, lawyers, doctors, truck drivers, plumbers, etc., you can't really generalize when it comes to sexual predators. Someone reported that if the protestant church was one organization, and not many, the percentage is just as high if not higher than the Catholic church, but the media reports focused on the Catholic church for a whole variety of other reasons.
 
Probably good for Bernie that they are going to the  ACC. Ain't no way he's going to get a fair trial in the Big East now. Another guy is set to come out on him tomorrow I am hearing. Worse is that Boeheim drew a line in the sand about it; no way you hang out with a guy for years and not know; he says they have been intimate friends for 35 years. It's going to get ugly in the salt city with no place to hide as the denials grow. Best way is to cut and run now and pick up the pieces later.
 
Dead man walking............but never underestimate the power of Syracuse's great communications and broadcasting school whose graduates have successfully managed to under exploit and diminish literally dozens of player scandals with basketball players over the past 30 years; and, with exerience of the administration to repeatedly pump out public denials [after careful legal investigation by our in house review board in concert with the Syracuse police department etc................Billy Bob will be playing in tonight's game against whomever]. The have become among the best at it.
To put some perspective on the kids involved, think about the chance for a 9 year old to become the batboy for the Yankees; however, in Syracuse, the ball boy job is much bigger than that. Bernie, in Syracuse, is not like Joe Gerardi, he is more like Mickey Mantle or Willie Mays. He's a king and he is powerful. It's hard to really understand till you live in a place like Syracuse or Gainsville, or Athens, or, even South Bend..
Mrs. Fine's comments tell the story of a true lack of respect for moral obligations. Penn State fired the AD and the President. This situation calls for that and more now that Mrs. Fine has spoken unwittingly and candidly,'off the record'..
Click to expand...
 

Very true. Their communications dept is legendary and permeates all media outlets. It will be interesting
to see how they soft soap this mess.
 
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