St. John's/Rutgers Game Thread

harkless was inconsistant...he was drafted based on his potential. that could be the case with sampson. of course, i hope he stays.
 
Quite frankly, Rutgers was begging to be blown out last night. We just wasn't capable of doing it.

Agree. We played Defense, stopped their big scorers and they weren't even a very good team. We played down to them and lost. Maddening to lose that way. I too thought we should have blown them out. We are simply not where we need to be yet.

Phil Greene didn't play real well and we are missing another good guard right now who can break down the defense. (ahem Rysheed..) Not sure why Branch didn't play more. I liked him in there and I think he gets to the rim much better than Phil. He also made an awesome no-look pass that displayed what he's capable of. Need more Branch in there.

Agree that Jakarr certainly needs another year. He's a good player that needs more strength and to round out his game some more.
 
Its hard to stay positive through a loss like that, especially since success is closer than we have had in a long time, we can almost taste it, national prominence and perennial tournament appearances are right there.

But our rebounding has greatly improved, our turnover rate is great, we just need to concentrate on free throws, and most of all shot selection.

If D'lo goes up for the easy lay up at the end instead of that 3 (I hate the breakaway 3) its a completely different game, we tie it, don't have to foul, maybe force another turn over, or possibly OT.

This loss hurts but we have not only gotten better than last year, than the beginning of this season but we are still getting better. a true PG would help as well.

unfortunately, and I hate to say it because I'm a sore loser, and when they lose games like this you cant talk to me for a few hours, next year will be great! for us, this is another roller coaster learning year.
 
Quite frankly, Rutgers was begging to be blown out last night. We just wasn't capable of doing it.

Ive been behind coach from day one but frankly tired of hearing how young we are! You can get 12 yr old kids to shoot fouls better That part of the game is not because they are young
They are young MEN If coach can get them to improve their foul shooting something is wrong Perhaps he should have put in the last minute those who could Dlo saying he lost concentration is inexcusable Perhaps Coach needs to let each player should 500 free throws a day If they can not shoot 7 0ut of ten consistently Maybe their mins should suffer until they get it. Know it sounds crazy Just venting very very disappointed I predicted 3 BE wins sure hope they make me wrong

Not focusing and lack of concentration has to be mainly on he staff These are top 100 kids who have benn playing 80% of their lives Think if we were shooting 70% from the line how many more wins we would have

Bobby Knight would get them to shoot better or they would be warming the bench recruiting is nice but lets recruit kids who shoot well DUKE does it
 
Red Johnnies...said very well.

I was more frustrated then ever last night because I truly felt like they needed this game. With the next two games being Gtown and ND a 1-4 record is highly likely.

That being said, anyone who questions where this program is compared to where it was prior to Lavin needs to have their head examined. If they get Jordan and Lawrence Lavin will finally have talent spread across three years and there will be no turning back. Hopefully the fan base will rally and we can get more than 6k at MSG! Not an excuse, but maybe if there were 12k of rabid fans there last night the Johnnies would have had a little more energy.
 
I'm not upset but just tired of poor performances by players and coaches
Do we really have only one player who can score ?
Do we have only one player who can make free throws ?
Do we really have one players who gets steals and rebounds ?
Harrison to me is the only player who showing the heart ,effort and emotion.besides the frosh center swatting blocks everywhere
The coaches have me baffled. We finally have more players to play from last years 6-7(maybe rotation) and we are still doing it.We have like ten guys on the bench including walk-ons and you can't put them in ? WHY? Get a spark , get a chemistry going, explain to these kids that you need to prove yourself.Work on free throws , Run the ball - your half court offense is terrible. No ball movement , no one is moving - just standing there and waiting for Harrison to make a big shot or pass.St.Johns have great coaches on the bench - does anyone talk to these kids about passing?The one postive thing is , they play hard......sound familar- always plays hard and all the other coaches said- St.Johns plays hard but can't shoot. Can't shoot - mid range , no post up players , Nothing. I see highschool kids , who will never make it to next level or even 7 year olds in CYO or rec league and shoot better, play the game right , pass the ball , movement - Basic basketball. Stop with the young stuff - Enough ! Go play the movie Hoosiers for this college team . Make them run everytime they miss a foul shot or turnover! Bring Bobby Knight in to talk to them ... Something ! Just get the feeling ..... whatever being told to them is going in one ear and out the other -
 
We are one non foul (Garrett foul in Nova game on three pointer) and one shot (D'Lo or Sampson hitting a shot at end of Rutgers game) from being 3-0. I know you can make the arguement that we are also one missed shot from being 0-3, but we are playing competitive games in Big East again. 4 years ago we were getting blown about by 30 every game with a handful of wins against Rutgets, SFLA, Seton Hall etc. Next year is an important year considering Lavin had to build from scratch. I think getting Jordan and Lawrence is more important than a .500 record this year becuase it continues the build.

I was however acting like a child last night when we lost.
 
We are one non foul (Garrett foul in Nova game on three pointer) and one shot (D'Lo or Sampson hitting a shot at end of Rutgers game) from being 3-0. I know you can make the arguement that we are also one missed shot from being 0-3, but we are playing competitive games in Big East again. 4 years ago we were getting blown about by 30 every game with a handful of wins against Rutgets, SFLA, Seton Hall etc. Next year is an important year considering Lavin had to build from scratch. I think getting Jordan and Lawrence is more important than a .500 record this year becuase it continues the build.

I was however acting like a child last night when we lost.

You know what it's called when you almost win a game? A loss

I go back to a line I heard Bill Parcells say one day. As time goes on, people forget about penalties or mistakes or unlucky bounces. All they do is go back, look at the box score, and see whether the team won or lost. And as of right now, St. John's is 1-2 in the Big East. Not 3-0.
 
You are right, however you can't deny progress. And you have to realistically look at how the team is being built. I am as frustrated as anyone, but we need to keep things in context. If those two plays went our way we would be talking about them as a tournament team. They aren't as bad as people are depicting here and they aren't a tournament team.
 
Red Johnnies...said very well.

I was more frustrated then ever last night because I truly felt like they needed this game. With the next two games being Gtown and ND a 1-4 record is highly likely.

That being said, anyone who questions where this program is compared to where it was prior to Lavin needs to have their head examined. If they get Jordan and Lawrence Lavin will finally have talent spread across three years and there will be no turning back. Hopefully the fan base will rally and we can get more than 6k at MSG! Not an excuse, but maybe if there were 12k of rabid fans there last night the Johnnies would have had a little more energy.

"If".
Who cares about Jordan and Lawrence right now? This team has enough talent to beat a Nova on the road and enough talent to beat a Rutgers at MSG of all places.

What incentive do fans have to come out? At least our excuse last year was that there were only 6 players and you knew everyone would play hard and give it their all.

This team has 2 set plays in its offensive Playbook from what I have seen watching closely this year:
1. Horns- which is a curl play for D'Angelo which is always called on out of bounds plays
2. Some play call (I don't know the name) to get Jakarr a 16-18 foot jumper

That's it. Everything else is just a pray & chuck from D'Angelo or Phil. That is unacceptable.

Guys like Mike Rice can't hold a candle to Steve Lavin's legacy. So why are we being so severely out coached? Why does Marco get a token 2 minutes then yanked for no apparent reason? Why does the offense look more fluid when Branch is out there and he gets yanked? Why does Lavin call (re: bur) timeouts just to talk to the players and not draw anything up?

This is so frustrating. It doesn't take much game tape for another team to watch to figure us out.

We watched D'Angelo repeatedly split the double team, get in the lane and dish it or easy baskets against Rutgers. Phil Greene hasn't done tat once this year. Why does he have the keys to the car?

You can't give an alumnus, a student or a curious tourist reason enough to pay to watch this team play. Sorry.
 
You are right, however you can't deny progress. And you have to realistically look at how the team is being built. I am as frustrated as anyone, but we need to keep things in context. If those two plays went our way we would be talking about them as a tournament team. They aren't as bad as people are depicting here and they aren't a tournament team.

Listen, I love this team and I'm hoping that it takes big strides as the season progresses. But if you would've asked the average fan if they expected losses to San Francisco, UNC Asheville, Villanova, and Rutgers this year, my guess is they would've said no.

People can talk about this and talk about that, but here's the fundamental problem. There is only 1 player on the court who can create his own shot. Nobody else has shown that ability yet. And defenses smartly have become aware of this and play us as such.

If Lavin wanted to combat this, he would put Branch on the court and would also give a few more minutes to Bourgault, who seems to have a real nice shot from the wing (although he is incapable of creating anything by himself). If you put a spot up shooter out there, maybe it changes the tempo of the game. And maybe it doesn't. But since our coaching staff is basically afraid to try anything new in gametime, I guess we'll just continue to talk about the same problems game after game.
 
We are one non foul (Garrett foul in Nova game on three pointer) and one shot (D'Lo or Sampson hitting a shot at end of Rutgers game) from being 3-0. I know you can make the arguement that we are also one missed shot from being 0-3, but we are playing competitive games in Big East again. 4 years ago we were getting blown about by 30 every game with a handful of wins against Rutgets, SFLA, Seton Hall etc. Next year is an important year considering Lavin had to build from scratch. I think getting Jordan and Lawrence is more important than a .500 record this year becuase it continues the build.

I was however acting like a child last night when we lost.

Same sentiment- I remember being at games from 01-09 feeling embarrassed midway through the 2nd half , now when I go its exciting- we have a good shot to beat any team in the Big East on a given night, we couldn't say that 4+ yrs ago.

I really think we should be looking at this season as Lavin's first real season. He was coaching Norm's guys, all of whom seniors and each player knew what the other was capable of. He inherited a good group of players, character individuals as well. He was diagnosed with cancer during the season and only made it public when the season was over. Coached 4 games with only 6/9 players from that heralded recruiting class the next year. Now he is back on the sideline full time with only 4 players from last year and a group of freshman that need to develop. It's clear that Marco can shoot, but not the same JUCO player as Brownlee or Hardy.

This his is first true season with HIS players that HE recruited, give it some time fellas- this team will make you smile this year...and be prepared to lose some hair along way as well lol. Future is bright.
 
Red Johnnies...said very well.

I was more frustrated then ever last night because I truly felt like they needed this game. With the next two games being Gtown and ND a 1-4 record is highly likely.

That being said, anyone who questions where this program is compared to where it was prior to Lavin needs to have their head examined. If they get Jordan and Lawrence Lavin will finally have talent spread across three years and there will be no turning back. Hopefully the fan base will rally and we can get more than 6k at MSG! Not an excuse, but maybe if there were 12k of rabid fans there last night the Johnnies would have had a little more energy.

"If".
Who cares about Jordan and Lawrence right now? This team has enough talent to beat a Nova on the road and enough talent to beat a Rutgers at MSG of all places.

What incentive do fans have to come out? At least our excuse last year was that there were only 6 players and you knew everyone would play hard and give it their all.

This team has 2 set plays in its offensive Playbook from what I have seen watching closely this year:
1. Horns- which is a curl play for D'Angelo which is always called on out of bounds plays
2. Some play call (I don't know the name) to get Jakarr a 16-18 foot jumper

That's it. Everything else is just a pray & chuck from D'Angelo or Phil. That is unacceptable.

Guys like Mike Rice can't hold a candle to Steve Lavin's legacy. So why are we being so severely out coached? Why does Marco get a token 2 minutes then yanked for no apparent reason? Why does the offense look more fluid when Branch is out there and he gets yanked? Why does Lavin call (re: bur) timeouts just to talk to the players and not draw anything up?

This is so frustrating. It doesn't take much game tape for another team to watch to figure us out.

We watched D'Angelo repeatedly split the double team, get in the lane and dish it or easy baskets against Rutgers. Phil Greene hasn't done tat once this year. Why does he have the keys to the car?

You can't give an alumnus, a student or a curious tourist reason enough to pay to watch this team play. Sorry.

This is why I would care about Jordan and Lawrence right now. If nothing is going to change then we just need to hope we can throw enough talent on the court in the future to win despite the lack of coaching. If we're going to play like an AAU showcase team, might as well want the best players.
 
We are one non foul (Garrett foul in Nova game on three pointer) and one shot (D'Lo or Sampson hitting a shot at end of Rutgers game) from being 3-0. I know you can make the arguement that we are also one missed shot from being 0-3, but we are playing competitive games in Big East again. 4 years ago we were getting blown about by 30 every game with a handful of wins against Rutgets, SFLA, Seton Hall etc. Next year is an important year considering Lavin had to build from scratch. I think getting Jordan and Lawrence is more important than a .500 record this year becuase it continues the build.

I was however acting like a child last night when we lost.

Same sentiment- I remember being at games from 01-09 feeling embarrassed midway through the 2nd half , now when I go its exciting- we have a good shot to beat any team in the Big East on a given night, we couldn't say that 4+ yrs ago.

I really think we should be looking at this season as Lavin's first real season. He was coaching Norm's guys, all of whom seniors and each player knew what the other was capable of. He inherited a good group of players, character individuals as well. He was diagnosed with cancer during the season and only made it public when the season was over. Coached 4 games with only 6/9 players from that heralded recruiting class the next year. Now he is back on the sideline full time with only 4 players from last year and a group of freshman that need to develop. It's clear that Marco can shoot, but not the same JUCO player as Brownlee or Hardy.

This his is first true season with HIS players that HE recruited, give it some time fellas- this team will make you smile this year...and be prepared to lose some hair along way as well lol. Future is bright.

This kind of mindset is an excuse. And I'm tired of excuses.

The product we see on the floor comes from preparation or lack thereof.

We act like we're the only team in the nation that loses players or has to deal with controversies.
 
Red Johnnies...said very well.

I was more frustrated then ever last night because I truly felt like they needed this game. With the next two games being Gtown and ND a 1-4 record is highly likely.

That being said, anyone who questions where this program is compared to where it was prior to Lavin needs to have their head examined. If they get Jordan and Lawrence Lavin will finally have talent spread across three years and there will be no turning back. Hopefully the fan base will rally and we can get more than 6k at MSG! Not an excuse, but maybe if there were 12k of rabid fans there last night the Johnnies would have had a little more energy.

"If".
Who cares about Jordan and Lawrence right now? This team has enough talent to beat a Nova on the road and enough talent to beat a Rutgers at MSG of all places.

What incentive do fans have to come out? At least our excuse last year was that there were only 6 players and you knew everyone would play hard and give it their all.

This team has 2 set plays in its offensive Playbook from what I have seen watching closely this year:
1. Horns- which is a curl play for D'Angelo which is always called on out of bounds plays
2. Some play call (I don't know the name) to get Jakarr a 16-18 foot jumper

That's it. Everything else is just a pray & chuck from D'Angelo or Phil. That is unacceptable.

Guys like Mike Rice can't hold a candle to Steve Lavin's legacy. So why are we being so severely out coached? Why does Marco get a token 2 minutes then yanked for no apparent reason? Why does the offense look more fluid when Branch is out there and he gets yanked? Why does Lavin call (re: bur) timeouts just to talk to the players and not draw anything up?

This is so frustrating. It doesn't take much game tape for another team to watch to figure us out.

We watched D'Angelo repeatedly split the double team, get in the lane and dish it or easy baskets against Rutgers. Phil Greene hasn't done tat once this year. Why does he have the keys to the car?

You can't give an alumnus, a student or a curious tourist reason enough to pay to watch this team play. Sorry.

This is why I would care about Jordan and Lawrence right now. If nothing is going to change then we just need to hope we can throw enough talent on the court in the future to win despite the lack of coaching. If we're going to play like an AAU showcase team, might as well want the best players.

I understand your point. But that is a scary mentality to have.

If what you're saying is actually the case, then Baron Davis was right on the money. Is this prideful fan base ready to admit that?
 
Why because we lost a close game does it mean Lavin can't coach? Not every game is going to be a blowout. We didn't make free throws...man our coach stinks. Sampson took some stupid shots, man Lavin sucks.. Cmon people... It's getting absurd already.

What was wrong with the strategy yesterday? Nothing.. We defended pretty well and it the glass. We just didn't make shots at times only have one guy why can score which is Harrison. My only real criticism yesterday is that Branch didn't play nearly enough because he's a lot better PG than Phil Greene. Greene is best off the ball.
 
Red Johnnies...said very well.

I was more frustrated then ever last night because I truly felt like they needed this game. With the next two games being Gtown and ND a 1-4 record is highly likely.

That being said, anyone who questions where this program is compared to where it was prior to Lavin needs to have their head examined. If they get Jordan and Lawrence Lavin will finally have talent spread across three years and there will be no turning back. Hopefully the fan base will rally and we can get more than 6k at MSG! Not an excuse, but maybe if there were 12k of rabid fans there last night the Johnnies would have had a little more energy.

"If".
Who cares about Jordan and Lawrence right now? This team has enough talent to beat a Nova on the road and enough talent to beat a Rutgers at MSG of all places.

What incentive do fans have to come out? At least our excuse last year was that there were only 6 players and you knew everyone would play hard and give it their all.

This team has 2 set plays in its offensive Playbook from what I have seen watching closely this year:
1. Horns- which is a curl play for D'Angelo which is always called on out of bounds plays
2. Some play call (I don't know the name) to get Jakarr a 16-18 foot jumper

That's it. Everything else is just a pray & chuck from D'Angelo or Phil. That is unacceptable.

Guys like Mike Rice can't hold a candle to Steve Lavin's legacy. So why are we being so severely out coached? Why does Marco get a token 2 minutes then yanked for no apparent reason? Why does the offense look more fluid when Branch is out there and he gets yanked? Why does Lavin call (re: bur) timeouts just to talk to the players and not draw anything up?

This is so frustrating. It doesn't take much game tape for another team to watch to figure us out.

We watched D'Angelo repeatedly split the double team, get in the lane and dish it or easy baskets against Rutgers. Phil Greene hasn't done tat once this year. Why does he have the keys to the car?

You can't give an alumnus, a student or a curious tourist reason enough to pay to watch this team play. Sorry.

This is why I would care about Jordan and Lawrence right now. If nothing is going to change then we just need to hope we can throw enough talent on the court in the future to win despite the lack of coaching. If we're going to play like an AAU showcase team, might as well want the best players.

I understand your point. But that is a scary mentality to have.

If what you're saying is actually the case, then Baron Davis was right on the money. Is this prideful fan base ready to admit that?

You mean the same Baron Davis who still comes to practice with SJU and keeps a close friendship with Lavin? I know what you are speaking about, but he has back tracked on that comment about Lavin.
 
Why because we lost a close game does it mean Lavin can't coach? Not every game is going to be a blowout. We didn't make free throws...man our coach stinks. Sampson took some stupid shots, man Lavin sucks.. Cmon people... It's getting absurd already.

I was pissed just as much as everyone else here after last night's debacle. But I agree with you, thsiplace should be the next setting for "American Horror Story -- Redmen.com."

It is nuts.
 
Back
Top