Roster
- Thread starter ccnobz
- Start date
I post this at the risk of being repetitive. I am trying a different approach, looking at potential minutes. Last time I try to suggest the roster isn't a mess, I promise, well, until the games start.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.
I will have a much better idea when I see the new guys in November but right now I feel like fifth place in the Big East and the team makes the NCAA tournament. I expect them to be picked lower than that in preseason predictions by scribes and the Big East coaches.
If they make the tournament I'm happy. If they actually win a game in the tournament I'm even happier. Anything more I can't contain myself. If those low standards make me part of some type of problem I apologize! My wife isn't a supermodel and yet I'm happy with her too, and I don't know anyone who thinks I shouldn't be.
Unless Union Turnpike has been moved to Lexington today (as of last night it was still in Queens) I think the analogy holds up.
If they make the tournament I'm happy. If they actually win a game in the tournament I'm even happier. Anything more I can't contain myself. If those low standards make me part of some type of problem I apologize! My wife isn't a supermodel and yet I'm happy with her too, and I don't know anyone who thinks I shouldn't be.
Unless Union Turnpike has been moved to Lexington today (as of last night it was still in Queens) I think the analogy holds up.
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Ray Morgan
Well-known member
There are going to be nights when everything is falling, and size won't matter. We have ample scoring, even from 3. Can't get stuck into half court games of attrition. If we know one thing about bigs, especially those who have not logged a lot of floor time, it's that they are foul prone. The refs are just looking to blow the whistle on the big bodies, and the opposing coaches know that more than us. Going to have to play small when that happens. I expect a lot of transition offense and a record number of 3s from our offense. Gang rebounding must happen. We lose shot blocking, but that never did us much good in the win/loss column anyway. Should be an exciting team. Not sure of the ceiling, but NCAA seems within reach.
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Knight" post=284711]Sweet 16?
Let's go to the dance before we plan on the after party.[/quote]
I disagree completely. I think it's a tired old sports theory that applies more to sports with monstrous rosters. You can go far out of the blue in a sport where only five guys are out there at the same time. You just need the right five guys.
Let's go to the dance before we plan on the after party.[/quote]
I disagree completely. I think it's a tired old sports theory that applies more to sports with monstrous rosters. You can go far out of the blue in a sport where only five guys are out there at the same time. You just need the right five guys.
IDRAFT wrote: I post this at the risk of being repetitive. I am trying a different approach, looking at potential minutes. Last time I try to suggest the roster isn't a mess, I promise, well, until the games start.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.
IDRAFT, excellent well-reasoned post. I think I'd take a couple of minutes off projected PT for Simon, Clark, Trimble & Williams and add a couple to Figueroa & Dixon. If we did have the second big, I'd also take a couple of minutes of Keita's PT and perhaps another minute or two off Trimble/Williams. However, there is no question that we'd be hard pressed to find more than 10-15 minutes pg for a second big unless he took some more PT from Keita or Clark. Based on some of the grad transfer signings, I expect there are/were some lesser skilled players who'd take that from a potential tourney team, but at this point, I agree we have what we have. Also agree that 4th or 5th place in BE is attainable if Ponds returns, Keita can stay on the floor and we stay healthy; would be very happy with that achievement. Looking forward to next year. Should be an entertaining team to watch.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.
IDRAFT, excellent well-reasoned post. I think I'd take a couple of minutes off projected PT for Simon, Clark, Trimble & Williams and add a couple to Figueroa & Dixon. If we did have the second big, I'd also take a couple of minutes of Keita's PT and perhaps another minute or two off Trimble/Williams. However, there is no question that we'd be hard pressed to find more than 10-15 minutes pg for a second big unless he took some more PT from Keita or Clark. Based on some of the grad transfer signings, I expect there are/were some lesser skilled players who'd take that from a potential tourney team, but at this point, I agree we have what we have. Also agree that 4th or 5th place in BE is attainable if Ponds returns, Keita can stay on the floor and we stay healthy; would be very happy with that achievement. Looking forward to next year. Should be an entertaining team to watch.
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=284710]Section9 wrote: Paultzman wrote:
Section9 wrote:
Paultzman wrote:
JohnnyFan wrote: Everybody loving the three point shot....huh? Sure hope they make them. Certainly won't be cleaning up on the boards.
I wonder if a more balanced attack would be wise? ......Nah, silly me.
Plus an inside out game with post players of consequence is a key element of three point shooting success. I know some guys have penciled in Keita as capable inside threat, but let’s see. Of course the grad big “ghost” may have helped in this regard also. Oh well.
I get it that an inside post presence on the offensive end would be nice, but that's not the style of play that Chris favors. He wants versatile quick players who can play multiple positions, create in the open court, slash to the basket and hit outside shots. A lot of potential recruits cite the fact that he runs a pro style offense and the game is more free-flowing. That's the way this roster is set up.
Didn't at least one potential late signing period big shy away when he realized he wouldn't be getting touches in the paint? That's why TO pulled up stakes and headed out because he and Daddy wanted to hoist up jumpers and 3 pointers and there were at least three guys who, justifiably so, were going to take priority.
Instead of harping on the lack of big men give this team a chance, there's some nice pieces in place for next year, especially if Shamorie returns.
The fact that Matt pursued two talented ready to play bigs even before Owens left confirms staff felt there was a need. The Cameroon kid who committed to UNLV was high on their list because he could help on both ends of court. I get why you are tired of this discussion, but also understand the disappointment of others. We fanned two years in a row on a grad big and hard to be happy about that.
If you acknowledge that we are an outside shooting/slashing offense with the bigs getting short shrift in the post, why would a grad transfer big, with one year of eligibility want to come here unless he's content with that roll?
As far as Owens' situation regarding potential big transfers, there were rumors late in the season that he was on the way out. Last game at CA during pre game warmups, while most of the guys were practicing shooting dribbling, two on twos, etc. Owens was at halfcourt absentmindedly dribbling the ball and bopping to the music, he was gone.
Section9, whether or not we were looking for another big before we knew Owens was gone, we were certainly going after that big as soon as we knew he was gone. Yes we are primarily a guard/wing oriented offense, but that presumes we have one big on the floor for rebounding, defense, rim protection and floor spacing. I know of no major conference teams that succeeded w/o at least one big on the floor most of the time. When I said that I feared that our failure to get that second big was going to come back to bite us on several occasions, I meant during BE play not in the tournament. If we are able to get through the season well enough to play in the dance, most fans (including this one) will be very pleased.[/quote]
Last year, when lovett was playing the starting five was lovett, Ponds, Clark, Ahmed and Simon, no big there. We did OK during the non conference schedule.
Section9 wrote:
Paultzman wrote:
JohnnyFan wrote: Everybody loving the three point shot....huh? Sure hope they make them. Certainly won't be cleaning up on the boards.
I wonder if a more balanced attack would be wise? ......Nah, silly me.
Plus an inside out game with post players of consequence is a key element of three point shooting success. I know some guys have penciled in Keita as capable inside threat, but let’s see. Of course the grad big “ghost” may have helped in this regard also. Oh well.
I get it that an inside post presence on the offensive end would be nice, but that's not the style of play that Chris favors. He wants versatile quick players who can play multiple positions, create in the open court, slash to the basket and hit outside shots. A lot of potential recruits cite the fact that he runs a pro style offense and the game is more free-flowing. That's the way this roster is set up.
Didn't at least one potential late signing period big shy away when he realized he wouldn't be getting touches in the paint? That's why TO pulled up stakes and headed out because he and Daddy wanted to hoist up jumpers and 3 pointers and there were at least three guys who, justifiably so, were going to take priority.
Instead of harping on the lack of big men give this team a chance, there's some nice pieces in place for next year, especially if Shamorie returns.
The fact that Matt pursued two talented ready to play bigs even before Owens left confirms staff felt there was a need. The Cameroon kid who committed to UNLV was high on their list because he could help on both ends of court. I get why you are tired of this discussion, but also understand the disappointment of others. We fanned two years in a row on a grad big and hard to be happy about that.
If you acknowledge that we are an outside shooting/slashing offense with the bigs getting short shrift in the post, why would a grad transfer big, with one year of eligibility want to come here unless he's content with that roll?
As far as Owens' situation regarding potential big transfers, there were rumors late in the season that he was on the way out. Last game at CA during pre game warmups, while most of the guys were practicing shooting dribbling, two on twos, etc. Owens was at halfcourt absentmindedly dribbling the ball and bopping to the music, he was gone.
Section9, whether or not we were looking for another big before we knew Owens was gone, we were certainly going after that big as soon as we knew he was gone. Yes we are primarily a guard/wing oriented offense, but that presumes we have one big on the floor for rebounding, defense, rim protection and floor spacing. I know of no major conference teams that succeeded w/o at least one big on the floor most of the time. When I said that I feared that our failure to get that second big was going to come back to bite us on several occasions, I meant during BE play not in the tournament. If we are able to get through the season well enough to play in the dance, most fans (including this one) will be very pleased.[/quote]
Last year, when lovett was playing the starting five was lovett, Ponds, Clark, Ahmed and Simon, no big there. We did OK during the non conference schedule.
[quote="OhioFan" post=284666][quote="L J S A" post=284665][quote="NCJohnnie" post=284662]
I will be very happy if I'm proven wrong, but expect the lack of a second big will come back to bite us on several occasions next season.[/quote]
It's be extremely painful if we have a high-octane offense and play exceptionally well all year, only to come to a grinding halt in the Sweet Sixteen because a flavor of the month mid-major has a big man who we couldn't stop.[/quote]
I would be extremely happy to be in the Sweet Sixteen, wouldn't you?[/quote]
I would hope so. I thought that post needed a smiley face.
I will be very happy if I'm proven wrong, but expect the lack of a second big will come back to bite us on several occasions next season.[/quote]
It's be extremely painful if we have a high-octane offense and play exceptionally well all year, only to come to a grinding halt in the Sweet Sixteen because a flavor of the month mid-major has a big man who we couldn't stop.[/quote]
I would be extremely happy to be in the Sweet Sixteen, wouldn't you?[/quote]
I would hope so. I thought that post needed a smiley face.
Section9 wrote: Last year, when lovett was playing the starting five was lovett, Ponds, Clark, Ahmed and Simon, no big there. We did OK during the non conference schedule.
Section9, I was talking about a major conference team having success (e.g. making the tournament) w/o at least one big playing most of the game. Lovett played in 7 non-conference games against New Orleans, Central Connecticut State, Molloy, Nebraska, Oregon State, UCF & Missouri. We lost to the only one of those teams that made the NCAA tournament (Missouri) although we did beat Nebraska who made the NIT. None of the others were close to being good enough to make post season play. Could we have been successful in the BE with that lineup and Owens not playing 30 minutes or more per game? We'll never know but I have my doubts. Owens played 39 and 37 minutes in our two biggest wins against Duke & Nova. In any event, we can agree to disagree on this one. That's what makes sports fun.
Section9, I was talking about a major conference team having success (e.g. making the tournament) w/o at least one big playing most of the game. Lovett played in 7 non-conference games against New Orleans, Central Connecticut State, Molloy, Nebraska, Oregon State, UCF & Missouri. We lost to the only one of those teams that made the NCAA tournament (Missouri) although we did beat Nebraska who made the NIT. None of the others were close to being good enough to make post season play. Could we have been successful in the BE with that lineup and Owens not playing 30 minutes or more per game? We'll never know but I have my doubts. Owens played 39 and 37 minutes in our two biggest wins against Duke & Nova. In any event, we can agree to disagree on this one. That's what makes sports fun.
This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp. 
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.
[quote="Paultzman" post=284750]This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?
[quote="L J S A" post=284665][quote="NCJohnnie" post=284662]
I will be very happy if I'm proven wrong, but expect the lack of a second big will come back to bite us on several occasions next season.[/quote]
It'll be extremely painful if we have a high-octane offense and play exceptionally well all year, only to come to a grinding halt in the Sweet Sixteen because a flavor of the month mid-major has a big man who we couldn't stop.[/quote]
I totally agree I don't think we have to wait to reach the Sweet 16 to have a big we can't handle. I think we will face that problem thru out the year. I am of the opinion, that you have to have a big that can clog the paint and make some shots when that very talented lineup is having an off night.
I will be very happy if I'm proven wrong, but expect the lack of a second big will come back to bite us on several occasions next season.[/quote]
It'll be extremely painful if we have a high-octane offense and play exceptionally well all year, only to come to a grinding halt in the Sweet Sixteen because a flavor of the month mid-major has a big man who we couldn't stop.[/quote]
I totally agree I don't think we have to wait to reach the Sweet 16 to have a big we can't handle. I think we will face that problem thru out the year. I am of the opinion, that you have to have a big that can clog the paint and make some shots when that very talented lineup is having an off night.
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[quote="Section9" post=284752][quote="Paultzman" post=284750]This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?[/quote]
Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a key piece for SJU apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?[/quote]
Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a key piece for SJU apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.
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Paultzman wrote: Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a center piece of SJU offense apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.
Paultz, it sounded like in this case the kid was really attracted to Nevada due to their track record of success with African players, including getting at least one to the NBA recently. Nevada would certainly have a big edge on us (and likely Gonzaga) in that regard.
Paultz, it sounded like in this case the kid was really attracted to Nevada due to their track record of success with African players, including getting at least one to the NBA recently. Nevada would certainly have a big edge on us (and likely Gonzaga) in that regard.
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[quote="NCJohnnie" post=284757]Paultzman wrote: Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a center piece of SJU offense apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.
Paultz, it sounded like in this case the kid was really attracted to Nevada due to their track record of success with African players, including getting at least one to the NBA recently. Nevada would certainly have a big edge on us (and likely Gonzaga) in that regard.[/quote]
No doubt. I was trying to say the notion we were going small ball all along does not line up with staff’s recognition of need to bolster interior with quality, not stop gap players. This was a three team battle all along, but Matt apparently felt we had a real chance. I applaud that effort.
My last comment ever on big void; staff knew we had the need last year and Matt worked hard to address it, but, for whatever reason, it did not materialize. This year was the same and was not a secondary consideration. Coming up short again is what is is, but disappointing imo.
Hopefully this team, which I like, avoids an interior injury and manages to effectively play the Mullin style of play alluded to here so often.
Paultz, it sounded like in this case the kid was really attracted to Nevada due to their track record of success with African players, including getting at least one to the NBA recently. Nevada would certainly have a big edge on us (and likely Gonzaga) in that regard.[/quote]
No doubt. I was trying to say the notion we were going small ball all along does not line up with staff’s recognition of need to bolster interior with quality, not stop gap players. This was a three team battle all along, but Matt apparently felt we had a real chance. I applaud that effort.
My last comment ever on big void; staff knew we had the need last year and Matt worked hard to address it, but, for whatever reason, it did not materialize. This year was the same and was not a secondary consideration. Coming up short again is what is is, but disappointing imo.
Hopefully this team, which I like, avoids an interior injury and manages to effectively play the Mullin style of play alluded to here so often.
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[quote="Paultzman" post=284755][quote="Section9" post=284752][quote="Paultzman" post=284750]This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?[/quote]
Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a center piece of SJU offense apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.[/quote]
I don't doubt he was pursued, nor do I doubt that they had wanted Owens to stay. I'm with them on Owens and wish they had handled Yakwe better and/or Yakwe was more accepting of a limited role as a senior. I don't think there is any question that not having another quality big is a problem, only is it a fatal one? We will find out.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote]
Don't you think that Chris is telling Kofi he'd get big minutes and see the ball in the post. There's a big difference between him and almost all the other transfer/jucos bigs mentioned here. Kofi deserves to see the ball and you can bet he will if he comes. The other cast of characters probably didn't deserve to be featured, even though their inflated egos thought they should.
There is no way I believe Chris wouldn't want and feature a big like Kofi, otherwise why bother putting in the effort?[/quote]
Kid’s and handlers look at results and style of play obviously. The Cameroon interior kid was pursued as a center piece of SJU offense apparently, but chose another program. Can tell you with certainty he was viewed as a high quality player, not a stop gap. When we whiff on a kid, so often we tend to rationalize.[/quote]
I don't doubt he was pursued, nor do I doubt that they had wanted Owens to stay. I'm with them on Owens and wish they had handled Yakwe better and/or Yakwe was more accepting of a limited role as a senior. I don't think there is any question that not having another quality big is a problem, only is it a fatal one? We will find out.
Dan V
Well-known member
[quote="Paultzman" post=284750]This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote] He is not the only guy out there, if we cant get him than we just need to find someone else. Assuming Matt is trying his best, it is what it is. Lets not act like Kofi was a ever a lock. He has bluebloods looking at him, not really the type of recruit we've had any luck with. Not trying to attack you or anything just saying.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote] He is not the only guy out there, if we cant get him than we just need to find someone else. Assuming Matt is trying his best, it is what it is. Lets not act like Kofi was a ever a lock. He has bluebloods looking at him, not really the type of recruit we've had any luck with. Not trying to attack you or anything just saying.
[quote="Dan V" post=284770][quote="Paultzman" post=284750]This “small ball” mantra being a center piece of Chris’ offensive desires should really be appealing to Kofi’s camp.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote] He is not the only guy out there, if we cant get him than we just need to find someone else. Assuming Matt is trying his best, it is what it is. Lets not act like Kofi was a ever a lock. He has bluebloods looking at him, not really the type of recruit we've had any luck with. Not trying to attack you or anything just saying.[/quote]
Never thought he or anyone we recruit is a lock. Heard a while ago he may want stay home and we had a shot. Nothing more than that.
Btw, local hoops reporter told me Hurley & Kimani Young have made Kofi a huge priority. Relative proximity to home, which apparently is an interest of his family, is a plus, as well as big minutes out of the gate.[/quote] He is not the only guy out there, if we cant get him than we just need to find someone else. Assuming Matt is trying his best, it is what it is. Lets not act like Kofi was a ever a lock. He has bluebloods looking at him, not really the type of recruit we've had any luck with. Not trying to attack you or anything just saying.[/quote]
Never thought he or anyone we recruit is a lock. Heard a while ago he may want stay home and we had a shot. Nothing more than that.
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[quote="IDRAFT" post=284720]I post this at the risk of being repetitive. I am trying a different approach, looking at potential minutes. Last time I try to suggest the roster isn't a mess, I promise, well, until the games start.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.[/quote]
Thanks for putting this together. I had just asked about it anothet thrread before seeing this. I've been one who's been on record saying we are not a popular destination for a grad big because we don't have the minutes to offer, well you proved it.
Plus something we all don't even realize is what was promised to these kids to even get them to agree to come here. Did we promise Figeroa a starting job and 20+ mins? Did we promise Keita 25+ mins? If we did, then can't go against our word.
Understanding that we haven't seen many of these players yet I propose the following as a conservative estimate of average minute distribution for next year. Keep in mind it is all based on Ponds return, which seems to be the staffs assumption too.
Ponds - 33
Simon - 33
Clark - 30
Keita - 25
Dixon - 20
Figeruoa - 20
Trimble - 15
Williams - 15
Remaining Roster - 9
Those numbers add. I took the minutes for our best two players down from last year since we played with such a short roster. I took Clark down a minute. Keita would only play a little over half a game, Dixon and Figerora only half. Trimble would play two less minutes a game as a sophmore. Williams, a higher rated player, would play two less minutes a game than Trimble was needed for last year (and a lot of that was in Big East play due to Lovett's "injury".)
Now I am on board that if we can find someone big, strong and talented to play the other nine minutes that would be grand. It is also easy to see why it is a tough sell, and why Owens took off. I still can't see how we could have gotten a committ from a starting player level big and also Figeruoa. Kids, especially immediately eligible players, would want minutes, no? A guy like Yakwe would fit what SJU needs and he transferred out as 12 minutes a game was not enough for him. I don't even think we have that available for him this year.
It's not that I do not think that size was a problem last year. It should be a weakness again. It's that most teams have strengths and weaknesses, the key is not to have too many of them. Our outside shooting was brutal last year. The idea that plugging in anyone with size will setup an inside/outside game is one way to free an outside shooter.. Another way is when a guard slashes and kicks out. We have two guards Ponds and Simon, that are excellent at that, which had as much to do with Clark leading the team in 3 Pt Percentage as anything else. If we added two more guys who can catch and shoot, and that's the big if, it will be a big deal.
I think there will certainly be games that we get abused inside and lose. It looks like the biggest issue. But I'm hopeful we will lose less games because nobody on the floor can hit an outside shot and we lost plenty of those last year too.
If Figueroa is bad the argument that we blew it by not using those minutes on a big is valid. If he does well it is only valid if his production isn't needed. You only get to play five guys at a time.[/quote]
Thanks for putting this together. I had just asked about it anothet thrread before seeing this. I've been one who's been on record saying we are not a popular destination for a grad big because we don't have the minutes to offer, well you proved it.
Plus something we all don't even realize is what was promised to these kids to even get them to agree to come here. Did we promise Figeroa a starting job and 20+ mins? Did we promise Keita 25+ mins? If we did, then can't go against our word.