Recruits for next year?

[Marillac]

If Lavin's recruiting has been so good than why didn't StJohns do better than a 5 seed in the Big East Tournamapent? ..... or beat Robert Morris?

You gotta be kidding, right? Do you think those things directly correlate with his recruiting? Indirectly, that's a possibility, but certainly not directly.

If that's the case, then you may wanna question the recruits of many teams who were a particular seed and bounced by a "supposed" inferior opponent.

The fact that he chooses to label us as a the five seed instead of tied for third place shows you the angle he wants to view things from. There is nothing that can be done with guys that want to see things there way. He started the same nonsense weeks before Lavin signed a top 25 recruit last year and if Lavin signed two more this year, he'd be right about at it next year if we didn't have someone signed. It's easy to see he's a Yankees fan...no way in the world does he have the patience to be a Mets fan.

Give me a sub-3.00 era from Wheeler this year and good progress on Harvey's rehab, and I can take 90 losses with a smile.

 

[MJDinkins]

Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach, but this season is baffling me. But I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on recruiting.

.......... If Mr.Lavin has done such a great job recruiting [your term: "beyond reproach"] during each of his 4 years at StJohns then please explain why StJohns (a) came in 5th place in the Big East regular season, (b) failed to qualify for the NCAA Tournament, (c) lost first round in the NIT, (d) has reportedly made 14 scholarship offers during the 2014 recruiting cycle but has failed to secure any recruits, and (e) has failed to secure any recruits for the 2015 cycle despite the fact many schools have already secured one or more quality players for the 2015 cycle?

(a) they tied for 3rd place.
(b) their record wasn't good enough.
(c) they were outscored.
(d) they would't give Whitehead's coach a job.

+1
And the notion that we actually recruited 14 players from this class is laughable.
Besides McCullough and Whitehead who else did they even go to watch play?
Lavin has his faults but he didn't go 0-14 with recruits this year. He de emphasized this class and concentrated on 2015, which I think is a mistake. But he didn't go 0-14. He's too good of a recruiter for that to happen

Desco, they did also aggressively go after Terrell, Abu and Paschal Chuwku. They came in late, but tried.

Paul, I didn't realize they had gone after Chuwku. What do you think of him? Not too many players from Prep make it in D1. Do you think Chuwku is the real deal?

I heard he's raw. Could take him a year or two. Not saying, he can't help the Friars while he work out the kinks in his game.

 

[1and1sju]

Otis I think you are discounting his second full class. Bringing in Obekpa and Sanchez was a big deal, and convincing Jakarr to come back was probably the second best signing of his SJU tenure.

I may have misspoke when I said above reproach, but I think his recruiting ability is top notch. My two concerns on the recruiting front have nothing to do with his ability, they are 1) that his strategy of focusing on 2015 could backfire, and 2) that the lack of winning and reputation he's getting will cause future recruits to tune him out. I know not everyone agrees, but going forward those things worry me. But overall recruiting is the least of my issues with this staff.

 

[JohnnyFan]

Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach, but this season is baffling me. But I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on recruiting.

.......... Rivals claims StJohns offered 14 recruits during the 2014 cycle, Scout claims Lavin offered 7 recruits, ESPN claims 6. ... but in the final analysis, it doesn't really matter whether Lavin offered 14, 7 or even zero because StJohns has zero recruits coming in next year with the possible exception of transfer Joey DeLaRosa, his brother or some unknown player found during a late scramble. The recently completed season was a disappointment to all but a few StJohns fans yet Lavin has seemingly failed to bring in any new talent into the program for improvement while most Big East teams have reloaded.

So Yeah, I disagree with the above quote that Lavin's recruiting is so good that it is beyond reproach.

IMO after his first season at StJohns Lavin has by and large brought in talent that has proven to be "pretty good" (Sanchez and Obekpa) to "mediocre" (Balamou, Bourgault, Jones, Hooper, Joey DeLaRosa) with just one big time recruit (Jordan) during the last 3 cycles.

If Lavin's recruiting has been so good than why didn't StJohns do better than a 5 seed in the Big East Tournamapent? ..... or beat Robert Morris?

I regret that my remarks are seen as "negative" but to me saying that " Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach" is at best, wishful thinking.

You keep coming back how many recruits Rivals says we offered (probably not the best barometer) and whiffed on. The year is still not over. What if Calipari whiffed on 30 recruits this year? Would everything he has done be wiped out? I'm not saying Lavn is Calipari, but applying the logic you use to back up your arguments it would render his past accomplishments worthless. Lavin can recruit. Can he instill toughness in his guys? Not that I've seen. Can he develop players? Debatable. Is he an x's and o's guru? I'd want him drawing up plays as much as I would want Otis to lead a St. John's pep rally.

It's hard for me to understand why you want Lavin to coach this team after the way you just described his coaching abilities. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but it would seem like you are completely comfortable having your head coach be a one dimensional (recruiting) threat. Unless, of course, Otis is a phenomenal pep rally leader.

Personally, I think it is settling. There are coaches that can do both.

 

[redmannorth]

If Lavin's recruiting has been so good than why didn't StJohns do better than a 5 seed in the Big East Tournamapent? ..... or beat Robert Morris?

You gotta be kidding, right? Do you think those things directly correlate with his recruiting? Indirectly, that's a possibility, but certainly not directly.

If that's the case, then you may wanna question the recruits of many teams who were a particular seed and bounced by a "supposed" inferior opponent.

The fact that he chooses to label us as a the five seed instead of tied for third place shows you the angle he wants to view things from. There is nothing that can be done with guys that want to see things there way. He started the same nonsense weeks before Lavin signed a top 25 recruit last year and if Lavin signed two more this year, he'd be right about at it next year if we didn't have someone signed. It's easy to see he's a Yankees fan...no way in the world does he have the patience to be a Mets fan.

Give me a sub-3.00 era from Wheeler this year and good progress on Harvey's rehab, and I can take 90 losses with a smile.

Marillac the exact same logic would work with everything you have to say. You can also be labeled as someone who wants to see things their way. You want to be optimistic about the future of this team great , that is your perogative but it certainly does not mean you are right by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortunately the similarities with what transpired at UCLA are far too numerous.
There are those who see 20 wins and see progress. There are those who see 20 wins in a greatly weakened conference with a very experienced team and no recruits committed and are seriously concerned. Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.
I understand fully well Coach Lavin will not be fired and if he were to leave it would be on his own volition. I also understand that we are capable of winning 25 games next season and bring in a great recruiting class.
However to knock other posters because they don't share your opinion is flat out near sighted on your part.

 

[JohnnyFan]

@CasualHoya: Temple transfer Anthony Lee is reportedly visiting Georgetown today.

6'9" and is eligible to play next year (Graduate Transfer Rule). We should be all over this guy.

 

[MJDinkins]

Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.

The team and staff certainly underachieved this season, IMO. You'll get no argument from me (or, most posters) there. But let me ask you something.... I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, either.

But if those same two posters who you feel analyze the play of the team and coaching staff was enamoured with the team and staff or 'on the fence,' then would you still pay attention to them? Or, are you paying attention to them because they are saying what you wanna hear? If the latter, then you're basically (indirectly) doing the same as you believe Marillac is doing.

Just asking an honest question.

 

[paultzman]

Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach, but this season is baffling me. But I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on recruiting.

.......... If Mr.Lavin has done such a great job recruiting [your term: "beyond reproach"] during each of his 4 years at StJohns then please explain why StJohns (a) came in 5th place in the Big East regular season, (b) failed to qualify for the NCAA Tournament, (c) lost first round in the NIT, (d) has reportedly made 14 scholarship offers during the 2014 recruiting cycle but has failed to secure any recruits, and (e) has failed to secure any recruits for the 2015 cycle despite the fact many schools have already secured one or more quality players for the 2015 cycle?

(a) they tied for 3rd place.
(b) their record wasn't good enough.
(c) they were outscored.
(d) they would't give Whitehead's coach a job.

+1
And the notion that we actually recruited 14 players from this class is laughable.
Besides McCullough and Whitehead who else did they even go to watch play?
Lavin has his faults but he didn't go 0-14 with recruits this year. He de emphasized this class and concentrated on 2015, which I think is a mistake. But he didn't go 0-14. He's too good of a recruiter for that to happen

Desco, they did also aggressively go after Terrell, Abu and Paschal Chuwku. They came in late, but tried.

Paul, I didn't realize they had gone after Chuwku. What do you think of him? Not too many players from Prep make it in D1. Do you think Chuwku is the real deal?

Saw him twice in last week in State playoffs & several times last year. He has improved a lot and is a game changer on defense, tremendous shot blocker. His offense is still a work in progress. As he works on his balance, strength & moves in the post, he should have tools to be very good BE player by second or third year at PC. Although competition in Ct. is not super, Fairfield Prep is well coached & should win it all tonight. One guard has a MAAC offer and an underclassman, Ryan Murphy, will be a D1 player.

 

[mkras99]

Paultz - gun to your head, Chukwu or Adonis as a four year guy?

 

[paultzman]

Paultz - gun to your head, Chukwu or Adonis as a four year guy?

Chukwu, because I think he will dominate on D one day. Don't see that in ADR, although he is more refined on offense.

 

[MJDinkins]

Paultz - gun to your head, Chukwu or Adonis as a four year guy?

I've only seen Chukwu on a couple of highlights, but I've seen De La Rosa play. Not sure how far off Chukwu's offensive game is at the moment. But De La Rosa has a decent, offensive game now. De La Rosa has a nice touch from about 12'-15'.

I'm not saying, De La Rosa will end up being the same player, but with some work De La Rosa may can mimic Roy Hibbert (who was 'under the radar' in HS).

 

[paultzman]

Paultz - gun to your head, Chukwu or Adonis as a four year guy?

I've only seen Chukwu on a couple of highlights, but I've seen De La Rosa play. Not sure how far off Chukwu's offensive game is at the moment. But De La Rosa has a decent, offensive game now. De La Rosa has a nice touch from about 12'-15'.

I'm not saying, De La Rosa will end up being the same player, but with some work De La Rosa may can mimic Roy Hibbert.

Interesting point. ADR does pass well & has a better sense of offense than Paschal now. If he works hard like Hibbert, who knows. Paschal btw has wing span of condor. Should be fun watching both guys develop.

 

[redmannorth]

Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.

The team and staff certainly underachieved this season, IMO. You'll get no argument from me (or, most posters) there. But let me ask you something.... I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, either.

But if those same two posters who you feel analyze the play of the team and coaching staff was enamoured with the team and staff or 'on the fence,' then would you still pay attention to them? Or, are you paying attention to them because they are saying what you wanna hear? If the latter, then you're basically (indirectly) doing the same as you believe Marillac is doing.

Just asking an honest question.

Very fair question MJD.
I would still adhere to what they have to say as I would much rather read the players are just not good, super overrated , etc.
I am not at all hearing what I want to hear. I want to hear we are a well coached team as I have repeatedly said we have talent. The abundance of talent we have is because of coach and I will never deny that.
If you think I am hoping for Coach Lavin to fail you are sorely mistaken. I have zero axe to grind and pray that he takes us to levels we haven't seen in too long a period of time. However, serious questions marks have arisen which have given myself and others cause for concern.

 

[MJDinkins]

Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.

The team and staff certainly underachieved this season, IMO. You'll get no argument from me (or, most posters) there. But let me ask you something.... I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, either.

But if those same two posters who you feel analyze the play of the team and coaching staff was enamoured with the team and staff or 'on the fence,' then would you still pay attention to them? Or, are you paying attention to them because they are saying what you wanna hear? If the latter, then you're basically (indirectly) doing the same as you believe Marillac is doing.

Just asking an honest question.

Very fair question MJD.
I would still adhere to what they have to say as I would much rather read the players are just not good, super overrated , etc.
I am not at all hearing what I want to hear. I want to hear we are a well coached team as I have repeatedly said we have talent. The abundance of talent we have is because of coach and I will never deny that.
If you think I am hoping for Coach Lavin to fail you are sorely mistaken. I have zero axe to grind and pray that he takes us to levels we haven't seen in too long a period of time.

I understand what you want to hear, as I know you want the team to be successful.

But since those two posters have the same perceptions as you, then you may be more partial to pay attention to what they have to say. I also know you don't want Lavin to fail nor do you have an axe to grind, as your posts doesn't reflect such.

However, serious questions marks have arisen which have given myself and others cause for concern.

Fair enough.

 

[redmannorth]

Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.

The team and staff certainly underachieved this season, IMO. You'll get no argument from me (or, most posters) there. But let me ask you something.... I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, either.

But if those same two posters who you feel analyze the play of the team and coaching staff was enamoured with the team and staff or 'on the fence,' then would you still pay attention to them? Or, are you paying attention to them because they are saying what you wanna hear? If the latter, then you're basically (indirectly) doing the same as you believe Marillac is doing.

Just asking an honest question.

Very fair question MJD.
I would still adhere to what they have to say as I would much rather read the players are just not good, super overrated , etc.
I am not at all hearing what I want to hear. I want to hear we are a well coached team as I have repeatedly said we have talent. The abundance of talent we have is because of coach and I will never deny that.
If you think I am hoping for Coach Lavin to fail you are sorely mistaken. I have zero axe to grind and pray that he takes us to levels we haven't seen in too long a period of time.

I understand what you want to hear, as I know you want the team to be successful.

But since those two posters have the same perceptions as you, then you may be more partial to pay attention to what they have to say. I also know you don't want Lavin to fail nor do you have an axe to grind, as your posts doesn't reflect such.

However, serious questions marks have arisen which have given myself and others cause for concern.

Fair enough.

MJD I don't really have a perception as I am not able to watch games living in Canada. I was able to attend one game this season , the Xavier game at the Garden and was terribly disappointed with what I saw.
As such I read this board religiously both as a poster and moderator and attempt to extract information therefrom.

 

[MJDinkins]

Unfortunately I happen to be in the latter camp and see an underachieving team all around. Furthermore, while I read and respect everything everyone all posters have to say on this board there are two posters whom I pay attention to who as opposed to wishful thinking or hurtful comments attempt to analyze the play of the team and the coaching of the staff. Unfortunately those two posters are not enamoured with the teams play or our coaching.

The team and staff certainly underachieved this season, IMO. You'll get no argument from me (or, most posters) there. But let me ask you something.... I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, either.

But if those same two posters who you feel analyze the play of the team and coaching staff was enamoured with the team and staff or 'on the fence,' then would you still pay attention to them? Or, are you paying attention to them because they are saying what you wanna hear? If the latter, then you're basically (indirectly) doing the same as you believe Marillac is doing.

Just asking an honest question.

Very fair question MJD.
I would still adhere to what they have to say as I would much rather read the players are just not good, super overrated , etc.
I am not at all hearing what I want to hear. I want to hear we are a well coached team as I have repeatedly said we have talent. The abundance of talent we have is because of coach and I will never deny that.
If you think I am hoping for Coach Lavin to fail you are sorely mistaken. I have zero axe to grind and pray that he takes us to levels we haven't seen in too long a period of time.

I understand what you want to hear, as I know you want the team to be successful.

But since those two posters have the same perceptions as you, then you may be more partial to pay attention to what they have to say. I also know you don't want Lavin to fail nor do you have an axe to grind, as your posts doesn't reflect such.

However, serious questions marks have arisen which have given myself and others cause for concern.

Fair enough.

MJD I don't really have a perception as I am not able to watch games living in Canada. I was able to attend one game this season , the Xavier game at the Garden and was terribly disappointed with what I saw.
As such I read this board religiously both as a poster and moderator and attempt to extract information therefrom.

A fine game you picked to go see.

 

[monte]

Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach, but this season is baffling me. But I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on recruiting.

.......... Rivals claims StJohns offered 14 recruits during the 2014 cycle, Scout claims Lavin offered 7 recruits, ESPN claims 6. ... but in the final analysis, it doesn't really matter whether Lavin offered 14, 7 or even zero because StJohns has zero recruits coming in next year with the possible exception of transfer Joey DeLaRosa, his brother or some unknown player found during a late scramble. The recently completed season was a disappointment to all but a few StJohns fans yet Lavin has seemingly failed to bring in any new talent into the program for improvement while most Big East teams have reloaded.

So Yeah, I disagree with the above quote that Lavin's recruiting is so good that it is beyond reproach.

IMO after his first season at StJohns Lavin has by and large brought in talent that has proven to be "pretty good" (Sanchez and Obekpa) to "mediocre" (Balamou, Bourgault, Jones, Hooper, Joey DeLaRosa) with just one big time recruit (Jordan) during the last 3 cycles.

If Lavin's recruiting has been so good than why didn't StJohns do better than a 5 seed in the Big East Tournamapent? ..... or beat Robert Morris?

I regret that my remarks are seen as "negative" but to me saying that " Lavin's recruiting has been so good that it's basically above reproach" is at best, wishful thinking.

But as
I don't view your comments as "negative" at all. I do think that Lavin did a great job immediately after taking over and under very difficult circumstances. But as I've said before, part of being a great recruiter-or a recruter above "reproach"-means getting not just high ranked kids, but kids that fill a void. He has failed to do that. Furthermore many of his highly ranked recruits have either left(Nurideen, Polee,) and/or failed to live up to their lofty rankings/expectations(IE Sir Dom, PG IV) or their Lavin hype(IE Marco, Max, Sanchez). He's actually had way more misses than hits IMO. So I wholeheartedly agree with you that his recruiting isn't quite what many believe it to be.


And please spare me the Norm comparisons. Norm is not the bar.

 

[hnkcolumbia]

Plyometrics!!!!!!!

 

[paultzman]

Paultz - gun to your head, Chukwu or Adonis as a four year guy?

I've only seen Chukwu on a couple of highlights, but I've seen De La Rosa play. Not sure how far off Chukwu's offensive game is at the moment. But De La Rosa has a decent, offensive game now. De La Rosa has a nice touch from about 12'-15'.

I'm not saying, De La Rosa will end up being the same player, but with some work De La Rosa may can mimic Roy Hibbert (who was 'under the radar' in HS).

Not comparing Cooley to anyone, but the man never stops working;

@BWMcGair03: From the airport to the Mohegan Sun: Ed Cooley plans to see future Friar & Fairfield Prep's Paschal Chukwu go for Conn. state title 2night

 

[Andrew]

Polee - Lavin's first recruit in the sweet sixteen - 15 points six rebounds.