(PRE-GAME) (H of F) Vermont, Sat. Nov. 16, 4p, FS-2, 570 WMCA

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[quote="Mike Zaun" post=363152]This is the type of game I won't be upset if we lose (they are a real good mid major), however I think we should win this game as a Big East team. We will need Heron and LJ to be on their game and hopefully Dunn can contribute. If we can do that and turn them over a decent amount, we can win this game maybe even by more than people think. But it will be tough no doubt. Let's give them hell on defense.[/quote]

Hahahahaha Suurrrrrrrrrrrre
 
[quote="Moose" post=363115][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363077]I don't really care who starts but dont act like one player is heads and shoulder above another when the other looks alittle better.
Maybe everyone wants a rim protecter, and that josh over julian, then ok fine, i agree.[/quote]

Who is acting like one is head and shoulders above the other one ?

Pretty sure josh and Julian are the two players the majority of posters are impressed with so far.

You said Julian should start over Josh. I and a few others said we disagreed. Since when did having a different opinion illicit the outcry that you are campaigning. It’s a message board for Christ sake. If we all agreed it would be a pretty stale environment[/quote]

Everybody is just assuming Steere will come in and start.. I don’t see it. If Roberts keeps progressing, and Champaigne does as well, depending on how well we are doing, Steere will come off the bench.

I mean, Steere hasn’t played in a game in almost 2 years seems like, so I don’t feel like he’s just going to come out and take over. Will take time. Champ is a good versatile guy at the forward position who helps with spacing. I think Dunn will be a bigger threat once he gets back in game rhythm. He will benefit from having 3 perimeter guys out there with him.

Roberts is just looks so comfortable in his role. Not trying to step out and shoot jump shots, banging, keeping balls alive, blocking everything, running in transition. I don’t see him going anywhere out of that center spot because that’s what he is.. a center. He knows his role and is doing it well thus far.
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=363072]Vermont up only 2 (24-22) over Boston U and 2-10 from three. Through 2 1/2 games their 3 point shooting is really atrocious.[/quote]

They are 18.5% from three so far. Shot 35.9% last year.

Of their players that have taken the most 3 point FG shots this year:

Stef Smith (4-14)
last year: 60-164 37%
3-5 against Florida St in NCAAs, 4-7@ Louisville and 3-5 @ Kansas

Anthony Lamb (1-14)
last year: 50-137 (37%)
3-10 against Florida St in NCAAs, 2-2 @ Louisville and 2-6 @ Kansas

Everett Duncan (1-9)
last year: 34-95 (36%)
1-4 against Florida St in NCAAs, 1-2 @ Louisville and 0-0 @ Kansas

Ryan Davis (2-8)
last year: 6-28 (21%)
0-0 against Florida St, 0-1 @ Louisville and 0-5@ Kansas
 
[quote="Moose" post=363153][quote="Mike Zaun" post=363152]This is the type of game I won't be upset if we lose (they are a real good mid major), however I think we should win this game as a Big East team. We will need Heron and LJ to be on their game and hopefully Dunn can contribute. If we can do that and turn them over a decent amount, we can win this game maybe even by more than people think. But it will be tough no doubt. Let's give them hell on defense.[/quote]

Hahahahaha Suurrrrrrrrrrrre[/quote]

Lol! Moose knows me too well. Ok I won't be happy but I'd try really hard to put it in perspective if we lose haha...more realistic?

And with Champ, I totally agree this is a rare time the staff hypes him up as a diamond in the rough and actually looks like it. He has a nice shot and many have not gone in, but a lot of it has just been bad luck. He gets the looks he wants, the rim has not been kind. Lots of in and outs that just don't bounce his way. They will start falling more and when they do, he will be a big factor IMO. Seems like a mature guy who goes about his business without distractions. Hopefully he stays all 4 years because by the time he's a senior I can see him being a damn good player at this level.
 
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[quote="Big Red" post=363154][quote="Moose" post=363115][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363077]I don't really care who starts but dont act like one player is heads and shoulder above another when the other looks alittle better.
Maybe everyone wants a rim protecter, and that josh over julian, then ok fine, i agree.[/quote]

Who is acting like one is head and shoulders above the other one ?

Pretty sure josh and Julian are the two players the majority of posters are impressed with so far.

You said Julian should start over Josh. I and a few others said we disagreed. Since when did having a different opinion illicit the outcry that you are campaigning. It’s a message board for Christ sake. If we all agreed it would be a pretty stale environment[/quote]

Everybody is just assuming Steere will come in and start.. I don’t see it. If Roberts keeps progressing, and Champaigne does as well, depending on how well we are doing, Steere will come off the bench.

I mean, Steere hasn’t played in a game in almost 2 years seems like, so I don’t feel like he’s just going to come out and take over. Will take time. Champ is a good versatile guy at the forward position who helps with spacing. I think Dunn will be a bigger threat once he gets back in game rhythm. He will benefit from having 3 perimeter guys out there with him.

Roberts is just looks so comfortable in his role. Not trying to step out and shoot jump shots, banging, keeping balls alive, blocking everything, running in transition. I don’t see him going anywhere out of that center spot because that’s what he is.. a center. He knows his role and is doing it well thus far.[/quote]

Roberts is simply not built like a center. He’s built like a thin PF or SF. I think he’s a natural Pf style wise. For all intents and purposes guys like Earlington, Roberts etc have played about as much as Steere has in the last year or so. Steere is very different build-wise and has the strength and athleticism to dunk on guys all day in the paint if he wants to. Will he? I don’t know, but he’s a 4 star kid and the only natural center on this team. I think he will be our center primarily when all is said and done after the rust is off.

People making it a competition between Roberts and Champagnie I think is silly. Plenty of minutes to go around for both of them at different spots including center at times, PF etc. I don’t think Roberts is really a Center when We play against teams with real centers, but he certainly has the athletic ability to challenge shots in the paint and rebound.
 
Making life difficult for Lamb & pressure D should result in nice home win.

Btw, who cares who starts. It is all about depth and minutes. Wear Vermont down with deeper, more talented roster.
 
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[quote="Paultzman" post=363160]Making life difficult for Lamb & pressure D should result in nice home win.

Btw, who cares who starts. It is all about depth and minutes. Wear Vermont down with deeper, more talented roster.[/quote]

Great point. Quality depth will be our biggest strength down the stretch with our style. We’ve already been pushing the tempo. Add Dunn and Steere and it allows us to push even more. As we’ve seen, we actually have some really decent quality depth with lots of guys getting solid minutes and big contributions from nearly everybody.
 
Starting or not, the two biggest things this team needs to beat expectations in conference is:

1. Emergence of 3rd scoring option capable of going for 12-15+ with some regularity; and

2. Interior presence that can defend and rebound in half court against teams with size and talent to slow our pace.

The hope is Dunn and Steere are both answers to 1. If one or certainly if both aren't there are too many quality defensive teams in conference capable of running multiple looks and bodies at LJ/Heron that scoring will be a challenge some nights. Won't always be able to rely purley on dictating pace and transition opportunities, need other options to emerge and I'm optimistic we'll get a lift from these two in this way.

Roberts and Champagnie have easily been the two best surprises early, but they aren't the answer on 2. We've had a front row seat the last few years for how undersized front courts fare in conference. Will need them to be big parts of the solution but we need Steere to be the anchor. If he's giving us 25 mpg as the type of guy Xavier always seems to have in the middle it puts a lot less pressure on the rest of the rotation, particularly Roberts/Champagnie playing along side him at the 4. Becomes a lot easier to steal 15 minutes with a combination of Roberts/Champagnie/Sears or going small.

Would think it's:

Rutherford/Dunn*
Heron
LJ
Roberts/Chamagnie*
Sears

Williams
Caraher
Earlington
Sears

*Could see starting lineup rotating in these spots throughout year based upon matchups and riding hot hand.
 
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Once Steere is eligible I think the point is we have options. I mean say Heron is in foul trouble would it be terrible to say Rutherford, Dunn, LJ, Roberts and Steere? I don’t see the need but I could think of a thousand different combinations.

It will be interesting to see how MA utilizes Dunn vs Vermont. He’s been practicing I believe so my guess is he’s a full go. All of us are just spit balling and the only guy whose vision matters is the Head Coach. Curious to see how he brings him along.
 
[quote="weathermannyc" post=363155][quote="NCJohnnie" post=363072]Vermont up only 2 (24-22) over Boston U and 2-10 from three. Through 2 1/2 games their 3 point shooting is really atrocious.[/quote]

They are 18.5% from three so far. Shot 35.9% last year.

Of their players that have taken the most 3 point FG shots this year:

Stef Smith (4-14)
last year: 60-164 37%
3-5 against Florida St in NCAAs, 4-7@ Louisville and 3-5 @ Kansas

Anthony Lamb (1-14)
last year: 50-137 (37%)
3-10 against Florida St in NCAAs, 2-2 @ Louisville and 2-6 @ Kansas

Everett Duncan (1-9)
last year: 34-95 (36%)
1-4 against Florida St in NCAAs, 1-2 @ Louisville and 0-0 @ Kansas

Ryan Davis (2-8)
last year: 6-28 (21%)
0-0 against Florida St, 0-1 @ Louisville and 0-5@ Kansas[/quote]

This actually makes me nervous. Sooner or later they are going to start making shots. I hope it does not start against us. Hoping our constant pressure and depth tires them out so their 2nd half threes are shot with heavy legs. Definitely a nice test early on. Not quite Michigan State but a previous year tourney team none the less.
 
[quote="Redmen88" post=363169][quote="weathermannyc" post=363155][quote="NCJohnnie" post=363072]Vermont up only 2 (24-22) over Boston U and 2-10 from three. Through 2 1/2 games their 3 point shooting is really atrocious.[/quote]

They are 18.5% from three so far. Shot 35.9% last year.

Of their players that have taken the most 3 point FG shots this year:

Stef Smith (4-14)
last year: 60-164 37%
3-5 against Florida St in NCAAs, 4-7@ Louisville and 3-5 @ Kansas

Anthony Lamb (1-14)
last year: 50-137 (37%)
3-10 against Florida St in NCAAs, 2-2 @ Louisville and 2-6 @ Kansas

Everett Duncan (1-9)
last year: 34-95 (36%)
1-4 against Florida St in NCAAs, 1-2 @ Louisville and 0-0 @ Kansas

Ryan Davis (2-8)
last year: 6-28 (21%)
0-0 against Florida St, 0-1 @ Louisville and 0-5@ Kansas[/quote]

This actually makes me nervous. Sooner or later they are going to start making shots. I hope it does not start against us. Hoping our constant pressure and depth tires them out so their 2nd half threes are shot with heavy legs. Definitely a nice test early on. Not quite Michigan State but a previous year tourney team none the less.[/quote]

Honestly, I would worry more about back door cuts which seemed to befuddle our team on numerous occasions the other night. Need to tighten that up a bit.
 
Despite the Dunn news, ESPN's predictor still has Vermont as 51% likely to win (completely unchanged- which shows just how useless their system is). Will be interesting to see the Vegas line. I'm expecting we'll be favored by a few. Really thrilled that we'll have Dunn back for this one!
 
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[quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363086][quote="austour" post=363081][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363070][quote="Moose" post=363067]
You remind me of someone who used to post here[/quote]

I hope that's a good thing.

[/quote]

No need to worry. I'm not sure who he's referring too but I'm betting it was just some other O'Toole.[/quote]

Ahhh so now I'm a tool for saying that roberts and juluan are even and that josh isn't 100% starting over julian?
Yeah and now if i say something back ill be the one in trouble
I'll just keep quiet and go.
Will be back after the vermont.
I hope Julian out performs Josh by alot.[/quote]

Someone's got some pretty thin skin. I just thought it was a funny joke. Oh and I don't like your posts. But besides that nothing personal.
 
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[quote="austour" post=363180][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363086][quote="austour" post=363081][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363070][quote="Moose" post=363067]
You remind me of someone who used to post here[/quote]

I hope that's a good thing.

[/quote]

No need to worry. I'm not sure who he's referring too but I'm betting it was just some other O'Toole.[/quote]

Ahhh so now I'm a tool for saying that roberts and juluan are even and that josh isn't 100% starting over julian?
Yeah and now if i say something back ill be the one in trouble
I'll just keep quiet and go.
Will be back after the vermont.
I hope Julian out performs Josh by alot.[/quote]

Someone's got some pretty thin skin. I just thought it was a funny joke. Oh and I don't like your posts. But besides that nothing personal.[/quote]

I got a chuckle out of it.
 
[quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363086][quote="austour" post=363081][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363070][quote="Moose" post=363067]
You remind me of someone who used to post here[/quote]

I hope that's a good thing.

[/quote]

No need to worry. I'm not sure who he's referring too but I'm betting it was just some other O'Toole.[/quote]

Ahhh so now I'm a tool for saying that roberts and juluan are even and that josh isn't 100% starting over julian?
Yeah and now if i say something back ill be the one in trouble
I'll just keep quiet and go.
Will be back after the vermont.
I hope Julian out performs Josh by alot.[/quote]

So you are hoping Julian out performs Josh not because Josh isn't playing well but to prove your point? :blink: :whistle: :pinch: How about hoping they both play well and we get a win.
 
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"Starting or not, the two biggest things this team needs to beat expectations in conference is:

1. Emergence of 3rd scoring option capable of going for 12-15+ with some regularity; and

2. Interior presence that can defend and rebound in half court against teams with size and talent to slow our pace.

The hope is Dunn and Steere are both answers to 1. If one or certainly if both aren't there are too many quality defensive teams in conference capable of running multiple looks and bodies at LJ/Heron that scoring will be a challenge some nights. Won't always be able to rely purley on dictating pace and transition opportunities, need other options to emerge and I'm optimistic we'll get a lift from these two in this way.

Roberts and Champagnie have easily been the two best surprises early, but they aren't the answer on 2. We've had a front row seat the last few years for how undersized front courts fare in conference. Will need them to be big parts of the solution but we need Steere to be the anchor. If he's giving us 25 mpg as the type of guy Xavier always seems to have in the middle it puts a lot less pressure on the rest of the rotation, particularly Roberts/Champagnie playing along side him at the 4. Becomes a lot easier to steal 15 minutes with a combination of Roberts/Champagnie/Sears or going small.

Would think it's:

Rutherford/Dunn*
Heron
LJ
Roberts/Chamagnie*
Sears

Williams
Caraher
Earlington
Sears

*Could see starting lineup rotating in these spots throughout year based upon matchups and riding hot hand."


Think you meant Steere in the starting lineup not Sears....
 
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[quote="mjmaherjr" post=363066][quote="Tom H O'Toole" post=363065][quote="mjmaherjr" post=363064]is there a point spread on this game yet ? Asking for a friend[/quote]

Tomorrow maher[/quote] when it comes out if you have it please put it up. Asking for a friend :)[/quote]

I tried to private you so I don't post here, but couldn't

[URL]https://www.vegasinsider.com/college-basketball/odds/las-vegas/line-movement/vermont-[/URL]@-saint-johns.cfm/date/11-16-19/

No line yet, thinking it might come out tomorrow.
 
Steere has been playing a lot with the team so the rust should not be an issue.He has to be in the front ct for at least 15-20 min,need his size and bulk That saying eventually should Start And player a lot of the mins
 
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