Possible Coaching Candidates

fordham96 said:
All I know is what I know.

Also I think Boynton is the one paying the price with the sanctions including lost post season year and now 3 scholarships.

So even if you want to pin guilt on him he unlike Brad Underwood at least is the one getting the punishment.

Either way I don't think that is an issue. The bigger question is would he be a clear upgrade.
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Just saying he's not all that great of a candidate. Even before the violations he was mediocre. Without Cade Cunningham what has he really done?

And everyone loves pointing out violations and extra marital issues for Pitino. I just find it a bit weird. Then again its the NCAA and I should stop trying to figure them out.
 
Regarding the buyout, does anyone have an understanding of the value to the university of NCAA invites vs. being a Big East bottom dweller? . Or packing the garden vs. half full? Figuring out a dollar amount per season should be doable. It is not impossible to think that a high quality coach who can retain Storr, keep Gardner and the Junior College star on board, and add a few transfers of his liking could dance next season. The school should be able to make this analysis.
 
Moose said:
Just saying he's not all that great of a candidate. Even before the violations he was mediocre. Without Cade Cunningham what has he really done?

And everyone loves pointing out violations and extra marital issues for Pitino. I just find it a bit weird. Then again its the NCAA and I should stop trying to figure them out.
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Again as I said his numbers are not spectacular. No doubt.

But Underwood only spent 1 season after several bad seasons leading to Underwood. Throw in the sanctions after just 1 year of Underwood and a brutally tough conference and there are at least mitigating circumstances.
 
RedStormNC said:
Assume Shanley makes decision for change, does the entire Board have to approve the decision for buyout and/or suggested replacement hire, or is there some select subcommittee that would vote...and would it be require just a majority vote or unanimous?
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Figure the most F'ed up process imaginable in regards to this situation then bank on it as part of our University's by-laws.
 
MugCostanza said:
Yes. Parity in college basketball is at an all time high especially at the lower conferences where it's nearly impossible to be super consistent especially when dealing with all of the injuries that Iona has been dealing with.

Iona is currently 81st in KenPom (ahead of St. John's). Nobody else in the MAAC is in the top 125.

Again, if not Pitino, which undefeated coach would you advocate for hiring instead?
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Dawn Staley
 
I don't buy the mantra that St. John's is in need of a miracle to save the basketball program. There are currently 6 teams in the top 25 (Marquette, Xavier, Providence, Creighton, Gonzaga & St. Mary's) who are private schools without the huge dollar advantages that state schools have plus schools like Villanova & Hall who are usually in the conversation for a berth. What St. John's needs to get into that group is a good hire who will coach and recruit well and most importantly win some Q1 and Q2 games. Win 20 games a couple of years in a row and see how perceptions and attendance changes. While I agree a Pitino hire would instantly make us relevant again, I don't agree that his hire is the only way to avoid continued disaster. But sticking with the current staff after what we've seen the last 2 years and expecting anything different would be insanity. I hope Shanley & Cragg are already in the process of identifying candidates and having conversations with the board regarding Pitino to determine if he is a possibility. What would be a disaster is to let the Pitino issue drift until after the season and find out too late that he is a no go and other possible candidates are already taken.
 
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Does St John's have a bottomless pit of money to throw at this? As discussed in another thread, St John’s would probably have to pay Anderson about $7.5 million- $10 million to terminate his contract today. That would be reduced by whatever compensation he got from his next head coaching job – assuming he actually got another decent job.

This is big bucks for a school like SJU to pay for an outgoing coach. Unless they are able to get a big name to replace him- be it Pitino or someone else- I just don’t see it happening.
 
Here is the irony of salaries and buyouts Pitino who is easily the most accomplished coach potentially available is making the least of anyone at Iona and probably has a small buyout.

See Boynton. He signed a 7 year extension after 2021 season base salary bumped up and total compensation of $3 mil+ which puts him probably still near the bottom of B12 Coaches, my guess is Mark Adams-Texas Tech and Tang of K State probably make less.

And look at his buyouts and how they work. My point is even if SJU goes after someone like Boynton it is not going to be cheap.

www.oklahoman.com

Big 12 basketball: What's in Mike Boynton's new contract & what's next for Bryce Thompson?

OSU coach Mike Boynton will make $2.1 million in base salary per season, according to his new contract.
www.oklahoman.com

Thirteen days after Boynton and OSU agreed to the extension, details have emerged about the contract that no longer leaves him as the lowest-paid coach in the Big 12.

Boynton will make $3 million each season, including total compensation. He will receive $2.1 million base salary each year beginning July 1 through the 2027-28 season, according to the contract obtained by The Oklahoman. He also received a raise to $500,000 from $100,000 for his annual stay benefit.
If Boynton were to depart without permission from the athletic director, he would owe 75% of the contract the first three seasons. The percentage drops to 44.44% in the 2024-25 season and 25% the year after. Boynton will not owe the university a portion of his remaining salary the final two seasons of the contract should he leave.
 
NCJohnnie said:
I don't buy the mantra that St. John's is in need of a miracle to save the basketball program. There are currently 6 teams in the top 25 (Marquette, Xavier, Providence, Creighton, Gonzaga & St. Mary's) who are private schools without the huge dollar advantages that state schools have plus schools like Villanova & Hall who are usually in the conversation for a berth. What St. John's needs to get into that group is a good hire who will coach and recruit well and most importantly win some Q1 and Q2 games. Win 20 games a couple of years in a row and see how perceptions and attendance changes. While I agree a Pitino hire would instantly make us relevant again, I don't agree that his hire is the only way to avoid continued disaster. But sticking with the current staff after what we've seen the last 2 years and expecting anything different would be insanity. I hope Shanley & Cragg are already in the process of identifying candidates and having conversations with the board regarding Pitino to determine if he is a possibility. What would be a disaster is to let the Pitino issue drift until after the season and find out too late that he is a no go and other possible candidates are already taken.
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I agree overall but other than Pitino I suspect anyone else brought in (new transfer rules or not) will need years and patience. And I’m running out of both.

And that’s best case scenario, most likely they get it wrong again.
 
As far as the buyout of Anderson you cannot only look at one side of the Income Statement. It has to be balanced against how much revenue (ticket sales, concessions and donations) could evaporate if the school does nothing. Those numbers are harder to quantify than a buyout number but based on how many posters say they would give up tickets does not feel like zero. When I see discussions of the buyout I never see any thought to the expense (lost revenues) associated with staying the course. Staying the course could be more expensive then biting the bullet on the “sunk costs” associated with paying off Anderson.
 
fordham96 said:
Here is the irony of salaries and buyouts Pitino who is easily the most accomplished coach potentially available is making the least of anyone at Iona and probably has a small buyout.

See Boynton. He signed a 7 year extension after 2021 season base salary bumped up and total compensation of $3 mil+ which puts him probably still near the bottom of B12 Coaches, my guess is Mark Adams-Texas Tech and Tang of K State probably make less.

And look at his buyouts and how they work. My point is even if SJU goes after someone like Boynton it is not going to be cheap.

www.oklahoman.com

Big 12 basketball: What's in Mike Boynton's new contract & what's next for Bryce Thompson?

OSU coach Mike Boynton will make $2.1 million in base salary per season, according to his new contract.
www.oklahoman.com

Thirteen days after Boynton and OSU agreed to the extension, details have emerged about the contract that no longer leaves him as the lowest-paid coach in the Big 12.

Boynton will make $3 million each season, including total compensation. He will receive $2.1 million base salary each year beginning July 1 through the 2027-28 season, according to the contract obtained by The Oklahoman. He also received a raise to $500,000 from $100,000 for his annual stay benefit.
If Boynton were to depart without permission from the athletic director, he would owe 75% of the contract the first three seasons. The percentage drops to 44.44% in the 2024-25 season and 25% the year after. Boynton will not owe the university a portion of his remaining salary the final two seasons of the contract should he leave.
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The thing is though it depends on if Oklahoma State would be upset to see Boynton go or not. If they miss the NCAA Tournament this year and their big boosters feel they might be better served with a change then it's possible Oklahoma State would waive some or all of that buyout to help push Boynton out the door without having to fire him. That's what Texas did with Shaka and Marquette. Though obviously if Oklahoma state is still fond of Boynton then yes it would be very expensive for SJU to go and grab him.
 
MugCostanza said:
Lazy Sunday today so was looking at some realistic coaching candidates in order of how much I'd like them. Will probably be missing a few names but would think anybody outside of this list would be a pretty big surprise or would be pretty off the board.

1. Rick Pitino
The Good - He's still one of the best coaches in the country and would be the best coach to ever lead this program. Cleared by the NCAA now and it's nearly impossible for me to envision a scenario where he wouldn't succeed here if he stays healthy. A total grand slam.
The Bad - He will be 71 on opening night next year.
My Grade - 10/10
Would he come? He's been dropping hints about wanting this job the past couple years. That said, have to be mindful of other schools with deeper pockets taking a run at him now that he's been cleared by the NCAA.

2. Chris Mack
The Good - Had a great run at Xavier where he made 8 of 9 NCAA Tournaments including during the transition from the A10 to the Big East which isn't easy. Currently unemployed so no buyout needed.
The Bad - Had a pretty quick and bad flameout at Louisville, though wonder how much the Dino Guadio situation contributed to that. No real ties to the NYC area.
My Grade - 8/10
Would he come? Probably if no better offers out there.

3. Mike Boynton
The Good - NYC guy that has done an admirable job leading Oklahoma State through a turbulent time with NCAA infractions in the toughest conference in the country. Have been top 40 in KP the past 3 seasons.
The Bad - His only NCAA appearance came from adding Cade Cunningham's brother to the coaching staff and generally their record has always lagged behind their metrics
My Grade - 6.5/10
Would he come? Probably not unless Oklahoma State kind of nudges him out the door.

4. Mike Brey
The Good - Has had quite a 20+ year run at Notre Dame in the Big East and ACC
The Bad - Barring a miracle this year he's going to be looking at 1 tournament appearance in his past 6 seasons
My Grade - 6/10
Would he come? - There were rumors he was interested in this job last time it was open before the search became a national embarrassment. ND is probably ready to make a change and Brey could look to get out before getting officially fired.

5. Matt Langel
The Good - Probably the best of the "up and coming" coaches. Inherited a moribund Colgate program and turned them into the absolute class of the Patriot League. Could end up being our version of Steve Pikiell.
The Bad - Has no experience in power conferences even as an Assistant. Far more of an offensive coach than defensive and I personally prefer defensive minded guys that are moving up a level or two.
My Grade - 6/10
Would he come? - Yes

6. Kimani Young
The Good - Queens native and excellent recruiter with lots of ties to this area/ Has already spent time in this program and is the second in command at a top 5 school. Could end up being for us what Jerome Tang has been for Kansas State.
The Bad - No head coaching experience.
My Grade - 6/10
Would he come? - Yes

7. Ryan Odom
The Good - Immediately turned UMBC from one of the worst programs in D1 to respectable and was the first 16 seed to ever beat a 1 seed in the tournament.
Currently in year 2 at Utah State and they are a factor in the Mountain West as usual.
The Bad - Hasn't demonstrated a super high ceiling a Utah State yet and has no NYC ties.
My Grade - 5/10
Would he come? - Would be looking at a substantial raise so probably.

8. Drew Valentine
The Good - Clearly highly respected enough to be given the Loyola Chicago job at the age of 30 after spending years as an Assistant there. Had a strong first season there getting 25 wins and a 10 seed in the NCAA Tournament
The Bad - Year 2 has been terrible as they are currently 6-9 (0-3) and 191st in KP. Has not yet proven he can build and maintain a program as the head guy. Not quite sure why so many people are high on him
My Grade - 4.5/10
Would he come? - Yes

9. James Jones
The Good - Has had a decent 20+ year run at Yale.
The Bad - Has never been a Head Coach or Assistant at a major conference program. Not easy to win consistently in the Ivy but he's only made 3 tournaments in his 20+ years there.
My Grade - 3/10
Would he come? - Apparently he interviewed for the job the last time around and word is he really wanted it, so yes.

10. Mark Jackson
The Good - Has NBA head coaching experience and will at the very least provide some national interest by returning to his alma mater.
The Bad - We've already been down this road with Mullin and it didn't go well. NBA guys with little to no college experience struggle bigtime. He would be a disaster IMO. Would be much more likely to have a Ewing like Georgetown run than taking this program to the next level.
My Grade - 0/10
Would he come? - No clue. Hope we never find out.
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Good overview. Keep in mind Jim Larranaga is 73 and still coaching well. He’s got Miami going on all cylinders.
 
fordham96 said:
Here is the irony of salaries and buyouts Pitino who is easily the most accomplished coach potentially available is making the least of anyone at Iona and probably has a small buyout.

See Boynton. He signed a 7 year extension after 2021 season base salary bumped up and total compensation of $3 mil+ which puts him probably still near the bottom of B12 Coaches, my guess is Mark Adams-Texas Tech and Tang of K State probably make less.

And look at his buyouts and how they work. My point is even if SJU goes after someone like Boynton it is not going to be cheap.

www.oklahoman.com

Big 12 basketball: What's in Mike Boynton's new contract & what's next for Bryce Thompson?

OSU coach Mike Boynton will make $2.1 million in base salary per season, according to his new contract.
www.oklahoman.com

Thirteen days after Boynton and OSU agreed to the extension, details have emerged about the contract that no longer leaves him as the lowest-paid coach in the Big 12.

Boynton will make $3 million each season, including total compensation. He will receive $2.1 million base salary each year beginning July 1 through the 2027-28 season, according to the contract obtained by The Oklahoman. He also received a raise to $500,000 from $100,000 for his annual stay benefit.
If Boynton were to depart without permission from the athletic director, he would owe 75% of the contract the first three seasons. The percentage drops to 44.44% in the 2024-25 season and 25% the year after. Boynton will not owe the university a portion of his remaining salary the final two seasons of the contract should he leave.
Click to expand...

IDRAFT said:
As far as the buyout of Anderson you cannot only look at one side of the Income Statement. It has to be balanced against how much revenue (ticket sales, concessions and donations) could evaporate if the school does nothing. Those numbers are harder to quantify than a buyout number but based on how many posters say they would give up tickets does not feel like zero. When I see discussions of the buyout I never see any thought to the expense (lost revenues) associated with staying the course. Staying the course could be more expensive then biting the bullet on the “sunk costs” associated with paying off Anderson.
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Good points. I do think there is a real risk of SJU fans giving up their tickets in protest if Anderson is paid $7-$10 million to leave AND St John's replaces him with a mid-major coach or an "up and comer." That's just not going to cut it. That's why I say the school needs to go big or go home if Anderson is in fact terminated.
 
MugCostanza said:
The thing is though it depends on if Oklahoma State would be upset to see Boynton go or not. If they miss the NCAA Tournament this year and their big boosters feel they might be better served with a change then it's possible Oklahoma State would waive some or all of that buyout to help push Boynton out the door without having to fire him. That's what Texas did with Shaka and Marquette. Though obviously if Oklahoma state is still fond of Boynton then yes it would be very expensive for SJU to go and grab him.
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Of course.

But for SJU if they were to pursue Boynton it sure would look better if he was coming off a solid NCAA year. If he tanks here and they fail to make the NCAA that is a double edge sword, yeah it may make Ok St less eager to keep him but it also not exactly wow the pants off of SJU fans for going after him.

Shaka was coming off a year in which Texas got a 3 seed in the NCAA's, that means they were a top 12 team in the country according to the committee.
 
Robert Jones and Matt Langel stats I saw on Twitter, their conference records are interesting

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