beast of the east
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PM me.Knight post=451596 said:
Pitino - Love/Hate Thread
- Thread starter SJU Double Alumn
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Ray Morgan
Well-known member
fordham96 post=451568 said:
No that is not how it works. 4 and 5 star kids are not going to Iona no matter if Pitino or K or Calipari are coaching there. Again that is not the litmus test. Furthermore if they did it would simply be written here as he "buys players" and the proof would be "Why else would a top 50 kid go to a MAAC school unless they were getting paid." It would give further creedence to the idea he is a product of just cheating.
Yes he is a great coach but those kids want to be on TV and play high quality competition EVERY night. Going to Iona is not suddenly going to put Iona vs Niagara on ESPN and CBS nor is it suddenly going to make the NIagara's land similar type of players.
Yes he is a great coach but those kids want to be on TV and play high quality competition EVERY night. Going to Iona is not suddenly going to put Iona vs Niagara on ESPN and CBS nor is it suddenly going to make the NIagara's land similar type of players.
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beast of the east
Active member
I would imagine his goal is to build a top 25 roster, annihilate his conference, and have a strong OOC schedule that would showcase how good they are and gain national attention.fordham96 post=451601 said:
He is a great salesman, and a great coach, so he may be able to do things at Iona in terms of transfers and HS recruits that most coaches could not.
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Yes and he already is getting a few kids that could definitely play/be recruited to Power5+BE type of schools. He said he has a kid on his team that he would have recruited to Louisville. But again that is still a far cry from consistently getting top 75 and top 50 kids to Iona no matter how good he is. Those kids for the most part are still going to want to go to schools that play high level competition and get on TV and get high seeds in the NCAA's. None of those things happen at Iona no matter how good Rick is.
But yeah his reputation and greatness will get some kids especially transfers that maybe able to make a power 5 roster but say would rather go to Iona get coached up by the best and excel at a lower level school. He is going to get that kid a lot as did Cluess. Rick will just dominate a little more and like you said try to play a better non-conference schedule.
But that doesn't mean he starts getting kids he could consistently get at Louisville at Iona. That is not how it works.
Beast of the East post=451602
I would imagine his goal is to build a top 25 roster, annihilate his conference, and have a strong OOC schedule that would showcase how good they are and gain national attention.
He is a great salesman, and a great coach, so he may be able to do things at Iona in terms of transfers and HS recruits that most coaches could not.
But yeah his reputation and greatness will get some kids especially transfers that maybe able to make a power 5 roster but say would rather go to Iona get coached up by the best and excel at a lower level school. He is going to get that kid a lot as did Cluess. Rick will just dominate a little more and like you said try to play a better non-conference schedule.
But that doesn't mean he starts getting kids he could consistently get at Louisville at Iona. That is not how it works.
Beast of the East post=451602
I would imagine his goal is to build a top 25 roster, annihilate his conference, and have a strong OOC schedule that would showcase how good they are and gain national attention.
He is a great salesman, and a great coach, so he may be able to do things at Iona in terms of transfers and HS recruits that most coaches could not.
beast of the east
Active member
Agreed. I would say if it is true that he is out selling donors on new facilities, he may stick around as coach till age 75 or beyond.fordham96 post=451605 said:
Ray Morgan
Well-known member
fordham96 post=451601 said:
I happen to have two Iona grads who I have been friendly with for many years and from talking with them I can tell you the Iona program is flying. Pitino has made a pre season goal to get an at large bid in case they don’t win the post season tournament. That will be tough because their league is worthless and he didn’t have enough time to build a better schedule but that is coming. He is planning multi games at MSG annually and is driving the Iona alumni for contributions for facility improvements.
He doesn’t have anything like SJUs alumni base but I am sure he will accomplish more in his first few years then any SJU coach has accomplished in the past 25 years.
He doesn’t have anything like SJUs alumni base but I am sure he will accomplish more in his first few years then any SJU coach has accomplished in the past 25 years.
Yeah I do. Facilities is no the same as conference. A great coach could overcome some of those things.
Trust me he would get players here. Again he has many flaws but Rick would kill it at SJU.
[URL]https://www.zagsblog.com/2019/...-he-would-bring-st-johns-back-to-elite-level/[/URL]
Trust me he would get players here. Again he has many flaws but Rick would kill it at SJU.
[URL]https://www.zagsblog.com/2019/...-he-would-bring-st-johns-back-to-elite-level/[/URL]
And one last thing on the facilities and other things. Jeff Goodman polled the BE coaches a few years ago to rank the BE jobs, best to worst. SJU was top half, number 5 using a series of criteria.
Now since then UCONN has joined and you would probably have to put them in the top half certainly. But this idea SJU is bottom 3-4 jobs is nonsense. It is still a good job. And there is money.
The most interesting thing is they still ranked Georgetown as the BEST BE job even at a time when they were swooning and Nova was coming off 2 NC's in 3 years.
https://watchstadium.com/big-east-b...k-the-best-jobs-in-the-conference-11-02-2018/
Now since then UCONN has joined and you would probably have to put them in the top half certainly. But this idea SJU is bottom 3-4 jobs is nonsense. It is still a good job. And there is money.
The most interesting thing is they still ranked Georgetown as the BEST BE job even at a time when they were swooning and Nova was coming off 2 NC's in 3 years.
https://watchstadium.com/big-east-b...k-the-best-jobs-in-the-conference-11-02-2018/
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SJU Double Alumn
Member
That poll wasn't really a ranking of desirability. It was a ranking of 8 criteria and then an equal weighting of the scores of all 8. But some criteria are more important than others which that poll did not take into account.fordham96 post=451621 said:
What makes the St. John's job desirable compared to other BE schools?
-The ability to live and earn a good income in the NY area, for those that love NY.
- Media. Not really. We don't get much coverage with all the pro teams in the area. It could be a positive with winning teams but that is a chicken and egg dynamic.
- The fan base. Eh, not a big differentiator from other schools.
- MSG. It is a positive, but again, not the differentiator that it used to be.
- Recruiting NY area talent. Same thing, not a big factor anymore.
- Facilities. Among the worst.
The key way to improve the program would be to improve the facilities and focus on NY as showplace to be.
Ray Morgan
Well-known member
salty dog post=451573 said:
Facilities was a part of that poll. And the poll was done by the coaches themselves. Not by fans so not sure why your opinion should be weighed greater than theirs. I am not suggesting SJU has great facilities but most of the other BE schools are not great or very poor.
The fact is SJU is not a bad job relative to other BE schools. It just isn't. The fact that the coaches put Georgetown above Villanova is evidence that Georgetown despite not having much recent success is still considered a good job.
Proud Alumn post=451623
That poll wasn't really a ranking of desirability. It was a ranking of 8 criteria and then an equal weighting of the scores of all 8. But some criteria are more important than others which that poll did not take into account.
What makes the St. John's job desirable compared to other BE schools?
-The ability to live and earn a good income in the NY area, for those that love NY.
- Media. Not really. We don't get much coverage with all the pro teams in the area. It could be a positive with winning teams but that is a chicken and egg dynamic.
- The fan base. Eh, not a big differentiator from other schools.
- MSG. It is a positive, but again, not the differentiator that it used to be.
- Recruiting NY area talent. Same thing, not a big factor anymore.
- Facilities. Among the worst.
The key way to improve the program would be to improve the facilities and focus on NY as showplace to be.
The fact is SJU is not a bad job relative to other BE schools. It just isn't. The fact that the coaches put Georgetown above Villanova is evidence that Georgetown despite not having much recent success is still considered a good job.
Proud Alumn post=451623
That poll wasn't really a ranking of desirability. It was a ranking of 8 criteria and then an equal weighting of the scores of all 8. But some criteria are more important than others which that poll did not take into account.
What makes the St. John's job desirable compared to other BE schools?
-The ability to live and earn a good income in the NY area, for those that love NY.
- Media. Not really. We don't get much coverage with all the pro teams in the area. It could be a positive with winning teams but that is a chicken and egg dynamic.
- The fan base. Eh, not a big differentiator from other schools.
- MSG. It is a positive, but again, not the differentiator that it used to be.
- Recruiting NY area talent. Same thing, not a big factor anymore.
- Facilities. Among the worst.
The key way to improve the program would be to improve the facilities and focus on NY as showplace to be.
Rick Pitino is a great BB Coach . Only a few would disagree with his Record over his entire Career. Purely as a Coach , he brought a lunch pail Providence Friar team to a Final 4 with Billy Donavan as the Star Player . As a pro Coach with the Knicks , he made Mark Jackson into the Rookie of the Year . And , turned Mark into a better pro than Pearl Washington or Kenny Smith . 2 NYC guards that were ranked much higher than Mark coming out of High School . He won 2 National Championships , Kentucky and Louisville . And , I don’t recall any allegations of Cheating at UK . Now at Iona , he is making the Gaels into possibly the best team in NY. One that has designs of playing top 50 Schools in their OOC schedule . It’s true the MAAC has usually gotten little National or TV attention but , who can remember not too many years ago , a little Jesuit School in Spokane , Washington with a young Coach Mark Few getting more and more National Recognition as the Wins piled up each year . Rick Pitino is very capable of doing that at Iona and may already be putting that together . High Ranked. Kids would play for him . Anyone doubting that is wrong . Kids who have elite talent mostly care about getting to the NBA. Their parents do too . They want a Coach and Program that gets them there . Period , the End ! Not only can Rick build a Program but , he can Coach like hell too! There aren’t many better in game Coaches than Rick . Pitino has a brand cache the likes of Coach K , Calipari, Jay Wright , Bill Self, Mark Few , Tom Izzo and a few others . Like it or not , Rick is a Elite Coach .
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SJU Double Alumn
Member
You are not expressing the poll correctly. The coaches didn't rank the programs, they ranked the criteria, then the publication just equal-weighted the different criteria.fordham96 post=451628 said:
beast of the east
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Proud Alumn post=451623 said:
- I would say our fan base is more of a negative than a positive. Creighton has a fan base that shows up year in, year out, good team, mediocre team. Ours only shows up when we are ranked or heading to the NCAAs.
- MSG: Yes, we play home games at MSG. No we aren't a draw. Villanova, UCONN in conf, and Syracuse, ND, Duke OOC put people in the seats else if we aren't a top 25 team, attendance is less than 8000 Johnny fans consistently. Any Big East school can say they play important games in the BET, with the Garden sold out and the nation's eyes are on the Garden. We can't
- Recruiting NYC talent? We haven't done that consistently in the 40 plus seasons I've followed the team. We rarely get one of the top 3 players out of the city, and always have to settle for the second tier of talent or worse.
beast of the east
Active member
You do know the school president's name is Shanley, and not Stanley? Just asking, How do you know how clean he is at Iona? Did they invite you to Newman Club when you were recruited?richard A Steinfeld post=451638 said: