Nov 8, 2016 - The lesser of two evils?

[fuchsia]

There is always the option of protesting the lack of protests. Better to light one candle than curse the darkness a thousand times.

And it is in a religious context that the phrase is first found in print. The English Wesleyan minister William Lonsdale Watkinson used the expression in The Supreme Conquest, and other sermons preached in America, 1907:

But denunciatory rhetoric is so much easier and cheaper than good works, and proves a popular temptation. Yet is it far better to light the candle than to curse the darkness.

 

[johnsliva]

I didn't vote for Trump but I'm trying to keep an open mind about the next four years. I do find it quite troubling though that Trump appointed Myron Ebell to head up his EPA transition team.....the man is a climate change denier.....if the country goes in the crapper, at least i've got legalized marijuana to self-medicate!

If you would like a real discussion on climate change I would be happy to oblige. There have been numerous warming and cooling cycles the earth has gone through without the benefit of man. Some people in their hubris think that we actually control more than we do and point to tiny statistical samples to prove their point (and panic people and create companies to make huge profits off their panic). We waste time on the bullcrap and we should be focusing on real issues and not destroy our rain forests and dump pollution in out waters and air.

Case in point "Sandy was the worst storm that ever hit NY and it was caused by climate change." In reality there were many force 5 hurricanes that hit ny in the early 1900'swhen the man made factors for climate change did not exist yet. The difference was the density of the population, the speed and breadth of communication and the stupidity of people densely building on the waterfront.

 

[88grad]

I didn't vote for Trump but I'm trying to keep an open mind about the next four years. I do find it quite troubling though that Trump appointed Myron Ebell to head up his EPA transition team.....the man is a climate change denier.....if the country goes in the crapper, at least i've got legalized marijuana to self-medicate!

If you would like a real discussion on climate change I would be happy to oblige. There have been numerous warming and cooling cycles the earth has gone through without the benefit of man. Some people in their hubris think that we actually control more than we do and point to tiny statistical samples to prove their point (and panic people and create companies to make huge profits off their panic). We waste time on the bullcrap and we should be focusing on real issues and not destroy our rain forests and dump pollution in out waters and air.

Case in point "Sandy was the worst storm that ever hit NY and it was caused by climate change." In reality there were many force 5 hurricanes that hit ny in the early 1900'swhen the man made factors for climate change did not exist yet. The difference was the density of the population, the speed and breadth of communication and the stupidity of people densely building on the waterfront.[/quote

I agree that the more tangible issues should be addressed like air pollution, water pollution, deforestation, etc. Whether you believe man is affecting the heating of the earth or not, it would be nice to have someone who is heading up the EPA actually give a crap about the planet.

 

[Class of 72]

I must confess the I was a Sanders supporter but congrats to my fellow redmen fans who are Republicans. United we stand, divided we fall.

 

[bamafan]

Heard two women interviewed tonight at a protest sight (was having dinner out so don't know where it was) who advocated a revolution stating that lives would have to be sacrificed. One of them was holding a baby. God help us all.

 

[monte]

Heard two women interviewed tonight at a protest sight (was having dinner out so don't know where it was) who advocated a revolution stating that lives would have to be sacrificed. One of them was holding a baby. God help us all.

One was that fat pg that the media outlets keep showing the video of. Her parents did a hell of a job raising her. They must be so proud. As for the revolution, these losers couldn't start a revolution if their lives depended on it. They talk a good game, but they have been given free reign. The push back is about to happen.

 

[Spocky Ramone]

Heard two women interviewed tonight at a protest sight (was having dinner out so don't know where it was) who advocated a revolution stating that lives would have to be sacrificed. One of them was holding a baby. God help us all.

They were not referring to their own lives, of corse...

 

[ErickTheRed]

Hard to lead a revolution when you have to rest and take a breath every few feet

 

[Moon Mullen]

I actually think some of them are afraid they might have a job when they graduate and
have to move out of parents house and rent their own place.

 

[redfazed]

Trump's divisive comments are the focus of attention, and understandably so.

But I think what's getting lost in the weeds here was that a hellava lot of white people who voted for Trump weren't "voting against women and minorities." They were actually voting on policy. For instance, Republicans in general and Trump in particular have been crystal clear about repealing Obamacare, which has become an unmitigated disaster (just ask Bill Clinton.)

I for one am now hopeful that something can actually be done about it. Do I have reservations about Trump's character? Yes. That's the ugly trade off I had to make. But sorry, it doesn't make me a misogynistic racist.

 

[frank]

Here I go again , Why are the white people considered racists when they voted republican ? How come minorities who voted 95% democrat not considered racists ? Do we not have a 2 party system where sometimes maybe the other party is more right ? Apparently not , to those who always vote one way .It blows my mind why anyone with so much evidence, would have voted for the corrupt Clinton machine . What have the Democrats done for the minorities that I don't see.? Did they get them a job ? Have they reduced the crimes and drugs in the big cities ? Have they placed so many housing regulations so that middle class was chased from the cities and left the city for only the very rich and the poor . The list could go on and on .

 

[mjmaherjr]

I have to admit and I think Beast touched on this earlier but I'm pretty impressed with how for the most part the thread has stayed civil. In the old days of R&P we'd be throwing verbal bombs at each other ( I kinda liked that since it made for fun reading ) but maybe we are just older and wiser but I love reading the different viewpoints ( just like I did in the R&P days )

 

[JackofVirginia]

Isn't it ironic that after Trump announced he may not accept the results of the election should he lose, all the liberals and media went beserk. Now after these losers lost the election they are not accepting the result.

 

[L J S A]

Isn't it ironic that after Trump announced he may not accept the results of the election should he lose, all the liberals and media went beserk. Now after these losers lost the election they are not accepting the result.

I suppose there may be some deniers out there, but people for the most part aren't saying the result isn't legitimate. He won the election. They are out there because they aren't happy with the result and what they think is coming.

Although it is laughable that he and those of his supporters on the lower end of the IQ spectrum cried about rigged elections for months in anticipation that they might lose, and once it was clear he was going to win, they suddenly had no issue with the process.

 

[firestorm]

I have to admit and I think Beast touched on this earlier but I'm pretty impressed with how for the most part the thread has stayed civil. In the old days of R&P we'd be throwing verbal bombs at each other ( I kinda liked that since it made for fun reading ) but maybe we are just older and wiser but I love reading the different viewpoints ( just like I did in the R&P days )

As an outsider (Canadian) with no dog in this fight, I've enjoyed this thread tremendously.

FWIW, I found the anti-Trump bias in the mainstream media infuriating – not because I agree with or support most of what he says; but because of the utter absence of balance in reporting on the two campaigns. To someone living outside your borders, it seemed the media was committed to painting a surface-level picture of Trump with no effort to create understanding of why his campaign appealed to so many people.

Reading this forum provided much better insights of how real Americans on both sides viewed the election. Very insightful and much appreciated...

 

[mjmaherjr]

I have to admit and I think Beast touched on this earlier but I'm pretty impressed with how for the most part the thread has stayed civil. In the old days of R&P we'd be throwing verbal bombs at each other ( I kinda liked that since it made for fun reading ) but maybe we are just older and wiser but I love reading the different viewpoints ( just like I did in the R&P days )

As an outsider (Canadian) with no dog in this fight, I've enjoyed this thread tremendously.

FWIW, I found the anti-Trump bias in the mainstream media infuriating – not because I agree with or support most of what he says; but because of the utter absence of balance in reporting on the two campaigns. To someone living outside your borders, it seemed the media was committed to painting a surface-level picture of Trump with no effort to create understanding of why his campaign appealed to so many people.

Reading this forum provided much better insights of how real Americans on both sides viewed the election. Very insightful and much appreciated...

Really appreciate your outsider POV on the media when you had no dog in this fight. Great post

 

[stjohnschris]

I have to admit and I think Beast touched on this earlier but I'm pretty impressed with how for the most part the thread has stayed civil. In the old days of R&P we'd be throwing verbal bombs at each other ( I kinda liked that since it made for fun reading ) but maybe we are just older and wiser but I love reading the different viewpoints ( just like I did in the R&P days )

As an outsider (Canadian) with no dog in this fight, I've enjoyed this thread tremendously.

FWIW, I found the anti-Trump bias in the mainstream media infuriating – not because I agree with or support most of what he says; but because of the utter absence of balance in reporting on the two campaigns. To someone living outside your borders, it seemed the media was committed to painting a surface-level picture of Trump with no effort to create understanding of why his campaign appealed to so many people.

Reading this forum provided much better insights of how real Americans on both sides viewed the election. Very insightful and much appreciated...

Well put. All sides of the media were out of control on this. Election Reality TV became a bigger seller than actual news, facts, platforms, policies, and genuine human interest stories... so they ran with it and the networks cleaned up. Facebook is in the blame line as well. No matter who ended up winning, it was all very embarrassing, and to some level continues to be. As a Canadian, you may not technically have a dog in the race, but you should definitely keep an eye on your neighbors new dog.

 

[redmannorth]

I have to admit and I think Beast touched on this earlier but I'm pretty impressed with how for the most part the thread has stayed civil. In the old days of R&P we'd be throwing verbal bombs at each other ( I kinda liked that since it made for fun reading ) but maybe we are just older and wiser but I love reading the different viewpoints ( just like I did in the R&P days )

As an outsider (Canadian) with no dog in this fight, I've enjoyed this thread tremendously.

FWIW, I found the anti-Trump bias in the mainstream media infuriating – not because I agree with or support most of what he says; but because of the utter absence of balance in reporting on the two campaigns. To someone living outside your borders, it seemed the media was committed to painting a surface-level picture of Trump with no effort to create understanding of why his campaign appealed to so many people.

Reading this forum provided much better insights of how real Americans on both sides viewed the election. Very insightful and much appreciated...

Well put. All sides of the media were out of control on this. Election Reality TV became a bigger seller than actual news, facts, platforms, policies, and genuine human interest stories... so they ran with it and the networks cleaned up. Facebook is in the blame line as well. No matter who ended up winning, it was all very embarrassing, and to some level continues to be. As a Canadian, you may not technically have a dog in the race, but you should definitely keep an eye on your neighbors new dog.

As the other known Canadian on the site , who graduated SJU with a degree in government and politics by the way , I found the race up to Tuesday deplorable and the conduct of tens of thousands since also deplorable.
Where I disagree with my fellow Canuck is that we have a huge stake in your election. As is often said when the US sneezes Canada catches a cold.
I disliked both candidates but I too found the treatment your president elect received from the media and President Obama shamefull. Obama was openly campaigning not for Hillary but against Trump. I have been following US elections for close to 40 years and never seen anything remotely similar. It seemed to me that Hillary had a huge advantage having a current president openly campaigning for her.
I can tell you that the results are similar in that Canadians voted for change and ousted a Prime Minister who had done a good job, though not without fault , and elected a very good looking , selfie taking , former high school teacher. Was I upset with the results , you bet. However, the next day the country united behind him and while running up massive deficits I must say has done some very good things.
I advise you all to unite behind the president elect come January 20 th , put down your gloves and stop the vitriol , and perhaps, just perhaps you too will be pleasantly surprised like I and many other Canadians are.
Believe me that is the much better route than continuing to talk down to one another and create further division.
If I over stepped my boundaries I apologise.

 

[redfanO10101ll]

I can vouch that the majority of these protesters aren't professionals. I personally know at least 15-20, if not more, friends/family/acquaintances who have attended protests across multiple cities. None of whom I've ever known to psychically show up to protest anything. This feels unique. Also the majority of those I've spoken with do understand that the result is legitimate and accept that Donald Trump is going to be our president. They're simply enacting their right to express outrage over the character of the man who is assuming the office. I support these protests, as I do all protests, as long as they are peaceful. There certainly are a smaller number who because of the popular vote are pushing for the Electoral College to vote Hillary into office against the will of their individual states (which I agree is not only ridiculously far-fetched but dangerous for our democracy). There are an even smaller number who talk about revolution. I've only seen these people on television. They make for good tv so I assume that's why they're being shown. I wouldn't mistake them for the majority of the crowd. The Democrats just suffered a major setback because they underestimated a large chunk of the electorate that Trump was listening to and speaking to. For Trump and his supporters to immediately write off all of these protestors as sore-losers & whiners would be a mistake (politically but also just a mistake for national unity). Learn from the Democrats in 2008: Big electoral success led to smugness which led to a spanking in midterms that crippled Obama's ability to be effective.

I was hesitant to post something political here because I don't know any of you guys personally and it seems I'm in the minority, so I'd like to add that although I'm a liberal Democrat (if that isn't somehow apparent from this post) I don't believe that all Trump supporters are racists or misogynists and I would never make those sort of judgments about someone without knowing them first. I've got a dad, uncles and a grandmother who voted for Trump and I would hope that nobody would call them those things without actually knowing them. I fear that a Trump presidency will lead to a very dark time for our nation but I genuinely hope that I'm proved wrong and President Trump leaves the country in a better state than he found it. In the end we hopefully all agree on the stuff that actually matters (The Big East is a top 3 conference, UConn sucks, Boheim is a baby, etc)

 

[mjmaherjr]

I can vouch that the majority of these protesters aren't professionals. I personally know at least 15-20, if not more, friends/family/acquaintances who have attended protests across multiple cities. None of whom I've ever known to psychically show up to protest anything. This feels unique. Also the majority of those I've spoken with do understand that the result is legitimate and accept that Donald Trump is going to be our president. They're simply enacting their right to express outrage over the character of the man who is assuming the office. I support these protests, as I do all protests, as long as they are peaceful. There certainly are a smaller number who because of the popular vote are pushing for the Electoral College to vote Hillary into office against the will of their individual states (which I agree is not only ridiculously far-fetched but dangerous for our democracy). There are an even smaller number who talk about revolution. I've only seen these people on television. They make for good tv so I assume that's why they're being shown. I wouldn't mistake them for the majority of the crowd. The Democrats just suffered a major setback because they underestimated a large chunk of the electorate that Trump was listening to and speaking to. For Trump and his supporters to immediately write off all of these protestors as sore-losers & whiners would be a mistake (politically but also just a mistake for national unity). Learn from the Democrats in 2008: Big electoral success led to smugness which led to a spanking in midterms that crippled Obama's ability to be effective.

I was hesitant to post something political here because I don't know any of you guys personally and it seems I'm in the minority, so I'd like to add that although I'm a liberal Democrat (if that isn't somehow apparent from this post) I don't believe that all Trump supporters are racists or misogynists and I would never make those sort of judgments about someone without knowing them first. I've got a dad, uncles and a grandmother who voted for Trump and I would hope that nobody would call them those things without actually knowing them. I fear that a Trump presidency will lead to a very dark time for our nation but I genuinely hope that I'm proved wrong and President Trump leaves the country in a better state than he found it. In the end we hopefully all agree on the stuff that actually matters (The Big East is a top 3 conference, UConn sucks, Boheim is a baby, etc)

I'd say there are a bunch of guys on this thread who have met but a lot haven't met either so don't be hesitant to post.

Some of my closest friends on this site started from when we all used to argue with each other way back around 2000 to 2004 when Bush got elected and when the R&P forum started virtually none of us knew each other and we were literally killing each other in the forum. Then we had our first redmen.com party in NYC and then we realized we all liked each other so the arguing-debating was great