Next Head Coach

[quote="Marillac" post=318136]While I hesitate to engage in the absurd mob frenzy that manifests itself every four years as reliably as the goddamn Olympics, I think any discussion of unproven up-and-comers like Oates is absurd.

Oates himself has said that he was just lucky to add a player like Massinhurg--who is a superior talent to anyone else in the MAC. For a Big East school to have someone THAT much better than the average conference starter they would need a current NBA player like Luka Doncic.

If Mullin leaves (he won't be fired) and you can't get a Hurley, the discussion begins and ends with Howland, Pearl, and Musselman.

The better option, IMO would be having Mullin add a veteran like Jim Calhoun and moving Mitch back to an advisory position.[/quote]

The Calhoun thing is interesting. I'd actually be for that but doubt he'd be interested. If he had any interest anymore at D1 wouldn't he be helping UConn? Musselman would be a dream hire.
 
[quote="fordham96" post=318132][quote="Mike Zaun" post=318130][quote="Marillac" post=318127]Why stop at the next coach? Who do you guys want when that guy is fired in 4 years? That will be more important...just a little more so than the guy that gets hired after he's canned in 3-4 years. We'll be the youngest team in the country by 2027, but we should be a bubble team soon after right around the time that coach will be on the hot seat.

We made a Final Four in 1985...tournament berths alone equal pink slips. Mediocrity will not be tolerated...as a result we will force ourselves into a perpetual state of inferiority.

We are...the Pink Storm!!!![/quote]

So we shouldn't get rid of coaches who stink just because...we want continuity? Sounds like the girl who stays in a toxic relationship just because she settles and finds an odd comfort in it. I'd suggest getting rid of the toxic situation and moving on rather than perpetuating it. Continuity for continuity sake makes no sense. You should only want continuity if it's working.

By the way I looked up Dixon's salary and he's making 3.2 million. Would we really be able to do that? Highly doubt it but maybe I'm wrong. This is why I don't think we can lure a F5 coach. They routinely pay much more than we do.[/quote]

Correct. So the stupid argument of the day is now you don't make coaching changes because the next coach may not work out either.

Look I don't think Coach is getting fired anyway but this argument is so ridiculous it stretches the bounds.

BTW-Norm Roberts called, he wants his 2010-11 season back...[/quote]


If think that 2010-11 season belongs to anyone bit Dunlap you are insane.

Norm was 6-12 with that squad as juniors PLUS a 5th-year senior Mase Jr. Norm was also 6-12 with them as sophomores. He was 5-13 with them as freshmen. See the pattern? He never won more than 7 conference games in 10 seasons as a head coach.

Norm didn't even start his two best players in 2009-10! He was an unmitigated disaster.
 
Look the best argument against a thread like this is it is premature and even with a collapse this year is still unlikely to happen.

But if the best argument you can come up with is that 'We can't keep doing this because the next coach could be just as bad or worse" you know you have run out of defensible arguments for the current staff.

But I honestly think the reality is much worse. I think the administration has boxed themselves and I don't see a way out at this point.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=318140][quote="Marillac" post=318136]While I hesitate to engage in the absurd mob frenzy that manifests itself every four years as reliably as the goddamn Olympics, I think any discussion of unproven up-and-comers like Oates is absurd.

Oates himself has said that he was just lucky to add a player like Massinhurg--who is a superior talent to anyone else in the MAC. For a Big East school to have someone THAT much better than the average conference starter they would need a current NBA player like Luka Doncic.

If Mullin leaves (he won't be fired) and you can't get a Hurley, the discussion begins and ends with Howland, Pearl, and Musselman.

The better option, IMO would be having Mullin add a veteran like Jim Calhoun and moving Mitch back to an advisory position.[/quote]

The Calhoun thing is interesting. I'd actually be for that but doubt he'd be interested. If he had any interest anymore at D1 wouldn't he be helping UConn? Musselman would be a dream hire.[/quote]

He's coaching d-3. He loves coaching that much. He's not just a prolific coach, he's one of the best program architects of all-time. From strength and conditioning to player development, he knows the value of obsessesing over the small details.
 
You know we've hit a low when the 76 year old, long-hated Jim Calhoun is being floated as an acceptable option.

Notice we have also reached the point of asking for Fran "check out my junk" Fraschilla and Rick "restaurant table" Pitino.

Oh boy.....that was, indeed, a bad loss.
 
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[quote="Marillac" post=318144][quote="Mike Zaun" post=318140][quote="Marillac" post=318136]While I hesitate to engage in the absurd mob frenzy that manifests itself every four years as reliably as the goddamn Olympics, I think any discussion of unproven up-and-comers like Oates is absurd.

Oates himself has said that he was just lucky to add a player like Massinhurg--who is a superior talent to anyone else in the MAC. For a Big East school to have someone THAT much better than the average conference starter they would need a current NBA player like Luka Doncic.

If Mullin leaves (he won't be fired) and you can't get a Hurley, the discussion begins and ends with Howland, Pearl, and Musselman.

The better option, IMO would be having Mullin add a veteran like Jim Calhoun and moving Mitch back to an advisory position.[/quote]

The Calhoun thing is interesting. I'd actually be for that but doubt he'd be interested. If he had any interest anymore at D1 wouldn't he be helping UConn? Musselman would be a dream hire.[/quote]

He's coaching d-3. He loves coaching that much. He's not just a prolific coach, he's one of the best program architects of all-time. From strength and conditioning to player development, he knows the value of obsessesing over the small details.[/quote]

I can not picture Jim Calhoun playing second fiddle to anybody.
 
[quote="fordham96" post=318142]Look the best argument against a thread like this is it is premature and even with a collapse this year is still unlikely to happen.

But if the best argument you can come up with is that 'We can't keep doing this because the next coach could be just as bad or worse" you know you have run out of defensible arguments for the current staff.

But I honestly think the reality is much worse. I think the administration has boxed themselves and I don't see a way out at this point.[/quote]

That's not the argument. The argument is that we've never seen what a staff can do with more than 3-6 years. We've never seen the value of continuity, learning your oppenents, experience in the conference, etc. We've only seen the destruction that constant firing and rebuilding does.

If anyone ever comes in here and does an immediate rebuild to the satisfaction of our horrific fanbase, they'd be hired somewhere else in the NBA or by a blue blood immediately!
 
Hire Rick Pitino!

Rick Pitino is out there looking for work and has never been more committed to winning in his life. He could give us the winning culture our program needs. SJU's problem is, just as Looie says it is "St. John's, It's all about the players". This philosophy has led us to only 2 NCAA tournaments since 2001, and we haven't seen back to back appearances since 99-00. To be a consistent winner you need a winning culture, talent is nice but having a proven and experienced wining culture is much more important. Their is no better example in sports today then the Islanders, they lose a top 3 player in the world but have managed to be better and claim 1st place because of the winning culture brought in by from front office acquisitions Lou Lamoriello and Barry Trotz.

I plead with all of you - please don't scoff at the idea of giving Pitino a second chance here. He would win big and win big immediately. Rick Pitino embodies the winning culture we have been lacking since Lapchick. The UCLA boosters want him, but I think we could still snag him if we tried!
 
[quote="Redmen07" post=318161]Hire Rick Pitino!

Rick Pitino is out there looking for work and has never been more committed to winning in his life. He could give us the winning culture our program needs. SJU's problem is, just as Looie says it is "St. John's, It's all about the players". This philosophy has led us to only 2 NCAA tournaments since 2001, and we haven't seen back to back appearances since 99-00. To be a consistent winner you need a winning culture, talent is nice but having a proven and experienced wining culture is much more important. Their is no better example in sports today then the Islanders, they lose a top 3 player in the world but have managed to be better and claim 1st place because of the winning culture brought in by from front office acquisitions Lou Lamoriello and Barry Trotz.

I plead with all of you - please don't scoff at the idea of giving Pitino a second chance here. He would win big and win big immediately. Rick Pitino embodies the winning culture we have been lacking since Lapchick. The UCLA boosters want him, but I think we could still snag him if we tried![/quote]

Last time I looked ST John's is a Catholic school. Sign me up for Rick but 0% chance it happens!
 
[quote="bamafan" post=317907][quote="Adam" post=317872]Thread came a few hours later than I expected lol.

Nate Oates would obviously be the best choice, though he seems unlikely.

For now hoping we can still turn things around... but not very optimistic.[/quote]
Not advocating for a coaching change one way or the other but just curious about Nate Oates. I know he has coached Buffalo the past 2 seasons after taking over for Bobby Hurley and is having a great season but he has like 5 seniors doing the heavy lifting so who knows if he can recruit or attract (with good recruiting assistants) good recruits. I'm sure he will look to bolt this year if he harbors higher aspirations than coaching at Buffalo because it is highly doubtful he will have the level of success next year that he has had this year. Obviously not a sure thing in my opinion. Think best option at this point would be to convince CM he needs to revamp his staff. We do have some fairly nice players in the pipeline. Hopefully this is our new AD's opinion and he can accomplish this task.[/quote]

I’m a UB alum who has followed the program closely since 96 and Nate Oats is the best coach Buffalo has ever had. He’s better than Bobby Hurley. Nate Oats was a successful high school coach in Detroit and got to know the Hurley’s when Danny was at Rhode Island recruiting one of Oats’ players (EC Matthews). When Bobby got the UB job, Danny recommended Nate for Bobby’s staff and put them in contact.

Right now there is nobody on the UB roster that has ties to Bobby Hurley. This roster is 100% Nate Oats. A bunch of the guys that Hurley was successful with were also guys that Oats coached in HS.

I’d love him to stay at UB but if he’s going anywhere I would kill to have him at St. John’s. He’s a guy who will win anywhere.
 
[quote="we are sju" post=318145]Pitino, Calhoun lol
How about John Wooden, Bobby Knight, the Easter Bunny or Captain Crunch?[/quote]

Phil Jackson’s unemployed now too ;) so is Todd Bowles
 
The Barbarians are at the Gate on Utopia Parkway ... Remotely suggesting Rick Pitino proves my Point . While we float that out, along with Jim Calhoun ,why not add Mike Rice for Assistant Coach ? Despite all the post game comments here , nearly calling for Chris to be dismissed, the reality is , with a shot dropping like Figgy’s yesterday or, the Ref reversing his call in the Hall game or, holding the lead on the Road at Nova , we could easily be 6-2 and not 3-5 . How about holding Players accountable for poor play ? Simon’s 5 points for example ? Or , Clarke shooting 3-15 and 2/9 from 3 ? 26 shots for those 2 players is way too much ! Making 5 is terrible. You can’t sugar coat their play yesterday .
 
My take on distributing the player vs coached blame. Keep in mind I want to see how this season ends before making any big decisions.

But you can absolutely point to individual games and moments and blame the players for their performance. But when a regime controls the program for 4-5 years and there is no success to showcase, that has to fall on the coach and the staff. Player have to play and coaches have to coach. And if there’s no success it falls on the figurehead
 
[quote="postell25" post=318181]
I’d love him [Nate Oats] to stay at UB but if he’s going anywhere I would kill to have him at St. John’s. He’s a guy who will win anywhere.[/quote]
——————
Oats coaches a fast paced uptempo game which in my mind is a big plus.
 
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[quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=318185]The Barbarians are at the Gate on Utopia Parkway ... Remotely suggesting Rick Pitino proves my Point . While we float that out, along with Jim Calhoun ,why not add Mike Rice for Assistant Coach ? Despite all the post game comments here , nearly calling for Chris to be dismissed, the reality is , with a shot dropping like Figgy’s yesterday or, the Ref reversing his call in the Hall game or, holding the lead on the Road at Nova , we could easily be 6-2 and not 3-5 . How about holding Players accountable for poor play ? Simon’s 5 points for example ? Or , Clarke shooting 3-15 and 2/9 from 3 ? 26 shots for those 2 players is way too much ! Making 5 is terrible. You can’t sugar coat their play yesterday .[/quote]

Isn't it the coach's job to determine what shots are desired and who should be taking them and then teach/guide/instruct the team to understand and execute that plan?
 
[quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=318185]The Barbarians are at the Gate on Utopia Parkway ... Remotely suggesting Rick Pitino proves my Point . While we float that out, along with Jim Calhoun ,why not add Mike Rice for Assistant Coach ? Despite all the post game comments here , nearly calling for Chris to be dismissed, the reality is , with a shot dropping like Figgy’s yesterday or, the Ref reversing his call in the Hall game or, holding the lead on the Road at Nova , we could easily be 6-2 and not 3-5 . How about holding Players accountable for poor play ? Simon’s 5 points for example ? Or , Clarke shooting 3-15 and 2/9 from 3 ? 26 shots for those 2 players is way too much ! Making 5 is terrible. You can’t sugar coat their play yesterday .[/quote]

The ref did blow that call at the end of the Seton Hall game and that should have been a win but the fact is that Mullin took the air out of the ball way too early having Ponds dribble out the shot clock and launching a bad three. That was our offense for most of the last 7-8 minutes. Same thing against Nova. Tried to take time off the clock instead of still running offense. Mullin almost blew the first Georgetown game as well with the same thing. And yesterday, I think we squeak that game out if we had a timeout left. But we were out with 7 minutes left. He’s the reason we are where we are.
 
[quote="otis" post=318188][quote="postell25" post=318181]
I’d love him [Nate Oats] to stay at UB but if he’s going anywhere I would kill to have him at St. John’s. He’s a guy who will win anywhere.[/quote]
——————
Oats coaches a fast paced uptempo game which in my mind is a big plus.[/quote]

That’s actually a misconception. On offense they play up tempo and try to get a good shot within 8 seconds, on defense they slow it down and grind down the opponent deep in to their shot clock.
 
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