MICHIGAN (@MSG), Mon., Nov. 13, 6:30p, FS-1

[Marillac2]

As bad as last night sounds like it was (I only saw the halfway decent part), it is one game at the start of a season with a whole new group who coach warned would struggle some at first. Let’s wait a while before deciding what these guys can do individually and together. By the time of the BC game I think we’ll have a better idea of the team’s potential.

It is only one game, but the problem is that Michigan is also a whole new group with a ton of transfers too. The kid, Burnett, who scored 19 first half points against us is new to Michigan this year and averaged 5 ppg for his career and scored 0 points against Youngstown State last week. Dug McDaniel is 3 games into his soph season and he looked a 3x All-American. All of their transfers and younger players played well while our transfers and younger players looked clueless. Michigan has a ton of room for improvement too. It's not like we got rocked by an established team returning 4-5 starters.

If it taught Jenkins and Ledlum a lesson it was worth the shellacking.

 

[Rocket]

Bol?

Maker?

 

[Moose]

Maker?

Thought you knew something about getting John Bol

 

[barbs20]

Seems to me like a lot of people thought because we got Pitino, we would never be blown out again. It happens to everyone and always will. Sucks it happened but rather it to Michigan who can turn out to be a solid tourney team and not end up a bad loss. I don't think this result is any indication of how good or bad the team is. I think the North Texas game and how they respond to this loss will be a better indicator.

 

[jackfro]

I'm older --- where's Mike Moses when you need him?

or Albie Schwartz, Jerry Houston or Carmine Calzonetti. I could go on but what's the point

 

[Jack Williams]

Seems to me like a lot of people thought because we got Pitino, we would never be blown out again. It happens to everyone and always will. Sucks it happened but rather it to Michigan who can turn out to be a solid tourney team and not end up a bad loss. I don't think this result is any indication of how good or bad the team is. I think the North Texas game and how they respond to this loss will be a better indicator.

Yea team will be fine and we are obviously capable of being blown out no matter who the coach is.

I think why a lot of posters are taking last night so hard is last night was supposed to be the re-announcement of St. John's basketball being relevant. That is why the game had so much hype for this school. It was supposed to be a celebration of getting Pitino and the celebration of a new and improved regime.

When you get your ass beat like that, its a huge buzzkill, no way around it. When you get your ass beat in Rick Pitino's first game at MSG as st johns coach, its a little bit of an extra buzzkill.

But yes, Some are struggling to find the balance between being upset about last night, while also understanding that its a long season and we can (and will) improve and show that we are better than what was seen yesterday.

 

[jackfro]

Also you know who else we are missing- AJ Storr - look at his stat sheet. Wish Rick could have kept him, I know he wanted to. Its just odd to me why Storr would be willing to play for an inferior coach, Anderson, at the same school yet jets when Pitino comes. Only thing I can think of is that Wisconsin offered more money. Thoughts?

Just dropped 17 against #9 Tennessee and played 33 minutes.

If you recall last year his defense was very little or nonexistent. We still would have lost. He would have not helped last night

 

[SLYFOXX1968]

After the next loss, I really hope a bunch of posters don't start lamenting how CP should have kept Posh or Storr or anyone else. CP doesn't like point guards that shoot 20% from 3. If you hire a hall of fame coach, best thing to do is get out if his way and let him do his thing. He knows what to do, and will get it done. Already signed a bunch of 4 star recruits between this season and next, and more are on the way. Coach's first season was likley going to be a difficult one at worst and a decent one at best. He sad it in the post game presser that you can't expect big things to happen with a roster pieced together 7 months before the season started.

I think that’s a great point about next year being even more important than this year for the Players that Rick will need to bring in to compete at a high level . We will the 4 and occasional 5 star player to be the nucleus of our future teams .

RP knows that more than we do .

 

[room112]

If you recall last year his defense was very little or nonexistent. We still would have lost. He would have not helped last night

And that's quite possibly why he didn't return. He was not willing to commit to what Rick would expect of him, the defensive end included.

 

[logen]

Also you know who else we are missing- AJ Storr - look at his stat sheet. Wish Rick could have kept him, I know he wanted to. Its just odd to me why Storr would be willing to play for an inferior coach, Anderson, at the same school yet jets when Pitino comes. Only thing I can think of is that Wisconsin offered more money. Thoughts?

Just dropped 17 against #9 Tennessee and played 33 minutes.

Yeah, dropped 17 on 20 shots, no great feat; shot 7 for 20, 2 for 7 from 3, and played his normal invisible floor game, 33 minutes, 2 assists and hustled and played hard to garner 1, yes 1, rebound.

 

[Section9]

or Albie Schwartz, Jerry Houston or Carmine Calzonetti. I could go on but what's the point

If any of those three were guarding Dug in a full court press they'd barely make it to half court while he was making a lay up at the other end. And I like all three of them.

 

[Dan V]

One loss in the second game of the year and Mike Anderson and the guys who left are being brought up lol. The talent gap wasn’t big against Michigan the team just didn’t have the chemistry to keep it together when things got tough. Mase made a good point older players yes but they have to adjust to new roles. Reminds me of team USA few years ago that had Durant and Lillard and they looked disappointing at first because a bunch of all stars had to start doing dirty work. If Luis is a better player than Soriano like some are saying he’s a hell of a player because Joel is easily the best player on this team.

 

[Marillac2]

Yeah, dropped 17 on 20 shots, no great feat; shot 7 for 20, 2 for 7 from 3, and played his normal invisible floor game, 33 minutes, 2 assists and hustled and played hard to garner 1, yes 1, rebound.

He’s a 6’6 Dingle. Doesn’t offer much anywhere else but offense. Easier to hide that kind of player at the 3 though.

 

[Dan V]

This team will improve. Pitino will go to more zone as the guys pickup the principles better in January. That will let Soriano stay home in the middle more instead of being caught out at the top of the key hedging.

They will learn one way or another that the best two shots are anything from Dingle and a set shot from Alleyne.

Jenkins and Ledlum will learn that they are secondary players that need to be patient and pick their spots instead of primary scorers or facilitators.

Dingle will get more time to handle the ball and he and Soriano will do well in pick and roll.

Taylor and Luis together will give us a chance to get more offense and still be fairly big at the 3-4.

I don’t think this team has the talent to be a good pressing team even with Pitino and even with 3 months of experience.

Your really defending that Alleyne take you had before the season. He doesn’t look anywhere near as good as you think he is. I believe you said he’d be top 2 or 3 on this team right? There is no way that’s going to happen he’d still be at UConn if he was that good.

 

[Marillac2]

One loss in the second game of the year and Mike Anderson and the guys who left are being brought up lol. The talent gap wasn’t big against Michigan the team just didn’t have the chemistry to keep it together when things got tough. Mase made a good point older players yes but they have to adjust to new roles. Reminds me of team USA few years ago that had Durant and Lillard and they looked disappointing at first because a bunch of all stars had to start doing dirty work. If Luis is a better player than Soriano like some are saying he’s a hell of a player because Joel is easily the best player on this team.

Nobody is bringing up Anderson to say they want him back. It’s just that this is the same result we always have.

Last night wasn’t just about chemistry. There is a lack of talent. When the coach can’t even press with his starters, there is a problem. When the coach says at the postgame presser game two that the front court depth is terrible, that’s more than a problem with chemistry

The sky isn’t falling, but dancing in March is not looking like a sure thing like it seemed to many of us two days ago.

 

[Marillac2]

You’re really defending that Alleyne take you had before the season. He doesn’t look anywhere near as good as you think he is. I believe you said he’d be top 2 or 3 on this team right? There is no way that’s going to happen he’d still be at UConn if he was that good.

Alleyne is the only proven contributor to a winning high major team on the roster. He is the only one who doesn’t have to prove a thing. He’s averaged double digits for a top 25 team that won the ACC. He shot 40.8% from 3 in the ACC. He’s started 3 seasons at Va Tech before UConn.

Who else can claim that? Who else started for an ACC champion or hit a three to send an NCAA tournament game to OT?

Alleyne also has a trash handle and is completely reliant on others to set him up. I’ve said that from day 1. The best play we will have every game will be a Nahiem Alleyne inside-out three point shot. Look over these stats and tell me who is capable for starting 3 years for an ACC team like he did.

Nahiem Alleyne College Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Nahiem Alleyne - Stats, Game Logs, Splits, and much more

www.sports-reference.com

 

[Rocket]

It is only one game, but the problem is that Michigan is also a whole new group with a ton of transfers too. The kid, Burnett, who scored 19 first half points against us is new to Michigan this year and averaged 5 ppg for his career and scored 0 points against Youngstown State last week. Dug McDaniel is 3 games into his soph season and he looked a 3x All-American. All of their transfers and younger players played well while our transfers and younger players looked clueless. Michigan has a ton of room for improvement too. It's not like we got rocked by an established team returning 4-5 starters.

If it taught Jenkins and Ledlum a lesson it was worth the shellacking.

Both Burnett and McDaniel were highly rated 4 star recruits out of high school. Both have played on upper echelon D1 teams in power five conferences.
Our backcourt was composed of an Iona transfer and a Penn transfer who was unranked coming out of high school. However, at Penn, Dingle held his own against non-ivy competition ( look at his Big 5 games....especially against Villanova). This was his second game. Don't underestimate his potential on this team.

By the 10 minute mark of the 2nd half Rick Pitino knew his starters were not in sync as a unit and benched them both as a teaching moment and to get his bench some invaluable experience playing against top level D1 competition.

Michigan's 4 four star players played to their rankings. Had Dingle, Jenkins and Ledlum played better, this would have been the close game everyone expected.

 

[Dan V]

Nobody is bringing up Anderson to say they want him back. It’s just that this is the same result we always have.

Last night wasn’t just about chemistry. There is a lack of talent. When the coach can’t even press with his starters, there is a problem. When the coach says at the postgame presser game two that the front court depth is terrible, that’s more than a problem with chemistry

The sky isn’t falling, but dancing in March is not looking like a sure thing like it seemed to many of us two days ago.

There is going to be guys that you just can’t press because they are too quick that’s a matchup problem not a talent problem. They could of communicated better on D to contain him but it still looks like the defense is a step slow with the rotations, that should improve.

It’s obvious that there is little depth behind Soriano I already acknowledged that but Joel handled both of their bigs just fine. I kept hearing about Michigans size up front the whole game but they weren’t the ones giving us problems it was the their two guards. McDaniel maybe but Burnett isn’t a way more talented player than what SJU has even without Luis, they just both went off in the same game which is what won them the game. Did Burnett even miss a shot in the first half? He hasn’t shown that type of ability up to this point.

 

[Marillac2]

The last thing I’ll say about this loss is we better make sure to get Wilcher 20 minutes against Holy Cross, Sacred Heart, Hofstra, and Fordham. Maybe throw him a start against Sacred Heart. Get him 10+ minutes against everyone else.

 

[SLYFOXX1968]

Both Burnett and McDaniel were highly rated 4 star recruits out of high school. Both have played on upper echelon D1 teams in power five conferences.
Our backcourt was composed of an Iona transfer and a Penn transfer who was unranked coming out of high school. However, at Penn, Dingle held his own against non-ivy competition ( look at his Big 5 games....especially against Villanova). This was his second game. Don't underestimate his potential on this team.

By the 10 minute mark of the 2nd half Rick Pitino knew his starters were not in sync as a unit and benched them both as a teaching moment and to get his bench some invaluable experience playing against top level D1 competition.

Michigan's 4 four star players played to their rankings. Had Dingle, Jenkins and Ledlum played better, this would have been the close game everyone expected.

Agree , both Burnette and McDaniel , 4 star Recruits are exactly the kind of Players that RP is going to want to bring in next year and beyond . He knows he needs to get the occasional 5 star player too . But , all that is being recruited now .

I think Alleyne and Dingle will need to be set up to get their shots . They have proven that over their careers that they can shoot well when that happens
Ledlum is undersized for a PF in the BE or other top conferences . We need to see the Ledlum that led the Ivy League in rebounding . Pitino knows he is under sized for that role . Which is. compounded by the lack of a back up for him , when he needs a blow or just needs to come out .

Getting Luis back soon is going to help in the front Court and Taylor could see more minutes as well .

Let’s see where we stand after Charleston .