Kudos Posh

[Section3]

Respectfully, it is a silly debate.  Different players.  Different positions.  Different strengths.  Different eras.  Both terrific and important players to their teams.

I understand the feedback...still...
I thought it was worth discussion...of course different players, different positions, different etas 1980s - 2020s
but are these two of our most significant freshman?
In any event - where would we be sans Posh!

 

It is definitely worth the discussion SS&G. I look at it like this, Posh is more important to this team than Chris was to the 1981-82 team. Take Chris off of that team, and you can put Kevin Williams who also played in the NBA as the starting shooting guard. You also have David Russell, Jeff Allen, and Billy Goodwin who all had nice careers overseas. Bill Wennington was a freshman that year with Chris and Ron Stewart. As great as Chris' career turned out, this team would have been good without him.

On the other hand, this year's team would be lost without Posh. As good as Julian is, Posh is the engine than runs this team. Take Posh away and this team is rudderless. So if you are looking at it as far as who has the most impact in their freshman year, I would have to say Posh. David Russell was the team's leading scorer during Chris' freshman year.

Posh has made all of his teammates better with his attitude, composeur, and leadership. Let's not get it twisted, I am not saying that Posh is going to have a Hall of Fame career like Chris, only that his impact on this year's team is greater than Chris' on the 81-82 team.

Posh = Born Leader...someone who raises everyone's confidence just by stepping on the court before he elevates it with his play

 

[MakingPlays]

Side bar comment - Moore becoming much more proficient out of post passing to cutters, open guys.

early in was disappointed with Moore mostly due to shot selection...but he seems to have taken the lessons and really has made great strides...gets a lot of hype for his dunks but much more skilled than just a dunker.

love his enthusiasm and he seems to be very an8mated even when on the bench

Moore has been a pleasant surprise during this stretch, and CMA has found a happy median with him.  He plays him strictly in that 15-20 minute range, he knows after that Moore gets a bit carried away and starts making bad decisions.  Moore is going to be great next year, I know they'll put some weight on him, and things will be slowed down for him, I expect to see him starting next year, he just has so much more upside than Roberts.  This year has been big for him as far as learning. 

 

[SLYFOXX1968]

Mullin was a close-to finished product from the minute he arrived here. 2nd team all Big East as a freshman. To best of my recollection, never had any freshman growing pains. Posh, for as great as he has been, took a little while to adjust to Big East play. This is no knock on Posh, but he wouldn't have even started on that 81' team. Don't think it's close between Mullin and Posh, but that doesn't take anything away from how great Posh has been, and how fortunate we are to have him. The fact that we are even having this discussion, and he is even being compared to the best ball player in our history, speaks volumes about his abilities and what he's accomplished this year.       Everyone is entitled to their opinion . Mullin averaged 16.6 his freshman year to David Russell's 17.3 . That's about a half point a game . Russell was a Jr when Chris was a fresh .   I liked David a lot but , you can't compare him to Mullin . Mullin was the guy every opponent knew they needed to guard .  I agree  that Posh wouldn't have started for the 81 team but , as we know , Louie rarely started any Freshman . It was a big weakness in Lou's Coaching . In 81 Bob Kelly started every game and averaged 33 minutes a game and scored less than 4 points a game ! Meanwhile Kevin Williams played barely 17 minutes a game but averaged  about 7 points a game . I'm not sure Kevin was the prototypical Point guard but , he was way better than Kelly and could spark a team .  Lou made much the same mistake with playing Mike Moses over Mark Jackson .  Posh is exciting and is the engine that makes this team go . Julian is the go to Scorer but , Posh makes it happen . He makes everyone better which is the ultimate accolade for a point guard !  There is no right or wrong answer here on Mullin or Posh since it's comparing apples  to oranges . 

 

[redmannorth]

Respectfully, it is a silly debate.  Different players.  Different positions.  Different strengths.  Different eras.  Both terrific and important players to their teams.

I understand the feedback...still...
I thought it was worth discussion...of course different players, different positions, different etas 1980s - 2020s
but are these two of our most significant freshman?
In any event - where would we be sans Posh!



 

It is definitely worth the discussion SS&G. I look at it like this, Posh is more important to this team than Chris was to the 1981-82 team. Take Chris off of that team, and you can put Kevin Williams who also played in the NBA as the starting shooting guard. You also have David Russell, Jeff Allen, and Billy Goodwin who all had nice careers overseas. Bill Wennington was a freshman that year with Chris and Ron Stewart. As great as Chris' career turned out, this team would have been good without him.

On the other hand, this year's team would be lost without Posh. As good as Julian is, Posh is the engine than runs this team. Take Posh away and this team is rudderless. So if you are looking at it as far as who has the most impact in their freshman year, I would have to say Posh. David Russell was the team's leading scorer during Chris' freshman year.

Posh has made all of his teammates better with his attitude, composeur, and leadership. Let's not get it twisted, I am not saying that Posh is going to have a Hall of Fame career like Chris, only that his impact on this year's team is greater than Chris' on the 81-82 team.

I agree Panther that it's a great discussion.   I don't agree with your argument at all.   When Chris Mullin stepped on the court for the very first time, he was already the best player we had put on the floor since George Johnson.   Within a few games, he was already better than Johnson.   He made a good team formidable, and comparing Kevin Williams, who incidentally never started for Looie,( but started for the Houston Rockets I believe at least for a bit) as a capable replacement for Chris, is almost absurd.   Chris made SJU a top conference competitor, and watching him play even as a freshman, was poetry in motion.

I could make the argument that I could have a bigger impact on a village in Burundi than Jeff Bezos has had on America, and make the same claim that Posh is more important to this team than Mullin was to his.

I will absolutely agree with you on this.   Right now, we do not know what Posh's ceiling is, because he does things that are really amazing to watch, yet we all believe he has miles of improvement left in him.   He excites fans in ways that no one here has done in a long time - ok Shamorie could light up a crowd, and so could D'Angelo - but Posh is different.    He seemingly has bno right outplaying better known players simply by locking them down and making big plays, but he's done that for a good chunk of the season.

I also noticed this.   I thought he looked tired in the second half last night , which shocked me, unless of course a Xavier player put kryptonite in his socks. 

Sorry Beast but the point was not if Mullin was a better player or if he was poetry in motion as a freshman or if he was a more complete player as a freshman. He was all of those. But Posh to the 2020 Johnies is far more important than Chris to the 1981 team. No Chris, they are still a very good team and yes Kevin Williams , who Lou never started for a very good reason, would have had to play the 2 and he would have been very good. He ended up being a very high second round draft pick. No Posh and I shudder to think where we would be. He is clearly the straw that stirs the drink that is SJU. Chris was just the second best piece of the puzzle as a freshman. Take away Posh and everyone's scoring goes down. Take away Posh and our rebounding decreases, our steal are down dramatically and our collective defensive effort is much poorer. 
In my 39 years of following SJU ball we have never had a freshman as important to the team as Posh. And if I had to pick number 2 it would be Malik Sealy. 

 

[Section3]

One thing I noticed last night.  Whenever Freemantle got a rebound, he held the ball high with Posh lurking.  Every game Posh has stolen the ball from a big man bringing the ball down after a rebound.  Freemantle obviously saw in film what Posh likes to do, and I don't believe it occured last night.  Love Freemantle.  Hopefully the rest of the opponents' big men we face haven't caught on!

IMO being in an opponent's head is key...whether it's the ball pressure on defense or attacking on offense and drawing fouls...it creates mental fatigue and doubt...it's what cost us the Butler game...they were very comfortable and we didn't get them out of it...part of it was we looked a bit slow that night and part of it was not changing the dynamic...they were driving to the basket and we should have done likewise..best way to change momentum is get the foul calls.
 

 

[BrooklynRed]

Posh is wonderful to watch because every night he does something different.  His intensity was seen with the dive for a loose ball and somehow getting it to Dunn who used smarts to call timeout.  Can't wait to be at CA and MSG to see Posh in person; imagine him drawing on the energy of the crowd to step it up a notch; is it possible as he already gives 100%.  
As to Moore and his work around the basket.  It has been a long time since we have had someone who could go straight up with authority and slam it home, incredibly quick off his feet and does not need a running start to slam. 

 

[SLYFOXX1968]

One thing I noticed last night.  Whenever Freemantle got a rebound, he held the ball high with Posh lurking.  Every game Posh has stolen the ball from a big man bringing the ball down after a rebound.  Freemantle obviously saw in film what Posh likes to do, and I don't believe it occured last night.  Love Freemantle.  Hopefully the rest of the opponents' big men we face haven't caught on!                 Fremantle from NJ would have looked great in our Red and White uniforms . He has a nice game .

 

[Amaseinyourface]

Point guard is the most important position in college basketball and the BE is always full of good ones. This year being no different. We have all seen the impact Posh (and Dunn of course ) has had on our team with just the "eye test" alone but I wanted to see how he stacked up against the rest of the leagues PGs. Here's the 11 starting PGs in the league plus Dunn and RJ Cole.

*stats in BE play only - per40 minutes*
pts / ast / reb / stl / to / fg% / 3fg%

Posh Alexander 
15.9 / 5.8 / 4.7 / 3.3 / 2.8. / 47.5 / 32.6 

Rasheem Dunn
12.7 / 5.4 / 3.7 / 2.0 / 3.1 / 42.1 / .06 

C. Gillespie 
16.9 / 6.7 / 3.5/ 1.2 / 2.0 / 42.3 / 39.3

Zegarowski 
17.7 / 4.5 / 4.8 / 1.3 / 2.4 / 43.3 / 38.7 

Bouknight (*4 games) 
26.7 / 2.5 / 5.5 / 1.9 / 3.5 / 46.8 / 27.8 

David Duke 
16.8 / 5.5 / 7.1 / 1.2 / 3.5 / 36.2 / 37.8 

Paul Scruggs 
16.8 / 7.0 / 4.7 / 2.0 / 3.5 / 46.0 / 40.6

Carton 
16.6 / 4.2 / 4.8 / 1.2 / 3.8 / 47.2 / 33.8 

Charlie Moore 
15.8 / 5.0 / 3.8 / 1.1 / 4.2 / 34.6 / 28.9 

Thompson 
11.5 / 5.7 / 3.0 / 1.3 / 3.2 / 50.5 / 0 

Blair
17.0 / 4.9 / 4.4 / 1.5 / 2.6 / 36.8 / 33.7 

Shavar Reynolds 
9.9 / 5.7 / 3.5 / 2.2 / 2.6 / 41.0 / 28.1 

RJ Cole 
15.1 / 5.3 / 3.9 / 1.4 / 2.5 / 37.4 / 36.7 

So Posh as a Freshmen is doing way more than holding his own and his biggest impact may never truly be seen on a box score. To conclude: 

Pts - 15.9 (8th)
Ast - 5.8 (3rd) 
A:TO - 2.07 (3rd)
Reb - 4.7 (T5th)
Stl - 3.3 (1st)
TO - 2.8 (6th best)
FG% - 47.5% (2nd)
3FG% - 32.6 (8th)

 

 

[mjmaherjr]

Don't know if it's been mentioned and too lazy to look. 2 of my favorite rebounding guards here have been Posh and Pinds. Rebounding is smarts and will. That simple. Ponds was so smart and knew angles and where the ball might go and he was just crafty. One of the smartest rebounders I've seen. Posh has those smarts but he goes up violently sometimes ( in a good way )  and plays 9 inches taller. I love watching players rebound or fight for them and when I see small guys do it to me that's a heart of lion statistic 

 

[Amaseinyourface]

Don't know if it's been mentioned and too lazy to look. 2 of my favorite rebounding guards here have been Posh and Pinds. Rebounding is smarts and will. That simple. Ponds was so smart and knew angles and where the ball might go and he was just crafty. One of the smartest rebounders I've seen. Posh has those smarts but he goes up violently sometimes ( in a good way )  and plays 9 inches taller. I love watching players rebound or fight for them and when I see small guys do it to me that's a heart of lion statistic 

They do it so differently but they both had such great hands. Man if only they could have played together. Thunder and lightning.

 

[Amaseinyourface]

Same stats as before - Posh and Wusu vs some of our better freshmen guard recruits since Barkley 

*Posh, Wusu, Ponds, Lovett, Harrison stats are per 40min conference games only 
*Barkley, Hill, Ingram stats are per 40min over the whole season. 

pts / ast / reb / stl / to / fg% / 3fg% / A:TO

Posh Alexander 
15.9 / 5.8 / 4.7 / 3.3 / 2.8. / 47.5 / 32.6 / 2.07

Dylan Wusu 
11.7 / 4.4 / 6.1 / 1.3 / 3.2 / 42.1 / 25.8 / 1.38

shamorie Ponds
21 / 3.2 / 4.4 / 2.7 / 2.1 / 44.2 / 31.2 / 1.52 

Marcus Lovett 
20.6 / 4.5 / 3.1 / 2.3 / 3.3 / 47.3 / 37.7 / 1.36

D'Angelo Harrison 
20.6 / 2.8 / 3.7 / 1.9 / 2.7 / 38.7 / 40.2 / 1.04 

Daryll Hill
16.9 / 4.3 / 3.1 / 1.9 / 4.0 / 38.1 / 34.4 / 1.08 

Elijah Ingram
13.4 / 3.3 / 3.2 / 1.7 / 3.0 / 37.5 / 36.1 / 1.1 

Erik Barkley 
16.3 / 5.7 / 3.8 / 2.7 / 2.5 / 39.5 / 34.3 / 2.28

Of course these guys were all in different situations and some are more 2s than 1s but I thought it was interesting to look at. Again, Posh's impact is hard to gauge solely from a box score. Wusu has steadily gotten better throughout the year and is a guy who leaves a mark on nearly every game. 
 

 

[paultzman]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

 

[SJU85]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

I hope there is no ligament damage either. 

 

[Lambsbball]

It's his right hand. They can securely tape the thumb. But can he still dribble and steal? Can he even grip the ball?

Dunn and Mcgriff need to get ready to play pg.

 

[L J S A]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

I hope there is no ligament damage either. 

This always scares me.

Different body part obviously, but I used to get up pretty high for a 5'10" white guy and was never the same after ligament damage. I always say I think I would have preferred a break, but not sure how fun a broken ankle would have been.

 

[Mean Gene]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

I hope there is no ligament damage either. 


MRI's show ligament damage. 
Injured ligaments on MRI may appear disrupted, thickened, heterogeneous, or at tenuated in signal intensity, and may be ab normal in contour. Fluidsensitive sequences are often helpful in detecting injury.

I think if there was ligament damage they would have said. 

 

 

[L J S A]

It's his right hand. They can securely tape the thumb. But can he still dribble and steal? Can he even grip the ball?

Dunn and Mcgriff need to get ready to play pg.

If McGriff is on his way out like many seem to think, I think it makes more sense for the future to let Dunn, Williams, and Wusu handle the ball. If McGriff was good enough to lead us to wins, he would have been playing.

 

[Alumni Hall]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

I hope there is no ligament damage either. 


MRI's show ligament damage. 
Injured ligaments on MRI may appear disrupted, thickened, heterogeneous, or at tenuated in signal intensity, and may be ab normal in contour. Fluidsensitive sequences are often helpful in detecting injury.

I think if there was ligament damage they would have said. 

Why disclose the full extent of his injury?

You list him as day to day to not give your opponent any pregame planning advantage. Take a page from the Patriots who never disclose the full extent of an injury. And the ONLY people that need to know are the coaches, parents and the player. No scouts, fans, press need to know. 
 

 

[beast of the east]

It's my understanding that every sprain is an injury to ligaments.  Black and blue around the injury is caused by tears that perfuse blood into tissue surrounding the injury.  Most are self healing with time and sometimes treatment.  A significant tear may require surgery and take significant time to heal.  That being said, a torn ligament in an ankle or knee is much more serious because they are weight bearing at all time, requiring a near full recovery to resume playing.  However, a serious tear to the thumb may also take a very long time to heal, with or without surgery.

 

[SJU85]

Zach B

St Johns PG Posh Alexander MRI on his right thumb came back without any fractures or breaks, I’m told. Will be further evaluated in days to come. #sjubb

I hope there is no ligament damage either. 


MRI's show ligament damage. 
Injured ligaments on MRI may appear disrupted, thickened, heterogeneous, or at tenuated in signal intensity, and may be ab normal in contour. Fluidsensitive sequences are often helpful in detecting injury.

I think if there was ligament damage they would have said. 


 

They specifically ruled out fractures or breaks, they did not ligament damage.