Criticism

[quote="Not an alum" post=408618]What kills me is when we defend well for 25 seconds than don’t rotate correctly and give up a wide open 3 end of shot clock

Not having a rim protector also hurts.[/quote]

I said to myself (and mentioned to another fan) that someone like Obekpa would be ideal for this team.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=408622][quote="espken" post=408617]What hurts most is we made the exact same mistake last year against Butler. Up 5 with 2 minutes left we foul Jordan Tucker 75 feet from the basket. The clock is our ally, why stop it, call off the full court press. Make them earn a bucket while killing 10+ seconds off the game clock. Fast forward to last night, up 7 with 2 minutes, SOS.

CMA is a class act, no one is turning on him. However the staff has to do a better job in crunch time. Period.[/quote]

Yep.... Being Anderson wanna bring pressure, then use token pressure in that situation as a means to simply make the opposition use some clock (and a bit of energy) to get into their offense. You may can still get the opposition to scramble a bit being they're behind late and need points. Just make 'em work harder to do so.[/quote]

If you recall, up 7 with 2 minutes and change on the clock, didn't we commit a dumb foul right away away from the basket? It stopped the clock, they made two, stole the inbounds and made a basket again. The Cole floated a cross court pass that got picked off. I don't know if that was bad coaching or reckless play. . I'd go with the latter, but that doesn't mean Coach is exempt from scrutiny.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=408624][quote="Not an alum" post=408618]What kills me is when we defend well for 25 seconds than don’t rotate correctly and give up a wide open 3 end of shot clock

Not having a rim protector also hurts.[/quote]

I said to myself (and mentioned to another fan) that someone like Obekpa would be ideal for this team.[/quote]

I said exact same thing. Scary! lol. Over past 20 years, I'd say we've had 3 competent low post players. Obekpa, Burrell and Lamont Hamilton. Don't think I'm missing anyone. All 3 were mobile enough to play in CMA's system. Wish we had someone like any of those 3, but agree that Obekpa would be best fit.
 
A lot of negativity is what happens when fans have overestimated the talent on the team. Then they blame the players and the coach when things don't turn out the way you hoped or expected.

I really liked Chris Mullin's line that anyone can score 20 at this level, but the great player is one that can give you that 20 every game. Moore just had a huge game, and Cole has had 2 excellent games. Earlington has had his moments. But they don't do it every night, and not often enough on the same night.

I am somewhat concerned about recruiting, mainly because CMA works hard and so does his staff. For whatever reason, the best don't want to play here. So what is left are transfers, JC players, and 3 star freshman. it's not from lack of effort, and it's not the style of play. This style should attract some very good and very athletic players. But every time St. John's goes for the big fish, they slip off the hook. The question is why, and the options plentiful. The truth may be too painful to discuss.
 
[quote="Monte" post=408626][quote="MJDinkins" post=408624][quote="Not an alum" post=408618]What kills me is when we defend well for 25 seconds than don’t rotate correctly and give up a wide open 3 end of shot clock

Not having a rim protector also hurts.[/quote]

I said to myself (and mentioned to another fan) that someone like Obekpa would be ideal for this team.[/quote]

I said exact same thing. Scary! lol. Over past 20 years, I'd say we've had 3 competent low post players. Obekpa, Burrell and Lamont Hamilton. Don't think I'm missing anyone. All 3 were mobile enough to play in CMA's system. Wish we had someone like any of those 3, but agree that Obekpa would be best fit.[/quote]

He made most teams and players hesitant to shoot close to the basket. The only player I can recall who challenged him and, in many ways, got the better of him was Jahlil Okafor. And, that was due to Okafor's skill and size.

Obekpa is easily the best shot blocker I've ever seen at St. John's, and one of the best I've ever seen in Big East history. Someone like him and his shot blocking prowess would be a huge lift for this group.
 
I have to assume that CMA knows a rim protector would do wonders for his style. Does he think Nyiwe is that guy?
 
Oh another rim protector! Fun! Blocked shots are cool. They draw oooohhs and ahhhhhs. They also manage to chip in 4-6 points a game in dumb goal tends. How about just play better defense.

Also nobody should be surprised. Making Plays and Billy Don and a few other Razorback faithful can fact check me but I knew CMA and his team to have a rep of giving up its fair share of points. But they also scored their fair share. I sure as hell am not happy with how things are going but they sure are more enjoyable than those 55-53 barnburners we had for a decade.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=408552]I disagree that we don't have a lot of true fans. When we had that meetup at Local before the Villanova game a few yrs back, there were so many people we had to start turning some away. The bar's manager came up to me, pulled me in the back and said, "So when are you going to do this again?! You're welcome back anytime" with a huge grin on her face. It was an awesome experience. Believe me when I tell you there are TONS of SJ fans out there. I think many are just in hiding until we have something to celebrate. It's expensive to go to games, take the train, get food/beer at MSG, etc. People are very busy. To have a bunch of people actively plan things around SJ games, the program has to make it worth their while. And right now we are a bottom feeder program not even playing at a Big East level. Once the product is decent enough, the people will come. Unfortunately I think the losing is becoming solidified and part of our culture.[/quote]

I was on that trip. It was awesome.

It was also about half-full until Dwight Hardy hit the shot to beat Pittsburgh. A lot of people jumped on after that.
 
I think some of you need to take a step back and look at the big picture (which Logen did a nice job of and Fordham as well).

This program has not been a relevant, bigtime program in a quarter century, and the school has never had the money to hire the sort of "destination coach" that is going to make it one overnight. Coach Anderson is a completely professional coach, not to mention a fine person. Given the position it was in / put itself in, St. John's more or less hit the lottery when it signed him.

You're in YEAR TWO of his program. He had more to start with than some of our previous coaches, but it isn't as though he inherited a bunch of all-BE players. And in case it went unnoticed, the COVID pandemic set back some of the Year 2 development (not only for us but for lots of teams) that he otherwise would have had, and could really have used given the player mix at the moment.

I think that the whole recruiting conversation is both overrated and premature. It seems to me that the players he's brought in, while not one-and-doners, have upside and that he knows how to develop them as well as the players he inherited. What team would NOT want Champagnie, who - by the way like Mamu at the Hall - was a 3-star recruit? As far as I can tell, the staff has a fine eye for players who are underrated and can turn into fine Big East players. And if we become a program that wins regularly, it will be easier to land difference-makers.

Yes, the defense has sucked early in the season. You can't let Georgetown shoot 60%, that's just ridiculous. The team needs to learn how to transition from the press-and-trap aggressiveness into fundamental D when needed (stop the ball, rotate to help in the paint, close out on the open shooter, get a body on a body). It'll come - it isn't as though Anderson is a coach who doesn't care about defense.

There are also growing pains that come with starting a freshman point guard. Anderson has clearly decided to take his lumps so Posh can get experience. The transfers are still adjusting - Moore obviously played his best game last night, Cole struggled, and Toro was very productive in his time on the floor.

Bottom line is that it's going to take time. The team should get better as the year goes on, and this year's project is all about laying the groundwork for next year, when you'll have a team of mostly returning players who have a year or two of experience in the system plus a few new pieces who can contribute in spots while they learn. It isn't a two year project. It's often a four year haul to lay the foundation for a program, I think we will get there in three.

Are we going to be Villanova in years 3 and 4? No, we won't. We will be Providence, or maybe Xavier. And that's just fine. If you thought we were going from irrelevant to Duke in 2 years, well, that's on you.
 
LMF, so you are preaching patience as the solution to the team’s performance. Trust CMA and be patient.
 
[quote="Knight" post=408647]LMF, so you are preaching patience as the solution to the team’s performance. Trust CMA and be patient.[/quote]

Yeah but I used more words.
 
[quote="lawmanfan" post=408648][quote="Knight" post=408647]LMF, so you are preaching patience as the solution to the team’s performance. Trust CMA and be patient.[/quote]

Yeah but I used more words.[/quote]

Lol.
 
Lawmanfan, nice post. I may disagree with some stuff there, but I can see where you're coming from. Unfortunately I don't see us being PC or Xavier in year 3 or 4. I think our ceiling is low with the 40 min of hell style mixed with the lack of talent and size. I can't really see us finishing any better than 7th out of 11, because so far we cannot win in conference play on any regular basis. We can't even come close to .500. Our poor starts year after year all but cement this fact even when the seasons start with hope. I think our program is used to a losing culture by now.
 
[quote="lawmanfan" post=408643]I think some of you need to take a step back and look at the big picture (which Logen did a nice job of and Fordham as well).

Bottom line is that it's going to take time. The team should get better as the year goes on, and this year's project is all about laying the groundwork for next year, when you'll have a team of mostly returning players who have a year or two of experience in the system plus a few new pieces who can contribute in spots while they learn. It isn't a two year project. It's often a four year haul to lay the foundation for a program, I think we will get there in three.

Are we going to be Villanova in years 3 and 4? No, we won't. We will be Providence, or maybe Xavier. And that's just fine. If you thought we were going from irrelevant to Duke in 2 years, well, that's on you.[/quote]

Rutgers Big Ten Records since Pikeil was hired:
3-15
3-15
7-13
11-9

This might anger some but I consider a SJU turnaround a fairly good job comparison. If you check these boards Pikeil is thought of well here (and I agree.)

It's year two for CMA. I'm not suggesting that folks enjoy losing or like everything CMA does as a coach. But even if this is going to work, it will take time. Personally, I like enough of what is going on to have some optimism.

As this board skews older, I tend to suspect that any coach suffers from expectations that might not be achievable. I don't envision SJU as a national program again in my lifetime. It's such a different world. Providence like success would suit me fine.

Would be thrilled to be wrong about that, and for those yearning for more - I'm wrong plenty.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=408654]Lawmanfan, nice post. I may disagree with some stuff there, but I can see where you're coming from. Unfortunately I don't see us being PC or Xavier in year 3 or 4. I think our ceiling is low with the 40 min of hell style mixed with the lack of talent and size. I can't really see us finishing any better than 7th out of 11, because so far we cannot win in conference play on any regular basis. We can't even come close to .500. Our poor starts year after year all but cement this fact even when the seasons start with hope. I think our program is used to a losing culture by now.[/quote]

This is my shocked face.
 
The feeling about SJUs future is really on a downswing. I don’t recall Anderson stating where he feels SJUs top is but many fans seem to feel it is middle of the big east. It feels like the complete opposite of what is going on at Iona.
Pitino first stated he envisonaged Iona becoming Gonzaga . Now he has downgraded that to Dayton. He is out recruiting Europeans and has completely vitalized the fan base and while he is not a young man and has many warts and will not make Iona even a Dayton because of Ionas limitations are there any other fans out there who feel SJU missed the boat?
 
[quote="Enright" post=408668]The feeling about SJUs future is really on a downswing. I don’t recall Anderson stating where he feels SJUs top is but many fans seem to feel it is middle of the big east. It feels like the complete opposite of what is going on at Iona.
Pitino first stated he envisonaged Iona becoming Gonzaga . Now he has downgraded that to Dayton. He is out recruiting Europeans and has completely vitalized the fan base and while he is not a young man and has many warts and will not make Iona even a Dayton because of Ionas limitations are there any other fans out there who feel SJU missed the boat?[/quote]

No.
 
Anderson has actually walked into a much more favorable program than any of St. John's coach of the last 15 or so years. There is some structure and a commitment to make athletics better.

There also aren't any steps to skip. This is par for the course when you hire a new coach. Implement a system, find guys that fit your system, develop, have upperclassmen leadership then translate into wins.

Anderson is clearly favoring his recruits on the court now. It will be a rollercoaster. He also is playing a system that teams are able to adjust better to with the influx of hybrid forwards and centers. It might not win a Be title but they'll eventually have some success.

The concern to me has always been the recruiting staff. I like Von Macon but I don't feel he is the lead recruiter that will get you high major talent. Demeo and Cleveland aren't tearing it up out there either. They will get some juco's and find some pieces but if fans are looking for the big dogs look elsewhere asap.
 
great point on playing time. CMA is going w his guys for the most part. If we play 9 (toro over Roberts), we have no players except Toro and Dunn with more than a year of substantial D1 playing time...

Crazy
 
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