GoldenLeaf
Active member
A very good friend of mine is, and has been, an Arkansas booster for many years. Down there he was referred to as Mediocre Mike. Fwiw.
Criticism
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[quote="Mike Zaun" post=408559]I encounter casual SJ fans on a weekly basis...sometimes daily. The common sentiment is, "we used to be really good way back in the day but now we are irrelevant". Hard to argue against that. I would usually say something like, "yeah but we have a chance to be pretty good with some solid players, check them out" trying to sell them a bit. There have been no moments for the last 20 yrs that SJ fans can say, "I remember that amazing season" like a Final Four run, an Elite 8, a Sweet 16, not even an NCAA win or a Big East championship either regular season or in the tourney. It reminds me of the Mets with all their 1986 moments played over and over. We play 1985 over and over. I saw a movie recently from 1985 and it looked like it was forever ago. We can't hold onto 1985 forever as our claim to fame if we want fans to show up. Eventually, we will need to do something in this current generation.[/quote]
Let's face it we stink and we havent been good for decades. Part of the reason was Harrington didnt care. They hired the wrong people as coaches. Anderson is half decent but they should have gotten Pitino. Basketball is dead at st johns
Let's face it we stink and we havent been good for decades. Part of the reason was Harrington didnt care. They hired the wrong people as coaches. Anderson is half decent but they should have gotten Pitino. Basketball is dead at st johns
JohnnyFever
Active member
Speaking for myself, I definitely took the Lavin years for granted. Winning 20+ games and being over .500 in conference play? That seems like ancient history now. I really didn't think we'd take a nosedive after that era. I figured we could build from it. Lavin was not a good coach, but the excitement was there, he recruited well, and we were taken seriously in the Big East. I fear we may be permanently irrelevant. When the 1985 era fans are gone, what on earth does SJ even have to be remembered by for younger fans? I don't even remember the 2000 season because I was too young to really follow. I know this sounds crazy, but is there any chance Lavin would ever come back? I mean, DePaul did it. Lavin is about the best we can possibly do at this point and he will drive us nuts with street ball and minimal development, but I'd take that with 20 win seasons any day over being the new DePaul the last 5 yrs.
Moose
Well-known member
[quote="SJU61982" post=408545][quote="Las Vegan" post=408030]So much frustration, angst and pain, but at least no one, as yet, has called for leaving the Big East and joining the MAAC.[/quote]
I'm not advocating for us to do that, by any means. However, the Big East has to be wondering what exactly we bring to the table for them.
NYC market? Outside of this message board, and a scattered number of other people, nobody cares about the team. Not many "true fans." Mullin's return upped the interest a bit, and people will jump on the bandwagon as far as attendance if we're even good, but we've never been a TV ratings winner, and since every conference game is on somewhere now, what's the big deal about taking us out, and replacing us with someone else?
MSG for the tournament? Well, from what I understand, the Big East has a long-term, iron-clad contract with the Garden for the tournament, so there's ample time for them to build an identity without us, and they might not need much. While Butler, Creighton, Xavier, and Marquette don't draw great when they play us in New York, their fanbases come out for the Big East Tournament (Marquette, less so then other three). A lot of their fans use it as a week's vacation, so my guess is that would continue without us being a part of it. Throw in strong local fanbases for Providence, UCONN, and Villanova, and they should have no problems drawing crowds to the building.
Facilities? Even if CA sold out every game, we wouldn't be making enough money from it to compete financially. And, we apparently pay a pretty penny to play at MSG, so much so, that we usually take a loss on it. On top of that, it will never be a true homecourt advantage for us, even if our fans fill it. The teams that we're playing against, play there once or twice a year, so it's a special moment for them, and they'll play with that extra zip. On the other hand, we play there 7 or 8 times a year, and I think it loses it's luster for our guys, after awhile. Only natural, IMO. Part of me is still tempted by the thought of playing all of our games at the new UBS Arena (Belmont Park site). It's perfectly located for most of our fan base (not for me actually, but for most, it is), and maybe we can do something like Seton Hall does at the Rock, and curtain off the upper bowl. At lot of people laughed at them for doing that, but it put all of the fans close to the court, and the sound reverberation made the place sound louder then it probably is, but that's still an advantage.
However, if we did that, we'd be laughed at for dumping MSG. But, what if MSG decides they want to go in another direction? There were rumors in recent years (unsubstantiated, and probably not true) that the only reason MSG allows us to stay is because Dolan likes us (that would be consistent with his style of ownership). I'm sure some Garden higher-ups consider us to be an albatross. Paying so many people for such little revenue, can't do them much good.
Ideally, we build a 10,000 seat on campus arena, and use the Garden for anything over that, but it's been mentioned on here before, that space is more of an issue then money would be, for something like that. If that's true, there's really nothing that can overcome that.
The cold, hard truth, is that very little separates our position now, from where Temple football was when the Big East kicked them out (granted, it was the old Big East Conference). In fact, what may be saving us, is the fact that DePaul has been even worse then us, through all of this, and it hasn't even been close. At least they tried though, by building a new arena. Granted, it was probably the worst job of building an arena that was ever planned, but at least they took a major step. It just hasn't worked out for them. We, OTOH, are stuck in neutral, with seemingly no good solutions.
If I'm the Big East, I take a long, hard look at our program, and wonder if we're worth it.[/quote]
You're on fire today.
First wishing the team got COVID
Next this.
The week is young and you have set the bar high, er low.
I'm not advocating for us to do that, by any means. However, the Big East has to be wondering what exactly we bring to the table for them.
NYC market? Outside of this message board, and a scattered number of other people, nobody cares about the team. Not many "true fans." Mullin's return upped the interest a bit, and people will jump on the bandwagon as far as attendance if we're even good, but we've never been a TV ratings winner, and since every conference game is on somewhere now, what's the big deal about taking us out, and replacing us with someone else?
MSG for the tournament? Well, from what I understand, the Big East has a long-term, iron-clad contract with the Garden for the tournament, so there's ample time for them to build an identity without us, and they might not need much. While Butler, Creighton, Xavier, and Marquette don't draw great when they play us in New York, their fanbases come out for the Big East Tournament (Marquette, less so then other three). A lot of their fans use it as a week's vacation, so my guess is that would continue without us being a part of it. Throw in strong local fanbases for Providence, UCONN, and Villanova, and they should have no problems drawing crowds to the building.
Facilities? Even if CA sold out every game, we wouldn't be making enough money from it to compete financially. And, we apparently pay a pretty penny to play at MSG, so much so, that we usually take a loss on it. On top of that, it will never be a true homecourt advantage for us, even if our fans fill it. The teams that we're playing against, play there once or twice a year, so it's a special moment for them, and they'll play with that extra zip. On the other hand, we play there 7 or 8 times a year, and I think it loses it's luster for our guys, after awhile. Only natural, IMO. Part of me is still tempted by the thought of playing all of our games at the new UBS Arena (Belmont Park site). It's perfectly located for most of our fan base (not for me actually, but for most, it is), and maybe we can do something like Seton Hall does at the Rock, and curtain off the upper bowl. At lot of people laughed at them for doing that, but it put all of the fans close to the court, and the sound reverberation made the place sound louder then it probably is, but that's still an advantage.
However, if we did that, we'd be laughed at for dumping MSG. But, what if MSG decides they want to go in another direction? There were rumors in recent years (unsubstantiated, and probably not true) that the only reason MSG allows us to stay is because Dolan likes us (that would be consistent with his style of ownership). I'm sure some Garden higher-ups consider us to be an albatross. Paying so many people for such little revenue, can't do them much good.
Ideally, we build a 10,000 seat on campus arena, and use the Garden for anything over that, but it's been mentioned on here before, that space is more of an issue then money would be, for something like that. If that's true, there's really nothing that can overcome that.
The cold, hard truth, is that very little separates our position now, from where Temple football was when the Big East kicked them out (granted, it was the old Big East Conference). In fact, what may be saving us, is the fact that DePaul has been even worse then us, through all of this, and it hasn't even been close. At least they tried though, by building a new arena. Granted, it was probably the worst job of building an arena that was ever planned, but at least they took a major step. It just hasn't worked out for them. We, OTOH, are stuck in neutral, with seemingly no good solutions.
If I'm the Big East, I take a long, hard look at our program, and wonder if we're worth it.[/quote]
You're on fire today.
First wishing the team got COVID
Next this.
The week is young and you have set the bar high, er low.
[quote="Not an alum" post=408572]Am I the only one that notices a lack of effort/hustle from certain starters? Not going for loose balls and not hustling back on defense. Lax passing to top it off?
That concerns me.[/quote]
This team hustles. I think that the style of play has many gassed.
That concerns me.[/quote]
This team hustles. I think that the style of play has many gassed.
[quote="Moose" post=408577][quote="L J S A" post=408576]I just hope Pitino has the good sense to retain Van to the St. John's coaching staff after we've run Anderson out of town.[/quote]
Come on
He's not gonna go from one MAAC school to another MAAC school[/quote]
Ouch! Lol
Come on
He's not gonna go from one MAAC school to another MAAC school[/quote]
Ouch! Lol
I think we don’t have the players to run CMA’s style of play. He needs to adjust his style and properly use his players.
Our Defense has been horrible, with few if any adjustments. He also seems to get lost in watching the game and forgets his time-outs.
The refs are screwing us most games. I was screaming for 3-second violations and fouls to be called on opponents guards advancing the ball while fending off our defender with their free hands. Need more passion from CMA in working the refs.
Reset and go forward.
Our Defense has been horrible, with few if any adjustments. He also seems to get lost in watching the game and forgets his time-outs.
The refs are screwing us most games. I was screaming for 3-second violations and fouls to be called on opponents guards advancing the ball while fending off our defender with their free hands. Need more passion from CMA in working the refs.
Reset and go forward.
beast of the east
Active member
Well it only took 2 conference games into CMA's second season for the tone of this site to turn against him. He had a pretty good honeymoon though. Welcome to NY Mike!
Mullins Revenge
Well-known member
[quote="Beast of the East" post=408581]Well it only took 2 conference games into CMA's second season for the tone of this site to turn against him. He had a pretty good honeymoon though. Welcome to NY Mike![/quote]
When u play 45 minutes of basketball yesterday and you only play Earlington for 13 of those minutes you deserve all the heat you get. The Duke was 4-6 from the field and 2-3 from deep in the 1st half. Coach Mike was completely clueless yesterday.
When u play 45 minutes of basketball yesterday and you only play Earlington for 13 of those minutes you deserve all the heat you get. The Duke was 4-6 from the field and 2-3 from deep in the 1st half. Coach Mike was completely clueless yesterday.
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Beast of the East" post=408581]Well it only took 2 conference games into CMA's second season for the tone of this site to turn against him. He had a pretty good honeymoon though. Welcome to NY Mike![/quote]
He should dress like Santa on Wednesday so posters here can throw snowballs at him like they do in Philly.
He should dress like Santa on Wednesday so posters here can throw snowballs at him like they do in Philly.
The criticism is over the top.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Duke of Earlington" post=408582][quote="Beast of the East" post=408581]Well it only took 2 conference games into CMA's second season for the tone of this site to turn against him. He had a pretty good honeymoon though. Welcome to NY Mike![/quote]
When u play 45 minutes of basketball yesterday and you only play Earlington for 13 of those minutes you deserve all the heat you get. The Duke was 4-6 from the field and 2-3 from deep in the 1st half. Coach Mike was completely clueless yesterday.[/quote]
That's all well and good, but you bailed on him when he had a tough few games. Are you the best person to call for him to get more PT?
When u play 45 minutes of basketball yesterday and you only play Earlington for 13 of those minutes you deserve all the heat you get. The Duke was 4-6 from the field and 2-3 from deep in the 1st half. Coach Mike was completely clueless yesterday.[/quote]
That's all well and good, but you bailed on him when he had a tough few games. Are you the best person to call for him to get more PT?
[quote="fordham96" post=408585]The criticism is over the top.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
Exactly.
Personally, I'm OK with the level of competitiveness we showed in our first 2 conference games, given all the constraints you outline above.
Anderson is a proven coach and surely deserves 4 years to turn this ship around.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
Exactly.
Personally, I'm OK with the level of competitiveness we showed in our first 2 conference games, given all the constraints you outline above.
Anderson is a proven coach and surely deserves 4 years to turn this ship around.
JohnnyFever
Active member
[quote="fordham96" post=408585]The criticism is over the top.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
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[quote="fordham96" post=408585]The criticism is over the top.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
In answer to your last 2 questions "Yes". Plenty of our fan base expected that. Their favorite motto "we're gonna surprise a lot of people this year". And now, the only ones surprised at how we're playing is them.
But so were the expectations of some people. This team was picked 9th for a reason. This team has no current RSCI top 100 recruits on its roster right now.
Again worth repeating coming off a 5-13 season and you land no consensus top 100 recruits and your team's leading scorer transfers late and you are picked almost universally to finish at the bottom of the conference and you expect what? To win 20 games? Go 10-10?[/quote]
In answer to your last 2 questions "Yes". Plenty of our fan base expected that. Their favorite motto "we're gonna surprise a lot of people this year". And now, the only ones surprised at how we're playing is them.