Adios Tariq

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This is the current system and where would our program be right now without transfers? We would have been playing Ponds, Yakwe, Amar and walkons. More and more you have to look at things one year at a time. For next year Clark and Simon seem all in, and Keita and Dixon can't reasonably go anywhere (yet!). Ponds is the wildcard and far and away the most important guy. If he also comes back to join them this team should be good next year.

I have been critical of the turnover but if you look around to expect none is not realistic. Keep everyone above, and if I was on the staff I would also be working on Trimble and Yakwe to stay. In Yakwe's case he can give you the shot blocking and defense Owens gave and he is willing to play inside. If you can convince him that 10-15 minutes is enough he can be a real asset and Owens leaving makes that a possibility.

If Yakwe and Trimble both leave also, that would bother me. The program can't have three or four guys leaving every year, over time that just can't work..
 
If Tarig and his father have any NBA dreams after his getting out of SJU , Md or wherever, they should go to a Knick game, sit behind the basket up close and they will realize that the big east is a women's league when compared to the NBA as far as playing in the paint and Tarig can't play near the basket in the big east.
I hope they are thinking of Europe unless he can put on forty lbs wherever he goes next year.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=277841]To me, this is the stupidest crap ever. If you are really an NBA talent, by age 22 and play at the D1 level in a major conference, you are already on the NBA radar or you aren't. Thinking that there is a magical program or situation where your skills will shine brightly and make you an NBA draft pick are just plain stupid. Jakarr Sampson in his final season at SJU had a downright miserable first half of a season where he couldn't make a wide open 5 foot shot, yet still found his way onto an NBA roster. Harkless was one and done here. Harrison was a Wooden finalist.

If Tariq is good enough to play in the NBA, the notice is there already. If not, not. Do you see him being the breakthrough offensive force that lights it up during the NCAA tourney? Maryland was an 8-10 finisher in the ACC and 19-13. Hardly a powerhouse program. I'd be stunned if he becomes a focal point of their offense and contributes 17 / 10 stats. First off, no inside game. Second, his outside shot is hit and miss. Third, at 23, the NBA won't see a big upside on his development.

He's gone. Like the kid who left during Dunlap's season as HC who averaged 50 ppg at Overbrook (Chamberlains alma mater) and who couldn't even make it big at Rider, I think Tariq will find that he has to look in the mirror to discover why he isn't on the NBA radar. But it's up to him, his right, and good luck.[/quote]

May I add that when he looks in that mirror he does so naked. His physical frame screams "knock me on my ass". His dad living vicariously through his son's basketball games will not put 30 pounds on his frame. I agree with everything else you said.
 
[quote="IDRAFT" post=277851]This is the current system and where would our program be right now without transfers? We would have been playing Ponds, Yakwe, Amar and walkons. More and more you have to look at things one year at a time. For next year Clark and Simon seem all in, and Keita and Dixon can't reasonably go anywhere (yet!). Ponds is the wildcard and far and away the most important guy. If he also comes back to join them this team should be good next year.

I have been critical of the turnover but if you look around to expect none is not realistic. Keep everyone above, and if I was on the staff I would also be working on Trimble and Yakwe to stay. In Yakwe's case he can give you the shot blocking and defense Owens gave and he is willing to play inside. If you can convince him that 10-15 minutes is enough he can be a real asset and Owens leaving makes that a possibility.

If Yakwe and Trimble both leave also, that would bother me. The program can't have three or four guys leaving every year, over time that just can't work..[/quote]

I am not a fan of players leaving but if there were two players that could be easily replaced if they left they are Trimble and Yakwe. If Matt can't find JC replacements for those two then he is not doing they job in which he supposedly specializes.
 
To the comment decision being his dad, not his.....

Owens is not a kid. He'll be 23 yrs old in June and a college graduate. Some people are married w/ a kid at 23.

Dad should not be calling shots alone. Listen to dad's input but make decision on where you want to be.
 
Haven't been on the site in awhile and this is another thread that reminds me why.

Owens transferred TO St. John's and sat a year to play. By all accounts (and just by watching him) he has been an A+ teammate during his time with the program. His game has improved from season to season and this year from game to game, despite the fact that he has had to play largely out of position. Kid has left it all on the floor every game.

It's obvious to anyone that he is better suited to being a stretch 4 with a mid-range jumper and maybe develop a decent 3-pointer than to be a post presence. Meanwhile all of the players who could have allowed him to do that have washed out or the staff won't play them (Sima, Yakwe).

If he graduates in May then he can go play anywhere he wants without sitting out another year. Since he has that option, he (or his dad, whose agenda is (correctly) his kid, not St John's) can look around and see if there is someplace that is a better fit for him or can add something to his game that he isn't getting at St. John's. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.

Obviously as St John's fans we want good players to stay, and its frustrating when they leave. But this is not a Lovett situation where the kid bailed on his team in the middle of a season. This is a kid who has fulfilled his academic obligations, maybe has options, and wants to explore them. Hopefully it will turn out that SJU is the best place for him after all.
 
[quote="lawmanfan" post=277859]Haven't been on the site in awhile and this is another thread that reminds me why.

Owens transferred TO St. John's and sat a year to play. By all accounts (and just by watching him) he has been an A+ teammate during his time with the program. His game has improved from season to season and this year from game to game, despite the fact that he has had to play largely out of position. Kid has left it all on the floor every game.

It's obvious to anyone that he is better suited to being a stretch 4 with a mid-range jumper and maybe develop a decent 3-pointer than to be a post presence. Meanwhile all of the players who could have allowed him to do that have washed out or the staff won't play them (Sima, Yakwe).

If he graduates in May then he can go play anywhere he wants without sitting out another year. Since he has that option, he (or his dad, whose agenda is (correctly) his kid, not St John's) can look around and see if there is someplace that is a better fit for him or can add something to his game that he isn't getting at St. John's. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.

Obviously as St John's fans we want good players to stay, and its frustrating when they leave. But this is not a Lovett situation where the kid bailed on his team in the middle of a season. This is a kid who has fulfilled his academic obligations, maybe has options, and wants to explore them. Hopefully it will turn out that SJU is the best place for him after all.[/quote] Welcome Back
 
Seems to me that we are set up for Tariq to play a stretch 4 with Keita and Earlington and whatever other big we can get making room for Marvin Clark and Simon and Tariq to slash to the middle behind the defense. We already did it last year with not enough players to sustain it. Talk is cheap. Maryland can say what they want but we already put it in to practice. The last thing Tariq should want is a playing situation that exposes how vulnerable he is as an underweight low post player.
 
[quote="lawmanfan" post=277859]Haven't been on the site in awhile and this is another thread that reminds me why.

Owens transferred TO St. John's and sat a year to play. By all accounts (and just by watching him) he has been an A+ teammate during his time with the program. His game has improved from season to season and this year from game to game, despite the fact that he has had to play largely out of position. Kid has left it all on the floor every game.

It's obvious to anyone that he is better suited to being a stretch 4 with a mid-range jumper and maybe develop a decent 3-pointer than to be a post presence. Meanwhile all of the players who could have allowed him to do that have washed out or the staff won't play them (Sima, Yakwe).

If he graduates in May then he can go play anywhere he wants without sitting out another year. Since he has that option, he (or his dad, whose agenda is (correctly) his kid, not St John's) can look around and see if there is someplace that is a better fit for him or can add something to his game that he isn't getting at St. John's. Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.

Obviously as St John's fans we want good players to stay, and its frustrating when they leave. But this is not a Lovett situation where the kid bailed on his team in the middle of a season. This is a kid who has fulfilled his academic obligations, maybe has options, and wants to explore them. Hopefully it will turn out that SJU is the best place for him after all.[/quote]

Everything you said is true but with Keita and assuming another big he would have been in a perfect position at his natural position. Obviously the Owens have doubts about that.
 
Brandon Tierney-
Absolutely love Tariq Owens. Incredibly affable young man with a bright future on and off the court. I understand the frustration from #SJUBB fans regarding his defection from the program, but keep in mind: he's really still a kid.

Keep it classy.

Good points.
 
[quote="Enright" post=277852]If Tarig and his father have any NBA dreams after his getting out of SJU , Md or wherever, they should go to a Knick game, sit behind the basket up close and they will realize that the big east is a women's league when compared to the NBA as far as playing in the paint and Tarig can't play near the basket in the big east.
I hope they are thinking of Europe unless he can put on forty lbs wherever he goes next year.[/quote]
That's exactly why the father wants him playing out on the wing and not in the paint.
 
Fuschia wrote:
Seems to me that we are set up for Tariq to play a stretch 4 with Keita and Earlington and whatever other big we can get making room for Marvin Clark and Simon and Tariq to slash to the middle behind the defense. We already did it last year with not enough players to sustain it. Talk is cheap. Maryland can say what they want but we already put it in to practice. The last thing Tariq should want is a playing situation that exposes how vulnerable he is as an underweight low post player.
---------
Agree that with Keita in the post then if Ponds comes back the team would be set up for an NCAA run with Owens playing his natural position and having a big impact. Can't see a lot of spots better for T.O. than that, and maybe after looking around he will come to the same conclusion.

[Edited since I forgot to quote Fuschia in the original version and that's who I was "agreeing" with]
 
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[quote="lawmanfan" post=277898]Agree that with Keita in the post then if Ponds comes back the team would be set up for an NCAA run with Owens playing his natural position and having a big impact. Can't see a lot of spots better for T.O. than that, and maybe after looking around he will come to the same conclusion.[/quote]
Question is: Will his father?
 
[quote="RedStormNC" post=277858]To the comment decision being his dad, not his.....

Owens is not a kid. He'll be 23 yrs old in June and a college graduate. Some people are married w/ a kid at 23.

Dad should not be calling shots alone. Listen to dad's input but make decision on where you want to be.[/quote]

College kids are wussy, most obey daddy.
 
[quote="Knight" post=277877]Brandon Tierney-
Absolutely love Tariq Owens. Incredibly affable young man with a bright future on and off the court. I understand the frustration from #SJUBB fans regarding his defection from the program, but keep in mind: he's really still a kid.

Keep it classy.

Good points.[/quote]

Someone tell Tierney that there were 2nd Louie's Tariq's age leading 18 year olds in combat in Vietnam. If his jock strap were big enough he would have the confidence in his ability to play a major role within the team concept. If, like LoVett, his concern, given his non NBA potential and skill sets, is all about himself, then I don't give a flying duck how nice a kid he is, because to me he wants to be above the team goal of playing as a "team".
If the past is any indication of his success potential in leaving, I think he could play on any other team but will have a more minimal role. Except for those that chose to dredge up ancient history with Roshown McLeod, none of the players that left St. John's amounted to very much.
 
[quote="fan5577" post=277847]It is obvious NCAA basketball is changing. I believe the NBA should have a true development league like baseball and hockey where kids not interested in school can go to develope. Using the NCAA as a feeder system is creating too many issue with transfers, illegal recruiting, the under the table money etc... Probably a pipe dream because of all the $ involved in college sports but this system sucks.[/quote]

A developmental league will never garner the same fan interest, money, TV audience, attendance, etc. as college hoops. Rivalries, representing people's schools, real passionate play (yes some get paid but compared to the pros it's nothing), miracles, the tournament, etc. No one cares about the D league.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=277940][quote="fan5577" post=277847]It is obvious NCAA basketball is changing. I believe the NBA should have a true development league like baseball and hockey where kids not interested in school can go to develope. Using the NCAA as a feeder system is creating too many issue with transfers, illegal recruiting, the under the table money etc... Probably a pipe dream because of all the $ involved in college sports but this system sucks.[/quote]

A developmental league will never garner the same fan interest, money, TV audience, attendance, etc. as college hoops. Rivalries, representing people's schools, real passionate play (yes some get paid but compared to the pros it's nothing), miracles, the tournament, etc. No one cares about the D league.[/quote]

Not many people go to Junior hockey games or single A games either. They are supported by the teams and the NHL and MLB. I understand that the NBA already subsidizes the WNBA and D league teams, I just think to give these kids a choice to get paid and be developed where they do not have to think about school should be an option somehow. MLB has 4-5 "development levels if a kid goes that way they get some $ and are developed by the team, if they choose to go to college there may be a 2 or 3-year commitment to the college team until they are eligible for the MLB draft; but they do have options.
Like I said, because of the money involved with college basketball this will most likely not happen but in my mind, it is needed.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=277923][quote="Knight" post=277877]Brandon Tierney-
Absolutely love Tariq Owens. Incredibly affable young man with a bright future on and off the court. I understand the frustration from #SJUBB fans regarding his defection from the program, but keep in mind: he's really still a kid.

Keep it classy.

Good points.[/quote]

Someone tell Tierney that there were 2nd Louie's Tariq's age leading 18 year olds in combat in Vietnam. If his jock strap were big enough he would have the confidence in his ability to play a major role within the team concept. If, like LoVett, his concern, given his non NBA potential and skill sets, is all about himself, then I don't give a flying duck how nice a kid he is, because to me he wants to be above the team goal of playing as a "team".
If the past is any indication of his success potential in leaving, I think he could play on any other team but will have a more minimal role. Except for those that chose to dredge up ancient history with Roshown McLeod, none of the players that left St. John's amounted to very much.[/quote]

Tariq is a very young man, and he will and should do what he wants even if it turns out to be a “mistake”. Nevertheless what better situation for him then being coached by two NBA/Hall of Fame coaches...
Especially if TO has any interest in playing after college.
 
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[quote="Class of 72" post=277923][quote="Knight" post=277877]Brandon Tierney-
Absolutely love Tariq Owens. Incredibly affable young man with a bright future on and off the court. I understand the frustration from #SJUBB fans regarding his defection from the program, but keep in mind: he's really still a kid.

Keep it classy.

Good points.[/quote]

Someone tell Tierney that there were 2nd Louie's Tariq's age leading 18 year olds in combat in Vietnam. If his jock strap were big enough he would have the confidence in his ability to play a major role within the team concept. If, like LoVett, his concern, given his non NBA potential and skill sets, is all about himself, then I don't give a flying duck how nice a kid he is, because to me he wants to be above the team goal of playing as a "team".
If the past is any indication of his success potential in leaving, I think he could play on any other team but will have a more minimal role. Except for those that chose to dredge up ancient history with Roshown McLeod, none of the players that left St. John's amounted to very much.[/quote]

Polee, Larry Wright. Mussini this year would have been huge. I'm sure there's others I'm leaving out. When you lose half your roster every year it's hard to keep track
 
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