a lot of endlessly repetitive chatter
- Thread starter paultzman
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[quote="AlBovino" post=292281]Our head coach will and should be responsible for his coaching staff. Let's just wait and see how it all plays out. There is no cone on this board who has a clue what Mullin is thinking and what the coaching staff for this upcoming year will look like.[/quote]
For sure, but it is obvious a ‘glitch’ has surfaced in hiring Rice and it seems, for now anyway, buzz-buzz, that it involves Mitch’s position and perhaps his unwillingness or hesitation to move aside.
And maybe it’s up to us fans, the media, some on staff, or some in the Administration, to focus on the end-game and realize what it is, this program needs, and not be crippled by hapless loyalty that dooms our chances for success.
Again, no animosity to Mullin whom I support or Mitch who should be a great asset, but it is what it is.
For sure, but it is obvious a ‘glitch’ has surfaced in hiring Rice and it seems, for now anyway, buzz-buzz, that it involves Mitch’s position and perhaps his unwillingness or hesitation to move aside.
And maybe it’s up to us fans, the media, some on staff, or some in the Administration, to focus on the end-game and realize what it is, this program needs, and not be crippled by hapless loyalty that dooms our chances for success.
Again, no animosity to Mullin whom I support or Mitch who should be a great asset, but it is what it is.
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[quote="redmanwest" post=292264]Mase they do get credit for those things. But the fact that hey are able to pull rabbits out of the hat does not mean, unfortunately, that they’re building a sound program. Regularized recruiting is essential.
I have been very pleased with the talent increases year
Over year. But this issue speaks to a larger question of can the university and this staff get its act together and restore a normal and regularized program that can sustain itself.[/quote]
I don’t think the staff is perfect and your post is fair; criticism isn’t unwarranted. I’m just not calling for their heads and think we are headed in right direction.
I have been very pleased with the talent increases year
Over year. But this issue speaks to a larger question of can the university and this staff get its act together and restore a normal and regularized program that can sustain itself.[/quote]
I don’t think the staff is perfect and your post is fair; criticism isn’t unwarranted. I’m just not calling for their heads and think we are headed in right direction.
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="AlBovino" post=292281]Our head coach will and should be responsible for his coaching staff. Let's just wait and see how it all plays out. There is no one on this board who has a clue what Mullin is thinking and what the coaching staff for this upcoming year will look like.[/quote]
Al, the head coach IS responsible for his coaching staff. He should also be held accountable for the close to 900 grand it is costing the university to pay for no show jobs while the administration buries their heads in the sand while raising our ticket prices after 3 consecutive losing seasons!
This is insanity!
Al, the head coach IS responsible for his coaching staff. He should also be held accountable for the close to 900 grand it is costing the university to pay for no show jobs while the administration buries their heads in the sand while raising our ticket prices after 3 consecutive losing seasons!
This is insanity!
[quote="Amaseinyourface" post=292284][quote="redmanwest" post=292264]Mase they do get credit for those things. But the fact that hey are able to pull rabbits out of the hat does not mean, unfortunately, that they’re building a sound program. Regularized recruiting is essential.
I have been very pleased with the talent increases year
Over year. But this issue speaks to a larger question of can the university and this staff get its act together and restore a normal and regularized program that can sustain itself.[/quote]
I don’t think the staff is perfect and your post is fair; criticism isn’t unwarranted. I’m just not calling for their heads and think we are headed in right direction.[/quote] I’m no B.B. wizard. But no body on the staff has real coaching exp. St. Jean appears to be knowledgeable, but is very young, MR is a no show in the off season. It seems to me we need an experieced associate head coach w a fire in his belly, recruiting ties and coaching experience. I live in S Fl., and wore my SJ B.B. shirt. Someone came up to me and told me he has a good friend that was a former player for SJ. He has been invited and attended numerous games . He doesn’t find them enjoyable and the program is in bad shape. Just 1 mans opinion. But loosing and a flawed staff makeup is not a good formula for success. I think not closing the deal w Rice would be another of a long list of mistakes.
I have been very pleased with the talent increases year
Over year. But this issue speaks to a larger question of can the university and this staff get its act together and restore a normal and regularized program that can sustain itself.[/quote]
I don’t think the staff is perfect and your post is fair; criticism isn’t unwarranted. I’m just not calling for their heads and think we are headed in right direction.[/quote] I’m no B.B. wizard. But no body on the staff has real coaching exp. St. Jean appears to be knowledgeable, but is very young, MR is a no show in the off season. It seems to me we need an experieced associate head coach w a fire in his belly, recruiting ties and coaching experience. I live in S Fl., and wore my SJ B.B. shirt. Someone came up to me and told me he has a good friend that was a former player for SJ. He has been invited and attended numerous games . He doesn’t find them enjoyable and the program is in bad shape. Just 1 mans opinion. But loosing and a flawed staff makeup is not a good formula for success. I think not closing the deal w Rice would be another of a long list of mistakes.
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MarkRedman
Well-known member
It doesn't have to be Rice, although I see the obvious benefits of hiring him
What we need is an experienced coach who has expertise in x's and o's and recruiting
Yes, the roster has improved but we're burning Matt A out as our sole recruiter
We need somebody to share that load and assist with player development and coaching strategy
While I support CM, I have to question his judgment if he doesn't see and acknowledge this as fact
What we need is an experienced coach who has expertise in x's and o's and recruiting
Yes, the roster has improved but we're burning Matt A out as our sole recruiter
We need somebody to share that load and assist with player development and coaching strategy
While I support CM, I have to question his judgment if he doesn't see and acknowledge this as fact
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Ray Morgan
Well-known member
[quote="Tom in Salem" post=292257]A head coach 3 time zones away from his office.
A full paid assistant that nobody knows the whereabouts of.
Not a single commit from the 2019 class, when others in the conference have multiples already.
Rice alone doesn't solve the problems here.
If the staff hadn't gotten so very fortunate with the late additions of Heron and Figueroa, they'd be looking at another cellar finish.
Time to clean house.[/quote]
Teleworking. Mullin's cutting back on his carbon footprint.
A full paid assistant that nobody knows the whereabouts of.
Not a single commit from the 2019 class, when others in the conference have multiples already.
Rice alone doesn't solve the problems here.
If the staff hadn't gotten so very fortunate with the late additions of Heron and Figueroa, they'd be looking at another cellar finish.
Time to clean house.[/quote]
Teleworking. Mullin's cutting back on his carbon footprint.
[quote="Sju grad 13" post=292277]I don’t think Mullin wants to hire Rice at all. I personally believe Mullin is very content with the team and it’s staff and is just hoping a successful season will get the NYC fans and Media ( NY Post, Newsday) to fall back.
Mullin probably thinks if he had Lovett for the whole season last year we’re probably a 20 win team (which we we were on pace for before Lovett left) and great wins over Duke and Nova = Equals tournament. If that’s the case why would Mullin change anything? He clearly wants Greg St. Jean to be a future recruiter ( Hence why he sent him to try and recruit the big fish Jordan Brown) while being the X&O’s coach (which he did all last year). If he already has two recruiters ( Greg and Matt) and a X&O’s coach ( Greg) why do I need Rice?
And to an extent Mullin is right. If we make the tournament or even NIT last year none of you guys are calling for Rice with the same urgency like you guys are doing right now. Mullin doesn’t need the recruiting help since he’s not really reliant on high school recruits so this is probably a waste of time for him.[/quote]
You state we have 2 recruiters Matt and St. Jean and an x&o's coach in St. Jean so why do we need Mike Rice. I notice you didn't mention Mitch Richmond and what he does so maybe the better question is why do we need Mitch or actually do we really even have Mitch.
Mullin probably thinks if he had Lovett for the whole season last year we’re probably a 20 win team (which we we were on pace for before Lovett left) and great wins over Duke and Nova = Equals tournament. If that’s the case why would Mullin change anything? He clearly wants Greg St. Jean to be a future recruiter ( Hence why he sent him to try and recruit the big fish Jordan Brown) while being the X&O’s coach (which he did all last year). If he already has two recruiters ( Greg and Matt) and a X&O’s coach ( Greg) why do I need Rice?
And to an extent Mullin is right. If we make the tournament or even NIT last year none of you guys are calling for Rice with the same urgency like you guys are doing right now. Mullin doesn’t need the recruiting help since he’s not really reliant on high school recruits so this is probably a waste of time for him.[/quote]
You state we have 2 recruiters Matt and St. Jean and an x&o's coach in St. Jean so why do we need Mike Rice. I notice you didn't mention Mitch Richmond and what he does so maybe the better question is why do we need Mitch or actually do we really even have Mitch.
[quote="MarkRedman" post=292290]It doesn't have to be Rice, although I see the obvious benefits of hiring him
What we need is an experienced coach who has expertise in x's and o's and recruiting
Yes, the roster has improved but we're burning Matt A out as our sole recruiter
We need somebody to share that load and assist with player development and coaching strategy
While I support CM, I have to question his judgment if he doesn't see and acknowledge this as fact[/quote] Of course it doesn’t have to be Rice. The problem is we are in August already and have been in talks w Rice for some time now. If the deal w Rice doesn’t come to fruition, I do not see us hiring another associate head coach this year.
What we need is an experienced coach who has expertise in x's and o's and recruiting
Yes, the roster has improved but we're burning Matt A out as our sole recruiter
We need somebody to share that load and assist with player development and coaching strategy
While I support CM, I have to question his judgment if he doesn't see and acknowledge this as fact[/quote] Of course it doesn’t have to be Rice. The problem is we are in August already and have been in talks w Rice for some time now. If the deal w Rice doesn’t come to fruition, I do not see us hiring another associate head coach this year.
[quote="AlBovino" post=292287]You are both just guessing. Neither of you actually knows what is going on behind the scenes.[/quote]
Nope, it's not 'guessing'. While details are absent and we're not privy to internal discussions, it's obvious there's a glitch in the process to hire Mike Rice.
It's taken too long--even for a mom 'n pop operation--for 'something to not be awry.
And this is too critical of a step forward for the future of the program--right-sizing the Staff--to allow nothing to happen and not raise a flag in honest and respectful protest.
Nope, it's not 'guessing'. While details are absent and we're not privy to internal discussions, it's obvious there's a glitch in the process to hire Mike Rice.
It's taken too long--even for a mom 'n pop operation--for 'something to not be awry.
And this is too critical of a step forward for the future of the program--right-sizing the Staff--to allow nothing to happen and not raise a flag in honest and respectful protest.
JohnnyFever
Active member
I think one of the biggest frustrations rooting for this program is all the rationalization, tolerance of mediocrity/failure, and normalization of dysfunction. I don't think anyone on this board "hates" the staff or wants them fired right now, so let's chill on that until after the season. I also think everyone understands Mullin started with nothing (how could we ever forget?). This stuff is not normal and it should not be happening. No AD which is just a revolving door and supposedly holds no power, record numbers of players jumping ship or committing then instantly decommitting, coaches in disputes, coaches MIA at recruiting events, head coach is rarely seen in the NYC metro area, awful HS recruiting and a complete reliance on transfers, terrible scheduling, and now apparently a strong resistance and possible refusal to get help. You'd have to be very biased at this point to not sense the dysfunction and spin it into some other gibberish. Jamal Adams came to the Jets and said he sensed dysfunction and a lack of accountability in the locker room...he wants to change that. We need a change agent badly in our program. Mullin needs to grow a pair and grab the program by the horns. Cut dead weight and start going ALL IN. Now go tell me I should just go root for Duke in an attempt to ignore the points above. I wish I were kidding but we are literally at the point where the collective fanbase would probably be making better decisions for the program.
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Chicago Days wrote: Not sure, but I think a buzz / rumor from the cognoscenti of our Board that ‘an opening’ on the Staff has to occur before ‘rice’ can be added to the menu...which seems to point to some intransigence or reluctance on Mitch’s part but that’s total speculation on my part.
That’s all the ‘tea-leaf reading’ I’m capable of.
Enjoy the beach, NCJ.
Thanks, Chicago. Beautiful sunny day at Wrightsville Beach today despite experts predictions for thunderstorms all afternoon. I'm going to take that as a sign that things will also work out for our Johnnies despite current sense of gloom that has overtaken board. I'm betting things will be clearer (one way or the other) by next weekend. Still very optimistic, though I will be less so if we go into season without either a more visibly committed Mitch or a change.
That’s all the ‘tea-leaf reading’ I’m capable of.
Enjoy the beach, NCJ.
Thanks, Chicago. Beautiful sunny day at Wrightsville Beach today despite experts predictions for thunderstorms all afternoon. I'm going to take that as a sign that things will also work out for our Johnnies despite current sense of gloom that has overtaken board. I'm betting things will be clearer (one way or the other) by next weekend. Still very optimistic, though I will be less so if we go into season without either a more visibly committed Mitch or a change.
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[quote="NCJohnnie" post=292302]Chicago Days wrote: Not sure, but I think a buzz / rumor from the cognoscenti of our Board that ‘an opening’ on the Staff has to occur before ‘rice’ can be added to the menu...which seems to point to some intransigence or reluctance on Mitch’s part but that’s total speculation on my part.
That’s all the ‘tea-leaf reading’ I’m capable of.
Enjoy the beach, NCJ.
Thanks, Chicago. Beautiful sunny day at Wrightsville Beach today despite experts predictions for thunderstorms all afternoon. I'm going to take that as a sign that things will also work out for our Johnnies despite current sense of gloom that has overtaken board. I'm betting things will be clearer (one way or the other) by next weekend. Still very optimistic, though I will be less so if we go into season without either a more visibly committed Mitch or a change.[/quote]
Yup NCJohnnie. We're in sync on this. Hoping.
Meanwhile, enjoy your time with the family.
That’s all the ‘tea-leaf reading’ I’m capable of.
Enjoy the beach, NCJ.
Thanks, Chicago. Beautiful sunny day at Wrightsville Beach today despite experts predictions for thunderstorms all afternoon. I'm going to take that as a sign that things will also work out for our Johnnies despite current sense of gloom that has overtaken board. I'm betting things will be clearer (one way or the other) by next weekend. Still very optimistic, though I will be less so if we go into season without either a more visibly committed Mitch or a change.[/quote]
Yup NCJohnnie. We're in sync on this. Hoping.
Meanwhile, enjoy your time with the family.
The "glitch" may not be a glitch at all. Maybe they are going in a different direction, or maybe you will wake up one day soon to find out Mike Rice has been hired. All I am saying is to wait and see what happens. Once actual decisions have been made then you can start bitching all you want. For some on this sight, they will bitch no matter what happens. And yes it is guessing, because absent details and not being privy to internal discussions, you and others know nothing.
[quote="AlBovino" post=292304]The "glitch" may not be a glitch at all. Maybe they are going in a different direction, or maybe you will wake up one day soon to find out Mike Rice has been hired. All I am saying is to wait and see what happens. Once actual decisions have been made then you can start bitching all you want. For some on this sight, they will bitch no matter what happens. And yes it is guessing, because absent details and not being privy to internal discussions, you and others know nothing.[/quote]
You're right Al, but I betcha it's an 'educated' guess...and the time she be getting a bit late in the day, when a major and necessary change in the Staff must be addressed. That's all I'm saying.
And I support Mully and I think Mitch would be a great asst IF fully engaged.
All that said, our staff needs to be right-sized, one way or the other, and soon.
You're right Al, but I betcha it's an 'educated' guess...and the time she be getting a bit late in the day, when a major and necessary change in the Staff must be addressed. That's all I'm saying.
And I support Mully and I think Mitch would be a great asst IF fully engaged.
All that said, our staff needs to be right-sized, one way or the other, and soon.
Basic 101 Rules for a successful College Basketball Program (Applies to Mom 'n Pop Ops as well):
#1: Thou shalt have a competent, fully-engaged, full-time Coaching Staff energetic and active in all aspects of the game, from in-game management, to recruiting, to player development, and generate fan involvement and consistent positive PR...or be doomed to fail, against major competitors who know and live the drill.
#1: Thou shalt have a competent, fully-engaged, full-time Coaching Staff energetic and active in all aspects of the game, from in-game management, to recruiting, to player development, and generate fan involvement and consistent positive PR...or be doomed to fail, against major competitors who know and live the drill.
Al Bovino wrote: The "glitch" may not be a glitch at all. Maybe they are going in a different direction, or maybe you will wake up one day soon to find out Mike Rice has been hired. All I am saying is to wait and see what happens. Once actual decisions have been made then you can start bitching all you want. For some on this sight, they will bitch no matter what happens. And yes it is guessing, because absent details and not being privy to internal discussions, you and others know nothing.
I'm with Al on this one. I am a lifelong Johnnies fan (starting watching them when I was 12 and am now 66) with absolutely no inside knowledge so I have no clue where the negotiations stand (if anywhere). However, I am not guessing when I say that there is nothing the least bit unusual about it taking two weeks or more for an executive employment agreement to be negotiated and finalized so if serious talks started after July, there is absolutely nothing unusual about them not being finalized yet. Also don't get the sense of urgency; so long as staff is set in the next few weeks what difference does it really make? Let's just give this time to play out. I agree that we need a change if Mitch is not going to be fully engaged but let's wait to see what happens before we proclaim the end of the world.
I'm with Al on this one. I am a lifelong Johnnies fan (starting watching them when I was 12 and am now 66) with absolutely no inside knowledge so I have no clue where the negotiations stand (if anywhere). However, I am not guessing when I say that there is nothing the least bit unusual about it taking two weeks or more for an executive employment agreement to be negotiated and finalized so if serious talks started after July, there is absolutely nothing unusual about them not being finalized yet. Also don't get the sense of urgency; so long as staff is set in the next few weeks what difference does it really make? Let's just give this time to play out. I agree that we need a change if Mitch is not going to be fully engaged but let's wait to see what happens before we proclaim the end of the world.
And it’s been an on the job learning process for Chris Mullin and most everyone involved. Just has to play itself out.
And there is so much heart and eagerness to see SJU back playing good B ball it undermines our patience and perspective.
It will be what it will be HOWEVER Mike Rice or not - we are in for the best season under the current reign! It’s his most talented team w his best depth.
Looking forward to see all of our kids play
Go St. John’s !
And there is so much heart and eagerness to see SJU back playing good B ball it undermines our patience and perspective.
It will be what it will be HOWEVER Mike Rice or not - we are in for the best season under the current reign! It’s his most talented team w his best depth.
Looking forward to see all of our kids play
Go St. John’s !
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