Rick Pitino - Head Coach at St John’s University!!!

espken said:
I was surprised at Fanta’s take on Soriano as well.
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I’ll add I think Soriano is still tremendously underrated on the national scale. Teams could focus on him last year yet he was a double-double machine. He gets little national hype despite being all production and no fluff. I hope it’s bulletin board material for him. They won’t be able to que on him this year or they’ll get torched from other places on the court.
 
MCNPA said:
I’ll add I think Soriano is still tremendously underrated on the national scale. Teams could focus on him last year yet he was a double-double machine. He gets little national hype despite being all production and no fluff. I hope it’s bulletin board material for him. They won’t be able to que on him this year or they’ll get torched from other places on the court.
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Soriano may or may not have as many double-doubles this upcoming season. One thing for sure is he will become a better player under Pitino.
 
McKillop has always been overrated by St. John’s fans imo. He advanced in the tournament one time in his 25 year HC career (with Steph Curry, with whom he also missed the tournament entirely the following year), and made the dance and promptly lost several times while winning a low major league (SoCon). In his years in the A10, Davidson was decent but not much better than the Johnnies.

Not casting a stone. He’s clearly an accomplished coach and would have been better than Norm and Mullin. I would have supported his hire multiple times during the dark years but also preferred Lavin when we hired him. But not sure how anyone can confidently say he would have been a transformative or even good SJU coach. Certainly not worth lamenting at this stage.

I’d take 75 year old Rick Pitino over prime McKillop. There’s always another low/mid major coach with upside. McKillop thrived at the right level for him.
 
MCNPA said:
I don’t agree with the Soriano production being “empty calories” at all though. He didn’t put up double doubles all season just to stuff a stat sheet. He will be every bit as productive this season but with more around him. He comes out to play every game, and rebounding is an effort stat. He did it against lots of good teams as well.
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He’s down to 10% body fat maybe slightly lower by the time I’m posting this too . Working his ass off in the gym
 
smalley said:
McKillop has always been overrated by St. John’s fans imo. He advanced in the tournament one time in his 25 year HC career (with Steph Curry, with whom he also missed the tournament entirely the following year), and made the dance and promptly lost several times while winning a low major league (SoCon). In his years in the A10, Davidson was decent but not much better than the Johnnies.

Not casting a stone. He’s clearly an accomplished coach and would have been better than Norm and Mullin. I would have supported his hire multiple times during the dark years but also preferred Lavin when we hired him. But not sure how anyone can confidently say he would have been a transformative or even good SJU coach. Certainly not worth lamenting at this stage.

I’d take 75 year old Rick Pitino over prime McKillop. There’s always another low/mid major coach with upside. McKillop thrived at the right level for him.
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No one is taking McKillop over Pitino. That’s silly.

But we would take McKillop over Mahoney, Fraschilla, Jarvis, and Roberts,
 
kranmars said:
No one is taking McKillop over Pitino. That’s silly.

But we would take McKillop over Mahoney, Fraschilla, Jarvis, and Roberts,
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That we don’t talk about the other 200 half decent coaches we would have taken over that lot is my point
 
mjmaherjr said:
He’s down to 10% body fat maybe slightly lower by the time I’m posting this too . Working his ass off in the gym
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I don’t even care about the body fat aspect. He’s been a double-double machine in a difficult Big East and gets little credit. He isn’t even a returning first team All Big East kid considering he smoked most if not all of the centers in the league. I’m ok with him being a “sleeper”, but other teams and the media will learn fast this season when he can’t be stopped.
 
espken said:
Soriano may or may not have as many double-doubles this upcoming season. One thing for sure is he will become a better player under Pitino.
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While I agree with your assessment 100%, I'm always hesitant about relying on stats produced on bad teams. Being in top shape will help him a lot for certain. Having Pitino work with another big plus. Despite averaging a double double, I don't see him as a dominant force on offense or under the boards. Vastly improved but still an unpolished offensive player. Rebounds mostly came as a result of being a big body who worked hard arounds the boards. My guess is on a better team will see decreased points per game, and on a deep team will play less minutes and get 8-9 rebounds. per game. Still an important piece of the puzzle, just not the centerpiece IMO.
 
Beasts of the East said:
While I agree with your assessment 100%, I'm always hesitant about relying on stats produced on bad teams. Being in top shape will help him a lot for certain. Having Pitino work with another big plus. Despite averaging a double double, I don't see him as a dominant force on offense or under the boards. Vastly improved but still an unpolished offensive player. Rebounds mostly came as a result of being a big body who worked hard arounds the boards. My guess is on a better team will see decreased points per game, and on a deep team will play less minutes and get 8-9 rebounds. per game. Still an important piece of the puzzle, just not the centerpiece IMO.
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I expect his offensive rebounds number to shrink.
 
kranmars said:
No one is taking McKillop over Pitino. That’s silly.

But we would take McKillop over Mahoney, Fraschilla, Jarvis, and Roberts,
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Hindsight is always 20/20. There are tons of mediocre college head coaches, and a very few great ones. Most of the mid major coaches who had a couple of great seasons when they had the horses, fail at a high D1.

Chances are, by history only, that McKillop would not have had the same success here. Not surprisingly, the guys who break through at a high level with the same sustained success also happen to be great recruiters, often buoyed by a great program. Cal, Self, K, all were/are great recruiters who had great programs behind them. Mark Few also, but he built the juggernaut.

Billy Donovan was on our list this time, but if he was interested (he wasn't) at this point to return to college could fetch $6-8 million as a top of the heap coach at a program with very deep pockets.

There are only a tiny handful of sure thing hires, if they even exist. RP is one of them. Without looking forward 6 years, it would be very unlikely to secure anyone at his level.

As important as the coach and likely much more important are NIL dollars needed to finance a top talent program. Essentially the portal along with NIL creates 1 year free agency where the price tag on break through players skyrockets.
 
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Beasts of the East said:
Hindsight is always 20/20. There are tons of mediocre college head coaches, and a very few great ones. Most of the mid major coaches who had a couple of great seasons when they had the horses, fail at a high D1.

Chances are, by history only, that McKillop would not have had the same success here. Not surprisingly, the guys who break through at a high level with the same sustained success also happen to be great recruiters, often buoyed by a great program. Cal, Self, K, all were/are great recruiters who had great programs behind them. Mark Few also, but he built the juggernaut.

Billy Donovan was on our list this time, but if he was interested (he wasn't) at this point to return to college could fetch $6-8 million as a top of the heap coach at a program with very deep pockets.

There are only a tiny handful of sure thing hires, if they even exist. RP is one of them. Without looking forward 6 years, it would be very unlikely to secure anyone at his level.

As important as the coach and likely much more important are NIL dollars needed to finance a top talent program. Essentially the portal along with NIL creates 1 year free agency where the price tag on break through players skyrockets.
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Certainly there were good coaches that wanted this job after Carnesecca.

But I am using a standalone hire the administration would have signed off on if they went that route.
Calipari for example, while he wanted this job, had a group against him which was never going to relent.

That’s why McKillop keeps coming up. I firmly believe he (and it is not hindsight because I also thought the same at that time) would have been better than the four I mentioned and by extension the program would have been in a better place.
 
smalley said:
That we don’t talk about the other 200 half decent coaches we would have taken over that lot is my point
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Not true. We often talk about many coaches who wanted the job after Carnesecca.

How many times have we shared the Calipari story? He wanted this job. And he is just one story.

We lament a lot from that period of time because SJU was a very solid program that could have made a jump with any of the interested candidates.

But the administration did not want to go in that direction. They had the money, but they did not have the vision. They incorrectly thought their mom and pop shop would continue to be successful.

That’s why we keep coming back to McKillop. He was a realistic candidate the administration would have embraced, while also improving the program as a whole.
 
Beasts of the East said:
I think all of the positive reports are great, but practice heroes can be like the first few miles of a marathon. Once the season starts, there are bound to be some guys who unexpectedly break from the pack and stand out among others when it all counts against BE competition. With a deep bench should be fun to watch and obviously there can be a bunch of contributors.
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good point... Zach Wilson had rave reviews during camp...
 
Beasts of the East said:
Hindsight is always 20/20. There are tons of mediocre college head coaches, and a very few great ones. Most of the mid major coaches who had a couple of great seasons when they had the horses, fail at a high D1.

Chances are, by history only, that McKillop would not have had the same success here. Not surprisingly, the guys who break through at a high level with the same sustained success also happen to be great recruiters, often buoyed by a great program. Cal, Self, K, all were/are great recruiters who had great programs behind them. Mark Few also, but he built the juggernaut.

Billy Donovan was on our list this time, but if he was interested (he wasn't) at this point to return to college could fetch $6-8 million as a top of the heap coach at a program with very deep pockets.

There are only a tiny handful of sure thing hires, if they even exist. RP is one of them. Without looking forward 6 years, it would be very unlikely to secure anyone at his level.

As important as the coach and likely much more important are NIL dollars needed to finance a top talent program. Essentially the portal along with NIL creates 1 year free agency where the price tag on break through players skyrockets.
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Thanks for your wisdom. Truly on target, although McKillop maybe not.

Above all,"It Don't Mean a Thing if you Aint Got That Swing' and it aint

the x's and the 0's its the Jimmies and the Joes. RECRUITING, OVER ALL !

CRP is an ace at recruiting. The money boys know that and when
you combine that with MSG and Wall Street" The Great Big City's a
Wondrous Toy." What an inve$$$tment !

"BINGO," WE HAVE A WINNER, ON UTOPIA BLVD.

Lastly McKillop and his little school, Davidson, sent a disproportionate amount
of guys to the NBA. Four years of his coaching meant something!
This includes, arguably, one of the all time ten best players
 
kranmars said:
Not true. We often talk about many coaches who wanted the job after Carnesecca.

How many times have we shared the Calipari story? He wanted this job. And he is just one story.

We lament a lot from that period of time because SJU was a very solid program that could have made a jump with any of the interested candidates.

But the administration did not want to go in that direction. They had the money, but they did not have the vision. They incorrectly thought their mom and pop shop would continue to be successful.

That’s why we keep coming back to McKillop. He was a realistic candidate the administration would have embraced, while also improving the program as a whole.
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McKillop would have been a solid hire at the time and would have been smart enough to hire a recruiter with strong local ties. One thing is for sure, his teams would have been fundamentally sound and enjoyable to watch.
 
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