As the rolling stones say. You can't always get what you want. But if you try real hard you get what you need
Rick’s Targets
- Thread starter paultzman
- Start date
guinness77
Well-known member
I’m gonna leave it at this. I got recruited by DI schools. I wasn’t good enough to get recruited by St. John’s. Not even close. SJU was a borderline blue blood in the early to mid 90s. Saying that…you think I was salivating at going to UNC Greensboro or SMU? I was happy to be getting calls and any attention at all, but going to some SUNY school smoking weed and chasing girls sounded a lot better to me than red shirting and busting my ass to be the 4th option off the bench.
The point is, any coaching staff is up against it here. I’m not making any excuses because Pitino threw the gauntlet down in his presser. But…these kids for the most part, don’t even know where SJU is, what our history is and, most importantly, that we were amongst the country’s best. We’re just some “commuter” school that hasn’t won in a long time.
The point is, any coaching staff is up against it here. I’m not making any excuses because Pitino threw the gauntlet down in his presser. But…these kids for the most part, don’t even know where SJU is, what our history is and, most importantly, that we were amongst the country’s best. We’re just some “commuter” school that hasn’t won in a long time.
Well considering we’ve gotten 4 star recruits somewhat consistently the last 10 years that kinda renders your point moot.
Sure, kids aren’t huddling around a tv to watch St John’s. That didn’t stop us from getting Moe Harkless, DLo, Pointer, Jamal Branch, Rysheed Jordan, Jakarr Sampson, Chris Obekpa, Shamorie Ponds, Justin Simon, Mustapha Heron, AJ Storr….
Correct me if I’m wrong these are all 4/5 star guys yes? Whether they committed out of high school (most did) or transferred here, these are all 4 star guys except for Sheed who was a 5.
And now we have one of the best college coaches of all time who has certainly won his fair share of recruiting battles.
We have a visit from a 4 star coming up very soon.
So why is it impossible to think we could get some of these guys?
And by the way, don’t give me the “well Lavin and mullin teams didn’t win anything with those players”
No they didn’t really win that much. But they sure as hell had a lot of highly ranked recruits. And the argument you’re making is that we can’t get those level of guys.
We can and we will
guinness77
Well-known member
My argument was to be patient. Not to expect it in 3 weeks. That was the point.
I expect 5-star recruits when we WIN. They’ll come if we win. We finally have the kind of coach who can bring in difference makers. Not just “4-star recruits”
Mullin got a commitment from Shamorie Ponds before he ever won shit at St. John’s as coach.
Ponds bought into Mullins pitch and wanted to play in NYC.
Now we have a proven winning coach who is one of the biggest names in college basketball history. It’s a lot easier of a sell to kids that this could work out. Which is why I think there will be multiple 4 stars on this roster year one (whether high school commits or through the portal)
Guess we’ll see
guinness77
Well-known member
Hey man, I want the same thing you want. I just want to see this team win. I just understand what we’re up against.
You’ve had it rough. I understand that. Making into the round of 32 or sweet 16 was our barometer, not winning 19 or 20 games, or winning in Villanova. I don’t want nice wins here and there, I want the kind of sustained success us old folks used to be used to. I feel bad for the younger fans like yourself who never got experience that.
We got Pitino. I’m pretty sure we want the same thing. I’m expecting big recruits. I am. I’m just not shocked when a “big recruit” doesn’t commit just quite yet because if you were that big recruit, where would you go, without a preconceived bias? I’d go to Florida before SJU if I wasn’t a SJU fan since I was 8. It’s gonna happen. And, you weren’t one of the people I was aiming at, but we can’t just start feeling defeated after a few weeks. It’ll happen. With this guy, I believe it.
RedStormRising
Well-known member
Or for a coach to say it.
It's not true that Mullin didn't immediately recruit- he signed recruits once he was hired in the Spring of 2015 for the Fall of 2015 and landed the #26 class nationally. That class included top 100 LoVett and several other 4 stars. Further, by September 2015 he signed Ponds (for 2016) before ever coaching a game, and his 2016 class was ranked #24 nationally. Again, that's two Top 26 classes before coaching a game. Lavin signed a LOT of huge players in the Fall of 2010 before coaching a game at St. John's and landed the #7 recruiting class for 2011. His 2010 team was already stacked with seniors, so he only had the only recruit for 2010.
Pitino also has the transfer portal to pull from, and there's no reason to think he can't attract high-level talent immediately like Lavin and Mullin did.
Just wanted to set the record straight. Anderson's recruiting was the outlier rather than the norm, where his best recruiting happened towards the end of his tenure.
Pitino also has the transfer portal to pull from, and there's no reason to think he can't attract high-level talent immediately like Lavin and Mullin did.
Just wanted to set the record straight. Anderson's recruiting was the outlier rather than the norm, where his best recruiting happened towards the end of his tenure.
guinness77
Well-known member
Yeah he just couldn’t coach. He was actually good at identifying talent, he just couldn’t do much with it.
I just think judging Pitino off 3 weeks is nuts. Most of this board didn’t give a nut about Clayton a month ago, that’s what cracks me up. Again, because I quoted your post doesn’t mean I’m saying that towards you.
You have misdirected here . I don’t know anything other than it was readily apparent Curbelo , Pinzon created some sort of issues that got both of them suspended . That’s a fact ..
It was stated in prior posts going back to the Pitino hiring that Fr Shanley and Cragg were appalled at a practice session they attended . You think they were upset over the AC ? Or , was it a chaotic and out of control mess . The Academic issues were also mentioned . Someone reported that Pitino canned all of CMA ‘ Academic Advisors .
The Mic’d up game showed everyone that our players were not paying any attention to CMA . They clearly showed disrespect and not a good look for Coach and also players . Macon and others reported that a lot of stuff was going on in the locker room . Not good stuff . No player was mentioned specifically but , if only Soriano and Traore were named as coming back and Soriano as Captain , what does that tell you ?
Nether you or I are likely to get specific information on all the issues , on Court or Off but , you think Pitino jettisoned players at a whim ? NewCoaches always have the closed door sessions with existing players and what their future may or may not be . It’s common practice . By the way , why use the old fashioned tactic of the” are you still beating your wife” reference ? We are talking Basket Ball here and not scripts from SVU tv show .
RedStormRising
Well-known member
You know whose fans didn’t have to be patient. Providence and Georgetown. Now I get why people would prefer Cooley, he’s a players coach that turned providence in to a consistent winner. And now he’s got the might of G’town alumni money behind him. They look poised to do the turn around we wanted.
But Providence, Kim English hired after RP and even he got his players to follow him.
It’s a bad look for Pitino to be unable to retain Storr, Posh, and Gardner and not be able to secure a commit from his former guys.
RedStormRising
Well-known member
That’s another problem if Clayton was going to be prize recruit we were not going to make the strides we need to make to be truly competitive in the big east. Clayton and Soriano and would be great pieces as option 2a and 2b but we would have still needed a star to put us over the top. Someone check if Champangie has any eligibility left. We can all kick in 50 bucks for NIL (does this forum have 40k members?).
guinness77
Well-known member
Cooley wouldn’t have moved if he didn’t already know what he could bring there with him. As good as he made Providence, I’m a big Cooley fan, that was a lateral move. Iona to St. John’s is not a lateral move.
I don’t know, when you shit on the entire roster, you can’t expect any of them to stay. I wasn’t exactly enamored with Pitino doing that. Would you bust your ass for some guy you just met who collectively took a crap on the entire roster? Like I said, he’s got a great reputation, best since I started supporting this team, but he’s got some work to do. Yes, partially his own undoing but also partially the perpetual losing we’ve done which maybe he underestimated.
Trust me I'm still thrilled we hired Pitino but if he were literally any other coach and had 1 starter signed 3 weeks in after missing out on a guy he coached for the past several years I'd be panicking. I'd still take our current situation 100/100 times vs going with Anderson for another year, and I fully agree about being patient, but I'm lowering my expectations for year one to just making the Tournament (even as the last team in and losing). Maybe a reality check is a good thing because I've seen several people expecting a Sweet 16 to Final 4 year one which was always asking for way too much.
guinness77
Well-known member
I’m not expecting much the first year. I said many times in game threads…ready to sacrifice Storr and Gardiner to get rid of Anderson. Sad but true. It happened, we move forward, from my perspective.
I don’t know. After reading these posts all day, you might think the sky is falling. Then again I think I’ll take the wait and see approach. Sure sounds like there are a whole bunch of players with talent left in the portal. I am pretty sure we will be fielding a team next year. RP has a pretty good, well actually a great record of finding and coaching kids up. There will be plenty of time to dissect what happens, you know when it actually happens.
Smoking weed and chasing college girls sounds like fun to me, 40 years later.
guinness77
Well-known member
LOL. Wish I could. Haven’t smoked weed in 21 years now because of my job and been married almost 17 now. Got me nowhere!
In the long run, you're probably right about making the program stronger. As I wrote earlier, there aren't many, if any, game coaches better than Pitino in the US.
And tomorrow there will be another prized recruit!