Realistic Expectation for First Four Games

We’d go up big early in the season against weaker opponents and then we’d revert to undisciplined ball. I mentioned it back then and got chastised for nitpicking. It didn’t matter in those games since we’d usually coast to victory. But it did matter in terms of preparing for the tougher part of our schedule. Winning programs use weaker teams as practice, to hone their game. Winning programs don’t revert to lazy and undisciplined ball for an entire half just because they’re up big against a much weaker opponent. 2-2 is fine right now. What I don’t like is that we played really well in all 4 conference games and we’re 2-2. If we had an off night or two then I could accept 2-2. We can’t afford to give away games that we play really well in for 35 minutes, because there’s still going to be games where either we’re ice cold, and/or the other team is red hot, and we are going to loose. We need to look upon every game as a one game playoff, fighting for our lives from start to finish.
 
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Before the season started if you would have told me we would have been 2-2 after the first 4 I'd have been fine with it but I totally understand Monte and Logen's point of view on how they feel

Time to go 4-0 the next 4
 
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Being happy with 2-2 is simply not a winner's mentality. The culture needs to change. Villanova and even Marquette would not have been satisfied with 2-2.

We've put ourselves in bad position having to beat Nova and SH at home to avoid sweeps.

Any house money some fans thought we were playing with against Noba was given back.
 
[quote="Marillac" post=309686][quote="Beast of the East" post=309685]This is a really interesting start of season. While they may got off to a fast start, I'm just feeling a 1-3 hole where each game didn't feel like a horrible loss but in the aggregate people will be pissed. Hope I'm wrong.[/quote]

You are.[/quote]

You assured 3-1, MArillac. I get it. I was worried about 1-3, so am satisfied with 2-2. We are not in a bad position. Years ago on here I coined the phrase holding serve. Some guys got annoyed and said angrily, stop with the shit, this isn't tennis. But it is exactly like tennis. If you don't know tennis, you walk in and the score in a set is 4-1, and you say damn, this guy is getting killed. But he's only down one break. If he holds serve and breaks back it's 4-4. So look at it any way you want, but based on how we played, we have to hold serve against SH and Nova at home. Of course now its a big opportunity for them to break us and put themselves in the enviable 2-0 position against a conference rival.

Yea, by the very close score we blew a good opportunity to go 4-0 in a very tough stretch of play to open the season. I'm okay with 2-2 so long as we take care of business.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=314000][quote="Marillac" post=309686][quote="Beast of the East" post=309685]This is a really interesting start of season. While they may got off to a fast start, I'm just feeling a 1-3 hole where each game didn't feel like a horrible loss but in the aggregate people will be pissed. Hope I'm wrong.[/quote]

You are.[/quote]

You assured 3-1, MArillac. I get it. I was worried about 1-3, so am satisfied with 2-2. We are not in a bad position. Years ago on here I coined the phrase holding serve. Some guys got annoyed and said angrily, stop with the shit, this isn't tennis. But it is exactly like tennis. If you don't know tennis, you walk in and the score in a set is 4-1, and you say damn, this guy is getting killed. But he's only down one break. If he holds serve and breaks back it's 4-4. So look at it any way you want, but based on how we played, we have to hold serve against SH and Nova at home. Of course now its a big opportunity for them to break us and put themselves in the enviable 2-0 position against a conference rival.

Yea, by the very close score we blew a good opportunity to go 4-0 in a very tough stretch of play to open the season. I'm okay with 2-2 so long as we take care of business.[/quote]

Beast I agree with you on our current record. And hopefully we keep moving forward from here and the SH and Nova loses become distant memories. And Panther is correct about keeping perspective. And I’m trying. What concerns me and so many others is less about our record and more about our tendency to get careless with leads. One bad possession is one thing. Two bad possessions in a row isn’t great. But 5 minutes of mostly bad possessions? It was even longer in the SH game but they also had a lot of bad possessions during that last 10 minute stretch so it took them a while to catch up to us. The record is good. The bad habits are not and need to be corrected.
 
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[quote="Monte" post=314005][quote="Beast of the East" post=314000][quote="Marillac" post=309686][quote="Beast of the East" post=309685]This is a really interesting start of season. While they may got off to a fast start, I'm just feeling a 1-3 hole where each game didn't feel like a horrible loss but in the aggregate people will be pissed. Hope I'm wrong.[/quote]

You are.[/quote]

You assured 3-1, MArillac. I get it. I was worried about 1-3, so am satisfied with 2-2. We are not in a bad position. Years ago on here I coined the phrase holding serve. Some guys got annoyed and said angrily, stop with the shit, this isn't tennis. But it is exactly like tennis. If you don't know tennis, you walk in and the score in a set is 4-1, and you say damn, this guy is getting killed. But he's only down one break. If he holds serve and breaks back it's 4-4. So look at it any way you want, but based on how we played, we have to hold serve against SH and Nova at home. Of course now its a big opportunity for them to break us and put themselves in the enviable 2-0 position against a conference rival.

Yea, by the very close score we blew a good opportunity to go 4-0 in a very tough stretch of play to open the season. I'm okay with 2-2 so long as we take care of business.[/quote]

Beast I agree with you on our current record. And hopefully we keep moving forward from here and the SH and Nova loses become distant memories. And Panther is correct about keeping perspective. And I’m trying. What concerns me and so many others is less about our record and more about our tendency to get careless with leads. One bad possession is one thing. Two bad possessions in a row isn’t great. But 5 minutes of mostly bad possessions? It was even longer in the SH game but they also had a lot of bad possessions during that last 10 minute stretch so it took them a while to catch up to us. The record is good. The bad habits are not and need to be corrected.[/quote]

Agree with careless with leads, but I think this happens more frequently for most teams on the road than at home. The crowd amps up at any sign that their team is fighting their way back a 10 point lead becomes 7, we miss a shot, and the team bangs another 3 to make it a 4 point lead and now the crowd is rocking.

I think also that part of the reason we stand around, though not acceptable, is because our guys, who can all shoot threes, spread the floor in those situations so that Ponds has room to operate. Problem is they still sag into the middle, and Ponds is left trying to shoot over a zone, or forcing it inside. In effect, in crunch time, our half court offense sucks.

Plenty of room for improvement for our guys. Trust me, it will be easier to hold onto leads at home.
 
Perhaps much of the acceptance from some fans with a 2-2 Early Record d is due to the nearly 2 decades of mostly bad Basketball . We seem to be happy to accept passing C grades instead of excellence with a A grade . Our being 4-0 was clearly in the grasp of this team , it fell off the cliff in 3 of the 4 games . I count the GTown game as one which could have easily been a loss . Squandered leads are not reflective of a good and certainly not great team . Several of the games looked remarkably like last Season’s January 0-11 swoon in which several of the losses were gut wrenching close losses . Yes, 2-2 so far is .500 Basketball , nothing more . If .500 Basketball is acceptable to this team and fans , we will wind up 9-9 and in 5 th or 6 place in the Confetence . Likely not a NCAA team with that record . The last 5 minute collapses should be troubling signs to players, Coaches, fans , etc . It’s becoming all too frequent . It’s like a race horse who holds the lead for 5 furlongs but, loses because it’s a 6 furlong race . I don’t know why this happens and don’t have a clue to fix it , but I am not taking any satisfaction in being 2-2 at this point . Nova already has 2 Road wins and while early in the season , that puts them in first place and in a enviable position going forward . Something is fundamentally wrong when games are not closed out with a Win in the grasp . It’s troubling me and should be a concern for all of us .. I hate to think it is representative of the Team’s character for the rest of the Season . Road Wins are Jewels to be had and giving them up late is not the stuff of Champions . Look at the poor Giants this Season ..
 
[quote="Monte" post=313992]We’d go up big early in the season against weaker opponents and then we’d revert to undisciplined ball. I mentioned it back then and got chastised for nitpicking. It didn’t matter in those games since we’d usually coast to victory. But it did matter in terms of preparing for the tougher part of our schedule. Winning programs use weaker teams as practice, to hone their game. Winning programs don’t revert to lazy and undisciplined ball for an entire half just because they’re up big against a much weaker opponent. 2-2 is fine right now. What I don’t like is that we played really well in all 4 conference games and we’re 2-2. If we had an off night or two then I could accept 2-2. We can’t afford to give away games that we play really well in for 35 minutes, because there’s still going to be games where either we’re ice cold, and/or the other team is red hot, and we are going to loose. We need to look upon every game as a one game playoff, fighting for our lives from start to finish.[/quote]

Your post is why I'm not satisfied with being 2-2 right now.
 
It’s difficult to be satisfied with being 2-2, because we should be 4-0, or 3-1–with the 1 loss to G*Town, not the Hall, and we should’ve beaten Nova y’day. So, 2-2 is a bit bitter-Sweet. Lol in my vino.
 
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We lost to Seton Hall because of a bad call.
We lost to Villanova because they have a real coaching staff.
Our second half substitutions consisted of one player, Trimble. Only coach responsible for subs is Greg St. Jean from appearances so credit him with a brain fart but it also reinforces the skepticism of fans who question Mullin's in-game coaching abilities. Not having a real college coach next to him is retarding Mullin's growth as a coach and it showed against Wright.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=314068]We lost to Seton Hall because of a bad call.
We lost to Villanova because they have a real coaching staff.
Our second half substitutions consisted of one player, Trimble. Only coach responsible for subs is Greg St. Jean from appearances so credit him with a brain fart but it also reinforces the skepticism of fans who question Mullin's in-game coaching abilities. Not having a real college coach next to him is retarding Mullin's growth as a coach and it showed against Wright.[/quote] wish he had someone like Lavins guy at buffalo
 
Have to start giving these other teams credit for winning games, its not always us giving the game away. Villanova got hot at home and came back. We will be fine there is no need to start panicking. It took everything these teams had to beat us at their place. We need to make sure we take care of business at home and we should be fine. If we win all our home games thats 9 wins, after that all we need is 3 wins on the road to get to 12 which is more than enough to get us a bid. We beat the hoyas already so we just need to steal 2 more on the road. Granted that could change if we lose at home, we would need to balance that out with another road win. Of course this is easier said than done but I think we have the talent make it happen.
 
Am a “one game at a time” guy, but Johnnies have great opportunity over next four games to position themselves well in this bear of a conference. Holding serve st home v DePaul, Creighton & GT while besting Butler on road to me is quite attainable and prepares us for tough consecutive road games with Duke, Marquette & Creighton. Let’s seize that opportunity by approaching DePaul game with same vigor as the great Marquette performance.

This is a NCAA Tourney caliber team, but that’s not a given. Let’s earn it with solid, heady play, especially down the stretch in close games.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=314068]We lost to Seton Hall because of a bad call.
We lost to Villanova because they have a real coaching staff.
Our second half substitutions consisted of one player, Trimble. Only coach responsible for subs is Greg St. Jean from appearances so credit him with a brain fart but it also reinforces the skepticism of fans who question Mullin's in-game coaching abilities. Not having a real college coach next to him is retarding Mullin's growth as a coach and it showed against Wright.[/quote]

I'm sure Mrs 72 disagrees with you.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=314122]Beast, Think Kellyanne Conway and George Conway and you will get the picture.;)[/quote]

political perspective or looks?
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=314011][quote="Monte" post=314005][quote="Beast of the East" post=314000][quote="Marillac" post=309686][quote="Beast of the East" post=309685]This is a really interesting start of season. While they may got off to a fast start, I'm just feeling a 1-3 hole where each game didn't feel like a horrible loss but in the aggregate people will be pissed. Hope I'm wrong.[/quote]

You are.[/quote]

You assured 3-1, MArillac. I get it. I was worried about 1-3, so am satisfied with 2-2. We are not in a bad position. Years ago on here I coined the phrase holding serve. Some guys got annoyed and said angrily, stop with the shit, this isn't tennis. But it is exactly like tennis. If you don't know tennis, you walk in and the score in a set is 4-1, and you say damn, this guy is getting killed. But he's only down one break. If he holds serve and breaks back it's 4-4. So look at it any way you want, but based on how we played, we have to hold serve against SH and Nova at home. Of course now its a big opportunity for them to break us and put themselves in the enviable 2-0 position against a conference rival.

Yea, by the very close score we blew a good opportunity to go 4-0 in a very tough stretch of play to open the season. I'm okay with 2-2 so long as we take care of business.[/quote]

Beast I agree with you on our current record. And hopefully we keep moving forward from here and the SH and Nova loses become distant memories. And Panther is correct about keeping perspective. And I’m trying. What concerns me and so many others is less about our record and more about our tendency to get careless with leads. One bad possession is one thing. Two bad possessions in a row isn’t great. But 5 minutes of mostly bad possessions? It was even longer in the SH game but they also had a lot of bad possessions during that last 10 minute stretch so it took them a while to catch up to us. The record is good. The bad habits are not and need to be corrected.[/quote]

Agree with careless with leads, but I think this happens more frequently for most teams on the road than at home. The crowd amps up at any sign that their team is fighting their way back a 10 point lead becomes 7, we miss a shot, and the team bangs another 3 to make it a 4 point lead and now the crowd is rocking.

I think also that part of the reason we stand around, though not acceptable, is because our guys, who can all shoot threes, spread the floor in those situations so that Ponds has room to operate. Problem is they still sag into the middle, and Ponds is left trying to shoot over a zone, or forcing it inside. In effect, in crunch time, our half court offense sucks.

Plenty of room for improvement for our guys. Trust me, it will be easier to hold onto leads at home.[/quote]

Agreed Beast, it happens to many teams on the road. West Virginia blew a 21pt lead in the second half yesterday on the road at Kansas St. Huggins is a Hall of Fame coach and it happened. Not only that but Kansas St. was playing without Dean Wade who is arguably their best player.
 
[quote="Paultzman" post=314105]Am a “one game at a time” guy, but Johnnies have great opportunity over next four games to position themselves well in this bear of a conference. Holding serve st home v DePaul, Creighton & GT while besting Butler on road to me is quite attainable and prepares us for tough consecutive road games with Duke, Marquette & Creighton. Let’s seize that opportunity by approaching DePaul game with same vigor as the great Marquette performance.
This is a NCAA Tourney caliber team, but that’s not a given. Let’s earn it with solid, heady play, especially down the stretch in close games.[/quote]

History tells us there are always hiccups along the way. I never pencil in wins as also likely is an unexpected home loss. or road loss to a weaker team, which has to be offset by an unexpected win. This team is good but not great, which means they will have to play well and for 40 minutes against every team in the conference. Key is shooting it well, as we don't have the type of team that wins a war of attrition. Ball movement, use our athleticism, and trust bench to keep our guys fresh. Box out, and more boxing out.
 
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Do we want to contend forvthe BE Title or are we happy to finish .500 and hope we get a bid ? Regardless of everything so far , this team lost 2 games they had control of until the last 5 or 10 minutes . And , agguably the GTown game could have been lost as well and for the same reasons as SH and Nova . Many posters have advanced their opinions on why we have dug defeat out of the hands of Victory but, it seems to be chronic . Many of the theories are valid but, it remains to be seen if they will be correctable . We have a tendency to shoot 3 point shots at a time when a drive to the hoop and a foul should be the game plan .And , Simon should not have the ball to control in tight spots on the perimeter . He isn’t a threat from out there and teams sag off him . They have scouted him well . His game is inside and driving and slashing not 3 pointers at less than 5 seconds on the shot clock . Also too, our guys seem to think they are going to get a call on every drive to the hoop . At crunch time , better to finish than let the game in Refs hands . On the Road, you won’t get the call unless you wind up in intensive care . Finish the play , dammit !
 
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A few more painful lessons left to be learned IMO. I'm hoping 5-6 losses could provide all the learning we need to make it through the first weekend of the tournament.
 
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