Ponds
- Thread starter paultzman
- Start date
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="Mean Gene" post=285892]If he wants to come back he can always take out an insurance policy to protect himself against possible injury[/quote]
I always thought that you were an insurance salesman.
I always thought that you were an insurance salesman.
[quote="fordham96" post=285851][quote="Knight" post=285850][quote="fordham96" post=285828][quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=285808]Ponds is certainly getting a chance to showcase his Game before several NBA teams . He should regard it as a learning experience and get the Pro feedback . The wise decision would be to return for 1 more Season..[/quote]
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote]
Because there is more to learn and work on. He's in a great situation for him with playing time and attention to getting stronger.[/quote]
Says who? You? What if he disagrees? He has more to learn, when do you not have more to learn?
I love all of these amateur scouts and psychologists.[/quote]
You obviously have no clue what your talking about. You think as a college sophomore Ponds is NBA ready? He could disagree, it doesn't change the facts.
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote]
Because there is more to learn and work on. He's in a great situation for him with playing time and attention to getting stronger.[/quote]
Says who? You? What if he disagrees? He has more to learn, when do you not have more to learn?
I love all of these amateur scouts and psychologists.[/quote]
You obviously have no clue what your talking about. You think as a college sophomore Ponds is NBA ready? He could disagree, it doesn't change the facts.
[quote="OhioFan" post=285876]I don't know what size contract he might get in Europe, but let's say $300K per year? That may be what he ends up deciding. We as fans don't like that but it would have been a great fallback for me at 21.
He is making a decision for his family, decisions that likely not many of us can comprehend.[/quote] If 300 grand a year would have been a great fallback for you when you were 21. How much are you making now? I wouldn't fault him for leaving to make 300 grand. But, he is still young and an NBA payout would be much greater. But, it’s his choice.
He is making a decision for his family, decisions that likely not many of us can comprehend.[/quote] If 300 grand a year would have been a great fallback for you when you were 21. How much are you making now? I wouldn't fault him for leaving to make 300 grand. But, he is still young and an NBA payout would be much greater. But, it’s his choice.
Last edited:
[quote="Knight" post=285898][quote="fordham96" post=285851][quote="Knight" post=285850][quote="fordham96" post=285828][quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=285808]Ponds is certainly getting a chance to showcase his Game before several NBA teams . He should regard it as a learning experience and get the Pro feedback . The wise decision would be to return for 1 more Season..[/quote]
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote]
Because there is more to learn and work on. He's in a great situation for him with playing time and attention to getting stronger.[/quote]
Says who? You? What if he disagrees? He has more to learn, when do you not have more to learn?
I love all of these amateur scouts and psychologists.[/quote]
You obviously have no clue what your talking about. You think as a college sophomore Ponds is NBA ready? He could disagree, it doesn't change the facts.[/quote]
Gents, please do not take the comments to another level of dispute. Thank you.
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote]
Because there is more to learn and work on. He's in a great situation for him with playing time and attention to getting stronger.[/quote]
Says who? You? What if he disagrees? He has more to learn, when do you not have more to learn?
I love all of these amateur scouts and psychologists.[/quote]
You obviously have no clue what your talking about. You think as a college sophomore Ponds is NBA ready? He could disagree, it doesn't change the facts.[/quote]
Gents, please do not take the comments to another level of dispute. Thank you.
Class of 72
Active member
[quote="richard A Steinfeld" post=285899][quote="OhioFan" post=285876]I don't know what size contract he might get in Europe, but let's say $300K per year? That may be what he ends up deciding. We as fans don't like that but it would have been a great fallback for me at 21.
He is making a decision for his family, decisions that likely not many of us can comprehend.[/quote] If 300 grand a year would have been a great fallback for you when you were 21. How much are you making now? I wouldn't fault him for leaving to make 300 grand. But, he is still young and an NBA payout would be much greater. But, it’s his choice.[/quote]
One of our own, D'Angelo Harrison, plays in Israel where the average salary is $100, 000 per year. Isreal pays less than the major leagues in Spain, Italy and Russia but to earn $300,000 in Europe you have to be a top foreign player with experience. As we know, Harrison was, and is, as very very good basketball player. But unlike Shamorie Ponds he is 6'4 and has a pro body. He is a consistent volume scorer.
Yes, Shamorie can likely make a deal with a foreign team but we are not talking anywhere near the NBA minimum salary.
The American minor league salary levels are much less than in Israel and earning less than 100K per year will not support the lifestyle Slick is aiming at as a goal.
He's pretty much guaranteed to be a 2nd round NBA pick next year but his goal should be a high second round or possibly slip into the 1st round which is unlikely.
It's a business decision with strategic consequences. While we all want Slick to return for selfish fan reasons we also hope he makes the right decision for his long term future.
He is making a decision for his family, decisions that likely not many of us can comprehend.[/quote] If 300 grand a year would have been a great fallback for you when you were 21. How much are you making now? I wouldn't fault him for leaving to make 300 grand. But, he is still young and an NBA payout would be much greater. But, it’s his choice.[/quote]
One of our own, D'Angelo Harrison, plays in Israel where the average salary is $100, 000 per year. Isreal pays less than the major leagues in Spain, Italy and Russia but to earn $300,000 in Europe you have to be a top foreign player with experience. As we know, Harrison was, and is, as very very good basketball player. But unlike Shamorie Ponds he is 6'4 and has a pro body. He is a consistent volume scorer.
Yes, Shamorie can likely make a deal with a foreign team but we are not talking anywhere near the NBA minimum salary.
The American minor league salary levels are much less than in Israel and earning less than 100K per year will not support the lifestyle Slick is aiming at as a goal.
He's pretty much guaranteed to be a 2nd round NBA pick next year but his goal should be a high second round or possibly slip into the 1st round which is unlikely.
It's a business decision with strategic consequences. While we all want Slick to return for selfish fan reasons we also hope he makes the right decision for his long term future.
[quote="fordham96" post=285870][quote="richard A Steinfeld" post=285869][quote="fordham96" post=285828][quote="SLYFOXX1968" post=285808]Ponds is certainly getting a chance to showcase his Game before several NBA teams . He should regard it as a learning experience and get the Pro feedback . The wise decision would be to return for 1 more Season..[/quote]
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote] Because he wasn’t invited to an NBA draft combine and NBA scouts say he isn’t ready.[/quote]
They did, which ones? Can you tell me which ones? Let me guess the ones that say so, do they double as SJU fans?
Please stop kidding yourself. The biggest reason you want him to come back is not because you think he will improve his draft status after another year, you have no idea plus he can still play professionally somewhere else. You want him to come back because you want SJU to be good next year, him improving his draft status is an ancillary benefit for you but you have zero skin in that game.I
Let me ask you and anyone else if Ponds comes back and gets seriously hurt will you donate your salary to him?[/quote]
and if he gets hurt next year in the G league making 20 grand or whatever is he set for life? Wouldn't even have a college schollie to return too. Are you going to donate your salary if he leaves and doesn't make it?
Why would that be the wise decision?[/quote] Because he wasn’t invited to an NBA draft combine and NBA scouts say he isn’t ready.[/quote]
They did, which ones? Can you tell me which ones? Let me guess the ones that say so, do they double as SJU fans?
Please stop kidding yourself. The biggest reason you want him to come back is not because you think he will improve his draft status after another year, you have no idea plus he can still play professionally somewhere else. You want him to come back because you want SJU to be good next year, him improving his draft status is an ancillary benefit for you but you have zero skin in that game.I
Let me ask you and anyone else if Ponds comes back and gets seriously hurt will you donate your salary to him?[/quote]
and if he gets hurt next year in the G league making 20 grand or whatever is he set for life? Wouldn't even have a college schollie to return too. Are you going to donate your salary if he leaves and doesn't make it?
After reading through the recent posts I have my own thoughts.
1) Almost all fans want him to come back because he will help the team win more games next year. I do.
2) I think he either comes back or gets signed to a G league team. I would be shocked if he signs directly with a foreign team. He may at some point but not immediately. He wants to take a shot at the NBA.
3) I am sure that NBA teams will give him a fair critique but if he wants to turn pro several of them would be happy to pick him up for their G league team without having to use a draft pick. Despite his small stature and poor outside shooting this year he is an outstanding talent that succeeded in high school and his first two years of college against good competition.
4) It will take a lot to go right to become a first round pick after next season.
5) With all that said, I believe he stays.
1) Almost all fans want him to come back because he will help the team win more games next year. I do.
2) I think he either comes back or gets signed to a G league team. I would be shocked if he signs directly with a foreign team. He may at some point but not immediately. He wants to take a shot at the NBA.
3) I am sure that NBA teams will give him a fair critique but if he wants to turn pro several of them would be happy to pick him up for their G league team without having to use a draft pick. Despite his small stature and poor outside shooting this year he is an outstanding talent that succeeded in high school and his first two years of college against good competition.
4) It will take a lot to go right to become a first round pick after next season.
5) With all that said, I believe he stays.
Last edited:
[quote="usguard" post=285934]Does anyone know what the salary is in the G league ?[/quote]
Base salary is going up to $35K next season. Average with bonuses was $44K this year. But "two-way players next season will earn up to $77,250, topped on days where they're called up by the prorated NBA rookie salary." Beats working a Walmart.
Base salary is going up to $35K next season. Average with bonuses was $44K this year. But "two-way players next season will earn up to $77,250, topped on days where they're called up by the prorated NBA rookie salary." Beats working a Walmart.
Last edited:
Ray Morgan
Well-known member
To put this into perspective, Mo Harkless averaged 6, 3 and 1 and made over 10 million this season. That's more than many Euro pros will make in a career. Ponds is coming off a poor shooting season, which may well have been affected by injuries and too many desperation 3s. With a stronger supporting cast on the offensive end, he has a chance to show he can shoot 40% from 3 and 45% overall. A big season may get him drafted and some guaranteed money. Playing one more college season is the smart percentage play. In case he isn't drafted, the Beijing Ducks aren't going anywhere and will still be an option.
[quote="Ray Morgan" post=285941]To put this into perspective, Mo Harkless averaged 6, 3 and 1 and made over 10 million this season. That's more than many Euro pros will make in a career. Ponds is coming off a poor shooting season, which may well have been affected by injuries and too many desperation 3s. With a stronger supporting cast on the offensive end, he has a chance to show he can shoot 40% from 3 and 45% overall. A big season may get him drafted and some guaranteed money. Playing one more college season is the smart percentage play. In case he isn't drafted, the Beijing Ducks aren't going anywhere and will still be an option.[/quote]
While my belief Shamori has an NBA career ahead of him took quite a hit this year I agree with everything else you said.
And also when discussing Int'l vs G League there's a real big difference between a guy in the US making $76K (two way contract) and paying their own taxes and living expenses and a guy overseas making $100K with no taxes and living expenses. It's not as close as it appears. Proably more than 3X the value annually and a much higher standard of living.
PS Mo has elite size and athleticism. Shamori has neither. Coming into the year I thought he had the chance to be Kemba-lite. Not so sure anymore. I think he can have a great Jr. season and change my mind back very easily though.
While my belief Shamori has an NBA career ahead of him took quite a hit this year I agree with everything else you said.
And also when discussing Int'l vs G League there's a real big difference between a guy in the US making $76K (two way contract) and paying their own taxes and living expenses and a guy overseas making $100K with no taxes and living expenses. It's not as close as it appears. Proably more than 3X the value annually and a much higher standard of living.
PS Mo has elite size and athleticism. Shamori has neither. Coming into the year I thought he had the chance to be Kemba-lite. Not so sure anymore. I think he can have a great Jr. season and change my mind back very easily though.
[quote="austour" post=285946][quote="Ray Morgan" post=285941]To put this into perspective, Mo Harkless averaged 6, 3 and 1 and made over 10 million this season. That's more than many Euro pros will make in a career. Ponds is coming off a poor shooting season, which may well have been affected by injuries and too many desperation 3s. With a stronger supporting cast on the offensive end, he has a chance to show he can shoot 40% from 3 and 45% overall. A big season may get him drafted and some guaranteed money. Playing one more college season is the smart percentage play. In case he isn't drafted, the Beijing Ducks aren't going anywhere and will still be an option.[/quote]
While my belief Shamori has an NBA career ahead of him took quite a hit this year I agree with everything else you said.
And also when discussing Int'l vs G League there's a real big difference between a guy in the US making $76K (two way contract) and paying their own taxes and living expenses and a guy overseas making $100K with no taxes and living expenses. It's not as close as it appears. Proably more than 3X the value annually and a much higher standard of living.
PS Mo has elite size and athleticism. Shamori has neither. Coming into the year I thought he had the chance to be Kemba-lite. Not so sure anymore. I think he can have a great Jr. season and change my mind back very easily though.[/quote]
Good points, Austour. Last year, Ponds was handicapped by the ruptured offense caused by LoVett's defection and nagging injuries early on and also late in the year. It took awhile for a good offensive flow to re-emerge.
Shamorie took far too many early-in-the clock 3-pt heaves and too many last second chucks when offensive schemes broke down.
Made for some ugly hoops.
His 3-pt % game plummeted in the process from 38% as a frosh to 25% last year.
If he returns, I fully expect him to regain his former stroke.
While my belief Shamori has an NBA career ahead of him took quite a hit this year I agree with everything else you said.
And also when discussing Int'l vs G League there's a real big difference between a guy in the US making $76K (two way contract) and paying their own taxes and living expenses and a guy overseas making $100K with no taxes and living expenses. It's not as close as it appears. Proably more than 3X the value annually and a much higher standard of living.
PS Mo has elite size and athleticism. Shamori has neither. Coming into the year I thought he had the chance to be Kemba-lite. Not so sure anymore. I think he can have a great Jr. season and change my mind back very easily though.[/quote]
Good points, Austour. Last year, Ponds was handicapped by the ruptured offense caused by LoVett's defection and nagging injuries early on and also late in the year. It took awhile for a good offensive flow to re-emerge.
Shamorie took far too many early-in-the clock 3-pt heaves and too many last second chucks when offensive schemes broke down.
Made for some ugly hoops.
His 3-pt % game plummeted in the process from 38% as a frosh to 25% last year.
If he returns, I fully expect him to regain his former stroke.
RedStormRising
Well-known member
FWIW, here's an interesting article on the CBA. Sorry if it's been posted before.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china
[quote="RedStormRising2" post=285950]FWIW, here's an interesting article on the CBA. Sorry if it's been posted before.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken!
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken!
L J S A
Well-known member
[quote="Chicago Days" post=285951][quote="RedStormRising2" post=285950]FWIW, here's an interesting article on the CBA. Sorry if it's been posted before.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken![/quote]
After reading that, if I'm a sure-fire stud I'd see if a Chinese team wanted to sign me for $10+ million for one season before heading to the NBA.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken![/quote]
After reading that, if I'm a sure-fire stud I'd see if a Chinese team wanted to sign me for $10+ million for one season before heading to the NBA.
[quote="L J S A" post=285953][quote="Chicago Days" post=285951][quote="RedStormRising2" post=285950]FWIW, here's an interesting article on the CBA. Sorry if it's been posted before.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken![/quote]
After reading that, if I'm a sure-fire stud I'd see if a Chinese team wanted to sign me for $10+ million for one season before heading to the NBA.[/quote]
Very true. I missed how many teams in the CBA--but it seems like a great alternative to Europe (handicapping the 'distance' metric), and a good opportunity for high level college talent that just miss NBA standards..
Might make sense for Shamorie--following a great season in 2018-19--if he's looking like a late second round pick in the NBA draft.
Also don't know what CBA teams would offer non-NBA x-college players or the caliber of play in the CBA--but it appears to be a demanding foreign league.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...ketball-players-share-tales-really-play-china[/quote]
Thanks RSR2. Great piece. Seems like the CBA is a destination after some time in the NBA, not before.
But seems like a great second career if a guy can handle being away from family and get used to eating raw octopus and ‘chicken’ that ain’t chicken![/quote]
After reading that, if I'm a sure-fire stud I'd see if a Chinese team wanted to sign me for $10+ million for one season before heading to the NBA.[/quote]
Very true. I missed how many teams in the CBA--but it seems like a great alternative to Europe (handicapping the 'distance' metric), and a good opportunity for high level college talent that just miss NBA standards..
Might make sense for Shamorie--following a great season in 2018-19--if he's looking like a late second round pick in the NBA draft.
Also don't know what CBA teams would offer non-NBA x-college players or the caliber of play in the CBA--but it appears to be a demanding foreign league.
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=285956]I get the feeling Shamorie is focused strictly on NBA and would play in China or Europe only if the NBA is not an option. That is the main reason I feel somewhat confident he will be back for one great year with SJU.[/quote]
Oh I agree NCJohnnie.
My point is that the CBA might be a great alternative for Shamorie IF the NBA doesn’t play out for him next year.
Also, I’m sure he knows about it and it might serve as a second option for him that’s better than the g leagues or 2nd Tier European leagues.
He’d have to have a great college season next year for the CBA to be interested since it seems to tap primarily x-NBA players.
Just a potentially attractive alternative for the kid, following a bang up and wildly exciting college season with St. John’s.
An option I don’t think is presently in his options quiver.
Oh I agree NCJohnnie.
My point is that the CBA might be a great alternative for Shamorie IF the NBA doesn’t play out for him next year.
Also, I’m sure he knows about it and it might serve as a second option for him that’s better than the g leagues or 2nd Tier European leagues.
He’d have to have a great college season next year for the CBA to be interested since it seems to tap primarily x-NBA players.
Just a potentially attractive alternative for the kid, following a bang up and wildly exciting college season with St. John’s.
An option I don’t think is presently in his options quiver.
