Mike Vacc SJU Critique

[shamsman2]

You don't get into the NCAA Tournament based upon TV appearances or even on recruiting alone. Putting together talent is one thing. Using it appropriately and keeping a proper cycle of players that fit the needs of your system is another. Both important components.
Our opponent on Friday, San Diego St University has been to the Tournament every year for the past 6 years with an at large bid every one of those with the exception of one Conf. Championship. They barely get any national TV exposure and are dwarfed by much bigger names in their recruiting sandbox. They have a system. They stick with it and recruit accordingly. The point being that as I specified, in the Big East (meaning as it is today), there is no reason St Johns should not be going to the Tournament every year with not going, being an aberration.

Do you really think that San Diego St. would have 6 bids in a row if they were in a major conference. Most people refer to the mountain west as a mid major and as such, even though they were 1st place in their league at 14-4, and sport a 27-9 record, they are exactly one seed better than SJU, a fifth place Big East team and downgraded by the NCAA seeding because of Obekpa's suspension. You might as well compare Harvard's success in dominating the Ivy League.

In our league, Villanova at this point should go every year. Georgetown pretty also. After that, it's one big fray. Providence is an up program now, so is Butler. Last season Creighton and Marquette were near the top, and will probably become more competitive. Xavier's not a bad program, and for a while this season Seton Hall seemed as tough as nails.

We now have over 20 years and 5 coaches to return to the gold standard of post season most years under Carnsecca - Repeat MOST years. Even Lou would fall short of your standard.

Nova to most observers doesn't have an NBA player on their roster. Yet they are the crown jewel of the conference.

They recruit kids that fit their system and style of play. They also haven't had the recurring ineligible kids, transfers out and suspensions. So there is a consistency there.

We don't have a system. We were supposed to be a running team that pressed defensively all game long. But it's taken 4 years to see any semblance of that.

Now we're chasing int'l kids.

It's consistency vs chaos. And that is why tourney bids have been out of reach. 10 wins in this conference should be an annual occurrence for us.

how long did it take Jay Wright to build his system? His first 3 years were all NIT bids, and he did not start with an empty cupboard as Lavin did. I don't want to make this about Lavin, but it takes time for your system to take hold, if indeed you have one. And also a bit of luck, which you need to take advantage of.

The difference between being successful and not can be so small. Wright is a hellava of a coach and has a system, it having a steady supply of seniors on his team who buy into his system and teach the freshman and sophomores. Smart dude, Paul is right, but it takes time, in a world that has no patience.

 

[action264]

The last time Lav was in the tournament with a bunch of seniors, he was new to the job and had assembled a highly-touted recruiting class to replace it. Four years later, he's waited till the 11th hour to replace 4-6 of his most significant players. He's either stuck out, accepted defeat, or is about to pull a rabbit out of his hat. Somehow, I don't think the Wizard will wow us.

 

[Red.Fans]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

 

[Class of 72]

I don't see any reason why we can't be Kentucky and go undefeated.

We are a day late and 10 players short.

 

[Marillac]

You don't get into the NCAA Tournament based upon TV appearances or even on recruiting alone. Putting together talent is one thing. Using it appropriately and keeping a proper cycle of players that fit the needs of your system is another. Both important components.
Our opponent on Friday, San Diego St University has been to the Tournament every year for the past 6 years with an at large bid every one of those with the exception of one Conf. Championship. They barely get any national TV exposure and are dwarfed by much bigger names in their recruiting sandbox. They have a system. They stick with it and recruit accordingly. The point being that as I specified, in the Big East (meaning as it is today), there is no reason St Johns should not be going to the Tournament every year with not going, being an aberration.

Do you really think that San Diego St. would have 6 bids in a row if they were in a major conference. Most people refer to the mountain west as a mid major and as such, even though they were 1st place in their league at 14-4, and sport a 27-9 record, they are exactly one seed better than SJU, a fifth place Big East team and downgraded by the NCAA seeding because of Obekpa's suspension. You might as well compare Harvard's success in dominating the Ivy League.

In our league, Villanova at this point should go every year. Georgetown pretty also. After that, it's one big fray. Providence is an up program now, so is Butler. Last season Creighton and Marquette were near the top, and will probably become more competitive. Xavier's not a bad program, and for a while this season Seton Hall seemed as tough as nails.

We now have over 20 years and 5 coaches to return to the gold standard of post season most years under Carnsecca - Repeat MOST years. Even Lou would fall short of your standard.

Nova to most observers doesn't have an NBA player on their roster. Yet they are the crown jewel of the conference.

They recruit kids that fit their system and style of play. They also haven't had the recurring ineligible kids, transfers out and suspensions. So there is a consistency there.

We don't have a system. We were supposed to be a running team that pressed defensively all game long. But it's taken 4 years to see any semblance of that.

Now we're chasing int'l kids.

It's consistency vs chaos. And that is why tourney bids have been out of reach. 10 wins in this conference should be an annual occurrence for us.

Jay Wright would have been destroyed here if he took over the irrelevant program Steve Lavin did. It's just not fair or accurate to paint Jay Wright as a saint who runs a drama-free program. I would love to have him here, but let's not pretend he is something he's not.

Wright was in a highly publicized cheating scandal with a Nova student. There were several fights among Nova players over the years, and there was also the drama about Fisher impregnating Scottie Reynolds gf. What about Nova suspending 12 players in 2003 over in the Phone Card Scandal? The two years of probation? The transfers out (King, Yacouba, Armwood, Brzoja, Kennedy, Chennault, Johnson off just in the last five years)? Taylor King's substance abuse? Let's not make them out to be choir boys.

New York Post article from 2005:

In his fourth season, Wright’s seat is getting hotter, and Villanova fans are getting antsy, waiting for their first trip to the NCAA tournament since 1999.
“I’m very aware that [the pressure] is there,” Wright said.

Nova made the tournament 4/5 years from 95-99. Wright took over in 2001 fresh off recruiting New York for the last several years. Lavin took over a team that was 12-24 in conference the prior two seasons and that hadn't made the the tournament in nine seasons.

Highly publicized? You need a lesson on what highly publicized is.
It was an unfounded rumor

There was no question it was highly publicized. It was on every fan board from here to UCLA, all over twitter and social Media. Whether or not it was true is a different matter entirely and something nobody on this board will every know for sure.

When have unfounded rumors slowed down attacks on Lavin? We average one a week around here. Just yesterday three NAMED players were reportedly suspended.

Nothing is fairly or consistently applied to Lavin by those that want him gone.

 

[Marillac]

The last time Lav was in the tournament with a bunch of seniors, he was new to the job and had assembled a highly-touted recruiting class to replace it. Four years later, he's waited till the 11th hour to replace 4-6 of his most significant players. He's either stuck out, accepted defeat, or is about to pull a rabbit out of his hat. Somehow, I don't think the Wizard will wow us.

Waited til the 11th hour? Please at least be factual. He recruited Briscoe "off his ass" for five years. He recruited Brandon Sampson for four years. He was on Alibegovic for a year before he committed. He was ADR for a long time, and he's been on Mussini for at least a year.

 

[monte]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

 

[Marillac]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

And if Lavin took the job from Steve Lapas (tournament in 4/5 years from 95-99) like Wright, he would not have had to endure 1/10th of the turmoil he did. Jay Wright didn't have to replace 10 seniors and two transfers after year one. Jay Wright didn't take over a program that was irrelevant for a decade and hadn't made the tournament in NINE seasons. Jay Wright didn't take over a program that hadn't had a winning conference season in nine seasons.

Jay Wright would have been a god if he was hired when Jarvis was being courted by the Bullets, but he would have been in the same situation as Lavin if he took over for Norm.

 

[Class of 72]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

 

[OLV72]

Wright has won 65% and Lavin has won 63% over the course of their careers. Wright took over a down program at Hofstra and took years to turn it around. He has a good thing going right now in the new BE.

 

[Marillac]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

False. Lappas went to the NCAA tournament in 1998-1999. He won 20 games in 1999-2000 and went 8-8 in conference and to the NIT. He went to the NIT again in 2000-2001 after winning 18 games and going 8-8 in conference. He won the NIT in 1993-1994, and then went to three straight tournaments from 1994-1995 season through 1996-1997 season, advancing twice.

Jay Wright took over a solid program. Steve Lavin took of a program in shambles.

 

[Class of 72]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

False. Lappas went to the NCAA tournament in 1998-1999. He won 20 games in 1999-2000 and went 8-8 in conference and to the NIT. He went to the NIT again in 2000-2001 after winning 18 games and going 8-8 in conference. He won the NIT in 1993-1994, and then went to three straight tournaments from 1994-1995 season through 1996-1997 season, advancing twice.

Jay Wright took over a solid program. Steve Lavin took of a program in shambles.

You are correct Marillac in his last 4 years he got ONE NCAA bid but lost in the first round. But it does change the moral of the story. We must stay away from Steve Masiello.

 

[monte]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

Back in the 80's, yes Nova's academic reputation was fine as was their basketball program. Now they are one of the top Catholic academic institutions in the country and they have one of the top basketball programs in the country. So I think its fair to say that not only were they LOOKING to elevate their academic standing and their basketball program, but they have been highly successful in doing so.

 

[Marillac]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

False. Lappas went to the NCAA tournament in 1998-1999. He won 20 games in 1999-2000 and went 8-8 in conference and to the NIT. He went to the NIT again in 2000-2001 after winning 18 games and going 8-8 in conference. He won the NIT in 1993-1994, and then went to three straight tournaments from 1994-1995 season through 1996-1997 season, advancing twice.

Jay Wright took over a solid program. Steve Lavin took of a program in shambles.

You are correct Marillac in his last 4 years he got ONE NCAA bid but lost in the first round. But it does change the moral of the story. We must stay away from Steve Masiello.

Stay away from all Manhattan coaches. They've all been busts: Mahoney, Fraschilla, Lappas, Gonzales....
Winning doesn't seem to be very hard at Manhattan.
Maseillo shouldn't even be a consideration after he lied to USF less than a year ago. I love his style of play and the toughness he brings, but we need to have standards. The guy is a ticking time bomb.

 

[beast of the east]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Villanova has had 4 coaches since 1961. Jack Kraft (12 seasons, 1 NCAA final), Rollie (19 seasons, NCAA championship), Lappas (9 seasons), and Wright (14 and counting, 2 seet 16s an elite 8, and Final Four).

Coming from Hofstra, Wright's success was by no means a guarantee, but Nov moved quickly on Wright, whose stock was very high. They also haven't waited until other schools came knocking to up Wright's salary (now above $2.5 million. The person who was behind his hire just passed away last week, university President Father Edmund Dobbin:

http://articles.philly.com/2015-03-11/news/59974914_1_presidency-student-newspaper-first-love

Dobbin was a huge basketball fan, and as the obit reads, understood that a nationally recognized program enhanced the university. On the other hand, he also had a much more generous alumni supporting the school. In the last 9 years alone, Nova completed a successful $300 million campaign (with a much smaller alumni base than SJU) and now at the end of the first year of a $600 million campaign (they've raised $411 million so far). Even so, Lappas was hired from Manhattan after a 25-9 season and three losing years. Wright was hired after 7 years at Hofstra - the last 2 NCAA appearances.

Nova (and Georgetown for that matter) has much more to work with in terms of endowment and generous alumni base, and of course that permeates all areas of those universities in terms of quality administration, faculties, facilities.

If we apply the every year rule to Villanova, they've made the tourney 10 of 14 times in the Wright era, twice in his first 5 years. For them right now the expectation is tourney every year, but as recently as 2011-2012, they were 13-19.

I do have a feeling Lavin will not be here after his final contractual season. The school will think long and hard about paying him $2.5 million per year guaranteed if they extend him. There doesn't seem to be a case of warm and fuzzies between Lavin and the university. If we start over in 2016-2017, whoever comes in will need at least 5 years to build their own program. So if there is an expectation of year in year out NCAA bids, it won't happen right away.

 

[beast of the east]

You don't get into the NCAA Tournament based upon TV appearances or even on recruiting alone. Putting together talent is one thing. Using it appropriately and keeping a proper cycle of players that fit the needs of your system is another. Both important components.
Our opponent on Friday, San Diego St University has been to the Tournament every year for the past 6 years with an at large bid every one of those with the exception of one Conf. Championship. They barely get any national TV exposure and are dwarfed by much bigger names in their recruiting sandbox. They have a system. They stick with it and recruit accordingly. The point being that as I specified, in the Big East (meaning as it is today), there is no reason St Johns should not be going to the Tournament every year with not going, being an aberration.

Do you really think that San Diego St. would have 6 bids in a row if they were in a major conference. Most people refer to the mountain west as a mid major and as such, even though they were 1st place in their league at 14-4, and sport a 27-9 record, they are exactly one seed better than SJU, a fifth place Big East team and downgraded by the NCAA seeding because of Obekpa's suspension. You might as well compare Harvard's success in dominating the Ivy League.

In our league, Villanova at this point should go every year. Georgetown pretty also.

We now have over 20 years and 5 coaches to return to the gold standard of post season most years under Carnsecca - Repeat MOST years. Even Lou would fall short of your standard.

Sounds like you are arguing with yourself with your convoluted Villanova envy. There is zero reason other than the program being run better, that they should be in the Tournament every year and St Johns shouldn't.

Nova is a better university than SJU top to bottom in almost every conceivable way, from academics, campus, infrastructure, and endowment. If you think that's convoluted, I really can't argue against that logic. If there is no reason other than the fact that through 2 campaigns over 9 years they've now raised over $800 million, compared to our one campaign that raised $300 million they simply have means that SJU doesn't possess.

 

[doodyny33]

Hey guys, you do remember we have an NCAA Tournament game tomorrow? Just a reminder that the season isn't over yet.

Can we focus on the team for now and then maybe talk about Lavin vs. Lappas afterward?

 

[monte]

You don't get into the NCAA Tournament based upon TV appearances or even on recruiting alone. Putting together talent is one thing. Using it appropriately and keeping a proper cycle of players that fit the needs of your system is another. Both important components.
Our opponent on Friday, San Diego St University has been to the Tournament every year for the past 6 years with an at large bid every one of those with the exception of one Conf. Championship. They barely get any national TV exposure and are dwarfed by much bigger names in their recruiting sandbox. They have a system. They stick with it and recruit accordingly. The point being that as I specified, in the Big East (meaning as it is today), there is no reason St Johns should not be going to the Tournament every year with not going, being an aberration.

Do you really think that San Diego St. would have 6 bids in a row if they were in a major conference. Most people refer to the mountain west as a mid major and as such, even though they were 1st place in their league at 14-4, and sport a 27-9 record, they are exactly one seed better than SJU, a fifth place Big East team and downgraded by the NCAA seeding because of Obekpa's suspension. You might as well compare Harvard's success in dominating the Ivy League.

In our league, Villanova at this point should go every year. Georgetown pretty also.

We now have over 20 years and 5 coaches to return to the gold standard of post season most years under Carnsecca - Repeat MOST years. Even Lou would fall short of your standard.

Sounds like you are arguing with yourself with your convoluted Villanova envy. There is zero reason other than the program being run better, that they should be in the Tournament every year and St Johns shouldn't.

Nova is a better university than SJU top to bottom in almost every conceivable way, from academics, campus, infrastructure, and endowment. If you think that's convoluted, I really can't argue against that logic. If there is no reason other than the fact that through 2 campaigns over 9 years they've now raised over $800 million, compared to our one campaign that raised $300 million they simply have means that SJU doesn't possess.

Agree with you., but on sheer volume of alumni alone SJU should be able to raise as much money as Nova. I suspect(although I have no knowledge of this), that it has as much to do with the effectiveness(or lack of) of our fundraising campaigns as anything.

 

[monte]

Hey guys, you do remember we have an NCAA Tournament game tomorrow? Just a reminder that the season isn't over yet.

Can we focus on the team for now and then maybe talk about Lavin vs. Lappas afterward?

Some of us are capable of discussing the game and the direction of the program at the same time.

 

[monte]

Beast in Lou's last 17 years of coaching, he made the NCAA tournament 15 times and the NIT twice, the second time wining the NIT championship the year Sealy and Werdann were rookies. Also we were ranked in the top 20 every single season of 17 with the exception of the year they won the NIT championship. I would take that over the next 17 years in a heartbeat.

And even with that "fans" were calling for his retirement saying the game had passed him by. I was not one of them by any means but I do think there was unfinished business even under LC and I'd like to set the bar as high as possible and not just settle for some "happy medium" for the whole program not just singling out a head coach. It should not be just trying to bring in some random guy and hope that he is going to provide an identity. That should be there already and any particular coach should be plugging into it and supporting it.

Nova had a perfectly decent coach in Steve Lappas. 9 years, 4 NCAA tournaments, 3 NIT, .613 winning percentage, While there's still some debate over his departure, I have no doubt that Nova was looking to elevate their basketball program just as they've elevated their academic reputation. IMO Steve Lavin, if he stays, will be our Steve Lappas. Its up to the school to decide if that's what they want for their basketball program.

Unfortunately his name was Steve. Unfortunately he was a one year wonder at Manhattan College.
Unfortunately of his 9 years at Nova his last 4 did not produce one NCAA bid and he lost too many games. Nova's academic reputation was fine and they had long elevated their basketball program under Rollie Massimino. The moral of the story is stay away from coaches named Steve and from Manhattan College.

False. Lappas went to the NCAA tournament in 1998-1999. He won 20 games in 1999-2000 and went 8-8 in conference and to the NIT. He went to the NIT again in 2000-2001 after winning 18 games and going 8-8 in conference. He won the NIT in 1993-1994, and then went to three straight tournaments from 1994-1995 season through 1996-1997 season, advancing twice.

Jay Wright took over a solid program. Steve Lavin took of a program in shambles.

You are correct Marillac in his last 4 years he got ONE NCAA bid but lost in the first round. But it does change the moral of the story. We must stay away from Steve Masiello.

Stay away from all Manhattan coaches. They've all been busts: Mahoney, Fraschilla, Lappas, Gonzales....
Winning doesn't seem to be very hard at Manhattan.
Maseillo shouldn't even be a consideration after he lied to USF less than a year ago. I love his style of play and the toughness he brings, but we need to have standards. The guy is a ticking time bomb.

Masiello is like Lavin on steroids with all his schtick. Plus I will never be able to get over the lying scandal. Something really sleazy about the guy. No thank you!