MICHIGAN (@MSG), Mon., Nov. 13, 6:30p, FS-1

room112 said:
I loved Posh as much as everyone else, one of my favorite St Johns players. But just remember how many poor games he had last season. It was rough to watch at times. Him being on the team last night would have made little difference.
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And not only did the kid have poor body language all season(even when Curbelo wasn't playing), he was given the chance to stay with the team and chose not to. This revisionist history by some is tiring. Posh is better off where he is, and we're better off where we are.
 
Last night they seemed leaderless and rudderless, with no-one to call them into a huddle and say "Let's get our shit together and stop the bleeding." That's what you get when you fire a whole team. These guys may all be 22, but they seem a little overmatched by major conference basketball, which very few of them have experienced. Hopefully someone will emerge....a la Posh Alexander, who without Curbelo around might have had a very nice senior season---and probably will have one for Butler. Nice to see Drissa get a few minutes....
 
fan5577 said:
Guys this team blew Marquette off the floor in a scrimmage. There were at least 2 incidents where players ran into each other and were knocked to the floor. This will take some time. I was disappointed in this game as well but the over reaction to this game is amazing!!
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I don’t see an over reaction at all, just many posters feeling disappointed (and rightly so) with a game that was super hyped by the fan base, coaches , media and the St John’s organization as well. No one is saying “ the sky is falling” or the season is over at all and all believe the team will get better but if you are not extremely disappointed with getting blown out to a team you were favored to beat on a national TV audience in Rick Pitinos Garden debut, then I would question just how true a fan you are. (I am not referring to this poster). I think the reality is coach Pitino or not, this rebuild is not going to happen overnight or as coach has said, “St. John’s will be back and it will happen fast”. It’s a process that may even take more than half a season or so.
 
Silly Donovan said:
I don’t see an over reaction at all, just many posters feeling disappointed (and rightly so) with a game that was super hyped by the fan base, coaches , media and the St John’s organization as well. No one is saying “ the sky is falling” or the season is over at all and all believe the team will get better but if you are not extremely disappointed with getting blown out to a team you were favored to beat on a national TV audience in Rick Pitinos Garden debut, then I would question just how true a fan you are. (I am not referring to this poster). I think the reality is coach Pitino or not, this rebuild is not going to happen overnight or as coach has said, “St. John’s will be back and it will happen fast”. It’s a process that may even take more than half a season or so.
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Agree, fair to feel very disappointed, yet hopeful this will be a solid season. Rick has his work cut out for him to get a Dance ticket, but this is not his first rodeo.

Playing “portal Russian roulette” mixing and matching players takes time and skill. Recruiting is going well, year one with some tinkering has promise and most importantly Pitino has a vision how to make this a consistently competitive program. Not blind faith, but I have confidence he will accomplish that. Let’s win two in Charleston at least & go from there.
 
Silly Donovan said:
I don’t see an over reaction at all, just many posters feeling disappointed (and rightly so) with a game that was super hyped by the fan base, coaches , media and the St John’s organization as well. No one is saying “ the sky is falling” or the season is over at all and all believe the team will get better but if you are not extremely disappointed with getting blown out to a team you were favored to beat on a national TV audience in Rick Pitinos Garden debut, then I would question just how true a fan you are. (I am not referring to this poster). I think the reality is coach Pitino or not, this rebuild is not going to happen overnight or as coach has said, “St. John’s will be back and it will happen fast”. It’s a process that may even take more than half a season or so.
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I think there has been an overreaction. I get that everyone was jumping out of their skin waiting for Pitino’s first game at the Garden as SJJ coach. I was too. And the disappointment was palpable.

But we have posters already pinning blame of players, saying this team is in dire straits, and wanting a former point guard back (who decided leave by essentially not doing what the coach asked).

Pitino made no bones about the effort and the efficiency. Both were sorely missing. And he had the starters watch roughly the last 10 minutes as the backups at least tried in an outcome already decided.

Come January, we will be all singing a different tune here. I know this because the coach and his staff will drill every single correction into their heads.

I would rather take this beating now, by a soon to be ranked Michigan, than beat the Incarnate World.
 
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kranmars said:
By the emotional extremes

I think there has been an overreaction. I get that everyone was jumping out of their skin waiting for Pitino’s first game at the Garden as SJJ coach. I was too. And the disappointment was palpable.

But we have posters already pinning blame of players, saying this team is in dire straits, and wanting a former point guard back (who decided leave by essentially not doing what the coach asked).

Pitino made no bones about the effort and the efficiency. Both were sorely missing. And he had the starters watch roughly the last 10 minutes as the backups at least tried in an outcome already decided.

Come January, we will be all singing a different tune here. I know this because the coach and his staff will drill every single correction into their heads.

I would rather take this beating now, by a soon to be ranked Michigan, than beat the Incarnate World.
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100% agree with that. Getting worked by Michigan is better for us than beating up on a cupcake. Feels like the past few seasons this program looked good against inferior competition in November and December and didn’t realize their own shortcomings until they were 1-5 in conference play. Hopefully this is an earlier wake up call then we’re used to seeing.
 
Ok so I feel I should post so I am not looked at as what happened to the optimist after a loss etc.

Before I do, nice seeing monte and his friend frank for a quick beer before heading into the garden!!


One game does not a season make but man that was disappointing. A bit confused how the first 15-16 min was so very competitive and a fun atmosphere to getting down 10 at the half the last couple minutes. And then expecting a good start to the second half and nothing.

We did hold them to no points the first 2 minutes but we couldn’t score either.

Although Michigan was scoring a lot in the first half we did play decent defense at times with deflections and steals and we had nice offensive sets.

Second half there was nothing defensively and it did not appear we had an offensive game plan either. I could have dribbled into the lane for a layup!!

So what I am going to do is temper my expectations out loud. Hope for a nice Luis transition into the lineup and hope our guys play to the roles that best suit the teams needs Because the talent is there and the coach is there to make it happen.

Good thing I couldn’t bet this game because I certainly would have taken St. John’s. Unfortunately I decided to take Florida gulf coast getting 9.5 points against Pitt and lost on a last possession shot by Pitt when they were up 9 with a 3. Why oh why did you have to take the shot? Game was over!!!!!

Out of frustration I then bet penn money line vs nova when they were up 2 at the half. At least I cashed that so the night wasn’t all a loss.

Anyway sorry for that side track. Wrong thread lol.
 
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Even with early struggles and chemistry development you hope for better than that vs Michigan.

But I think it’s necessary to understand literally everyone on the team is playing a different role now compared to the teams they were on last year.

Jenkins now has talented players everywhere to keep happy. Dingle has to share shots and look for shots at the same time. Taylor isn’t a primary scoring option like he was before. Ledlum isn’t the biggest guy on the court. Soriano has a coach that demands he do the little things that he seemed to get away with before. Not to mention level of competition and new schools. Bench is the same.

I think our experience and good, but not great, talent will shine through as we go. Lavins first year group had different type of experience but similar age factor. They also had a new coach and completely different roles. DJ went from 1st option to 3rd. Hardy went from 6Th man to star. Brownlee from 7Th to stud. Paris scored 16 points a game as a soph! He was a defensive stopper who picked his spots on that winning team.

That team got beat by St Bonaventure and Fordham before they figured it out. There is no reason to let last nights unfortunate beat down make you give up on the potential for this season to be a successful one.
 
Rocket said:
I think the coaches at Tennessee thought the same thing after working him out.
I'm still happy to have him and his rebounding skill but he is a very bright guy who will learn from his mistakes at this level. I dare say our front line would have been rail thin without him.
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I saw some Mustapha Heron in Ledlum last night, another player who had D1 talent but seemed to fall betwixt and between roles, spots, desires, usage and ultimately, results.
 
Amaseinyourface said:
Even with early struggles and chemistry development you hope for better than that vs Michigan.

But I think it’s necessary to understand literally everyone on the team is playing a different role now compared to the teams they were on last year.

Jenkins now has talented players everywhere to keep happy. Dingle has to share shots and look for shots at the same time. Taylor isn’t a primary scoring option like he was before. Ledlum isn’t the biggest guy on the court. Soriano has a coach that demands he do the little things that he seemed to get away with before. Not to mention level of competition and new schools. Bench is the same.

I think our experience and good, but not great, talent will shine through as we go. Lavins first year group had different type of experience but similar age factor. They also had a new coach and completely different roles. DJ went from 1st option to 3rd. Hardy went from 6Th man to star. Brownlee from 7Th to stud. Paris scored 16 points a game as a soph! He was a defensive stopper who picked his spots on that winning team.

That team got beat by St Bonaventure and Fordham before they figured it out. There is no reason to let last nights unfortunate beat down make you give up on the potential for this season to be a successful one.
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I recall Bootsy Thornton slightly being inconsistent/out of sorts his first handful of games for the Johnnies before he became a consistent threat. I'm not saying anyone will turn out like Thornton, but I feel some players are feeling out their role on the team (particularly someone like Dingle).

By the way, I'd likely be okay going 2-1 in Charleston, but that's predicated on how we get to 2-1. If we go 2-1 after losing the first or second game, then I'd consider it a disappointment. If we go 2-1 in the championship then I'd probably be fine (depending on how we play in the finals).
 
While some have stated we have a veteran team, it's important to note we have veteran players, which is a lot different. They didn't play like a team on both ends last night. What concerned me going in is whether we had high major athleticism. We didn't pass that test. Players at all levels of college basketball have similar skill sets. It's the size and speed of the athletes that changes at this level. We tried to run with Michigan.]. It worked for about 12 minutes and made for exciting basketball until their better and faster players overwhelmed us.

Michigan looked like a top 20 team. The question is whether our guys made them looked that way, or whether they are really that good.
 
Fair to say it but last night was DISAPPOINTING. Period. The team needs to move away from wallowing in pity. Michigan did shoot the lights out and that won’t always happen.

However, time to move on. I assume there will be an intense practice or two. The Charleston trip might come at the exact right time for some team building. Go away be locked up together and get back to work. Of course, they are facing some tough games there. Don’t take anything for granted.
 
kranmars said:
By the emotional extremes

I think there has been an overreaction. I get that everyone was jumping out of their skin waiting for Pitino’s first game at the Garden as SJJ coach. I was too. And the disappointment was palpable.

But we have posters already pinning blame of players, saying this team is in dire straits, and wanting a former point guard back (who decided leave by essentially not doing what the coach asked).

Pitino made no bones about the effort and the efficiency. Both were sorely missing. And he had the starters watch roughly the last 10 minutes as the backups at least tried in an outcome already decided.

Come January, we will be all singing a different tune here. I know this because the coach and his staff will drill every single correction into their heads.

I would rather take this beating now, by a soon to be ranked Michigan, than beat the Incarnate World.
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I do agree about those fans wishing for players like Posh to be back. I guess they forgot that Posh led a team that won 7 out of 20 games last year in the Big East or that he bolted when coach Pitino gave him the opportunity to earn playing time. I guess that aspect is an over reaction.
 
Dal975 said:
I saw some Mustapha Heron in Ledlum last night, another player who had D1 talent but seemed to fall betwixt and between roles, spots, desires, usage and ultimately, results.
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Damn, can’t say you’re definitely wrong, but I’m definitely hoping you are. Mustapha was one of my least favorite players to watch.
 
Silly Donovan said:
I do agree about those fans wishing for players like Posh to be back. I guess they forgot that Posh led a team that won 7 out of 20 games last year in the Big East or that he bolted when coach Pitino gave him the opportunity to earn playing time. I guess that aspect is an over reaction.
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Posh on Butler…the end.
 
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