Mets

While I miss Bobby Ojeda's head nearly combusting on post-game shows that followed games such as this...Nelson Figueroa has been an understated solid analyst. He just made a point about the Harvey decision, and how Collins in his own way had been building Harvey up to do what he did tonight, and I think he is correct. When that shutdown/innings nonsense happened, TC kind of rebuilt Harvey in the image of the very bulldog he tried being tonight. Collins knew what the right call was, but as he said in his post game interview, "trust players"--he wanted it for the kid as much as Matt wanted it for himself.

Tragic, but sweet.

Thank god Mets fans have SNY...best baseball broadcasters in the game. Word.
 
Collins gets it wrong again, he didn't learn anything from last night. Brings Familia in behind the 8 ball again. Great, great game by Harvey but you manage with your head not emotion. Harvey not a complete game pitcher, has decidedly worse stats after 100 pitches, and Familia was arguably your MVP, certainly your stud. Should have been a no brainer.
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You had to atleast let Harvey start the 9th, but after the leadoff walk I would have gotten him out.
I thought Niese was gonna pitch a second inning and was surprised when Reed came in in the 12th.
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. I don't understand the reasoning regarding Harvey at all and I guess that is just a change in sports. In my mind, why do you have to let Harvey start the 9th? You do what's best to win the game, especially a WS elimination game, and that, imo, was Familia. I don't remember a complete game the Mets had all year and after bringing in Familia with no margin for error last night Collins does it again tonight. Frankly, I would have brought him in to start the 8th yesterday and 9th today. Lose with your best, giving your best the best chance to succeed. Yankees did it with Goose and Mariano, heck, the Royals did it last night and tonight with Davis. The WS is over and I wish I was as level headed as Sleek718 but the Mets had great starting pitching and Familia and by and large got the starting pitching but Collins tied Familia's hands behind his back.
 
Sorry guys.

But on the bright side, we're getting pretty close to witnessing a team defy the expectations of most basketball writers and analysts who think we'll suck.
 
While I miss Bobby Ojeda's head nearly combusting on post-game shows that followed games such as this...Nelson Figueroa has been an understated solid analyst. He just made a point about the Harvey decision, and how Collins in his own way had been building Harvey up to do what he did tonight, and I think he is correct. When that shutdown/innings nonsense happened, TC kind of rebuilt Harvey in the image of the very bulldog he tried being tonight. Collins knew what the right call was, but as he said in his post game interview, "trust players"--he wanted it for the kid as much as Matt wanted it for himself.

Tragic, but sweet.

Thank god Mets fans have SNY...best baseball broadcasters in the game. Word.
Click to expand...
. And that is the biggest change in sports as I hit my mid 60's, it has become all about the individual and not team, Terry Collins should have allegiance to 25 guys, not making decisions for any one player. Glad I am in D. C. and didn't see the interview. So we get "Dark Knight trying to be a bulldog crap" and a TEAM, the Royals, celebrate.
 
While I miss Bobby Ojeda's head nearly combusting on post-game shows that followed games such as this...Nelson Figueroa has been an understated solid analyst. He just made a point about the Harvey decision, and how Collins in his own way had been building Harvey up to do what he did tonight, and I think he is correct. When that shutdown/innings nonsense happened, TC kind of rebuilt Harvey in the image of the very bulldog he tried being tonight. Collins knew what the right call was, but as he said in his post game interview, "trust players"--he wanted it for the kid as much as Matt wanted it for himself.

Tragic, but sweet.

Thank god Mets fans have SNY...best baseball broadcasters in the game. Word.
Click to expand...
. And that is the biggest change in sports as I hit my mid 60's, it has become all about the individual and not team, Terry Collins should have allegiance to 25 guys, not making decisions for any one player. Glad I am in D. C. and didn't see the interview. So we get "Dark Knight trying to be a bulldog crap" and a TEAM, the Royals, celebrate.
Click to expand...
. One added thought, what about Familia and his pride, his feelings, as it were. He set the dubious record of most blown saves in a WS with 3, 2 of which imo were on Collins but I guess none of that counts because Familia doesn't walk around with his ego on his sleeve. Harvey pitched a great game tonight, no question, but I guess in the end it was all about Harvey as it seems it always is.
 
While I miss Bobby Ojeda's head nearly combusting on post-game shows that followed games such as this...Nelson Figueroa has been an understated solid analyst. He just made a point about the Harvey decision, and how Collins in his own way had been building Harvey up to do what he did tonight, and I think he is correct. When that shutdown/innings nonsense happened, TC kind of rebuilt Harvey in the image of the very bulldog he tried being tonight. Collins knew what the right call was, but as he said in his post game interview, "trust players"--he wanted it for the kid as much as Matt wanted it for himself.

Tragic, but sweet.

Thank god Mets fans have SNY...best baseball broadcasters in the game. Word.
Click to expand...
. And that is the biggest change in sports as I hit my mid 60's, it has become all about the individual and not team, Terry Collins should have allegiance to 25 guys, not making decisions for any one player. Glad I am in D. C. and didn't see the interview. So we get "Dark Knight trying to be a bulldog crap" and a TEAM, the Royals, celebrate.
Click to expand...
. One added thought, what about Familia and his pride, his feelings, as it were. He set the dubious record of most blown saves in a WS with 3, 2 of which imo were on Collins but I guess none of that counts because Familia doesn't walk around with his ego on his sleeve. Harvey pitched a great game tonight, no question, but I guess in the end it was all about Harvey as it seems it always is.
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Logen, I'm more worried about you at this point than Harvey, TC, or Familia. :)
 
Collins gets it wrong again, he didn't learn anything from last night. Brings Familia in behind the 8 ball again. Great, great game by Harvey but you manage with your head not emotion. Harvey not a complete game pitcher, has decidedly worse stats after 100 pitches, and Familia was arguably your MVP, certainly your stud. Should have been a no brainer.
Click to expand...

You had to atleast let Harvey start the 9th, but after the leadoff walk I would have gotten him out.
I thought Niese was gonna pitch a second inning and was surprised when Reed came in in the 12th.
Click to expand...
. I don't understand the reasoning regarding Harvey at all and I guess that is just a change in sports. In my mind, why do you have to let Harvey start the 9th? You do what's best to win the game, especially a WS elimination game, and that, imo, was Familia. I don't remember a complete game the Mets had all year and after bringing in Familia with no margin for error last night Collins does it again tonight. Frankly, I would have brought him in to start the 8th yesterday and 9th today. Lose with your best, giving your best the best chance to succeed. Yankees did it with Goose and Mariano, heck, the Royals did it last night and tonight with Davis. The WS is over and I wish I was as level headed as Sleek718 but the Mets had great starting pitching and Familia and by and large got the starting pitching but Collins tied Familia's hands behind his back.
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Uhhh Maybe because he was dominating the whole game and he threw only 102 pitches going into the 9th, and starters should be able to throw 115-120 pitches, so I had no prob with him starting the 9th. Stay with the hot hand.
 
While I miss Bobby Ojeda's head nearly combusting on post-game shows that followed games such as this...Nelson Figueroa has been an understated solid analyst. He just made a point about the Harvey decision, and how Collins in his own way had been building Harvey up to do what he did tonight, and I think he is correct. When that shutdown/innings nonsense happened, TC kind of rebuilt Harvey in the image of the very bulldog he tried being tonight. Collins knew what the right call was, but as he said in his post game interview, "trust players"--he wanted it for the kid as much as Matt wanted it for himself.

Tragic, but sweet.

Thank god Mets fans have SNY...best baseball broadcasters in the game. Word.
Click to expand...
. And that is the biggest change in sports as I hit my mid 60's, it has become all about the individual and not team, Terry Collins should have allegiance to 25 guys, not making decisions for any one player. Glad I am in D. C. and didn't see the interview. So we get "Dark Knight trying to be a bulldog crap" and a TEAM, the Royals, celebrate.
Click to expand...
. One added thought, what about Familia and his pride, his feelings, as it were. He set the dubious record of most blown saves in a WS with 3, 2 of which imo were on Collins but I guess none of that counts because Familia doesn't walk around with his ego on his sleeve. Harvey pitched a great game tonight, no question, but I guess in the end it was all about Harvey as it seems it always is.
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Logen, I'm more worried about you at this point than Harvey, TC, or Familia. :)
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. All good, I am just ridiculously, my friends and family might say psychotically, passionate and opinionated. Love the Mets, been a fan since '62 and at the end of the day, certainly loved the season. I just figure if you are there, even as totally unexpected as that was, you might as well win it.
 
Collins gets it wrong again, he didn't learn anything from last night. Brings Familia in behind the 8 ball again. Great, great game by Harvey but you manage with your head not emotion. Harvey not a complete game pitcher, has decidedly worse stats after 100 pitches, and Familia was arguably your MVP, certainly your stud. Should have been a no brainer.
Click to expand...

You had to atleast let Harvey start the 9th, but after the leadoff walk I would have gotten him out.
I thought Niese was gonna pitch a second inning and was surprised when Reed came in in the 12th.
Click to expand...
. I don't understand the reasoning regarding Harvey at all and I guess that is just a change in sports. In my mind, why do you have to let Harvey start the 9th? You do what's best to win the game, especially a WS elimination game, and that, imo, was Familia. I don't remember a complete game the Mets had all year and after bringing in Familia with no margin for error last night Collins does it again tonight. Frankly, I would have brought him in to start the 8th yesterday and 9th today. Lose with your best, giving your best the best chance to succeed. Yankees did it with Goose and Mariano, heck, the Royals did it last night and tonight with Davis. The WS is over and I wish I was as level headed as Sleek718 but the Mets had great starting pitching and Familia and by and large got the starting pitching but Collins tied Familia's hands behind his back.
Click to expand...
.

Uhhh Maybe because he was dominating the whole game and he threw only 102 pitches going into the 9th, and starters should be able to throw 115-120 pitches, so I had no prob with him starting the 9th. Stay with the hot hand.
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. Uhhhh maybe starters should be able to throw 115-120 but Harvey has a track record of losing it after 100. So don't manage to "starters" manage to Harvey. Just to pound the point, Harvey has thrown 115-120 pitches how many times and has how many complete games? Not to mention he was facing the heart of s very talented, relentless lineup. He did his job beautifully, let Familia do his. But no, for whatever reason Collins decided to use an elimination WS game to see if Harvey could go somewhere he'd never been before and it backfired. Terrible managing imo, plain and simple. As with mjmaherjr, we just disagree, no big deal.
 
I've been to about 10-12 games this year including 2 at Wrigley (first time ever in April, and then the pennant clincher), one at Fenway (a shrine to baseball) and 7 at Citifield including 2 playoffs. It's too soon for me to feel good about what this team accomplished after how we went out in the series.

Our starting pitching, considering their age and inexperience are, to a man, tough SOBs who were ready to pitch the biggest games of their lives. Each is worth the price of admission.

The lack of execution was startling. Murphy is so enigmatic - he can make an amazing play, or botch the simplest of ground balls. His Buckner like misplay was just that - the pressure of a close play at first caused him to misplay the ball. The Wilpons must be breathing a sigh of relief to clearly assess how much he is worth, after his NL playoffs for the ages.

Duda's throw to the plate had choke written all over it. Wright did the best he could, and I do believe Flores raced to cover third. An accurate throw gets Hosner easily, but credit to KC for aggressive heads up baseball with little to lose.

Cannot fault Collins one bit for keeping Harvey in, and for me, Harvey showed he is a gamer, and gave it all for the team, against his agent's wishes. Familia was not lights out vs the Royals (credit to them also), so I was all for Harvey coming out for the 9th. If Cespedes doesn't get hurt, a defensive switch may have had him in left and maybe he gets that ball.

Cespedes coming down to earth also helps fairly value him. I like him, and anyone who thinks the Mets lineup is fearsome without him in it is wrong. Power hitters go hot and cold, and his hot was beyond belief. Maybe he's only a 15 million player, and for that range I'd sign him up.

D'Arneau couldn't throw anyone out, and maybe the Met's pitchers had something to do with that. Would Plawecki been a better choice once KC took bases at will?

Credit to the Royals. Their bullpen is far superior to ours, and in this era of 105 pitch outings, that's a huge advantage. The 2006 Mets had a great middle innings corps, but that was decimated to pay for Santana. In this era, I'd sign two closers and pay them like closers, but use them as early as the 7th inning in tandem.

Sad to come this year with an amazing season. I would have been much more content if we played our butts off in the Series only to lose to a better team. There are no moral victories, but at least you can go out and know you played well. Our guys handed the Royals the series with some really messy baseball.

Alderson has a lot of work to do this winter, Congratulations to the Royals. the better team won
 
The royals were the better team and they dreamed of this since last October when they lost. It's not that I got a "happy to be here" vibe from the mets, they played their hearts out, but the royals just seemed way more focused and experienced.

You just gotta hope the mets get back here next season and are like the royals, a determined team looking for redemption. With our pitching staff we have the potential to be back playing October baseball for many seasons in the next few years, hopefully we can take advantage and make it back to the series and win it.
 
I was at the game last night and one of the few people NOT chanting Harvey's name after the 8th. I looked over to my fiance and said "if Terry gets bullied into this, we're screwed." This team made it this far in spite of the manager.

Terry is a fantastic gentleman, but I truly believe the Mets were the better team. Familia let one go in Game 1, but in Games 3 and 5 we put him in the crappiest situations because of Terry's mismanagement.

Some drunk guy before the game came walking out of a women's bathroom while i was waiting. He told me, "Harvey tonight 8 shutout innings!!" I laughed at him. Turns out he knew Harvey's ceiling and sure enough the guy went out there and delivered. What seems more plausible? Harvey extending himself to the 9th and finishing it, which I'm pretty sure he hasn't done all year, or Familia protecting a 2 run lead?

Very proud of this team, but it's going to take a few days to get over what I saw last night and can't help but think we handed it to these guys. Onto next season with a July rotation of deGrom, Syndergaard, Harvey, Matz and Wheeler!!!
 
Best line of the night came from Harold Reynolds as extra innings started, as he observed, quite accurately, that the Mets would need a home run to score, but the Royals would only need a baserunner. Although Collins is no master strategist, the series was won by the more complete team. I can't recall how many times their pitchers were behind 3 and 0 and came back to get outs, as ours were ahead 0 and 2 and gave up a hit or a walk. I don't recall a single infield pop up or foul pop out by the Royals all series. as their great base running, defense, and clutch hitting was all on display. No weak bats in the lineup. The fact that we were ahead into the 8th or 9th in 3 of the 5 games makes me feel pretty upset, even though they outplayed us in every aspect of the game but the long ball. Yet when they needed one in game one, they came through.
With the Dodgers pitching and rising Cubs team, the Mets management better looked to make this team better next season. Middle relief, defense, guys that get on base, speed are all needed.
 
Best line of the night came from Harold Reynolds as extra innings started, as he observed, quite accurately, that the Mets would need a home run to score, but the Royals would only need a baserunner. Although Collins is no master strategist, the series was won by the more complete team. I can't recall how many times their pitchers were behind 3 and 0 and came back to get outs, as ours were ahead 0 and 2 and gave up a hit or a walk. I don't recall a single infield pop up or foul pop out by the Royals all series. as their great base running, defense, and clutch hitting was all on display. No weak bats in the lineup. The fact that we were ahead into the 8th or 9th in 3 of the 5 games makes me feel pretty upset, even though they outplayed us in every aspect of the game but the long ball. Yet when they needed one in game one, they came through.
With the Dodgers pitching and rising Cubs team, the Mets management better looked to make this team better next season. Middle relief, defense, guys that get on base, speed are all needed.
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Losing this series was like being stabbed to death with a bobby pin.
Royals are a good team, but honestly the Mets played terribly and still should have won 3 of the games they lost
 
All in all, I'm still glad my dad made me a New York Mets fan.
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My story is nowhere near as romanticized as yours.

My parents were Italian immigrants who had no idea what baseball was. I just grew up walking distance from Shea. And tickets were cheap in the 70's and 80's.
 
Since chances of signing Harvey long term are slim, trade him to Boston for Xander boegarts play him at ss move Flores to 2nd base. Conforto in left. Still look for a speedy glove for cf if lageres can't improve and heal and or Brandon Nimmo up in mid summer. Travis d'naud may have to learn 1b/3b he's great w staff but it's open track for runners on bases. Degrom Thor Matz Niese and a serviceable 5 starter maybe Bart for 1 more yr. guess it's hot stove now lol
 
Since chances of signing Harvey long term are slim, trade him to Boston for Xander boegarts play him at ss move Flores to 2nd base. Conforto in left. Still look for a speedy glove for cf if lageres can't improve and heal and or Brandon Nimmo up in mid summer. Travis d'naud may have to learn 1b/3b he's great w staff but it's open track for runners on bases. Degrom Thor Matz Niese and a serviceable 5 starter maybe Bart for 1 more yr. guess it's hot stove now lol
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You forgot Wheeler too. I think you keep Harvey and trade him after this year if he wont take extension. Harvey will command a boatload of return so maybe that is your best bet but I want him on staff next year because further away from the surgery I think he will be lights out

Today is a real rough day as a fan
 
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