LoVett Future

Funny.
When Harkless left people were claiming it was not that big a deal because Sampson was better.-He was not.

When Sampson left people were claiming we were better off-We were not.

When we got rid of a coach that took us two 2 NCAA's and 2 NIT's people said we would be better off.- Look we could go 0-32 next year and I won't ever kill the Mullin hiring. But that is mostly because I watched Mullin play here. I don't want Lavin back but still confused by the hatred.

When Jordan and Obekpa left people said good riddance.-Hey there was nothing that could be done about either but we certainly would have been better the last two seasons with those guys.

Some even argued AA over Chris Jones was the right move.-it most certainly was not.

Pretty sure based on our track record here SImon replacing Lovett not going to be a good trade.-Just saying.

I don't remember anyone ever saying that Harkless leaving was no big deal?

WTF was Mullin/St John's supposed to do with Jordan and Obekpa? and this crap answers part of your other question about Lavin.

Might have been other board but I def was arguing Harkless vs Sampson thing vs people. And my point on that is would have been great to have both.

Again not blaming school or Mullin. My point is as FANS not sure why every time someone leaves we are better off?
Purely from fan perspective, which is what we are. Not blaming anyone for anyone leaving. Well Amar vs Jones if that was a choice was a pretty bad one.
 
Funny.
When Harkless left people were claiming it was not that big a deal because Sampson was better.-He was not.

When Sampson left people were claiming we were better off-We were not.

When we got rid of a coach that took us two 2 NCAA's and 2 NIT's people said we would be better off.- Look we could go 0-32 next year and I won't ever kill the Mullin hiring. But that is mostly because I watched Mullin play here. I don't want Lavin back but still confused by the hatred.

When Jordan and Obekpa left people said good riddance.-Hey there was nothing that could be done about either but we certainly would have been better the last two seasons with those guys.

Some even argued AA over Chris Jones was the right move.-it most certainly was not.

Pretty sure based on our track record here SImon replacing Lovett not going to be a good trade.-Just saying.

I don't remember anyone ever saying that Harkless leaving was no big deal?

WTF was Mullin/St John's supposed to do with Jordan and Obekpa? and this crap answers part of your other question about Lavin.

Might have been other board but I def was arguing Harkless vs Sampson thing vs people. And my point on that is would have been great to have both.

Again not blaming school or Mullin. My point is as FANS not sure why every time someone leaves we are better off?
Purely from fan perspective, which is what we are. Not blaming anyone for anyone leaving. Well Amar vs Jones if that was a choice was a pretty bad one.

I agree completely. I think it's a defense mechanism. Some try to cope with a loss by demonizing the former coach or player and convincing themselves we are better off without them when clearly we aren't.
 
Funny.
When Harkless left people were claiming it was not that big a deal because Sampson was better.-He was not.

When Sampson left people were claiming we were better off-We were not.

When we got rid of a coach that took us two 2 NCAA's and 2 NIT's people said we would be better off.- Look we could go 0-32 next year and I won't ever kill the Mullin hiring. But that is mostly because I watched Mullin play here. I don't want Lavin back but still confused by the hatred.

When Jordan and Obekpa left people said good riddance.-Hey there was nothing that could be done about either but we certainly would have been better the last two seasons with those guys.

Some even argued AA over Chris Jones was the right move.-it most certainly was not.

When Slice left people were practically slamming the door on him.-Now I am not a recruiting guru or anything but it seems that his rep was that of a great recruiter. Even if situation had to end this way since school is paying him anyway and everyone was so excited when he came, not sure how he became a bum in one year?

Pretty sure based on our track record here SImon replacing Lovett not going to be a good trade.-Just saying.

Nice WAS
however " methinks" this will just have to
play out
Not sure how truly significant/impactful ML was or could be
Good yes, impactful? well...
Likely will benefit both the young man and his SJU family if he stays,
but as I posted elsewhere:
- Mr.Lovett do what your heart says but do it well once you decide :)
As far as what I as a fan would prefer...let's see...

Don't go, please stay, don't go...
If we got on our knees and begged you to stay...
If we called out your name like a prayer in the night
Would you leave us alone with our tears?
( the Drifters 1961, written by Bob Hillary & Burt Bacharach)

All the best ML
all the best
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.


Good point Austour
However
and not knowing the circumstances
And only wishing ML the best...

room and board
do not put
food on the table,
nor provide the table
in the home,
nor provide
the home for the family
BACK IN THE STATES
room and board
are just
room and board
there
not income for a family...
here
" just saying "

nor does playing
Over There, Over There
allow his family
To watch ML
Over here, Over here

all the best with your decision ML
It's certainly an
Important one
very important but primarily...
For you
:)
 
NBA Draft referenced in his father's basketball training group twitter post

WE WIN WEST

@WeWinWest

@NBADraft will make it's decision on @Marcus_LoVett...not our opinions of him as a student athlete...#sjubbpic.twitter.com/vZO5ETlVR2

12:03 PM - 9 Mar 2017
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.

And in most cases, the club will offset a player's taxes as well, so his salary would essentially be tax-free.

I do believe that Lovett would be able to get a contract around 200k in Europe. I can't fault him whatsoever if he chooses to go get his money. Fact of the matter is, 100k-200k is worth much more than the value of SJU tuition. As a basketball period he has a short period of time to cash in on his talents, and if his family isn't in a great financial situation you can't fault him one bit for wanting to support them. He can go make 6-figures in Europe and save a bit of that money each year and go back to school to get his degree once his playing career is over.

In fact, more and more schools are starting to pledge lifetime scholarships for athletes (its a good recruiting tool). Selfishly I want him to come back but can't at all fault the kid if he wants to go make some actual money which exceeds the value he's getting at SJU.

You qualified "tuition" I'd still say that your college time is a special one that can't be replaced even with some bling and relatively insignificant cash so I think the value proposition is definitely debatable especially in the reality of where most professional athletes end up no matter how much money they make. This from someone that grew up poor OG latchkey kid, and started working when I was 9 years old all the way through high school and 4 years at St Johns. Aside from that, pretty easy to burn through that kind of money especially living abroad and if you have a posse leaching off you.
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.

And in most cases, the club will offset a player's taxes as well, so his salary would essentially be tax-free.

I do believe that Lovett would be able to get a contract around 200k in Europe. I can't fault him whatsoever if he chooses to go get his money. Fact of the matter is, 100k-200k is worth much more than the value of SJU tuition. As a basketball period he has a short period of time to cash in on his talents, and if his family isn't in a great financial situation you can't fault him one bit for wanting to support them. He can go make 6-figures in Europe and save a bit of that money each year and go back to school to get his degree once his playing career is over.

In fact, more and more schools are starting to pledge lifetime scholarships for athletes (its a good recruiting tool). Selfishly I want him to come back but can't at all fault the kid if he wants to go make some actual money which exceeds the value he's getting at SJU.

You qualified "tuition" I'd still say that your college time is a special one that can't be replaced even with some bling and relatively insignificant cash so I think the value proposition is definitely debatable especially in the reality of where most professional athletes end up no matter how much money they make. This from someone that grew up poor OG latchkey kid, and started working when I was 9 years old all the way through high school and 4 years at St Johns. Aside from that, pretty easy to burn through that kind of money especially living abroad and if you have a posse leaching off you.

We just make all of these rational arguments of how college life is so good, and they aren't incorrect. If I had to guess, for a kid who has had academic problems, he may not have a high interest in cracking the books AND playing college bball without a salary. I couldn't imagine trying to play a demanding D1 sport like bball that spans most of 2 semesters AND have to do school work. When I worked at SJU my office was in the Academic Computing Lab. Most basketball players came in at the end of the semester with an entire semester's work of mandatory assignments that had to be handed in. Usually they asked student workers to give them lots of assistance completing them. In my time working there, only one ball player actually came in regularly to do his assignments on his own during the school year.

Yes, 100K for those of us that know doesn't go far. For kids who sometimes come from a life of public assistance, or a single parent who earns far less than that, It sounds like and to some extent is, a fortune. But being a professional basketball player is some far flung exotic place in Europe, Asia, or South America sounds like a really cool deal to kids who have grown up poor. And it is. I do agree that a college degree changes the trajectory for any kid, so for that alone I hope he stays.

I think of guys like Reggie Carter, Frank Gilroy, George Johnson, Rudy Wright, Charles Minlend at their commencements. I saw one or two of them in cap and gown. I think of D'Angelo, Pointer, Greene, and that group at their commencement and can only imagine their ear to ear grins at earning their degrees. I actually feel good for them that there was, is, and will be a better life after basketball partly because of that degree. I hope Lovett is in that group - not for the points and wins he would provide for us along the way, but for him and his family.
 
14 win team possibly loses 2nd best player. I would think that it would be ok to fret over that one. I did not see anyone post we would be doomed. Possible that might be because people thought we already were but still. I don't understand how people could complain about people worrying about Lovett possibly leaving. That is much more understandable then the people saying someone they have never seen before who though highly ranked supposedly can't shoot will be as productive or more than Lovett was.

"I did not see anyone post we would be doomed"

Then you've got some serious reading comprehension issues. Furthermore worrying ain't gonna do jack s _ _ t. So man up, we may not make the tourney next year. But we'll be just fine and will make the NIT IMO. Such is life as a result of CM having inherited arguably one of the worst rosters that any college basketball coach has ever inherited, and just 2 years ago. As for stability that many keep whining about,, stability is a result of having a roster of solid 3-4 year players, both starters and roll players (IE Mussini). Supplemented with one and done type guys. Right now we are still in the re-build stage, and the staff is doing an exceptional job in re-building a program left in shambles by our last few coaching hires. You have to re-build before you can have stability.
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.

And in most cases, the club will offset a player's taxes as well, so his salary would essentially be tax-free.

I do believe that Lovett would be able to get a contract around 200k in Europe. I can't fault him whatsoever if he chooses to go get his money. Fact of the matter is, 100k-200k is worth much more than the value of SJU tuition. As a basketball period he has a short period of time to cash in on his talents, and if his family isn't in a great financial situation you can't fault him one bit for wanting to support them. He can go make 6-figures in Europe and save a bit of that money each year and go back to school to get his degree once his playing career is over.

In fact, more and more schools are starting to pledge lifetime scholarships for athletes (its a good recruiting tool). Selfishly I want him to come back but can't at all fault the kid if he wants to go make some actual money which exceeds the value he's getting at SJU.

You qualified "tuition" I'd still say that your college time is a special one that can't be replaced even with some bling and relatively insignificant cash so I think the value proposition is definitely debatable especially in the reality of where most professional athletes end up no matter how much money they make. This from someone that grew up poor OG latchkey kid, and started working when I was 9 years old all the way through high school and 4 years at St Johns. Aside from that, pretty easy to burn through that kind of money especially living abroad and if you have a posse leaching off you.

We just make all of these rational arguments of how college life is so good, and they aren't incorrect. If I had to guess, for a kid who has had academic problems, he may not have a high interest in cracking the books AND playing college bball without a salary. I couldn't imagine trying to play a demanding D1 sport like bball that spans most of 2 semesters AND have to do school work. When I worked at SJU my office was in the Academic Computing Lab. Most basketball players came in at the end of the semester with an entire semester's work of mandatory assignments that had to be handed in. Usually they asked student workers to give them lots of assistance completing them. In my time working there, only one ball player actually came in regularly to do his assignments on his own during the school year.

Yes, 100K for those of us that know doesn't go far. For kids who sometimes come from a life of public assistance, or a single parent who earns far less than that, It sounds like and to some extent is, a fortune. But being a professional basketball player is some far flung exotic place in Europe, Asia, or South America sounds like a really cool deal to kids who have grown up poor. And it is. I do agree that a college degree changes the trajectory for any kid, so for that alone I hope he stays.

I think of guys like Reggie Carter, Frank Gilroy, George Johnson, Rudy Wright, Charles Minlend at their commencements. I saw one or two of them in cap and gown. I think of D'Angelo, Pointer, Greene, and that group at their commencement and can only imagine their ear to ear grins at earning their degrees. I actually feel good for them that there was, is, and will be a better life after basketball partly because of that degree. I hope Lovett is in that group - not for the points and wins he would provide for us along the way, but for him and his family.

If I remember correctly, Carl Beckett came here as a prop 48 kid and wound up leaving with a Master's degree. Lets not forget Rob Thomas. Having said that, the window for making money playing ball is short. The opportunity to get a college degree is always there, as Walter showed when he went back and got his years later. So I get it.
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.

And in most cases, the club will offset a player's taxes as well, so his salary would essentially be tax-free.

I do believe that Lovett would be able to get a contract around 200k in Europe. I can't fault him whatsoever if he chooses to go get his money. Fact of the matter is, 100k-200k is worth much more than the value of SJU tuition. As a basketball period he has a short period of time to cash in on his talents, and if his family isn't in a great financial situation you can't fault him one bit for wanting to support them. He can go make 6-figures in Europe and save a bit of that money each year and go back to school to get his degree once his playing career is over.

In fact, more and more schools are starting to pledge lifetime scholarships for athletes (its a good recruiting tool). Selfishly I want him to come back but can't at all fault the kid if he wants to go make some actual money which exceeds the value he's getting at SJU.

You qualified "tuition" I'd still say that your college time is a special one that can't be replaced even with some bling and relatively insignificant cash so I think the value proposition is definitely debatable especially in the reality of where most professional athletes end up no matter how much money they make. This from someone that grew up poor OG latchkey kid, and started working when I was 9 years old all the way through high school and 4 years at St Johns. Aside from that, pretty easy to burn through that kind of money especially living abroad and if you have a posse leaching off you.

Paul from everything that I've heard and read, Marcus's Dad is very involved in every aspect of his life. I'd like to think that would help keep the leeches at a distance, but ya never know since leeches can be very resourceful. As for the college experience, I think it's different for every kid. I attended school in the morning and worked a 40 hours + per week, afternoons and weekends. So for me, it wasn't much of a college experience. I looked at college a means to an end. I have no clue what Marcus feels about his college experience. Since he's older than most kids, maybe he's not all about the college experience, and more about finding the best route to make a living. I know at 21 years old, I was very anxious to be done with college and start making some real money. Just saying that it's different for everyone.
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.

And in most cases, the club will offset a player's taxes as well, so his salary would essentially be tax-free.

I do believe that Lovett would be able to get a contract around 200k in Europe. I can't fault him whatsoever if he chooses to go get his money. Fact of the matter is, 100k-200k is worth much more than the value of SJU tuition. As a basketball period he has a short period of time to cash in on his talents, and if his family isn't in a great financial situation you can't fault him one bit for wanting to support them. He can go make 6-figures in Europe and save a bit of that money each year and go back to school to get his degree once his playing career is over.

In fact, more and more schools are starting to pledge lifetime scholarships for athletes (its a good recruiting tool). Selfishly I want him to come back but can't at all fault the kid if he wants to go make some actual money which exceeds the value he's getting at SJU.

You qualified "tuition" I'd still say that your college time is a special one that can't be replaced even with some bling and relatively insignificant cash so I think the value proposition is definitely debatable especially in the reality of where most professional athletes end up no matter how much money they make. This from someone that grew up poor OG latchkey kid, and started working when I was 9 years old all the way through high school and 4 years at St Johns. Aside from that, pretty easy to burn through that kind of money especially living abroad and if you have a posse leaching off you.

Paul from everything that I've heard and read, Marcus's Dad is very involved in every aspect of his life. I'd like to think that would help keep the leeches at a distance, but ya never know since leeches can be very resourceful. As for the college experience, I think it's different for every kid. I attended school in the morning and worked a 40 hours + per week, afternoons and weekends. So for me, it wasn't much of a college experience. I looked at college a means to an end. I have no clue what Marcus feels about his college experience. Since he's older than most kids, maybe he's not all about the college experience, and more about finding the best route to make a living. I know at 21 years old, I was very anxious to be done with college and start making some real money. Just saying that it's different for everyone.

It is a good plan to make $$$ while you have the opportunity because things get happen then you won't have the chance College use to be a means to an end but things have changed.yes, you can do things fist and say I will go back to school and finish however most do not. You weigh the$$$ your situation and your talent You can go outside the USA but your life would change and if you where not making a boat load of money it would not be so good Family and friends would be tweeting ,letters etc Now if you know you can play a yr overseas and then you have a better chance to go NBA that great. But if your skills are close to NBA i say stay in school ,improve (if not at your current school then find another) then go for it,Don,t be a fool stay in a usa school
 
14 win team possibly loses 2nd best player. I would think that it would be ok to fret over that one. I did not see anyone post we would be doomed. Possible that might be because people thought we already were but still. I don't understand how people could complain about people worrying about Lovett possibly leaving. That is much more understandable then the people saying someone they have never seen before who though highly ranked supposedly can't shoot will be as productive or more than Lovett was.

"I did not see anyone post we would be doomed"

Then you've got some serious reading comprehension issues. Furthermore worrying ain't gonna do jack s _ _ t. So man up, we may not make the tourney next year. But we'll be just fine and will make the NIT IMO. Such is life as a result of CM having inherited arguably one of the worst rosters that any college basketball coach has ever inherited, and just 2 years ago. As for stability that many keep whining about,, stability is a result of having a roster of solid 3-4 year players, both starters and roll players (IE Mussini). Supplemented with one and done type guys. Right now we are still in the re-build stage, and the staff is doing an exceptional job in re-building a program left in shambles by our last few coaching hires. You have to re-build before you can have stability.

Exactly. I hope next year can bring a tourney appearance, but I am still looking at 2018-2019 as a measuring stick for the CM era. I, too, place high value on 3-4 year players. When you have adult bodies on the floor, it makes a big difference. Ponds is truly remarkable. He is essentially impacting BE games with a high school body (rare).
 
Thanks to the NCAA for robbing us of a year.

We would have sucked last year with or without Marcus, and he may have left after last year. And then we may have sucked this year too. So in some warped way, the NCAA may have helped us by declaring ineligible last year.

Look Marcus is a good player but to be honest if he left we could find a better replacement. He has not really been consistent, last 3 games he disappeared ,he is undersized yes he is fast but in this league you saw what happened to both of our guards trying to drive against talented big teams they did not finish or where blocked Simon and and ponds would seem to compliment each other
How can we say we are a very good shooting team when we shot poorly against GT and badly against Nova Looking back at this season it was pure frustration in our ability to defend we ran around a lot not being able to pick for players our shot selection was not even satisfactory success would have been to beat teams we were suppose too like LIU and to play teams close we were on too many lopsided loses and the way we played against Nova says little to argue a successful season

I do not think it likely we would find a better replacement -- at least not in the short term. I totally get the mentality that when one of our players leave early, we focus on the player's negatives and try to remain optimistic about the future.

I for one think Lovett was, for the most part, very good this year and believe he could develop into a terrific player with experience and a better surrounding cast.

I don't think there is any way to sugar coat it -- his loss would be a significant blow to the program. I understand that transfers and early departures are commonplace in today's college basketball landscape, but as several posters have pointed out, this program craves some modicum of stability.

At this moment, we simply don't have the talent and depth to replace the early departure of one of our best players. We need to catch a break sooner or later. Very much hoping Mr. Lovett returns.

No offense to Marcus, but when you recruit a kid who has moved around and played for 3-4 different high schools, stability is not really on the table.
 
14 win team possibly loses 2nd best player. I would think that it would be ok to fret over that one. I did not see anyone post we would be doomed. Possible that might be because people thought we already were but still. I don't understand how people could complain about people worrying about Lovett possibly leaving. That is much more understandable then the people saying someone they have never seen before who though highly ranked supposedly can't shoot will be as productive or more than Lovett was.

"I did not see anyone post we would be doomed"

Then you've got some serious reading comprehension issues. Furthermore worrying ain't gonna do jack s _ _ t. So man up, we may not make the tourney next year. But we'll be just fine and will make the NIT IMO. Such is life as a result of CM having inherited arguably one of the worst rosters that any college basketball coach has ever inherited, and just 2 years ago. As for stability that many keep whining about,, stability is a result of having a roster of solid 3-4 year players, both starters and roll players (IE Mussini). Supplemented with one and done type guys. Right now we are still in the re-build stage, and the staff is doing an exceptional job in re-building a program left in shambles by our last few coaching hires. You have to re-build before you can have stability.

Exactly. I hope next year can bring a tourney appearance, but I am still looking at 2018-2019 as a measuring stick for the CM era. I, too, place high value on 3-4 year players. When you have adult bodies on the floor, it makes a big difference. Ponds is truly remarkable. He is essentially impacting BE games with a high school body (rare).

In 2018-2019 we will be talking about 2021-2022 "BEING OUR SEASON".
3-4 year players are great if they have ability. Mussin , RF, Amar in 4 years are still going to be Mussini, RF and Amar. Some guys it takes time but there has to be a skill level there to begin with.
 
Thanks to the NCAA for robbing us of a year.

We would have sucked last year with or without Marcus, and he may have left after last year. And then we may have sucked this year too. So in some warped way, the NCAA may have helped us by declaring ineligible last year.

Look Marcus is a good player but to be honest if he left we could find a better replacement. He has not really been consistent, last 3 games he disappeared ,he is undersized yes he is fast but in this league you saw what happened to both of our guards trying to drive against talented big teams they did not finish or where blocked Simon and and ponds would seem to compliment each other
How can we say we are a very good shooting team when we shot poorly against GT and badly against Nova Looking back at this season it was pure frustration in our ability to defend we ran around a lot not being able to pick for players our shot selection was not even satisfactory success would have been to beat teams we were suppose too like LIU and to play teams close we were on too many lopsided loses and the way we played against Nova says little to argue a successful season

I do not think it likely we would find a better replacement -- at least not in the short term. I totally get the mentality that when one of our players leave early, we focus on the player's negatives and try to remain optimistic about the future.

I for one think Lovett was, for the most part, very good this year and believe he could develop into a terrific player with experience and a better surrounding cast.

I don't think there is any way to sugar coat it -- his loss would be a significant blow to the program. I understand that transfers and early departures are commonplace in today's college basketball landscape, but as several posters have pointed out, this program craves some modicum of stability.

At this moment, we simply don't have the talent and depth to replace the early departure of one of our best players. We need to catch a break sooner or later. Very much hoping Mr. Lovett returns.

No offense to Marcus, but when you recruit a kid who has moved around and played for 3-4 different high schools, stability is not really on the table.

And Mullin took a shot on him because he realized we need talented players to go with the Mussini's and Amar's of the world.
 
the other side of this is that when you are traveling your nut is bigger. So $100k (assuming you make that much) may sound like a lot to a 19 year old, figure in your expenses and it may not be. Play in Korea and make $100k and you won't even be able to get a tiny apartment (to RENT) without a huge down payment. Heck in Silicon Valley you have $100k annual and you are eating ramen every night.

Everyone talks about not begrudging kids from making a paycheck but a paycheck is there for the rest of your life and most of these kids that are the rare exceptions to make a big paycheck are too immature to hold on to it. For most playing overseas won't get them enough income to change their life or their extended families. College is a good life and 4 years to live in a bubble of fun, learning and security. You can grow and become a better version of yourself. Professional is dog eat dog forever no turning back. You have kids and the NCAA is screwing you. OK go get a paycheck. If you don't, enjoy college life for as long as you can.

Just to point out that most overseas professional teams provide room and some if not all board expenses in addition to salary.


Good point Austour
However
and not knowing the circumstances
And only wishing ML the best...

room and board
do not put
food on the table,
:)

Hope you don't mind the edit so we can keep to point. True but room and board, plus the tax relief Theo mentioned, extend the value of your salary. If you make $100-200K AND do not have to worry about shelter, sustenance or taxes you have even more to share with family members who might need assistance.
 
I'd like to have Marcus back.

That said, if he decided to go pro, it would present an opportunity to put a bigger guard next to Ponds, which would not be the worst thing in the world. It's tough playing D with two six-footers in the backcourt. Also Ponds and Lovett have not seemed to develop any chemistry on the floor, too often it is either/or in terms of one of them having a big game. If the 2nd guard was not quite as ball-dominant as Ponds and Lovett both are, that wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.

Just saying.

Great post and agree.

As often the case don't see either of the extremes being discussed coming in here. Sky is not falling for the reasons you noted. Thought Ponds and Lovett were really playing off each other around the time of the @Prov, Marq, SHU wins (if I recall both were exceptional in all 3 games). Seemed to get off track from there and the either/or dynamic you noted was particularly noticeable last few games. Don't think there's anything there, just a matter of styles that may not always naturally be in sync. Add in the size and defense considerations and easy to see how we can still continue to get better even if Marcus leaves.

But I also don't think it makes sense to just completely rationalize just how fine we'll be, which is why I obviously agree with you would like to have him back. He averaged 16, 4, and 3 on 46/38/80 shooting and was one of the 4 best freshmen in the conference. It's one of the best and most efficient seasons from SJU guard in the last 15 years, and one of the only better seasons was his backcourt mate this year, also a freshman. We are not at a point as a program where we can afford to be remotely this selective. To the contrary we are at a point where we continue to need a massive talent upgrade (won 14 games). I think Simon and Clark are really going to help in this regard (I'm probably higher on both than average), but even with them both being the guys I think they are we still have a ways to go. Losing a player who as a first year player just put up one of the best seasons we've seen at his position for this program in almost 2 decades is unlikely to be helpful to that effort.

Part of the problem with SJU since about 2000 is that we are in a majority of years it seems talking the following season hinging materially on players who have not yet suited up for SJU. While this doesn't have to be a problem in a single year (and next year might be one of those) on a year over year basis it's a fundamental issue. So it would be nice for a change of pace to be looking forward to a season hinging on players we have seen, and that we expect to improve, not only individually but as a collective unit because they've been through at least one season together.

This is not an alien occurrence for other teams and is in some cases the norm even in the fluid landscape of college hoops. Think we've almost come to expect this not to be the case because we've gotten so used to it. At some point would be great to start reversing that a bit and a backcourt that, as sophomores, has a chance to be the best in the conference and one of the best in the country might be a decent place to start, even if we'll be ok if it doesn't happen.
 
Rumor on JJ that Mussini is leaving. I could live w 1 loss, but both would leave us short handed at the guard position. Obviously would rather have Lovett. But I like Mussini coming off the bench.
 
Rumor on JJ that Mussini is leaving. I could live w 1 loss, but both would leave us short handed at the guard position. Obviously would rather have Lovett. But I like Mussini coming off the bench.

That would be unfortunate. Hard worker, good teammate and potentially a great role player.
 
Rumor on JJ that Mussini is leaving. I could live w 1 loss, but both would leave us short handed at the guard position. Obviously would rather have Lovett. But I like Mussini coming off the bench.

Other than Monte being heart broken that would have zero effect on anything else.
 
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