Lavin's Body Of Work At SJU

I have been a big fan of Lavin and another season with no NCAA bid will not change that. However, if I'm the AD, he's on a very short leash at this point. Lavin needs to come up wth a plan for the future, and it can't be more of the same.

How is he going to balance the roster so that we are not left with zero returning starters in a given year? How is he going to win the recruiting battles for kids who are eligible and fully vett the ones with questionable eligibility? How is he going to improve on filling all of the pieces of a roster that a Big East caliber team require rather than throwing the best 5 athletes on the floor and hope for the best. How is he going to do a better job to keep his players disciplined, focused, level-headed on and off the court? If he holds accountable for the past and current results and has a plan to improve and it's believable, I'd give him an extension.

You can make it all about the numbers and tournament appearances and such. Can't forget, however, that this is a game of inches and it is only by inches that he has missed on the goals that a reasonable would fan would have set. A couple of close losses last year cost us the NCAA's. A matter of a few baskets. Looks like this year, could be the same thing. And it's not all on Lavin. He's not the one missing wide open 3's, layups, and free throws. Things could have and should have gone very differently for Lavin. Wish him and the players the best down the stretch. They really deserve to catch a break or two and get into the NCAA's.
 
I have been a big fan of Lavin and another season with no NCAA bid will not change that. However, if I'm the AD, he's on a very short leash at this point. Lavin needs to come up wth a plan for the future, and it can't be more of the same.

How is he going to balance the roster so that we are not left with zero returning starters in a given year? How is he going to win the recruiting battles for kids who are eligible and fully vett the ones with questionable eligibility? How is he going to improve on filling all of the pieces of a roster that a Big East caliber team require rather than throwing the best 5 athletes on the floor and hope for the best. How is he going to do a better job to keep his players disciplined, focused, level-headed on and off the court? If he holds accountable for the past and current results and has a plan to improve and it's believable, I'd give him an extension.

You can make it all about the numbers and tournament appearances and such. Can't forget, however, that this is a game of inches and it is only by inches that he has missed on the goals that a reasonable would fan would have set. A couple of close losses last year cost us the NCAA's. A matter of a few baskets. Looks like this year, could be the same thing. And it's not all on Lavin. He's not the one missing wide open 3's, layups, and free throws. Things could have and should have gone very differently for Lavin. Wish him and the players the best down the stretch. They really deserve to catch a break or two and get into the NCAA's.
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Will he get an ncaa appearance with his own recruits after year? No, unless some miracle run happens in the conf tourny.
Who cares how close he came, or if this or that happened.

The bottom line is, no ncaa appearance since coaching another coaches recruits.
 
I have been a big fan of Lavin and another season with no NCAA bid will not change that. However, if I'm the AD, he's on a very short leash at this point. Lavin needs to come up wth a plan for the future, and it can't be more of the same.

How is he going to balance the roster so that we are not left with zero returning starters in a given year? How is he going to win the recruiting battles for kids who are eligible and fully vett the ones with questionable eligibility? How is he going to improve on filling all of the pieces of a roster that a Big East caliber team require rather than throwing the best 5 athletes on the floor and hope for the best. How is he going to do a better job to keep his players disciplined, focused, level-headed on and off the court? If he holds accountable for the past and current results and has a plan to improve and it's believable, I'd give him an extension.

You can make it all about the numbers and tournament appearances and such. Can't forget, however, that this is a game of inches and it is only by inches that he has missed on the goals that a reasonable would fan would have set. A couple of close losses last year cost us the NCAA's. A matter of a few baskets. Looks like this year, could be the same thing. And it's not all on Lavin. He's not the one missing wide open 3's, layups, and free throws. Things could have and should have gone very differently for Lavin. Wish him and the players the best down the stretch. They really deserve to catch a break or two and get into the NCAA's.
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The SJU admin isn't here to make Lavin a better coach. Provide him with the right tools, including budgeting enough for a good staff, yes. But he is what he is as a coach. All of the questions you raise should have been addressed when Lavin interviewed for the job.

As for the near misses leading to no NCAA, that's an excuse that losing programs make. You don't have to be that special to make the dance. It should not come down to blaming a few bad bounces or bad calls by the refs. Not when you are spending big money on your head coach and staff.

What bothers me is Lavin's failure to bring in the right pieces, and his inability to mine the high schools or junior colleges for the type of players that can succeed at the college level. To you really have to fly to Europe to find a guy like Amar? You couldn't find someone with a similar skill set here? In his last 3 recruiting classes, you have had less Big East capable recruits that you had academic issues or suspensions. He is not at UCLA anymore. We need a coach that can both find and sign top 100 talent, but also find the gems that make your roster complete. You need a balanced team built for today's college game.
 
Truth: We have had two years of nearly every announcer and analyst declaring our roster as one of the most talented in the Big East.

Truth: We have nothing to show for that.

Hoping for change........
 
Some decent individual talent recruited. Poor progress. Unfocused coaching, no team concept developed. Thin bench not developed. Questionable recruiting efforts & candidates attracted.
 
I could imagine Lavin as a kid trying to build a model airplane, or better yet a fighter plane. He would just use the long and sleek wings, but no tail or fuselage. Then he would order more wings, but no machine guns to mount to the front of the plane, meaning no ability to shoot. Then he and all around him couldn't figure out how those 5 beautiful wings could not be put together to build a complete model plane like all the other kids had.
 
I could imagine Lavin as a kid trying to build a model airplane, or better yet a fighter plane. He would just use the long and sleek wings, but no tail or fuselage. Then he would order more wings, but no machine guns to mount to the front of the plane, meaning no ability to shoot. Then he and all around him couldn't figure out how those 5 beautiful wings could not be put together to build a complete model plane like all the other kids had.
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You mock his model building skills, but neglect to mention that his friend's goldfish had recently died and been flushed down the loo. How can anyone be expected to perform while under that sort of stress? Plus his baby teeth had just fallen out. Also, you left out the part where he wrote a fawning letter to his mentor Buzz Aldrin asking for advice about how to apply the decals and also the part where he asked Eddie Rickenbacker to be his wing man at the junior prom.
 
I could imagine Lavin as a kid trying to build a model airplane, or better yet a fighter plane. He would just use the long and sleek wings, but no tail or fuselage. Then he would order more wings, but no machine guns to mount to the front of the plane, meaning no ability to shoot. Then he and all around him couldn't figure out how those 5 beautiful wings could not be put together to build a complete model plane like all the other kids had.
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I thought the Thomas and ADR signings were hints that Lavin had accepted that you can't play in the Big East when every opponent looks at your lineup and asks 'Where's the beef?" Given the 2010-11 success with a roster that included Burrell and Brownlee and Sean Evans and Dele Coker, the fact that Keady was the master of using bigs as picks and screens, and the fact that his UCLA teams would get beat in the tournament buy teams that could both run and bang, I had hope that change was coming. Perhaps we shall see, perhaps not. It would have been nice to see D'LO and Sheed playing with a solid post player with good hands who could make a layup.
 
I could imagine Lavin as a kid trying to build a model airplane, or better yet a fighter plane. He would just use the long and sleek wings, but no tail or fuselage. Then he would order more wings, but no machine guns to mount to the front of the plane, meaning no ability to shoot. Then he and all around him couldn't figure out how those 5 beautiful wings could not be put together to build a complete model plane like all the other kids had.
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I thought the Thomas and ADR signings were hints that Lavin had accepted that you can't play in the Big East when every opponent looks at your lineup and asks 'Where's the beef?" Given the 2010-11 success with a roster that included Burrell and Brownlee and Sean Evans and Dele Coker, the fact that Keady was the master of using bigs as picks and screens, and the fact that his UCLA teams would get beat in the tournament buy teams that could both run and bang, I had hope that change was coming. Perhaps we shall see, perhaps not. It would have been nice to see D'LO and Sheed playing with a solid post player with good hands who could make a layup.
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A true point guard and a 2 and 3 that can nail threes. You need those in the toolbox. Lavin has to know that. I don't know what the ADR signing had to do with anything. Besides the fact that someone on the staff should be able to figure out eligibility, who watched this kid all summer? Has he lost weight since practice began? I don't know if Lavin provides for a country club environment, although it does seem at times that the inmates run the asylum.
 
The body of work is just about complete. I don't think we need to see more. Rest of SEASON?
For me, whatever happens will not change my opinions . Many of you feel differently, which is ok too.

Lavin was brought here because he was a Name, from UCLA AND ESPN. We needed to make a splash after NORM and Lavin, obviously wanted back in to Coaching and for what we would pay him, why not?

The ink was barely dry before our UCLA BRETHERN AND cistern, told us to be wary of Lavin and his whole Coaching persona and his tenure there. Most of us, me included chalked that up to sour grapes and still holding onto their Legendary years, etc.

When Lavin delivered his first recruiting class with DLO, HARkLESS, Greene, Garrett, Sampson, Pelle, Pointer, Lindsay we were in heaven, after so many year's of Norm's failure in landing a top recruit. The UCLA rumors were totally vanquished at that point.

First inkling of the trouble began to emerge , when Sampson, Garrett, Pelle all failed to qualify and Lindsay quit after a few games in the out of conference schedule. So the hoopla associated with this class was already muted by their not initially arriving as planned. Questions were raised by some, at the time, or, at least eyebrows, by thinking what type of players was Lavin recruiting if they weren't ready for college. And, it wasn't just 1 suspect recruit, it was 4 counting Lindsay.

The 20O9-10 season resulted in our only NCAA BID in this Century but, it was done with Norm's players, not Lavin's. Little did we know, this was to be the high water mark of Steve's SJU career. It has all gone hopelessly downhill since, culminating in this year's False contender status.

Many of us got fandom disease of actually thinking it had all come together when our 11-1 start resulted in a top 15 ranking. It was all FOOL'S GOLD though as soon as the BE Conference schedule began with a loss to Seton Hall.

The deficiencies of the past , with these players surfaced and most opponents took pinpoint advantage. exposing our team, as 5 players not suited to playing together because of the type of athlete Lavin covets. Poor skilled at fundamentals and seemingly incapable of adjusting to other team's strategies , which is part Coaching and part their own shortcomings. All of which have been blatantly revealed over Lavin's tenure.

Throw in a Soap Opera script capable of afternoon TV , with player suspensions, benchings, transfers, mysterious and unexplained disappearance and, this week, on Court Thuggery by a repeat offender.

It's really quite enough for any decision maker to step up and say so long, Steve.
Lavin wasn't brought here, at this compensation to deliver a career losing record in the BE and, nary a NCAA BID, WITH HIS HAND PICKED PLAYERS.

I admire those who continue to express boundless optimism that the Ship can be righted 1/2 way thru the BE season. A realistic assessment of a 8th place team at 3-6 currently may be too bitter a fact that many can't accept.
This is a flawed constructed and ineptly Coached Team. It won't change in the 11th hour or, in the BE tournament. It may get worse.

Some worry potential new RECRUITS currently uncommitted will shy away if Lavin isn't retained. It's a needless worry however, as most incoming players will decommit or, ask for a release if the existing COACH is let go. We can get other players with a new COACH, DON'T WORRY.

And, the sad fact still remains, with evidence abounding, even if STEVE got all Cal's incoming class, he still doesn't have the ability to Coach Success. It's all now, a complete resume for him.


Lavin has not accomplished any results that justify continuing, at best, a below mediocre career.
Many lament, St JOHN'S will not get anyone capable of returning our Program to its' storied past. I SAY NONSENSE.

Butler turned their poor first season in the BE to this year contending for the regular season title.Providence, long a BE doormat has won a BE Championship and is contending again this year.. Butler doing it, with a interim Coach, just promoted to Head Coach. They may be the best Coached team in the CONFERENCE.
So, don't despair REDMEN fans, we can get a excellent COACH HERE. And, the Program is fixable, with the right leadership at the top. It just isn't STEVE.

Who knows if Shaka Smart would take our job, or not? And, how about Billy Donavan? Things change over time.. He is having a trying year in Gainesville and competing against Cal has to be getting tiresome for him. And, what about , either of the Hurley Bros? No one can tell me, either would not get top tier kids from the Metro AREA. Even, maybe some from New Jersey? ha.

This University is capable of paying what is necessary to get a decent COACH, regardless of all the hand ringing some bean counters on here think. We came up with $2 million for Lavin, didn't we?

So, let's look for a new tomorrow for St JOHN'S BASKETBALL. THANK YOU.
 
Steve Lavin has won just ONE Big East Tournament game since taking over at St. John's. As we know, that one win was with Norm Robert's recruits. Steve Lavin has never one a Big East Tournament game with his recruits.

Five years ago, as the top recruits were rolling in, I simply never would have believed this.

Just as an aside, Norm won two BE Tournament games with his recruits. That's double Lavin's total! Relax.....I am not saying Norm was better. Just saying, Lavin's results have been seriously anemic.

Are we REALLY considering another year with him?
 
Steve Lavin has won just ONE Big East Tournament game since taking over at St. John's. As we know, that one win was with Norm Robert's recruits. Steve Lavin has never one a Big East Tournament game with his recruits.

Five years ago, as the top recruits were rolling in, I simply never would have believed this.

Just as an aside, Norm won two BE Tournament games with his recruits. That's double Lavin's total! Relax.....I am not saying Norm was better. Just saying, Lavin's results have been seriously anemic.

Are we REALLY considering another year with him?
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It depends on who "we" is. If the posters had a vote, and it was majority rule, probably no. But like most decisions of this sort, money is a factor. How much to buy Lavin out? How much to get a coach that can do better? How much does the program, or could the program generate in additional revenue to justify paying a sure thing? My guess is you will see Lavin back next year. If he gets Diallo, then I would call it a sure thing. What's the late signing period? April? We should know something right about then.
 
I'd like to hear some posters' theories about Lavin. Do you think he was always lazy, and simply busted his butt the first year so he could coast the rest of the contract? Or did something change with him, possibly after the cancer? Is he not actually lazy, but just doesn't care enough about local players? Or something else entirely?
 
I'd like to hear some posters' theories about Lavin. Do you think he was always lazy, and simply busted his butt the first year so he could coast the rest of the contract? Or did something change with him, possibly after the cancer? Is he not actually lazy, but just doesn't care enough about local players? Or something else entirely?
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I think he busted his ass the first year up to the point he got cancer. I think he tried to come back to early and it fucked him up. I think other teams totally took advantage of that recruiting. I think he lost his right hand man to the nba coaching and maybe too much self confidence hurt him in replacing dunlap. I think Lavin had too much self confidence and thought basically he would pick up recruit wise how he left off but got out hustled for guys. I won't say lazy because I don't know what happens day to day. i think he thought last year he thought the team would be real good and didn't anticipate sucking.

Let me say one thing while admittedly I don't know what goes in day to day and whether he is doing enough work ( the numbers speak for themselves ) I will say I don't blame him for his sunday routine which people malign him for because we'd all BS to say he should work 24/7 the reality is not one person here does and god knows my own career isn't healthy and is the cause of my own sleep problems because I am always thinking about the markets and different scenarios and quite honestly it;s way too unhealthy for me so if he finds balance by spending sundays doing yoga or spending time with his wife then I fully support that.

But the bottom line is results and thats what he is getting paid for no matter how much of a good guy he is.

I hope we turn it around or it better be a monster class coming in next year
 
I'd like to hear some posters' theories about Lavin. Do you think he was always lazy, and simply busted his butt the first year so he could coast the rest of the contract? Or did something change with him, possibly after the cancer? Is he not actually lazy, but just doesn't care enough about local players? Or something else entirely?
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I think he cared the first 3 years, then him and staff got lazy last year for some reason. This year with one year left he knows that he has to recruit.
 
I think his notoriety from ESPN helped him immensely his first year. After he got sick, he unfortunately lost some of his cache. Then when the team didn't win, things started to snowball. I think he could turn around the recruiting if we can win but It is going to be tough this year and will be difficult next year as well. Not sure what the solution is.
 
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