Jordan Status?

[beast of the east]

Are any of you bashers ever going to learn your lesson and stop destroying our "kids" any chance you get. The same people were ready to give up on D'Lo, Obekpa, the 4th, SirDom. It has to be exhausting jumping on and off the bandwagon so often. Everyone was disappointed that we lost Jordan for a game and possibly more but some of the "fans" go way too far attacking our own players. We didn't have all the information but we knew his grandmother passed away. Have a little respect. They are just college kids for goodness sake, whether they stay or not they put in a lot more work and passion for SJU than it will ever give back to them.

I'm sorry but nonsense; if Jordan left for a game because his grandmother died, say it and EVERYONE would accept it and move on. But when the coach doesn't even know when he will return because he doesn't have enough info, people fill in the blanks. I don't know Jordan but anyone who has any real insight into the program knows this kid has been high drama, high maintenance since he came here. Your Pollyanish last sentence is almost comical; while some are, some are not just college kids - it is nothing more than a temporary stop until they can turn pro. Sampson last year sabotaged our season because by the time he decided to play a team game and not just look out for his own future all the advantages of early practice and the Europe trip had already been derailed. I feel for Jordan, but you don't solve your problems by going about it the way he is apparently handling them. Welcome him back, I don't - this has become too much a recurring theme from him. I do acknowledge the positive in him returning for Harrison, Greene, Pointer, and Branch; they do deserve it.

First off you make it sound like we have the right to know what goes on behind the scenes of this program. We do not. We are fans....no more and no less.

Secondly, where do you get off saying that they should and need to announce that the reason for him taking a break was the death of his grandmother? The death of a family member is a very personal and private thing, and should be treated as such, unless otherwise noted by the individual.

But you are right, I can't believe that Lavin and Jordan weren't thinking about how the posters on redmen.com would react with only having such little knowledge of the situation. Shame on them!!

Lavin didn't say too much because he, like Jordan, didn't really know what was going on or when/if Jordan would return. I'm sure Lavin didn't sit down with Jordan and be like, "Rysheed, I'm really sorry to hear about your grandmother........so when do you think you will be back with the team?" If it's one thing we know about Lavin it's this: he genuinely cares about his team, not just as basketball players, but as people as well. So the conversation was probably more like, "I'm sorry to hear about your grandmother, please take all the time you need and let me know if there is anything I can do for you and your family."

And his return probably was up in the air. Everyone reacts differently to situations such as these, and I'm sure the last thing on Jordan's mind was basketball....

I'm sorry, but to be upset that Lavin and Jordan didn't make a public announcement regarding the death of a family member is just downright rude and disrespectful.

Look, you are entitled to your opinion and you are obviously a Lavin supporter big time; you have every right to be. But IMO you have an excuse and rationalization for every incident this program endures, again your take. But when a prominent member of a high profile (as you like to say the 15th ranked team in the country) program cannot play there is a length of absence and reason given; injury, personal reasons, etc. None of that was available for whatever reason; in fact Lavin was quite forthcoming in that he didn't have enough "info" to even speculate on a return. Not Jordan has serious personal issues that leave his return open-ended, the COACH didn't even have enough information about what was going on to even speculate on a return. Now, miraculously, Jordan is returning after a one game absence; by the way, not the first time this has happened with this player. I manage a large group of people and one thing I always tell my staff is that if you do not communicate clearly people will fill in the blanks according to their take on the situation. So, while I agree Lavin and Jordan did not have to announce ALL the facts they certainly should have provided way more insight into what was going on then they did. Again, you take any and all individual incidents and rationalize them away and criticize those who choose to look at the larger, cumulative picture. And the cumulative number of negatives associated with Lavin's tenure speaks for itself. The ridiculously, embarrasingly lack of legitimate D1 players on this roster speaks for itself. The prospects for next year in which we may not even field an even marginally representative team speaks for itself. You have your opinion of my position and I have one concerning yours. I believe mine is developed examining facts and reality over the last 4 years, yours with blind loyalty all the while hoping for a fairy tale ending..

Logen,

The lack of legitimate D1 players on this team? We are a top 25 team. How is that possible if there is a lack of talent on this team?

I do, however, agree with you that communication is important, and that people will fill in the blanks (by the way, they are going to do that regardless). If Lavin had said that Jordan was out due to the death of a family member, rumors would have started to flow how he was going to transfer home to be closer to family. People are going to talk either way, that's just the nature of the beast.

You also stated that you manage a group of people, and you emphasize the importance of communication. If someone on your staff is terminated, do you make a public announcement and/or hold a press conference? Probably not. Why? Because it doesn't concern anyone else. But I'm guessing that you communicate internally to make sure the rest of your staff is aware of the situation.

Here is another example. Rex Ryan was fired from the Jets (as well as their GM...I'm not a Jets fan, so I can't think of his name). Did the owners give an exact reason as to why they were terminated, or was it more of a generic statement such as "we feel that it is in the best interest of our organization to part ways with Coach Ryan"?

There are no stakeholders in SJU basketball. No one is going to lose or gain based on Rysheed Jordan's availability. He took some time off from the team to deal with some personal stuff. No explanation should be needed.

Again, sorry but I do not manage a business in the public arena; SJU is. Publicity, like it or not, is part of the game. As for your comment about being a Top 25 team, which is obviously true; that just as obviously negates with you the fact that we have 6, count 'em 6, legitimate D1 players on the roster with 4 set to graduate, even ignoring the status of Obekpa and Jordan for next year. Like I said, you are entitled to your rosy outlook as to the state of the program, I just don't begin to share it.

St. John's status as a business in the public arena is trumped by their obligations as an educational institution to hold in confidence the private information regarding their enrolled students, particularly regarding health, grades, and family matters. Barring a subpoena STJ is at risk for not holding such information in confidence. Our rights as internet fans have less than no standing.

You guys can really stop with the lawyer crap. The truth of the matter is SJU administration, coaching staff, etc. don't have a clue as to how to run a big time program. Public relations ia a legitimate part of that; in truth they have been shilling and lying for Jordan since he came here. If a player can't play, tell us why; you don't have to give intimate and personal details but as a head coach and "face" of the program you don't say I don't have enough "information." The fact is Lavin had no idea Jordan left until well after the fact; take that to the bank. Lavin "convinced" him to come back and is hailed as a hero by many here and the fact is if we had anything resembling a legitimate D1 roster Jordan would have been sent home packing long ago as he should have been and should be now. A side of me is glad he is back solely for the benefit of the seniors who stuck through the insanity that is this program but I would not bet the mortgage that "The Jordan Saga" is anywhere near complete.

Five coaches in 22 years since Carnesecca, all considered failures to a man. Carnesecca took us to 18 NCAA tournaments in 24 years. You excoriate our administration, and based on results of our bball team, it's not without warrant. I think we have to take a closer look at the program and budget to see if this is a scenario that can be remediated. We are so quick to rip apart, but seriously, do any of us have any experience or talent in this area, other than to complain about the results. If any among us feel they have the ability to remediate this, then why aren't you change careers and work at something you are obviously so passionate about?

I think the problem is a lot more complicated than you suggest. The "right" hire comes in two flavors: One is the grizzled, highly decorated and successful D1 coach who is attained at great price. I'm curious as to the actual success quotient of the guys who move from considerable success at one high level D1 program to a flailing program. I'm guessing their success is no greater than 50%. Ben Howland is an example of a guy who has had a lot of success, but gets fired after missing the NCAAs two of his final 4 years at UCLA, and exiting early the other 2 years.

The other type is the up and coming guy at a mid-major. Sometimes these guys strike gold in a class, get one or two guys with pro potential or close, and coach the hell out of them before departing for big bucks. My guess is their success rate at the next level is considerably less than 50%. I'm thinking of guys like Steve Donohue, who turned Cornell around before failing at BC.

You can anecdotally point to the guys who have had sustained success when moving to another high level D1 program - Pitino and Calipari. Those guys come at incredibly high cost, and in Cal's place often leave a program with a string of violations. Doesn't matter - in either care, they are unaffordable for private institutions, not to mention a school that doesn't like to spend money (SJU)

The second group is a crapshoot. Mid major guys usually bolt for cash and never duplicate their success again. Again, anecdotally, you can point to the guys who catch lightning in the bottle at a higher level, but selecting them in hindsight is really easy - like picking last weeks lottery numbers.

I suggest that after 5 coaches, there are no magic bullets out there in our price range, just crapshoots. Are there guys we would take a chance on - yes, and we all have our favorites - mine is Cluess, but it isn't absolute - some here hate him.

I'm happy we are a competitive program once again, but like you I want more. But unlike you, I'm not so certain we will ever attain the success of Lapchick and Carnesecca - not that those were exactly happy days for us.

 

[monte]

Lavin's desperation is quite sad.

If Sheed missed practices and team functions, he should be suspended. Period.

Doesn't matter if it was the Duke game up next.

Indefinite leave of absence is not a suspension.

You guys talking about Sheed starting is amazing. He shouldn't even be playing.

It has been a long time since st johns has been on the map, a lot of it is due to the poor coaches we had (Norm), lazy coaches (Jarvis) , the Keita incident and the way Harrington decided to treat the basketball program after Pittsburgh.. This is our chance to get back on the map. Most of these kids are seniors and this is their last opportunity. Therefore, I let the Jordan play without suspension, the team wants him back, the team needs him, the fan base needs him, st johns needs to win and make a mark this year. There are no tomorrows. This program has been in a rut much too long

Not sure what any of the above has to do with anything.

Lavin was benching players 2 years ago for not shaving.

He dug this hole for himself. No one else.

And now since he wants a contract extension, a trip to Maui and more trips to Italy, anything goes?

Every player on that team is away from friends, family, girlfriends, sick relatives, etc. Every single one of them.

Some of you are so desperate for a win you sound like you've lost your minds.

Lavin stood in front of the media and told everyone D'Lo had to "earn his way back on the team."

Sheed hits the Pennsylvania Turnpike whenever he wants to and he gets the red carpet rolled out for him?

This is absurd.

And all for what when next year Sheed is playing overseas and Lavin's back in the booth?

I lost my mind a long time ago following this team, but the fact of the matter is that by all accounts Sheed has been pulling these antics since he got here, and been getting away with it. IMO now is not the time for Lavin to show tough love and//or try to prove a point. IMO that ship has sailed. And Sheed is not D'lo. Two different kids, two different situations, two different times. He needs to let Sheed come back not for us, but for D'lo, Dom and PG IV who had a legitimate chance to finish their careers here on a hit note. If they are willing to take Jordan back, then I'm fine with it.

Come on with that nonsense.

He suspended D'Lo prior to the BE tournament. I'd say that's much bigger than a game in January.

And it's a joke to placate one kid when everybody else had to play by the same rules and make the same sacrifices all because this guy is trying to save his job.

Suspending Sheed is not showing tough love nor is it proving a point.

It's the right thing to do regardless of our record or ranking.

The seniors don't need Sheed to win a game. That's nonsense. And it's besides the point.

"Nonsense"? I think not little man.

Save the personal comments.
When players can come and go as they please, the inmates have taken over. And it sends a bad message to the other players. But I guess it should be overlooked because it always has been...

I actually disagree with this. It's all about communication. As far as I can tell, one of Lavin's strong suits is his communication techniques. As long as he keeps the whole team in the loop and on the same page, nobody should have their feelings hurt.

Agreed. If his teammates are willing to take him back for the sake of achieving a common goal, then I'll for it. And I feel that these kids have a genuine affinity for Jordan. I assume that D'lo had a lot of say in this. Unlike Sampson and Sanchez last year, by and large Jordan has bought in to the program while on the court, even with an eye on the next level. Geez I really have to wonder if some of you guys ever played on a team with prima donnas(or any team at all) who got preferential treatment?

 

[SJUalum98]

Lavin's desperation is quite sad.

If Sheed missed practices and team functions, he should be suspended. Period.

Doesn't matter if it was the Duke game up next.

Indefinite leave of absence is not a suspension.

You guys talking about Sheed starting is amazing. He shouldn't even be playing.

It has been a long time since st johns has been on the map, a lot of it is due to the poor coaches we had (Norm), lazy coaches (Jarvis) , the Keita incident and the way Harrington decided to treat the basketball program after Pittsburgh.. This is our chance to get back on the map. Most of these kids are seniors and this is their last opportunity. Therefore, I let the Jordan play without suspension, the team wants him back, the team needs him, the fan base needs him, st johns needs to win and make a mark this year. There are no tomorrows. This program has been in a rut much too long

Not sure what any of the above has to do with anything.

Lavin was benching players 2 years ago for not shaving.

He dug this hole for himself. No one else.

And now since he wants a contract extension, a trip to Maui and more trips to Italy, anything goes?

Every player on that team is away from friends, family, girlfriends, sick relatives, etc. Every single one of them.

Some of you are so desperate for a win you sound like you've lost your minds.

Lavin stood in front of the media and told everyone D'Lo had to "earn his way back on the team."

Sheed hits the Pennsylvania Turnpike whenever he wants to and he gets the red carpet rolled out for him?

This is absurd.

And all for what when next year Sheed is playing overseas and Lavin's back in the booth?

I lost my mind a long time ago following this team, but the fact of the matter is that by all accounts Sheed has been pulling these antics since he got here, and been getting away with it. IMO now is not the time for Lavin to show tough love and//or try to prove a point. IMO that ship has sailed. And Sheed is not D'lo. Two different kids, two different situations, two different times. He needs to let Sheed come back not for us, but for D'lo, Dom and PG IV who had a legitimate chance to finish their careers here on a hit note. If they are willing to take Jordan back, then I'm fine with it.

Come on with that nonsense.

He suspended D'Lo prior to the BE tournament. I'd say that's much bigger than a game in January.

And it's a joke to placate one kid when everybody else had to play by the same rules and make the same sacrifices all because this guy is trying to save his job.

Suspending Sheed is not showing tough love nor is it proving a point.

It's the right thing to do regardless of our record or ranking.

The seniors don't need Sheed to win a game. That's nonsense. And it's besides the point.

"Nonsense"? I think not little man.

Save the personal comments.
When players can come and go as they please, the inmates have taken over. And it sends a bad message to the other players. But I guess it should be overlooked because it always has been...

I actually disagree with this. It's all about communication. As far as I can tell, one of Lavin's strong suits is his communication techniques. As long as he keeps the whole team in the loop and on the same page, nobody should have their feelings hurt.

Agreed. If his teammates are willing to take him back for the sake of achieving a common goal, then I'll for it. And I feel that these kids have a genuine affinity for Jordan. I assume that D'lo had a lot of say in this. Unlike Sampson and Sanchez last year, by and large Jordan has bought in to the program while on the court, even with an eye on the next level. Geez I really have to wonder if some of you guys ever played on a team with prima donnas(or any team at all) who got preferential treatment?

Monte,
Have you been watching the same team as everyone else?

And FWIW, I don't think Sanchez was showcasing himself last year.

 

[monte]

There were a lot of scenes like this this year

 

[monte]

Lavin's desperation is quite sad.

If Sheed missed practices and team functions, he should be suspended. Period.

Doesn't matter if it was the Duke game up next.

Indefinite leave of absence is not a suspension.

You guys talking about Sheed starting is amazing. He shouldn't even be playing.

It has been a long time since st johns has been on the map, a lot of it is due to the poor coaches we had (Norm), lazy coaches (Jarvis) , the Keita incident and the way Harrington decided to treat the basketball program after Pittsburgh.. This is our chance to get back on the map. Most of these kids are seniors and this is their last opportunity. Therefore, I let the Jordan play without suspension, the team wants him back, the team needs him, the fan base needs him, st johns needs to win and make a mark this year. There are no tomorrows. This program has been in a rut much too long

Not sure what any of the above has to do with anything.

Lavin was benching players 2 years ago for not shaving.

He dug this hole for himself. No one else.

And now since he wants a contract extension, a trip to Maui and more trips to Italy, anything goes?

Every player on that team is away from friends, family, girlfriends, sick relatives, etc. Every single one of them.

Some of you are so desperate for a win you sound like you've lost your minds.

Lavin stood in front of the media and told everyone D'Lo had to "earn his way back on the team."

Sheed hits the Pennsylvania Turnpike whenever he wants to and he gets the red carpet rolled out for him?

This is absurd.

And all for what when next year Sheed is playing overseas and Lavin's back in the booth?

I lost my mind a long time ago following this team, but the fact of the matter is that by all accounts Sheed has been pulling these antics since he got here, and been getting away with it. IMO now is not the time for Lavin to show tough love and//or try to prove a point. IMO that ship has sailed. And Sheed is not D'lo. Two different kids, two different situations, two different times. He needs to let Sheed come back not for us, but for D'lo, Dom and PG IV who had a legitimate chance to finish their careers here on a hit note. If they are willing to take Jordan back, then I'm fine with it.

Come on with that nonsense.

He suspended D'Lo prior to the BE tournament. I'd say that's much bigger than a game in January.

And it's a joke to placate one kid when everybody else had to play by the same rules and make the same sacrifices all because this guy is trying to save his job.

Suspending Sheed is not showing tough love nor is it proving a point.

It's the right thing to do regardless of our record or ranking.

The seniors don't need Sheed to win a game. That's nonsense. And it's besides the point.

"Nonsense"? I think not little man.

Save the personal comments.
When players can come and go as they please, the inmates have taken over. And it sends a bad message to the other players. But I guess it should be overlooked because it always has been...

I actually disagree with this. It's all about communication. As far as I can tell, one of Lavin's strong suits is his communication techniques. As long as he keeps the whole team in the loop and on the same page, nobody should have their feelings hurt.

Agreed. If his teammates are willing to take him back for the sake of achieving a common goal, then I'll for it. And I feel that these kids have a genuine affinity for Jordan. I assume that D'lo had a lot of say in this. Unlike Sampson and Sanchez last year, by and large Jordan has bought in to the program while on the court, even with an eye on the next level. Geez I really have to wonder if some of you guys ever played on a team with prima donnas(or any team at all) who got preferential treatment?

Monte,
Have you been watching the same team as everyone else?

And FWIW, I don't think Sanchez was showcasing himself last year.

Of course there have been selfish moments by Jordan, but for the most part I think he's played relatively under control and within the flow of the game. We'll have to disagree on Sanchez.

 

[TX Redman]

Sanchez was showcasing himself for a Downy commercial.

 

[Amaseinyourface]

i think the problem with christian jones is confidence. If he has a break out game i think he'll play better. He definitely has the body to bang the boards. he can make lay ups, but looks lost on defense and gets down on himself with a foul or missed shot.

Does getting pulled from game regardless of situation help, probably not.

 

[ras]

i think the problem with christian jones is confidence. If he has a break out game i think he'll play better. He definitely has the body to bang the boards. he can make lay ups, but looks lost on defense and gets down on himself with a foul or missed shot.

Does getting pulled from game regardless of situation help, probably not.

One problem we may have w our backup is; after a few minutes they get yanked, cant really get into the flow of the game and have to look over their shoulders. You have to figure there has to to be 1 player out of our entire roster, that could provide quality backup minutes ,outside of our main 6 men.

 

[simplyred]

i think the problem with christian jones is confidence. If he has a break out game i think he'll play better. He definitely has the body to bang the boards. he can make lay ups, but looks lost on defense and gets down on himself with a foul or missed shot.

Does getting pulled from game regardless of situation help, probably not.

One problem we may have w our backup is; after a few minutes they get yanked, cant really get into the flow of the game and have to look over their shoulders. You have to figure there has to to be 1 player out of our entire roster, that could provide quality backup minutes ,outside of our main 6 men.

That's the role of a backup. You go in for a few and give the starters a break. While you're in there, you should try to contribute but there is no need to look over your shoulders or get deflated when you come back out.

 

[Class of 72]

i think the problem with christian jones is confidence. If he has a break out game i think he'll play better. He definitely has the body to bang the boards. he can make lay ups, but looks lost on defense and gets down on himself with a foul or missed shot.

Does getting pulled from game regardless of situation help, probably not.

One problem we may have w our backup is; after a few minutes they get yanked, cant really get into the flow of the game and have to look over their shoulders. You have to figure there has to to be 1 player out of our entire roster, that could provide quality backup minutes ,outside of our main 6 men.

That one player appears to be Jordan while it should be Greene. He is our second platoon. Then again it will be worse next year when the entire team may be in basic training for the season.

 

[Chris7]

At this point i think we can all stop bitching, whichever opinion we have, blah blah blah...fact is its game time, RJ will be in uniform. Time to ball. I've been waiting for a meaningful game, it's our time now. Time to support the kids. Let's go!

 

[TX Redman]

RJ23 will be huge in the NBA. The Norwegian Basketball Assoc. hmy:

 

[redstorm89]

jordan should stayed in philly. no point of playing if you are not going to contribute anything.

 

[ras]

Lavin has to substitute more. Could give Miles some more burn. Should have played JDR, Guys would have been less fatigued in the end and would help prevent foul trouble. Jones looked useless. Hopefully Sheed can get his head in the game. Just have to regroup and hope we can steal one against Providence. Also have to be smarter w the fouls, we are too thin to take chances. W Dom and CO out an opponent is going to eat us alive on the glass.

 

[romiSJU]

Jordan status=wack

Bring it next game.
BRING IT.

 

[redfan259999888]

Jordan status=wack

Bring it next game.
BRING IT.

WTF IS HE GONNA BRING?

 

[Marillac]

Jordan was pitiful, but to his credit his demeanor was great. He was respectful to the staff and the officials and he looked like he was trying to be a good teammate. Baby steps I guess.

He needs to give us more. I can live with the 0-6, but his defense wasn't strong and he only had one board all game. His biggest contribution to this team is his defense and rebounding...that should never be off.

 

[beast of the east]

I think he did hit the rim on three of his shots.

 

[romiSJU]

Jordan status=wack

Bring it next game.
BRING IT.

WTF IS HE GONNA BRING?

Hopefully something good!

 

[Moose]

Jordan was pitiful, but to his credit his demeanor was great. He was respectful to the staff and the officials and he looked like he was trying to be a good teammate. Baby steps I guess.

He needs to give us more. I can live with the 0-6, but his defense wasn't strong and he only had one board all game. His biggest contribution to this team is his defense and rebounding...that should never be off.