Creighton Game
- Thread starter Jack Williams
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Class of 72
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How are we going to beat the best teams when we just lost to the worst teams??? We are defective at almost every position. You name it, point guard, center, forwar, shooting guards, all have serious flaws in their games. The kids looked bewildered last night on offense. Another loss and they will look defeated. The season will end like last season where they get to the NIT but feel they were too good for it and go out and play some street ball only to lose to a team glad to keep playing in March and hoping to build on next season.
We beat providence, they are 2nd in the conference, so it isn't impossible.
Creighton is not a good basketball team. Not a bad team either, but much more MVC this year than Big East. Play solid team basketball, but not a mistake they lost 9 in a row.
Unfortunately we are not a good basketball team either. Not bad, but not good.
There are just so many things that not only do we not do well, but that don't improve. Not in-season, not even from one year to the next. You could scout us in November for a game in February and identify the areas of weakness to expose. Little, if anything, would change.
It's not a coincidence, or bad luck, that teams shoot the stuffing out of it from 3 against us. We don't guard. Howland said it at halftime - wide open. And we don't take any clues. When a Toby Hegner makes one or two, there is no question the next one is going up. We should be aware of this trend playing against Phil Greene in practice every day, who after a soft miss puts his head down and chucks the next 5. So maybe pay a little attention to a Hegner before he (or Carlino, or whoever) makes 4 in a row?
Could go on and on but don't see point. Kids play so hard, Dee and Dom have become two of my favorite players ever for the effort they are putting in this season to will us to something, anything. But we are short personnel and short strategy and it's difficult to have to climb both mountains consistently against real competition. It's a shame.
Unfortunately we are not a good basketball team either. Not bad, but not good.
There are just so many things that not only do we not do well, but that don't improve. Not in-season, not even from one year to the next. You could scout us in November for a game in February and identify the areas of weakness to expose. Little, if anything, would change.
It's not a coincidence, or bad luck, that teams shoot the stuffing out of it from 3 against us. We don't guard. Howland said it at halftime - wide open. And we don't take any clues. When a Toby Hegner makes one or two, there is no question the next one is going up. We should be aware of this trend playing against Phil Greene in practice every day, who after a soft miss puts his head down and chucks the next 5. So maybe pay a little attention to a Hegner before he (or Carlino, or whoever) makes 4 in a row?
Could go on and on but don't see point. Kids play so hard, Dee and Dom have become two of my favorite players ever for the effort they are putting in this season to will us to something, anything. But we are short personnel and short strategy and it's difficult to have to climb both mountains consistently against real competition. It's a shame.
ZanMan
Well-known member
I agree. I'm not thrilled with our current conference record, but the "it's over" "it's impossible" posts are absurd and too dramatic.
It's over when we play our last game in the BET. Again, I'm less than thrilled with the state of things right now, but also know this team isn't done by any means.
We need everyone available to play and last night proved that yet again with Jordan not playing. Acceptable? Maybe not. But we all knew this coming into this season.
Creighton thoughts:http://www.bigeastboards.com/
Coach Lav took in walk ons and gave ships to players that don't belong here. The kid that could play was never going to see the court, but it looked for a while he got a usefully part. He doesn't' go to players who can't play because he knows they can't because he brought them here. Now he's in a spot where he might not be able to hide the fact he failed to get players. This was discussed when Jordan left and we all saw how fragile the situation was. NY still the place where teams come to get a road win. Does hurt, as this is the only team I really root for. I figure most on this board feel that coach let the team down.
beast of the east
Active member
8-3 in remaining games to be in the hunt for a bid, 9-2 to be more secure. Not impossible, but more unlikely with each passing game.
Everyone in LA at the time-fans, casual observers, people around the program, the administration-figured out in short order exactly who Lavin was. Then he left the coaching ranks for a while and turned up here. Many here(I was not one of them) felt that he was unfairly branded by disgruntled UCLA fans with unreasonable expectations. I too wanted to believe that in spite of my reliable sources telling me otherwise, especially after his immediate recruiting splash and successful first year. But it gradually became apparent that the Lavin we got here was the same Lavin that was run out of town in LA. A zebra don't often change his stripes. IMO he should be given the last year of his contract in a last ditch effort to prove that he can do so.
ZanMan
Well-known member
How about 7-4 and a few wins in the BET? How about 5-6 and they win the BET? There are several scenerios that could get us in. Nothing is impossible nor unlikely. We can only say that when the season is truly over and we are on the outside looking in.
I'm a realist and know the deal and I'm NOT happy with the last month. I'm upset that we are in this predicament again! But I refuse to give up on these guys and do feel that they can pull it off. This is why you play all the games, not less than half and give up and go home.
I promise those kids are not ready to quit. They have never quit yet this season...ever. This is why I will still watch and root for them. Flaws and all, they are enjoyable for me to watch. This is one of my favorite squads in quite a while, despite all the bad stuff we see.
monte, I completely get your rationale for keeping Lavin the entire length of his contract. I just don't see the point. If he couldn't win last year when his team was loaded and he couldn't win this year when he had all seniors, what makes you think he could win with all freshmen? IMO, I think both parties involved would be better off parting ways and moving on. And whoever the school brings in, first and foremost he should be able to coach.
We beat Providence the same way we Syracuse, by hitting a bunch of threes well above our season average. In other words, we got lucky. Sure if can, and almost certainly will be done again before the end of the season. But we need that type of performance nearly every game, not just a select few.
Of course we aren't statistically out of it yet, but after last night I'm done fooling myself. At least this team got to experience a top 15 ranking, that's the only positive thing I can say.
"Flaws and all, they are enjoyable for me to watch. This is one of my favorite squads in quite a while, despite all the bad stuff we see. "
Agree ZanMan, they have gone from one of my least favorite to being an enjoyable but frustrating watch. It is all about effort and this group of 5 give it. Funny, my brother who is not a fan or a hater of the Johnnies but at 68 a ball lifer, watched the game with me last night. Anyway he argued that we have OVERACHIEVED this year. In his words (paraphrasing); You play four guards all of whom are pretty much average shooters at best, only one of whom is a real stoned scorer, none of whom are exceptional athletes, nor are any off the charts quick or great jumpers. You have a very athletically gifted hybrid player (no real position) who has very flawed basketball skills and an undersized center with so-so hands that is offensively challenged to say the least. Obepka and Pointer can block shots which covers up to some degree the guards inability to keep opposing players in front of them so that helps. On top of that, you have one of the worst game coaches around. But you are gritty and tough minded so you stay in games against almost anyone but at the end of the day can't close out games because when the temperature gets turned up you just don't have the over-all talent and depth for this level. I think you are an incredibly overachieving team that must be hell to root for. "
Interesting and the more I think about it a pretty objective summary. Regardless, it is what it is and as much as I can't wait to get rid of Lavin, I will be with the crowd rooting each and every game. Hey, I'm used to it, I'm a die-hard Met fan forever.
Agree ZanMan, they have gone from one of my least favorite to being an enjoyable but frustrating watch. It is all about effort and this group of 5 give it. Funny, my brother who is not a fan or a hater of the Johnnies but at 68 a ball lifer, watched the game with me last night. Anyway he argued that we have OVERACHIEVED this year. In his words (paraphrasing); You play four guards all of whom are pretty much average shooters at best, only one of whom is a real stoned scorer, none of whom are exceptional athletes, nor are any off the charts quick or great jumpers. You have a very athletically gifted hybrid player (no real position) who has very flawed basketball skills and an undersized center with so-so hands that is offensively challenged to say the least. Obepka and Pointer can block shots which covers up to some degree the guards inability to keep opposing players in front of them so that helps. On top of that, you have one of the worst game coaches around. But you are gritty and tough minded so you stay in games against almost anyone but at the end of the day can't close out games because when the temperature gets turned up you just don't have the over-all talent and depth for this level. I think you are an incredibly overachieving team that must be hell to root for. "
Interesting and the more I think about it a pretty objective summary. Regardless, it is what it is and as much as I can't wait to get rid of Lavin, I will be with the crowd rooting each and every game. Hey, I'm used to it, I'm a die-hard Met fan forever.
I'm probably thinking a little to much from a business perspective, but here's my rationale Doody:
If I'm the administration, I'm figuring I have to pay him next year anyway. So I give him a verbal vote of confidence now for next year and tell him to go out and recruit his ass off this year and in to next year. If he doesn't get a vote of confidence now, then IMO he reads the writing on the wall and as the season progresses he cuts back on recruiting. I also tell him that I want to see how he does with recruits and with the team next year and that we'll revisit the contract extension possibility at some point mid-late next year. His strength as we know is recruiting. I would rather suffer with him one more year and have him hopefully bring in a few more top flight recruits, then have to pay him(and the new coach) next year and have the cupboard bare for the new coach.
If I'm the school that's what I'd do.