Cluess

[quote="Tha Kid" post=340522][quote="Marillac" post=340515][quote="Tha Kid" post=340509][quote="Andrew" post=340506]http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=400988530

Mullin vs Cluess. 12 3's vs 32[/quote]

They outrebounded us, outassisted us and hit 10/32 3s while we went 0 for 12. Classic case of talent winning out - nothing to do w coaching in that one.[/quote]

This was actually a blowout. We are up 20 with ten minutes remaining and started to skate. It could have been a 30-40 pt win if we didn’t have one of the worst shooting nights ever.[/quote]

Shows what the stats and score can make it appear like if you don’t watch the game! Must not have seen that one.

I basically agree with what you’ve been saying Marillac. Cluess is probably a slight upgrade - I’d be shocked if he is a huge upgrade or downgrade - and there was no need to get rid of Mullin when we did to end up w cluess.

I will be content if we get cluess but have an ace staff - something like Borman hsu and GSJ.[/quote]

He’s failure proof. I’m going to support him 100% but I’m very disappointed in this search and how it was handled. It’s been a very sobering week. St. John’s just isn’t a good job anymore and the Big East seems to be devolving into a slightly better West Coast Conference with Nova as the eastern Gonzaga.
 
[quote="Marillac" post=340450][quote="MCNPA" post=340428][quote="we are sju" post=340421][quote="Marillac" post=340419]Cragg shat the bed. We paid 5 million dollars and lost players to swap Mullin for Cluess?

Where was Cluess going? Why not take a one year shot with St. Jean? Cluess would have been there and cheaper next year.

If Mullin was forced out after a tournament berth what is Cragg’s punishment for handling this like an amateur?

The worst part about this is ASU didn’t even flinch. Their fans laughed it off. They admit they are a second tier program and they treated us like an annoying mosquito instead of a threat.

This isn’t just bad for us...this is bad for the whole conference. Behind Nova and Gtown you’d think we would have the third most attractive job.[/quote]

I am ok with Cluess but really looked like this whole thing came as a surprise to Cragg. Very reactionary.[/quote]

Yeah, from all I’ve heard, this was not planned. Cragg expected Mullin back next year, then the impasse. I think people are making up their own narratives at times to get fired up. Would you be fired up if you found out that when Cragg made the statement that Mullin was the coach a week ago that it might have been the case and an argument ensued after that that lead to this all going down? Just saying Marillac, you’re making up your own pseudo-facts without knowing how it all unfolded. I don’t think Cragg had much more time than the past week or two to work on this.[/quote]

Stop making excuses for Cragg. He overplayed his hand like a delusional nerd in high school telling everyone he would go to the prom with the hottest girl in school and then looked ridiculous when he was turned down. Now he’s going with his fat cousin from New Rochelle.

If Hurley is your only dream target what good does it do to let all the media report that? You don’t tel the seller of your dream house that it’s your dream house.

Cragg controlled the timetable. He scheduled the meeting. He loaded the gun and put it in front of Mullin.

I’ll never believe for a second that Mullin would have resigned unless he was forced out. He reached out to Hsu before his meeting.

We are a laughing stock. They are howling in Tempe tonight at our expense. Every forum in the conference is making fun of us.[/quote]
If people howl in Tempe do they really make a noise?
 
I see some mention Cluess and recruiting. What major recruit has the guy landed? I get that he was at Iona and not a big conference but how exactly does he walk into some kids house and say trust me? I’m the guy to get you to the next level? Iona no offense where’s that? Look at my success at.....Iona?.. really? He doesn’t seem like a dynamic personality. Sorry but I don’t think he is a good choice.
 
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[quote="Adam" post=340500]People will feel a lot better once Cluess signs, hires some highly respected ACs, brings back LJ/Heron/others, and we see him and his staff recruiting all summer.

He's a good Plan B. Plan A wasn't worth the $$$. It happens.[/quote]

Only at St. John's are we content with getting a Plan B.
Plan A was a national search.
What no one applied??????
Why are people blaming Cragg? He was the messenger for a cowardly President.
If Cragg targeted Hurley there had to be $$$ available. What happened?
Did Mullin resign? If so, why are we on the hook for his salary which appears to be handicapping our ability to be competitive with major programs or even with Xavier and Butler?
This is a cluster fck of major proportions.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=340422] Cluess has won a lot of meaningless games at all levels but has never won anything anywhere. His teams, when they lose, regularly give up 80-90 points per game. A defensive maven he is not. He kisses a lot of local ass to get their second best players. He relies on transfers and even settled for Norvel Pelle, a Lavin flunky.
Please tell me this is all a bad dream not repeating itself.[/quote]

^^^^This!

I think some of the "newbies" haven't seen true winning basketball, so they may not know any better. While some of the older fans have gotten so used to poor-to-mediocre basketball that any resemblance to "food--in this case crumbs on the table--are just desperate to eat, regardless.
 
[quote="Adam" post=340526]I keep seeing talk about how we "got rid of Mullin", but I don't buy it. What other option was there besides extending him? Mullin didn't deserve an extension and unlike Lavin he didn't want to be here with only 2 years remaining. That's his choice but I'm glad he wasn't extended. I'd much rather have Cluess next year anyways.

Can anyone answer how you would've handled Mullin? Would you have extended him?[/quote]

I think Mullin with Hsu and Borman could have been much better.

I would have been fine with a lame duck Mullin returning even if he was slightly disgruntled. That probably beats a Cluess-led team post-exodus.

I also would be fine with giving St. Jean a year to prove himself outside of Mullin’s system with a good staff. Cluess wasn’t going anywhere and his buyout only goes down.

If you could lock up a talent like St. Jean with an airtight contract with a prohibitive buyout on his end and a favorable buyout for us...when will you ever have that kind of leverage again? I’m talking 10-12 years at 350k starting and 1 mill ending. With a 7 mill coach’s buyout and a 1 mill school buyout. No way he turns that down. And what’s the risk for us?
 
With Hurley off the table cluess pricetag could just have increased, if he is smart.
They can't do nearly as well in the $1 million range even if there are no other suitors for him.
 
Really thought Cragg was a top notch exec but if Cluess is the answer what is the question?
Big programs pursue Big East coaches while StJohns goes after MAAC coaches Now going on number 3
 
[quote="mattc" post=340487]Cluess may work out just fine, but I'll never be convinced that Cragg handled this well. You force Mullin out the door and your only two options are Hurley and Cluess, the latter of whom you could hire next year if you're so inclined? This is laughable. I readily admit I don't know all the facts about how this played out, but from where I sit we look once again like a mom and pop store. You HAVE to have a plan B, and it looks like Cragg did not. What a friggin joke. I'm furious.[/quote]

I’ve said it before but many are seeing it now. Cragg is learning on the job. Never had to make a big hire before.
 
Hey guys I read a few days ago in 1 of our local papers, the local HS and AAU coaches love cluess so with the right local assistants this could be our best coach in 20 years, New Yorkers love new Yorkers! Let's try and stay positive!
 
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[quote="Marillac" post=340534][quote="Adam" post=340526]I keep seeing talk about how we "got rid of Mullin", but I don't buy it. What other option was there besides extending him? Mullin didn't deserve an extension and unlike Lavin he didn't want to be here with only 2 years remaining. That's his choice but I'm glad he wasn't extended. I'd much rather have Cluess next year anyways.

Can anyone answer how you would've handled Mullin? Would you have extended him?[/quote]

I think Mullin with Hsu and Borman could have been much better.

I would have been fine with a lame duck Mullin returning even if he was slightly disgruntled. That probably beats a Cluess-led team post-exodus.

I also would be fine with giving St. Jean a year to prove himself outside of Mullin’s system with a good staff. Cluess wasn’t going anywhere and his buyout only goes down.

If you could lock up a talent like St. Jean with an airtight contract with a prohibitive buyout on his end and a favorable buyout for us...when will you ever have that kind of leverage again? I’m talking 10-12 years at 350k starting and 1 mill ending. With a 7 mill coach’s buyout and a 1 mill school buyout. No way he turns that down. And what’s the risk for us?[/quote]

I actually agree with that as crazy as it seems. Cragg should listen to his plan and weigh it against other options. He does love it here.
 
Cluess will do a really good job here. He knows the game and will bring discipline and a fun style. He has a great relationship to all the programs in NY. I’m not hating this as much as some others are. As some have said, “less sizzle and more steak” and I think that’s a good thing for SJU. Cluess doesn’t have to learn the area, NYC, nor learn in the job. His main obstacle will only be filling a roster for next season. I think kids will love to play for him.
 
[quote="Marillac" post=340534][quote="Adam" post=340526]I keep seeing talk about how we "got rid of Mullin", but I don't buy it. What other option was there besides extending him? Mullin didn't deserve an extension and unlike Lavin he didn't want to be here with only 2 years remaining. That's his choice but I'm glad he wasn't extended. I'd much rather have Cluess next year anyways.

Can anyone answer how you would've handled Mullin? Would you have extended him?[/quote]

I think Mullin with Hsu and Borman could have been much better.

I would have been fine with a lame duck Mullin returning even if he was slightly disgruntled. That probably beats a Cluess-led team post-exodus.

I also would be fine with giving St. Jean a year to prove himself outside of Mullin’s system with a good staff. Cluess wasn’t going anywhere and his buyout only goes down.

If you could lock up a talent like St. Jean with an airtight contract with a prohibitive buyout on his end and a favorable buyout for us...when will you ever have that kind of leverage again? I’m talking 10-12 years at 350k starting and 1 mill ending. With a 7 mill coach’s buyout and a 1 mill school buyout. No way he turns that down. And what’s the risk for us?[/quote]
Given the options that lay in front of us, I can’t disagree. Before all this went down, I said that I didn’t think Mullin had the 50 week a year passion necessary at this level but could succeed if he was surrounded by folks who would fill the gaps. Not how you ideally want to staff a high major D1 program but nonetheless viable - especially if you were either locked into that coach or didn’t have better options.

Given the level of conference in which we play, the core of players we needed to protect and the urgency to take a leap upward, we needed a discernible step up.

Either better options aren’t available or haven’t been explored via a professionally led national search. You just don’t crash and burn what would have at least been a team with pieces that could compete to make what is at best a marginal coaching jump. I would rather have 2 new recruiters touting, among other things, CM than TC’s record at Iona.

I’ll root like hell in any case and back whoever is selected but just believe we really mismanaged this and are setting ourselves back once again.
 
[quote="salty dog" post=340547]Really thought Cragg was a top notch exec but if Cluess is the answer what is the question?
Big programs pursue Big East coaches while StJohns goes after MAAC coaches Now going on number 3[/quote]

Providence hired Cooley from Fairfield and that worked out pretty well for them
 
He might not win the press conference or check every box for some but Tim Cluess is a good basketball coach and that is all we can ask for after what has seemed like an eternity since we have had someone who could actually coach . He also is the type of guy who will be at Christ the king on a Wednesday and Stepinac on a Friday to go watch a kid play . Smart and not lazy is a winning combination for a coach and this guy has won everywhere he has ever coached. If hired let's hope that continues :)
 
[quote="Happy" post=340579]He might not win the press conference or check every box for some but Tim Cluess is a good basketball coach and that is all we can ask for after what has seemed like an eternity since we have had someone who could actually coach . He also is the type of guy who will be at Christ the king on a Wednesday and Stepinac on a Friday to go watch a kid play . Smart and not lazy is a winning combination for a coach and this guy has won everywhere he has ever coached. If hired let's hope that continues :)[/quote]
If he is the man, let’s hope he is adaptable. Disdain for defense will not fly at this level.
 
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