(@Bar) California, Mon. Nov. 19, 7pm, ESPN-2 / 970 WNYM

[quote="rawdognyc" post=303408][quote="Class of 72" post=303404][quote="panther2" post=303391]I was at the game and got very nervous in the second half. Happy we got the win. What I think is happening is that players are still adjusting to their roles. Last game Heron and LJ combined for 50 points while Shamorie had 8. This game Shamorie had 32 while Heron and LJ had 29. LJ scored his 13 points on 5 shots. I believe that we will get better as the season goes on. Clark is our 5 and he is adjusting to banging down low. Simon is still filling the stat sheet. It takes time and games experience to become a cohesive unit.

A win is a win, is a win. Let's get one more tomorrow.[/quote]

I really don't think Clark is our 5 except during the opening tip.;)
Tonight he took 11 shots and 6 were from the 3 point line. While his rebounding was good, the Cal sophomore Sueing outplayed him. The St. John's guards, especially Simon and Dixon, couldn't handle the young Cal backcourt of McNeil and Austin who easily got off their 27 shots. Cal had 2 true 5's in the game with Dutch kid going 7'3 and Kelly 6'8, 270lbs. We, and Clark, were lucky they are just freshmen. One thing is certain and that is we can't play either Temple or VCU the way we played Cal.[/quote]

Do you think that Cal two hasn't played in like a week and a half may have had a little more energy than the SJ guards because of only a couple of days off? Or do you feel this early in the season that that shouldn't matter? I'm just curious because the team didn't seem as energetic as they were against Rutgers.[/quote]

Cal last played on Tuesday night against Hampton, before the cancellation two days later. So, they had an extra three days rest. That can really go either way for a team. It did seem like Cal had an extra pep in their step because of that, especially early on.

The switch to a zone defense in the final minutes did seem to turn things around for us.
 
[quote="Monte" post=303415]Taped the game and just got done watching. Yet again, lazy D and to much one on one offense. We got the W so I'll take it, but way to much talent and athleticism on this team to have a another nail biter against a team that we are far superior to.[/quote] totally agree but Simon was good and Ponds took over for a bit
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=303387][quote="Amaseinyourface" post=303381][quote="we are sju" post=303374][quote="Amaseinyourface" post=303372][quote="we are sju" post=303347][quote="Ray Morgan" post=303339][quote="ron s m" post=303333]Trimble has a reputation of being a good 3 point shooter. Seems like he misses whenever I watch him![/quote]
Trimble shot low 30s last year, which isn't very good. However, a lot of optimists on the board.[/quote]

Defense is killing this team. And not our interior defense but on the perimeter. Kid defends and plays hard. He took and missed two shots. I am fine with Trimble.[/quote]

I might have to go back and read more of your posts. I don’t know you as well as I thought. Never thought you’d take the guy who scored 0 and played ok defense over the guy who scored 7 and played bad d.

To me Trimble is the bare minimum for a college player. Anything worse would be not deserving of minutes. As it is right now the best thing I can say is he’s not hurting us. My guess is willians gets a few minutes tomorrow or maybe somewhere else soon, plays well, and starts to get those 10-12 minutes a game.[/quote]

No. Usually ST John's teams struggle to score but play hard. And don't mean to keep killing Dixon but on bad defensive team he stands out. And seems to either be effort or lack of basketball IQ. Which is why I am fine with Trimble. If we were scoring 50 than Trimble would be a problem.[/quote]

Trimble reminds me of a norm player. Dixon reminds me of a leavin player.[/quote]

Figueroa reminds me of a Mahoney player. Heron reminds me of a Fraschilla player. Ponds reminds me of a Jarvis player.
Williams, Earlington and Roberts remind me of Mullin players. All three will likely be dissatisfied and transfer by their sophomore year.
Seriously though, the team was completely out of sync tonight. Clark, a 5th year player, was playing against freshmen and sophomores and had a subpar game. Played with flat feet and shot 2-11. That put a player like Figueroa off kilter. Figgy took only 5 shots. Heron 10 shots. Sixth man Trimble provides no offensive spark whatsoever. Dixon plays matador defense. Fixing that scenario is the staff's job.There should be no need for hero ball with Heron, Figgy and Ponds. Clark and Simon needs to assimilate better.[/quote] tube fair Dixon is older than St Jean
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=303416][quote="rawdognyc" post=303408][quote="Class of 72" post=303404][quote="panther2" post=303391]I was at the game and got very nervous in the second half. Happy we got the win. What I think is happening is that players are still adjusting to their roles. Last game Heron and LJ combined for 50 points while Shamorie had 8. This game Shamorie had 32 while Heron and LJ had 29. LJ scored his 13 points on 5 shots. I believe that we will get better as the season goes on. Clark is our 5 and he is adjusting to banging down low. Simon is still filling the stat sheet. It takes time and games experience to become a cohesive unit.

A win is a win, is a win. Let's get one more tomorrow.[/quote]

I really don't think Clark is our 5 except during the opening tip.;)
Tonight he took 11 shots and 6 were from the 3 point line. While his rebounding was good, the Cal sophomore Sueing outplayed him. The St. John's guards, especially Simon and Dixon, couldn't handle the young Cal backcourt of McNeil and Austin who easily got off their 27 shots. Cal had 2 true 5's in the game with Dutch kid going 7'3 and Kelly 6'8, 270lbs. We, and Clark, were lucky they are just freshmen. One thing is certain and that is we can't play either Temple or VCU the way we played Cal.[/quote]

Do you think that Cal two hasn't played in like a week and a half may have had a little more energy than the SJ guards because of only a couple of days off? Or do you feel this early in the season that that shouldn't matter? I'm just curious because the team didn't seem as energetic as they were against Rutgers.[/quote]

Made no difference whatsoever. You are right that this early in the season it is irrelevant. Cal is full of freshmen and sophomores and have stunk in previous games. We didn't play tired, we played lazy D and didn't share the ball with our money players. No way Heron should be taking only 5 shots! Mullin substituted freely between Dixon and Trimble. It's on him that Clark may be worn out near the end of games by not giving the freshman Roberts some floor time against fellow freshmen on Cal. Watching the 7'3 Dutch kid or the the 6'8 Kelly tower over Trimble inside was comical.[/quote]


Yeah. Obviously you know I support Mullin, however I'm really confused as to why we aren't using the deep bench that he has sorely been lacking the previous seasons. Williams and Roberts need to be in the rotation. Especially early on in the season so they have some experience come BE play. You can't teach height. Roberts has height, plus it's not like he's lost out there on the few minutes he's played this season. It's time to go 9 deep in my opinion.
 
[quote="panther2" post=303391]I was at the game and got very nervous in the second half. Happy we got the win. What I think is happening is that players are still adjusting to their roles. Last game Heron and LJ combined for 50 points while Shamorie had 8. This game Shamorie had 32 while Heron and LJ had 29. LJ scored his 13 points on 5 shots. I believe that we will get better as the season goes on. Clark is our 5 and he is adjusting to banging down low. Simon is still filling the stat sheet. It takes time and games experience to become a cohesive unit.

A win is a win, is a win. Let's get one more tomorrow.[/quote]
You mention that the players are adjusting to their roles but all your points are about the offensive end. We are scoring over 80 points a game the problem especially tonight was the defense. Laconic, lack of intensity getting up on your man. We switch a lot and it seems like they are happy they successfully switched they don't get within 5 feet of the new guy they are covering. Most of the time you play like you practice so I doubt they are playing intense D in practice. Mully never known for his D except for being smart and getting in passing lanes with quick hands for steals has to be more demanding they get up into their men. There is a reason it seems like every team seems to shoot well against us save for Rutgers.
 
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[quote="Monte" post=303415]Taped the game and just got done watching. Yet again, lazy D and to much one on one offense. We got the W so I'll take it, but way to much talent and athleticism on this team to have a another nail biter against a team that we are far superior to.[/quote]
1 on 1 ? Team had 15 assists on 29 Fg’s shot 54.7%. Cal slowed it down , made some tough shots late in the shot clock. They only had 10 assists .
 
We are 4-0, so I'll take that every single time.

I know we all tend to focus on the negatives, even during wins, but Ponds is absolutely incredible. For as much as we talk about our flaws, opposing teams (who are on the losing end of these games) must be looking at him with envy.
 
[soundcloud][/soundcloud][quote="Danny Noonan" post=303431][quote="Monte" post=303415]Taped the game and just got done watching. Yet again, lazy D and to much one on one offense. We got the W so I'll take it, but way to much talent and athleticism on this team to have a another nail biter against a team that we are far superior to.[/quote]
1 on 1 ? Team had 15 assists on 29 Fg’s shot 54.7%. Cal slowed it down , made some tough shots late in the shot clock. They only had 10 assists .[/quote]

Almost all of those came in the first half. I think the announces said 70% of our first half shots were assisted which mean only 25% or so in the second half. They offence in the 2nd half was not pretty and basically just ponds taking over.
 
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Not every game will be pretty, but ugly wins count. 4-0 is pretty and 5-0 would be prettier. Let’s get it done today.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=303397]On train now. Sat in student section and the same 5-6 of us twentysomethings (barely for me sadly) were losing our voices hoping it caught on. It never does unfortunately. The crowd is very lazy and only cares if it’s close with 2 min left. Then there was noise. Ponds brought BK down with the same type of dagger 3 he killed Duke with. Great homecoming for him.

Got the chance to go on court for a promotion and thankfully made my layup. Was thinking of everyone here and the SJ fam and was nervous to let everyone down with an airball missed layup :) . Won a basketball, hat, and a legends classic jersey which was cool. At this point I’m just thrilled to get a W any way possible. Cal had their swag going and they were very confident. Let’s hope the college basketball gods start to finally ease up on us tomorrow so we can get a trophy for the case. Been decades I’m sure. Ugly game but we lose this and BG last yr no doubt. Hope we finally have a good game at Barclays, it has an odd negative effect on us it seems. Survive and advance![/quote]

Oh so you were one of those loud annoying guys with the red hair sitting and yelling half the game, standing and blocking my view?? Just kidding lol, you guys were great. I was the row behind. Unfortunately just not a great college basketball atmosphere so it was tough for you guys to get others to join in.
 
I don't know about the team, but I'm tired today. The game didn't end until 2:30AM GMT. I was hoping we would pull away so I could go to bed, but we never did. Ponds had an amazing 2nd half and really bailed us out. I haven't gotten to see much of the team in the past couple years. Simons does a lot of nice little things, but I hope he never has to shoot that horrific looking foul shot when it matters. Clark was unimpressive and beat by 3* freshmen. The staff needs to get LJ involved more. On to the next one.
 
[quote="Room112" post=303443][quote="Mike Zaun" post=303397]On train now. Sat in student section and the same 5-6 of us twentysomethings (barely for me sadly) were losing our voices hoping it caught on. It never does unfortunately. The crowd is very lazy and only cares if it’s close with 2 min left. Then there was noise. Ponds brought BK down with the same type of dagger 3 he killed Duke with. Great homecoming for him.

Got the chance to go on court for a promotion and thankfully made my layup. Was thinking of everyone here and the SJ fam and was nervous to let everyone down with an airball missed layup :) . Won a basketball, hat, and a legends classic jersey which was cool. At this point I’m just thrilled to get a W any way possible. Cal had their swag going and they were very confident. Let’s hope the college basketball gods start to finally ease up on us tomorrow so we can get a trophy for the case. Been decades I’m sure. Ugly game but we lose this and BG last yr no doubt. Hope we finally have a good game at Barclays, it has an odd negative effect on us it seems. Survive and advance![/quote]

Oh so you were one of those loud annoying guys with the red hair sitting and yelling half the game, standing and blocking my view?? Just kidding lol, you guys were great. I was the row behind. Unfortunately just not a great college basketball atmosphere so it was tough for you guys to get others to join in.[/quote]

Haha guilty as charged, sorry for blocking your view. I'm only 5'10, so I'm not that hard to see over. If everyone is standing with the stadium seating, everyone will see :cheer: . Funny you were that close...at least you know we are trying though. Since they were good seats and weren't staying for the 2nd game, we tried giving these 2 Temple fans our tickets (they were sitting pretty high up). They looked at us strangely and clearly had a language barrier. They pointed to their shirts and said "no we are Temple" all confused. Once they understood they said "ok maybe". We always try to find a father and son sitting higher up at games if it's a double header and we have good seats but oh well couldn't find any.
 
Defense:

-Don't think effort was the problem last night. Were there some shots where we could have had a hand up quicker? Yes. Was that the reason they shot 50% from 3? No. We play an aggressive style of defense with gambling and overpursuit. We try to create turnovers. That's going to inevitably lead to open shots and layups. It just needs to disrupt more sets than clean looks allowed.

-A lot of 50/50 balls ended up in Cal hands

-The motion offense Cal was running in the second half exposed our quick switching and lack of size/shot blocking threat in the middle. That will prob be a consistent theme this year until Keita comes back/we adjust.

-They hit some tough contested shots. We (read Ponds) hit some too, so I guess it cancelled out.

-Would have liked to have seen more pressing/trapping

Offense;
-Good flow on the offensive end in the first half, but don't know why it took so long to put Ponds in middle of zone to break it down. Also, don't know why we went away from doing that. Ponds was getting what he wanted at will

-Second half we just had too many empty possessions. Lack of killer instinct seems to be a concern. We get loose, then we get tight, then we get focused

-Not concerned with the lower assist % in the 2nd half. They found the Clark/Ponds high screen set they liked and Ponds got anything he wanted out of that- layups, three pointers, fouls. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Odds and Ends:
-Love when Heron just imposes his will. Reminds me a bit of Artest

-Not down on Dixon. Thought he made some nice plays on the offensive end. He'll figure it out defensively. We're going to need points off the bench

-Would love to see Roberts and Williams get a little run (5 min or so). They haven't look out of place in their brief cameos.
 
[quote="MCNPA" post=303436]Not every game will be pretty, but ugly wins count. 4-0 is pretty and 5-0 would be prettier. Let’s get it done today.[/quote]

The only pretty game thus far was Rutgers. We are 4-0 but let's remember who we are 4-0 against. Clark shot 2-11 last night. That's an ugly game. He can be a 3 point threat but the effectiveness of both Figueroa and Heron were sacrificed in the process of him being set up in the corner. He was playing against Cal freshmen inside so he should have schooled them but unfortunately he doesn't play big and Mullin seems content with him on the perimeter. He missed what should have been 3 easy shots right under the basket. He is not a finesse player inside and is more comfortable playing 20 feet from the basket. Ponds, Figueroa and Heron are the best players on the offensive end and every effort should be made to keep them involved in the offense. Defensive pressure has been lacking and this team is a far cry from the 40 minutes of hell we expected. Mullin is just not a good defensive coach.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=303450][quote="MCNPA" post=303436]Not every game will be pretty, but ugly wins count. 4-0 is pretty and 5-0 would be prettier. Let’s get it done today.[/quote]

The only pretty game thus far was Rutgers. We are 4-0 but let's remember who we are 4-0 against. Clark shot 2-11 last night. That's an ugly game. He can be a 3 point threat but the effectiveness of both Figueroa and Heron were sacrificed in the process of him being set up in the corner. He was playing against Cal freshmen inside so he should have schooled them but unfortunately he doesn't play big and Mullin seems content with him on the perimeter. He missed what should have been 3 easy shots right under the basket. He is not a finesse player inside and is more comfortable playing 20 feet from the basket. Ponds, Figueroa and Heron are the best players on the offensive end and every effort should be made to keep them involved in the offense. Defensive pressure has been lacking and this team is a far cry from the 40 minutes of hell we expected. Mullin is just not a good defensive coach.[/quote]

I did not expect 40 minutes of hell. Tough to play that way when we were only ever going to play 8 at most. Furthermore Ponds and Simon were not good perimeter defenders last year. I even said before season that along with rebounding defending against three would be my biggest worry. If you have two guys who don't put effort in on simply closing out, how are you going to press? Now on top of Ponds / Simon you add the single worst defender in Division 1 to the mix.
We should be able to switch defensively since all 5 guys are basically the same size. The effort is simply not there. After two switches the other team gets an open look. There are stretches like end of first half where we looked good. Ponds, Simon and especially Dixon need to put a better effort in and we would be fine.
 
[quote="we are sju" post=303452][quote="Class of 72" post=303450][quote="MCNPA" post=303436]Not every game will be pretty, but ugly wins count. 4-0 is pretty and 5-0 would be prettier. Let’s get it done today.[/quote]

The only pretty game thus far was Rutgers. We are 4-0 but let's remember who we are 4-0 against. Clark shot 2-11 last night. That's an ugly game. He can be a 3 point threat but the effectiveness of both Figueroa and Heron were sacrificed in the process of him being set up in the corner. He was playing against Cal freshmen inside so he should have schooled them but unfortunately he doesn't play big and Mullin seems content with him on the perimeter. He missed what should have been 3 easy shots right under the basket. He is not a finesse player inside and is more comfortable playing 20 feet from the basket. Ponds, Figueroa and Heron are the best players on the offensive end and every effort should be made to keep them involved in the offense. Defensive pressure has been lacking and this team is a far cry from the 40 minutes of hell we expected. Mullin is just not a good defensive coach.[/quote]

I did not expect 40 minutes of hell. Tough to play that way when we were only ever going to play 8 at most. Furthermore Ponds and Simon were not good perimeter defenders last year. I even said before season that along with rebounding defending against three would be my biggest worry. If you have two guys who don't put effort in on simply closing out, how are you going to press? Now on top of Ponds / Simon you add the single worst defender in Division 1 to the mix.
We should be able to switch defensively since all 5 guys are basically the same size. The effort is simply not there. After two switches the other team gets an open look. There are stretches like end of first half where we looked good. Ponds, Simon and especially Dixon need to put a better effort in and we would be fine.[/quote]

“EFFORT” being the key word. There is no reason in the world that we should have the let-ups on D that we do. We start to pull away and then we ease up on D and get sloppy on the other end. Then game gets close and we re-focus. Maybe we’re just playing down to the level of the comp. But I sure as hell wish we’d be more intense for longer periods of the game in what is seemingly the cupcake part of our schedule.
 
[quote="Spocky Ramone" post=303351][quote="Mean Gene" post=303342]I think Trimble we find his shot. He did last year.[/quote]
You thought we would lose tonight, so do we write off Trimble?[/quote]

Not at all. I think Trimble will find his shot. he hustles and plays defense.
 
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