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Amaseinyourface said:
Oh yes. I four year starter who always gave his all. I remember exactly what I was doing that day vs cuse. LONG overdue. Phil got the chance to play off the ball that season and was vindicated because of it. Doesn’t look like Jenkins will get that chance.
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There are a few notable differences between Greene and Jenkins. Phil could legitimately shoot the ball. He averaged 40% from 3 as a junior and 39.1% as a senior. He also played within his abilities even though he was clearly out of position. He spread the ball around. His passes weren’t high level at all but he did his best.

There is something so final with the plays Jenkins makes that I have a hard time describing. Like he just dribbles himself into problems without a plan.

I also have an issue with the sheer amount of dribbling he does. When you combine that with 15-17 shots it’s suffocating. Someone like Champagnie took more shots but didn’t dominate the dribbling at all and shot it much better.


Imagine playing a backyard game and one guy dribbled the ball the entire time, made a majority of the meaningful passes and slashes, and led the team in shots? You’d have to be like “I guess I’ll just set picks the next 4 years” like the comedian Shane Gillis.
 
Marillac2 said:
There are a few notable differences between Greene and Jenkins. Phil could legitimately shoot the ball. He averaged 40% from 3 as a junior and 39.1% as a senior. He also played within his abilities even though he was clearly out of position. He spread the ball around. His passes weren’t high level at all but he did his best.

There is something so final with the plays Jenkins makes that I have a hard time describing. Like he just dribbles himself into problems without a plan.

I also have an issue with the sheer amount of dribbling he does. When you combine that with 15-17 shots it’s suffocating. Someone like Champagnie took more shots but didn’t dominate the dribbling at all and shot it much better.


Imagine playing a backyard game and one guy dribbled the ball the entire time, made a majority of the meaningful passes and slashes, and led the team in shots? You’d have to be like “I guess I’ll just set picks the next 4 years” like the comedian Shane Gillis.
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Phil could dribble aimlessly with the best of them his first few years!
 
austour said:
That assumes you think I think Jenkins is "running the point". As one of the two combo guards being discussed Jenkins has slightly PG skills, both dribble(d) around too much but there is a bit more creativity and distribution in Jenkins game. But PGIII (IV whatever) has far better SG skills, after a complete dud of a soph year he shot just under 40% from 3 his last two years. If he were bringing the ball down, using the screen and hoisting it up and making 40% there would be far less complaints than there is now. But in all honesty that was another class without a PG until Rysheed showed up, when he did show up that is. If the problem you see with Jenkins is his love for any shot then Greene can be seen as an upgrade.
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That’s his biggest problem but still would rather him with that problem handle the point responsibilities than Phil. I have no interest in a point guard who is incapable of breaking down a defense and making plays for others. Would rather take my chances with a guy who’s got those skills but nah need to be reined in. Jenkins has that ability and hopefully he can limit the stuff he does poorly.
 
logen said:
IMO, clearly the best player, not perfect by any means but clearly the Johnnie’s best player. Hopefully, Soriano decides to come to play and puts him in the rear view mirror for that distinction the rest of the year.
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I don't disagree that he and Joel are the best players on the team right now. But to me that says more about rest of the players than Daniss. Rj brady and simeon probably have higher ceilings and will likely be better as fifth years seniors than Daniss is now but on this team we need Daniss. As i keep saying would just like a better Daniss, especially given how much this team needs him.
 
Amaseinyourface said:
That’s his biggest problem but still would rather him with that problem handle the point responsibilities than Phil. I have no interest in a point guard who is incapable of breaking down a defense and making plays for others. Would rather take my chances with a guy who’s got those skills but nah need to be reined in. Jenkins has that ability and hopefully he can limit the stuff he does poorly.
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Agree I even said so in my post. It was disingenuous for me to put PGIV in with point guards when it was his weakest quality maybe.
 
Jack Williams said:
MR, you have to admit, it is pretty ironic and funny that the mantra you used on here ad nauseam when Pitino got hired was "theres no place for posh here because Pitino gets guys who can shoot"

Posh is such a bad shooter that I started to see your point.

But now our starting point guard is gonna shoot under 30% from 3 this year anyway.

I'm definitely Jenkins>posh but, it is just ironic how things play out sometimes
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We were supposed to have a bunch of guys who could shoot this year. Well so far, we haven't seen that at all.
 
redmanwest said:
I share (to a lesser degree of passion) your sense that Jenkins shoots too much. He's not perfect, but he is what we've got.

BUT, the statement above is a little hyperbolic. Though it is definitely a subjective evaluation, I think guys like Sprolling, Hatton, Bangura, Sanchez, Lovett, to name just a few who come to mind, who were definitely more or equally vexing... There is a long list unfortunately of past St. John's players that were frustrating or who underachieved, etc. Just sayin.
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Hatten?
 
Jack Williams said:
Was he candid? Was it explained fully? Cause during the introductory press conference, he said he had to meet with most of the other players before making a decision. So coming out of the press conference, there was still a shot that he could have retained some other guys. It didn't play out that way, which is fine... really, it is.

The reality is some of these guys were kicked on the way out by some cocky St. John's fans who thought we were too good for them once we got Rick. They got caught in the hype and headlines as you mentioned. In reality, some of those guys could have helped us this year. I don't think acknowledging that is "silly" which brings me to my next point.


I'm not gonna lie, I am getting sick and tired of the narrative that we should never "long" for former players because they didn't win enough when they were here.

Our coach was not good, did not have control over the team (clearly) and we were a poorly run basketball team. That says absolutely nothing about the individual talent we had.

How is AJ Storr on a 13-4 Wisconsin team? He didn't win anything while playing for Mike Anderson, therefore we can't talk about his potential value? Do I have that right?

I don't get you guys sometimes, its a st johns basketball forum and you act like discussing past st johns players, who were literally here less than a year ago, is some off limits topic? I literally read some of you guys discuss Mike Jarvis weekly. The Jarvis era.. who gives a fuck about the Jarvis era in 2024? Well people on here do because they live and breathe st johns basketball. Thats cool with me.

Should past coaches who failed here be off limit topics due to silliness?
Should past seasons where we didn't win a lot be off limits due to silliness?
Should past players who were on the team LAST season be off limits due to silliness?

I am just trying to figure out all the unwritten rules.

No one was even talking about our former players in here until one poster who shit on Posh to prop up Jenkins play. Whether you find it silly or not that right there invites a discussion about Posh/Jenkins which leads to talk about former players.
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AJ Storr wasn’t dismissed, he left on his own accord and I don’t recall too many posting they were glad he was gone but the opposite.
 
austour said:
I don't disagree that he and Joel are the best players on the team right now. But to me that says more about rest of the players than Daniss. Rj brady and simeon probably have higher ceilings and will likely be better as fifth years seniors than Daniss is now but on this team we need Daniss. As i keep saying would just like a better Daniss, especially given how much this team needs him.
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And water is wet, I would like everyone on the team to play better, one of the all-time great left handed compliments. Along with a completely irrelevant comparison to what you think Dunlap and Wilcher will be 4 years from now. Really pains you guys to admit Jenkins is having a very good, not great, year. If not for him, we are DePaul, not even Georgetown.
 
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