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sjc88 said:
Woodson made some terrible and confusing decisions to close out that game. He stuck with the guys who got them on the 10-0 run. Then seems to be confused as to who he wanted on the floor. Brings back two guys including MGbako who were ice cold.

Two chances to inbound the ball after a TO and don’t execute a play to get a final shot. If he was our Coach we would be electrocuting him for his decisions.
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Agree but it’s not like Indiana fans let him off the hook there were a lot of boos after that final play. Almost every year for the last 25 save this one we would be happy to be 14-7 which is what Indiana is. I would think Indiana fans are more demanding than our fans. I think just about all of our demanding fans post on this board.
 
lawmanfan said:
The NCAA tournament winning percentages are somewhat useful but also somewhat misleading. The ACC is a top heavy league and has been progressively so over the years. It used to have 4-5 excellent teams, then 3-4, then 2-3, and now it's down to 1. So when the top team(s) make deep runs it offsets the losses of the others that get eliminated early and also does not count the bulk of the league that wasn't good enough to make it. Most years the BE is putting about half the league in the tournament whereas the ACC is closer to a third.

My eyeball test says that if you merged the leagues this year Duke would be the best team, followed by Marquette and SJU, and then you could put UConn, Creighton, X, Louisville, and Clemson in a hat for the next tier. After that you'd get to Nova and Pitt, and then everyone else is garbage. Except that is half of the BE and three-quarters of the ACC.

KenPom (just grabbed it for one data point) doesn't entirely agree with me about the top end of the rankings but it does confirm that half of the ACC is terrible as opposed to two teams (less than 20%) of the BE.

So you can definitely make a case that the top third of the ACC is competitive with the top 80% of the BE, and I would agree that Duke is the best team of the lot.

But the bottom half to two-thirds of the ACC is absolute garbage.

Anyway sooner or later Clemson, FSU, UNC and NC State are going to the SEC, Pitt, Stanford, Cal and Louisville will be in the Big 12, and then the rest of the league will become the football division of the BE. At which point we will be on the same side!

KenPom rankings:
1. Duke
12. Marquette
18. SJU
25. Louisville
27. Clemson
32. Creighton
34. Pitt
36. UConn
38. UNC
47. Xavier
50. SMU
54. Villanova
69-76: FSU, Wake, Stanford, ND
77. Georgetown
83. Butler
87. Providence
100+: the rest of the ACC, Seton Hall and DePaul
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I would have read it but I have to finish War and Peace first. Your eye test and Kenpom don't mean sh*t. Head to head on neutral courts under the highest stakes is where conferences prove their metal.. I don't make the rules. 12 and 5; 4 sweet sixteens; 3 elite eights; 1 final four. The Acc kicked a$$ and shut up and proved all the naysayers wrong. As did the BE. All except you of course. Your initial post was silly and wrong. You can admit it.
 
bamafan said:
Agree but it’s not like Indiana fans let him off the hook there were a lot of boos after that final play. Almost every year for the last 25 save this one we would be happy to be 14-7 which is what Indiana is. I would think Indiana fans are more demanding than our fans. I think just about all of our demanding fans post on this board.
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I wasn’t suggesting they let him off the hook. Frankly I think he’s getting canned. Not sure about the 14-7. I think they are 5-5 in Conference and potential for some serious slippage based on the schedule. Indiana fans are not only demanding but they are unrealistic to an extent. The Big Ten feels like they have a hundred teams. Finishing in the middle isn’t that bad. 😂 Way tougher than us. Our bitching and moaning in second rate given where we’ve been!
 
Us playing more games at MSG is not going to prevent or stop Ru from having one there too. We don’t play enough home games period.

MSG wants to make money and does not when the arena is dark.

Play more games there in the future, sure but MSG will continue to follow their proud tradition of holding college basketball games there, both national and local. We just need to make it so they are just visiting tourists, it is our house. We do that by continuing to win and start packing the house whenever we play there.
 
SJU85 said:
Us playing more games at MSG is not going to prevent or stop Ru from having one there too. We don’t play enough home games period.

MSG wants to make money and does not when the arena is dark.

Play more games there in the future, sure but MSG will continue to follow their proud tradition of holding college basketball games there, both national and local. We just need to make it so they are just visiting tourists, it is our house. We do that by continuing to win and start packing the house whenever we play there.
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You're not wrong, but we need to become more important to them and limit the window for them to see how easy it is to replace us. Some years we played what 6-7 games there?

The reality is they can completely replace us right now with a couple of extra games for Uconn, Syracuse, Rutgers, and a few one-offs with blue bloods.

There is also the league component. We are the #2 draw in this league behind Uconn. We should be getting preferential treatment next season. Uconn, Nova, Creighton, Marquette all on the weekend. This league has nothing close to a sold out MSG game with St. John's v. a ranked team in a premier slot. It's the best marketing possible for the league and for us.

Xavier, Providence, Creighton, DePaul, Seton Hall, Butler, Uconn, and Marquette are all going to draw roughly the same crowds regardless of when the game is played. We could have a 14,000 fan discrepancy between a weekday game at CA v. a weekend game at MSG and a 5,000 fan discrepancy between a weekday game at MSG v. a weekend game at MSG.
 
Marillac2 said:
Not good that they drew like this IMO. That’s two massive alumni bases in NYC for a single weekend game, but still.

We need to be super aggressive demanding more games at the Garden and more premier times.

Maybe DePaul at CA, but that’s it for league games. UConn, Nova, Creighton, and Marquette all on the weekend. 2 huge OOC opponents.
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Depaul, Butler and probably Seton Hall at CA.
 
RedStormNC said:
Doug Gottlieb measuring rim heights before game. They still lost and now 2-20

awfulannouncing.com

Doug Gottlieb's rim-measuring ahead of latest loss drew comment

Ahead of Wisconsin-Green Bay's loss to Cleveland State Saturday, head coach/radio host Doug Gottlieb was measuring rims.
awfulannouncing.com awfulannouncing.com
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Of course a bad look all things considered with his current situation, but..

“To Gottlieb’s credit, though, his rim-measuring did prompt an official change to the one basket’s height”
 
Amaseinyourface said:
Of course a bad look all things considered with his current situation, but..

“To Gottlieb’s credit, though, his rim-measuring did prompt an official change to the one basket’s height”
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Good catch. Thanks.

Never considered who does it. I would have thought the refs are responsible to measure before games. Anyone know the rules / responsibilities? Is it usually just left to home team and honor system.
 
Marillac2 said:
You're not wrong, but we need to become more important to them and limit the window for them to see how easy it is to replace us. Some years we played what 6-7 games there?

The reality is they can completely replace us right now with a couple of extra games for Uconn, Syracuse, Rutgers, and a few one-offs with blue bloods.

There is also the league component. We are the #2 draw in this league behind Uconn. We should be getting preferential treatment next season. Uconn, Nova, Creighton, Marquette all on the weekend. This league has nothing close to a sold out MSG game with St. John's v. a ranked team in a premier slot. It's the best marketing possible for the league and for us.

Xavier, Providence, Creighton, DePaul, Seton Hall, Butler, Uconn, and Marquette are all going to draw roughly the same crowds regardless of when the game is played. We could have a 14,000 fan discrepancy between a weekday game at CA v. a weekend game at MSG and a 5,000 fan discrepancy between a weekday game at MSG v. a weekend game at MSG.
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Knicks and Rangers are of course are priority, Bill Joel and we fall somewhere behind that but ahead of Ru. The number of games we played there in the past had to do with a lot of factors including the fact that we sucked for so many years and online when UConn came to town and the occasional game against Syracuse. St. John’s was losing money.

This year has changed the narrative and I am sure everyone knows it. More games at MSG, the dates and times is a decision made among MSG, St. John’s, the Big East (scheduling) and Networks to work on. The better this season goes, the more games at MSG.

Getting mad or upset because others use the Worlds Most Famous Arena especially on a day when we were off is just a waste of time and thought.
 
SJU85 said:
Knicks and Rangers are of course are priority, Bill Joel and we fall somewhere behind that but ahead of Ru. The number of games we played there in the past had to do with a lot of factors including the fact that we sucked for so many years and online when UConn came to town and the occasional game against Syracuse. St. John’s was losing money.

This year has changed the narrative and I am sure everyone knows it. More games at MSG, the dates and times is a decision made among MSG, St. John’s, the Big East (scheduling) and Networks to work on. The better this season goes, the more games at MSG.

Getting mad or upset because others use the Worlds Most Famous Arena especially on a day when we were off is just a waste of time and thought.
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I would agree that this year changed the narrative. 14,500 against Xavier mid-week with awful weather is so promising.

I think we can sell out (or come close) 6 games next year if we are a top 10-15 team and the games are on the weekend.
 
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Silly Donovan said:
UNC will continue to get top talent with or without Davis. Their NIL pocketbook is insane. Just ask Bill Bellacheat. Hearing Ian Jackson got enough money to buy a car………dealership.😂👍
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Talk for basketball is that it's not that insane. They did not get a replacement for Bacot and it's hurt them. Claims some of the bigger donors holding back as they don't want Hubert. Who knows?
 
RedStormNC said:
Talk for basketball is that it's not that insane. They did not get a replacement for Bacot and it's hurt them. Claims some of the bigger donors holding back as they don't want Hubert. Who knows?
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Really, that’s one way to get rid of their coach. Apparently for Bellacheat, they opened up the banks.
 
carmineabbatiello said:
I would have read it but I have to finish War and Peace first. Your eye test and Kenpom don't mean sh*t. Head to head on neutral courts under the highest stakes is where conferences prove their metal.. I don't make the rules. 12 and 5; 4 sweet sixteens; 3 elite eights; 1 final four. The Acc kicked a$$ and shut up and proved all the naysayers wrong. As did the BE. All except you of course. Your initial post was silly and wrong. You can admit it.
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I'll cut it down to two words for you, Carmine: TOP HEAVY

And since a picture is worth a thousand words, here are the conferences merged and sorted by NET. In the somewhat-arbitrary tiers I put them into, the leagues are basically even in the top 3 tiers (Duke is clearly the best team and I don't think it's especially close). But when you get to the bottom two tiers the only word for the ACC is ... woof. 9 of the bottom 11 teams in NET. And 12 of the bottom 17.

1737986671628.png
 
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