a lot of endlessly repetitive chatter

[quote="Boo Harvey" post=291906]It’s not like we’re hiring Nick Saben. What could possibly be so complicated about this contract? Head coaches are frequently locked up within a day or two no less an assistant coach. We are . . .[/quote]
Boo, you have heard about the $$$ and trauma fallout from Slice's contract, yes? The program can't afford -- literally -- to take another hit like that.
 
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[quote="redken" post=291909][quote="Boo Harvey" post=291906]It’s not like we’re hiring Nick Saben. What could possibly be so complicated about this contract? Head coaches are frequently locked up within a day or two no less an assistant coach. We are . . .[/quote]
Boo, you have heard about the $$$ and trauma fallout from Slice's contract, yes? The program can't afford -- literally -- to take another hit like that.[/quote]

Yup, I’m familiar with it. Not sure that debacle explains the glacial pace of negotiations here. Presumably the school is willing to pay a certain amount and Rice is willing to accept a certain amount. That fact exists, irrespective of past history. It should be a lot easier to get a contract done when the number is in the low hundred thousands as opposed to the millions.
 
[quote="redken" post=291909][quote="Boo Harvey" post=291906]It’s not like we’re hiring Nick Saben. What could possibly be so complicated about this contract? Head coaches are frequently locked up within a day or two no less an assistant coach. We are . . .[/quote]
Boo, you have heard about the $$$ and trauma fallout from Slice's contract, yes? The program can't afford -- literally -- to take another hit like that.[/quote]

Neither can our players. :)

Note: nm=not much

Nvm=never mind
 
[quote="Boo Harvey" post=291914][quote="redken" post=291909][quote="Boo Harvey" post=291906]It’s not like we’re hiring Nick Saben. What could possibly be so complicated about this contract? Head coaches are frequently locked up within a day or two no less an assistant coach. We are . . .[/quote]
Boo, you have heard about the $$$ and trauma fallout from Slice's contract, yes? The program can't afford -- literally -- to take another hit like that.[/quote]

Yup, I’m familiar with it. Not sure that debacle explains the glacial pace of negotiations here. Presumably the school is willing to pay a certain amount and Rice is willing to accept a certain amount. That fact exists, irrespective of past history. It should be a lot easier to get a contract done when the number is in the low hundred thousands as opposed to the millions.[/quote]

How many contracts have you written up? How many contained buy out clauses, behavioral clauses etc.? With someone with issues that plagued Rice in the past, I'm sure that this contract is going to protect the University and they need to make sure every "T" is crossed and every "I" is dotted to protect them at all costs. What difference does it make really if it happens by the end of the week? I don't think the University is concerned about what WE think here on a message board. This isn't minute Rice... It's a slow cooked Rice that will taste great once it's finished. Patience.. Paultz said its almost done.. Get your fork
 
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We could have had him last year for cheaper. He's less cheap now. I think the price he set for himself is much higher that what St. John's thinks it should pay a guy who flamed out at last college gig. Rice is smart enough to know this, so there's bound to be haggling even though both parties know he's taking the job. I'm sure sorting out how much of a raise there will be annually in lieu of relatively low starting salary is something that doesn't get ironed out in a day. I'm not sure you are allowed to build in performance bonus for delivering a player from your AAU program, so that's also language that needs to be properly disguised by legalese.

And of course behavior clauses. Plus if Rice's side wants to build in substantial raise for assuming control of program in the instance of a Mullin retirement, then that's probably a pain in the ass to hammer out as well.

I'm not a lawyer, though, so the ones on the board should feel free to chime in if any of my post seems off.
 
So I am 100% in favor of this move and do believe we would have had 2-3 more wins last year with a stronger coaching staff. What MR did was disgusting IMO, but people with (big) head coaching jobs have done far worse and they are still around. I also believe in second chances and if MR is on our bench, CM and team will keep him in check.

With that said, why can’t I find any mention of this possible coaching addition on that World Wide Web ? Is this hire a real possibility of happening or is this more speculation that the local college sports writers don’t want to report on just yet.
 
[quote="L J S A" post=291921]We could have had him last year for cheaper. He's less cheap now. I think the price he set for himself is much higher that what St. John's thinks it should pay a guy who flamed out at last college gig. Rice is smart enough to know this, so there's bound to be haggling even though both parties know he's taking the job. I'm sure sorting out how much of a raise there will be annually in lieu of relatively low starting salary is something that doesn't get ironed out in a day. I'm not sure you are allowed to build in performance bonus for delivering a player from your AAU program, so that's also language that needs to be properly disguised by legalese.

And of course behavior clauses. Plus if Rice's side wants to build in substantial raise for assuming control of program in the instance of a Mullin retirement, then that's probably a pain in the ass to hammer out as well.

I'm not a lawyer, though, so the ones on the board should feel free to chime in if any of my post seems off.[/quote]

From what we've heard from Paultz, Rice doesn't have any other D-1 assistant coaching offers on the table other than, potentially, St John's. If that's the case, Rice is not negotiating this contract from a position of strength. If this deal falls through, he's still an AAU coach. So, while he would like a certain salary and other perks, he may have to temper his expectations in his first contract to get his "foot back in the door" and prove himself to be the kind of coach and person he will be expected to be. Once he accomplishes that goal, he will be in a far stronger negotiating position the next time around.
 
[quote="CBA1992" post=291922]So I am 100% in favor of this move and do believe we would have had 2-3 more wins last year with a stronger coaching staff. What MR did was disgusting IMO, but people with (big) head coaching jobs have done far worse and they are still around. I also believe in second chances and if MR is on our bench, CM and team will keep him in check.

With that said, why can’t I find any mention of this possible coaching addition on that World Wide Web ? Is this hire a real possibility of happening or is this more speculation that the local college sports writers don’t want to report on just yet.[/quote]
After meeting with Mullin several times in last year, my impression is he met with SJU Administration last week which went well. If there are no contract snags, it may just be a matter of Mullin choosing when to announce. It “ain’t over till it’s over” especially here, but I would be quite surprised if this does not happen. I give Rice credit for a great deal of patience, but then again he really wants the job and opportunity to stay local & not uproot family.
 
[quote="rawdognyc" post=291919][quote="Boo Harvey" post=291914][quote="redken" post=291909][quote="Boo Harvey" post=291906]It’s not like we’re hiring Nick Saben. What could possibly be so complicated about this contract? Head coaches are frequently locked up within a day or two no less an assistant coach. We are . . .[/quote]
Boo, you have heard about the $$$ and trauma fallout from Slice's contract, yes? The program can't afford -- literally -- to take another hit like that.[/quote]

Yup, I’m familiar with it. Not sure that debacle explains the glacial pace of negotiations here. Presumably the school is willing to pay a certain amount and Rice is willing to accept a certain amount. That fact exists, irrespective of past history. It should be a lot easier to get a contract done when the number is in the low hundred thousands as opposed to the millions.[/quote]

How many contracts have you written up? How many contained buy out clauses, behavioral clauses etc.? With someone with issues that plagued Rice in the past, I'm sure that this contract is going to protect the University and they need to make sure every "T" is crossed and every "I" is dotted to protect them at all costs. What difference does it make really if it happens by the end of the week? I don't think the University is concerned about what WE think here on a message board. This isn't minute Rice... It's a slow cooked Rice that will taste great once it's finished. Patience.. Paultz said its almost done.. Get your fork[/quote]

I’m an attorney so I’ve drafted quite a few contracts, including employment agreements.
 
I realize some of us including myself especially are being a bit impatient, but you have to admit this has taken a very long time even considering the complex contract. I believe someone said this has been going on for over a year and not sure if that's true but it feels like it. Every day that goes by without him being hired is one more day Rice can't text Scottie Lewis and co. and say "hey, it's official come join me at St. John's!". I know, some will ask, "how do you know that hasn't already happened behind the scenes?". But recruits will wait for the official word IMO. You have to remember that other programs have their pedal to the floor with these top 2019 guys we are chasing. We need all the help we can get as soon as we can, though I'm being realistic in realizing he will likely bring none even if hired.

You can't blame a fanbase for being impatient after going through so much of the same for so long. Fans want to see things get done in a timely manner. That's typical and completely understandable. It comes from a good place IMO because it shows eagerness. I wonder if lawyers just drag things out intentionally if they're paid hourly. I know there are advocates people can hire and they talk about nothing over and over because they get paid hourly.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=291926]I realize some of us including myself especially are being a bit impatient, but you have to admit this has taken a very long time even considering the complex contract. I believe someone said this has been going on for over a year and not sure if that's true but it feels like it. Every day that goes by without him being hired is one more day Rice can't text Scottie Lewis and co. and say "hey, it's official come join me at St. John's!". I know, some will ask, "how do you know that hasn't already happened behind the scenes?". But recruits will wait for the official word IMO. You have to remember that other programs have their pedal to the floor with these top 2019 guys we are chasing. We need all the help we can get as soon as we can, though I'm being realistic in realizing he will likely bring none even if hired.

You can't blame a fanbase for being impatient after going through so much of the same for so long. Fans want to see things get done in a timely manner. That's typical and completely understandable. It comes from a good place IMO because it shows eagerness. I wonder if lawyers just drag things out intentionally if they're paid hourly. I know there are advocates people can hire and they talk about nothing over and over because they get paid hourly.[/quote]

I heard the lawyers want to bill for 12 more hours, however I’m not sure how many days or weeks that will be spread out by. So we just have to wait.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=291926] I know there are advocates people can hire and they talk about nothing over and over because they get paid hourly.[/quote]

If I ever need one.........
 
It's been pointed out by other posters, but given the Slice debacle which is apparently still costing the school money and the circumstances around Rice leaving his last job, the school would be crazy not to proceed cautiously and make sure all contractual bases are covered. If this isn't done by the end of next week, I might start to wonder. Maybe we all need a week at the beach. .
 
[quote="L J S A" post=291921]We could have had him last year for cheaper. He's less cheap now. I think the price he set for himself is much higher that what St. John's thinks it should pay a guy who flamed out at last college gig. Rice is smart enough to know this, so there's bound to be haggling even though both parties know he's taking the job. I'm sure sorting out how much of a raise there will be annually in lieu of relatively low starting salary is something that doesn't get ironed out in a day. I'm not sure you are allowed to build in performance bonus for delivering a player from your AAU program, so that's also language that needs to be properly disguised by legalese.

And of course behavior clauses. Plus if Rice's side wants to build in substantial raise for assuming control of program in the instance of a Mullin retirement, then that's probably a pain in the ass to hammer out as well.

I'm not a lawyer, though, so the ones on the board should feel free to chime in if any of my post seems off.[/quote]
LJSA, I, for one, am perfectly OK with the university having put off signing Rice for an additional year, even though it might cost more money. Putting that extra year of distance between his acting like a madman at Rutgers and joining our staff -- another year of stable, under-control behavior -- makes me considerably more comfortable with signing him, whereas a year ago, I was very wary of it.
 
[quote="redken" post=291941]
LJSA, I, for one, am perfectly OK with the university having put off signing Rice for an additional year, even though it might cost more money. Putting that extra year of distance between his acting like a madman at Rutgers and joining our staff -- another year of stable, under-control behavior -- makes me considerably more comfortable with signing him, whereas a year ago, I was very wary of it.[/quote]

I was one of the posters who wasn't wary, but certainly understand your position.
 
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[quote="Mike Zaun" post=291926]I realize some of us including myself especially are being a bit impatient, but you have to admit this has taken a very long time even considering the complex contract.[/quote]

Two weeks doesn't seem extraordinarily long to me. It was speculated many times here that finishing out the AAU season was beneficial to all parties involved, and that just ended.
 
[quote="MarkRedman" post=291923]
From what we've heard from Paultz, Rice doesn't have any other D-1 assistant coaching offers on the table other than, potentially, St John's. If that's the case, Rice is not negotiating this contract from a position of strength. If this deal falls through, he's still an AAU coach. So, while he would like a certain salary and other perks, he may have to temper his expectations in his first contract to get his "foot back in the door" and prove himself to be the kind of coach and person he will be expected to be. Once he accomplishes that goal, he will be in a far stronger negotiating position the next time around.[/quote]

Do we think it would be a two-year deal? Longer? Some sort of annual rollover like Norm had? Does he start in the low 2s? I think we pay everyone else in the high 3s and 4s, so how low is too low before it seems like a slap in the face? (I assume it would have to be a real lowball offer in this case to cause anger considering the situation.)

Not sure any of this would be revealed, but I'm really interested in those details.
 
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