When Keita Returns

[quote="Chicago Days" post=311534][quote="Marillac" post=311522][quote="Beast of the East" post=311405][quote="Room112" post=311357][quote="stjohnnie75" post=311340]https://twitter.com/stjohnsbball/status/1080316032621924353?s=21[/quote]

You've got to love these kids.[/quote]

Keita when not in, was a gigantic cheerleader on the bench. The only thing that prevented last night's game from being perfect was Marillac not apologizing to Keita to his face.[/quote]

Never. I posted the night of the SH game that he'd play in this game. It makes his absence that much more egregious to me. This is a 7-week old injury...not some fresh sprained ankle. How is it possible for him to play with no visible sign of injury 68 hours after the SH game ended but not play in the SH game? The kid was running around and agile as ever against Marquette. He couldn't give 5 minutes against SH? His teammates needed him and any tough player would have answered that call if it was even close. He proved last night he was.

I know they all read these forums and I wanted end his free pass on here.[/quote]

I think you’re of the rails on this, Marillac.
Neither you nor me, nor 99.9% of posters know the extent of Keita’s injury and surgery repair.
There wasn’t a whisper from our coaches nor any grumblings from any players regarding Keita’s rehab integrity (that I’m aware of) that gives any credence to your continual harping about the kid’s—in your view—‘slow’ recovery from arthroscopic knee surgery to be able toplay in a high major D1 hoops game.
You’ve questioned the kid’s toughness and honesty, and you are way off base in my view and you, yeah you, should apologize punlbicly to Keita.
Almost better yet, just shaddup about it.[/quote]

Believe me...I'm all too familiar with knee and shoulder injuries. I'm also familiar with treatment in the SJU training room. I understand I played before the world went soft and before the whole concussion and athlete first mentality was born, but the athlete is still in sole control over whether he gets cleared to play based on the info he gives the trainer. The trainer has to rely on the athlete's subjective level of discomfort. It was standard to fib or even downright lie just 15 years ago. That doesn't mean I think I'm Rambo, but I got cleared by that same training room to play when I knew for a fact I had one big hit left in my shoulder. It was simple: Them: "Does it hurt?" Me "Nope" and then some range of motion where you don't outwardly show pain. Boom...cleared.

Chris Snee had 28 surgeries and procedures and never missed time. He was basically Frankenstein.
 
[quote="Marillac" post=311543][quote="Chicago Days" post=311534][quote="Marillac" post=311522][quote="Beast of the East" post=311405][quote="Room112" post=311357][quote="stjohnnie75" post=311340]https://twitter.com/stjohnsbball/status/1080316032621924353?s=21[/quote]

You've got to love these kids.[/quote]

Keita when not in, was a gigantic cheerleader on the bench. The only thing that prevented last night's game from being perfect was Marillac not apologizing to Keita to his face.[/quote]

Never. I posted the night of the SH game that he'd play in this game. It makes his absence that much more egregious to me. This is a 7-week old injury...not some fresh sprained ankle. How is it possible for him to play with no visible sign of injury 68 hours after the SH game ended but not play in the SH game? The kid was running around and agile as ever against Marquette. He couldn't give 5 minutes against SH? His teammates needed him and any tough player would have answered that call if it was even close. He proved last night he was.

I know they all read these forums and I wanted end his free pass on here.[/quote]

I think you’re of the rails on this, Marillac.
Neither you nor me, nor 99.9% of posters know the extent of Keita’s injury and surgery repair.
There wasn’t a whisper from our coaches nor any grumblings from any players regarding Keita’s rehab integrity (that I’m aware of) that gives any credence to your continual harping about the kid’s—in your view—‘slow’ recovery from arthroscopic knee surgery to be able toplay in a high major D1 hoops game.
You’ve questioned the kid’s toughness and honesty, and you are way off base in my view and you, yeah you, should apologize punlbicly to Keita.
Almost better yet, just shaddup about it.[/quote]

Believe me...I'm all too familiar with knee and shoulder injuries. I'm also familiar with treatment in the SJU training room. I understand I played before the world went soft and before the whole concussion and athlete first mentality was born, but the athlete is still in sole control over whether he gets cleared to play based on the info he gives the trainer. The trainer has to rely on the athlete's subjective level of discomfort. It was standard to fib or even downright lie just 15 years ago. That doesn't mean I think I'm Rambo, but I got cleared by that same training room to play when I knew for a fact I had one big hit left in my shoulder. It was simple: Them: "Does it hurt?" Me "Nope" and then some range of motion where you don't outwardly show pain. Boom...cleared.

Chris Snee had 28 surgeries and procedures and never missed time. He was basically Frankenstein.[/quote]

Lots of former NFL players regret that mindset. Jim Otto I recall was one. Wayne Chrebet shoudl have stopped playing long before that. Many are virtual cripples, guys who were given cortisone shots and pain killers to mask pain and reduce normal swelling to keep them on the field, mostly in the days where if you were injured, you might be out of football soon. Nothing glorious or manly about that. Guys were ruined for life.
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=311549][quote="Marillac" post=311543][quote="Chicago Days" post=311534][quote="Marillac" post=311522][quote="Beast of the East" post=311405][quote="Room112" post=311357][quote="stjohnnie75" post=311340]https://twitter.com/stjohnsbball/status/1080316032621924353?s=21[/quote]

You've got to love these kids.[/quote]

Keita when not in, was a gigantic cheerleader on the bench. The only thing that prevented last night's game from being perfect was Marillac not apologizing to Keita to his face.[/quote]

Never. I posted the night of the SH game that he'd play in this game. It makes his absence that much more egregious to me. This is a 7-week old injury...not some fresh sprained ankle. How is it possible for him to play with no visible sign of injury 68 hours after the SH game ended but not play in the SH game? The kid was running around and agile as ever against Marquette. He couldn't give 5 minutes against SH? His teammates needed him and any tough player would have answered that call if it was even close. He proved last night he was.

I know they all read these forums and I wanted end his free pass on here.[/quote]

I think you’re of the rails on this, Marillac.
Neither you nor me, nor 99.9% of posters know the extent of Keita’s injury and surgery repair.
There wasn’t a whisper from our coaches nor any grumblings from any players regarding Keita’s rehab integrity (that I’m aware of) that gives any credence to your continual harping about the kid’s—in your view—‘slow’ recovery from arthroscopic knee surgery to be able toplay in a high major D1 hoops game.
You’ve questioned the kid’s toughness and honesty, and you are way off base in my view and you, yeah you, should apologize punlbicly to Keita.
Almost better yet, just shaddup about it.[/quote]

Believe me...I'm all too familiar with knee and shoulder injuries. I'm also familiar with treatment in the SJU training room. I understand I played before the world went soft and before the whole concussion and athlete first mentality was born, but the athlete is still in sole control over whether he gets cleared to play based on the info he gives the trainer. The trainer has to rely on the athlete's subjective level of discomfort. It was standard to fib or even downright lie just 15 years ago. That doesn't mean I think I'm Rambo, but I got cleared by that same training room to play when I knew for a fact I had one big hit left in my shoulder. It was simple: Them: "Does it hurt?" Me "Nope" and then some range of motion where you don't outwardly show pain. Boom...cleared.

Chris Snee had 28 surgeries and procedures and never missed time. He was basically Frankenstein.[/quote]

Lots of former NFL players regret that mindset. Jim Otto I recall was one. Wayne Chrebet shoudl have stopped playing long before that. Many are virtual cripples, guys who were given cortisone shots and pain killers to mask pain and reduce normal swelling to keep them on the field, mostly in the days where if you were injured, you might be out of football soon. Nothing glorious or manly about that. Guys were ruined for life.[/quote]

We'll have to disagree on that. Playing 4-5 minutes at center in basketball is not a tall task with a knee brace. That would have been all we needed. He was able to shoot warmups and jump around the sideline in dress shoes but he couldn't play a few minutes at a time? I find that hard to believe. Showing up 68 hours later making cuts and moving well laterally doesn't help that IMO. I'm happy to drop this, but I won't change my mind.
 
I think their is a line of demarcation between a professional athlete and a college kid playing basketball.
In the case of a professional many with guaranteed contracts won't or will refuse to play with minor ailments or at least in cases that they are not 100%. The difference between hurt and injured. Their reasoning (like it or agree with it or not) is that when they play hurt their numbers are hurt and drives down their next payday. I don't believe this drives all pro players but their certainly are a number of them who have this belief. The topic has been discussed during arbitration hearings. Teams have routinely denigrated their own player to win the salary case as an example. Then when its over they slap the guy on the back, smile and say "your our guy, we love you!"
Now, this should not be confused with a college athlete who gets paid absolutely nothing. It is unfair, without any idea of the injury or medical history that someone is or isn't able to play. Let's stick with the medical pros and let them make the decisions as to the who what and when a kid is ready and able to play.
 
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[quote="Marillac" post=311543][quote="Chicago Days" post=311534][quote="Marillac" post=311522][quote="Beast of the East" post=311405][quote="Room112" post=311357][quote="stjohnnie75" post=311340]https://twitter.com/stjohnsbball/status/1080316032621924353?s=21[/quote]

You've got to love these kids.[/quote]

Keita when not in, was a gigantic cheerleader on the bench. The only thing that prevented last night's game from being perfect was Marillac not apologizing to Keita to his face.[/quote]

Never. I posted the night of the SH game that he'd play in this game. It makes his absence that much more egregious to me. This is a 7-week old injury...not some fresh sprained ankle. How is it possible for him to play with no visible sign of injury 68 hours after the SH game ended but not play in the SH game? The kid was running around and agile as ever against Marquette. He couldn't give 5 minutes against SH? His teammates needed him and any tough player would have answered that call if it was even close. He proved last night he was.

I know they all read these forums and I wanted end his free pass on here.[/quote]

I think you’re of the rails on this, Marillac.
Neither you nor me, nor 99.9% of posters know the extent of Keita’s injury and surgery repair.
There wasn’t a whisper from our coaches nor any grumblings from any players regarding Keita’s rehab integrity (that I’m aware of) that gives any credence to your continual harping about the kid’s—in your view—‘slow’ recovery from arthroscopic knee surgery to be able toplay in a high major D1 hoops game.
You’ve questioned the kid’s toughness and honesty, and you are way off base in my view and you, yeah you, should apologize punlbicly to Keita.
Almost better yet, just shaddup about it.[/quote]

Believe me...I'm all too familiar with knee and shoulder injuries. I'm also familiar with treatment in the SJU training room. I understand I played before the world went soft and before the whole concussion and athlete first mentality was born, but the athlete is still in sole control over whether he gets cleared to play based on the info he gives the trainer. The trainer has to rely on the athlete's subjective level of discomfort. It was standard to fib or even downright lie just 15 years ago. That doesn't mean I think I'm Rambo, but I got cleared by that same training room to play when I knew for a fact I had one big hit left in my shoulder. It was simple: Them: "Does it hurt?" Me "Nope" and then some range of motion where you don't outwardly show pain. Boom...cleared.

Chris Snee had 28 surgeries and procedures and never missed time. He was basically Frankenstein.[/quote]

I luv Chris Snee, but those were different times. Guys played to save their livelihoods and as Beast notes often became cripples later in life.
I agree that toughness in sports and in life—to be resolute and forge on at a critical time, to be heroic—is admirable and should be honored.
Just saying that we don’t know the details here of Keita’s injury.
He seemed totally engaged in the progress of the game when on the bench.
He played last night and hopefully this is behind him and the team.
Time to move on and root like hell.
It could be a legendary season in the making.
 
Good news is Keita is back and will help us a lot going forward. Time to move on. We are 13-1 (should be 14-0) so not like we were mortally wounded by his absence.
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=311566]Good news is Keita is back and will help us a lot going forward. Time to move on. We are 13-1 (should be 14-0) so not like we were mortally wounded by his absence.[/quote]

Well said.
 
[quote="IDRAFT" post=311537]Nothing he does on the court will top his ability to get a few of the dead men sitting to stand in Section 7. Those seatbacks must be REALLY comfortable, those guys never leave them unoccupied.[/quote]
Actually a lot of them don't even show up. Being at the game on same side of chair backs but on second level in corner section can't really see how filled the seats are in those sections. Watched game on TV today and the large number of empty seats in the chair back sections is disconcerting and a bad look on TV.
 
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