We Need Rysheed

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

 

[paultzman]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

 

[room112]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

 

[lawmanfan]

The current state of the team is not purely a "we need Rysheed" problem.

By my count, in the Butler game (which I attended), we got a total of zero points from the bench. Zero, zip, nada.

So if Jordan played then perhaps we would have gotten 6 or 8 points from the bench, which may well have turned the outcome of that game.

But realistically, you cannot expect to win games when you are getting production from 5 players. Or even 6 players, especially when the result of playing your 6th player is that you are often playing a 5 guard lineup.

You're right in principal, expect Butler got a total of 0 points from their bench on Saturday as well.

It was also the rare close game that didn't come down to free throw shooting. Butler was 14-20 from the line, we were 15-19.

An all-around strange game statistically.

Yeah, especially their 3 pt. shooting. You could make the case that in both BE losses we ran into exceptionally hot shooting from beyond the arc, a couple of misses in either game and we could be 2-0.

I don't think you can say that good 3 point shooting against us is an aberration. We have had a predictable vulnerability to being hurt by the 3 point shot against teams that move the basketball well around the perimeter. Anybody who can swing it to the corner can get a good look against us before we rotate and extend on D.

Though in fairness it's been less so this year and we also have not been getting killed by back doors, which is nice.

 

[room112]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

 

[MarkRedman]

The reality is that transfers are happening at an alarming rate nationwide
Kids aren't willing to "pay their dues" and "wait their turn" anymore
They've been coddled since they were little kids and want immediate gratification
I am more concerned about the kids that we counted on having that had significant academic issues when they were being recruited (ie: Pelle, Sampson, Thomas, ADR, etc)

 

[1and1sju]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

You would send your own son to play for Lavin?

 

[room112]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

So there have or haven't been transfer of note? I'm just responding to your claim, not everything else that has happened here.

 

[monte]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

So there have or haven't been transfer of note? I'm just responding to your claim, not everything else that has happened here.

Amir

 

[ras]

Polee. But I can't blame him, he was recruited over.

 

[simplyred]

Polee. But I can't blame him, he was recruited over.

So he lied when he said it was to be closer to his ill mother? And his continued relationship with Lavin is just a cover up?

 

[ras]

Polee. But I can't blame him, he was recruited over.

So he lied when he said it was to be closer to his ill mother? And his continued relationship with Lavin is just a cover up?

A lot of wings and similar,higher ranked players in the 11 class. I also believe it was Polees father who wanted the transfer, Speaking of Polee, I hope he is all-right, Ironically many didn't qualify and he would have gotten plenty of burn. But on paper ,it looked like his PT would be limited.

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

You would send your own son to play for Lavin?

Seriously, I would. The first criteria for me was surrounding my kids with people that cared about them as people first. The best coaches, teachers, bosses, whatever, have this attribute. I'll go so far as to say I don't know if I'd like Lavin personally, but based on how he's handled these players, with toughness, yet caring, is something I have to admire about him.

 

[beast of the east]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

So there have or haven't been transfer of note? I'm just responding to your claim, not everything else that has happened here.

Amir

Garrett's transfer had nothing to do with bad feelings about this program. He had to devote more time to baseball but wanted to compete in basketball at some level. You want to put THAT on Lavin? Come on.

 

[monte]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

So there have or haven't been transfer of note? I'm just responding to your claim, not everything else that has happened here.

Amir

Garrett's transfer had nothing to do with bad feelings about this program. He had to devote more time to baseball but wanted to compete in basketball at some level. You want to put THAT on Lavin? Come on.

You asked for transfers of note. I mentioned "Amir". One word.

 

[room112]

I do have a tendency to be an "I told you so person", but last week I cautioned against those wanting to extend Lavin immediately, because in two or three games everything could change quickly.

Then when everything changed quickly so many of us went berserk and were calling for Lavin's head, some immediately despite the result of doing that back in the Jarvis era. I suggested we just be patient, and asked that we let the Jordan saga play out. After I calmed down I suggested that he had so few options, that I thought he'd be back.

Now I am not suggesting that the Jordan tale is over yet, but I do think that Coach Lavin played his hand as well as possible. When you consider that in less than 2 years, it looked like Harrison, Obekpa, Greene, and now Jordan were headed out the door, never to be seen again, Coach Lavin masterfully brought them back. If you don't think that Lavin has built up incredible trust and respect from these kids prior to whatever event caused them to be headed for the exits, you are sadly mistaken. Guys like the aforementioned don't suddenly listen to words of wisdom from their soon-to-be-ex-coach unless they have a sincere belief that he looks out for their best interests, and their best interest is to be here at SJU. For this reason and this reason alone, I think he ranks as the best post-Carnesecca era coach of the Johnnies, even if he should be gone after this season/

We can lose every game, miss the tournament, fire Lavin justly for any number of failures, but NONE of this should be lost on you knuckleheads. I might not think Lavin is the best coach in the world, but I tell you I would trust my own kids to him, and that's the highest praise I can give him.

That "tendency" has been very clear Beast.

Just follow along with me. Optimism bounded by probable events has its merits.

Not to say you're wrong, but why are so many kids on the verge of being out the door in the first place? The number of transfers/defections/statements of wanting out that have taken place since he took over is a bit alarming. Now I'm not saying this doesn't happen elsewhere, but the number seems very high.

Why? IMO, there are an increased number of kids that have never had to listen to anyone. Not parents, not relatives, not teachers, hs coaches. then you end up in a structured system with other D1 worthy athletes, and you pout because you aren't the star. Obekpa blew a gasket because Lavin put him on the bench vs. Providence despite the fact that it was Obekpa who committed dumb fouls away from the basket in this and many other games. Harrison's meltdowns were well documented, and Jordan had multiple infractions from lateness to AWOL. You want to put that on the coach because there were so many - be my guest. But if I had to guess, there are a lot of dirtbag coaches out there in D1 that would ignore all of that stuff if the players just earn him his paycheck. Lavin isn't exactly recruiting Riker's island or Grady Reynolds for that matter. They appear to be good kids who just need(ed) some discipline.

Ok and what about the extremely high number who have transferred out?

Can you run the names by me during Lavin's tenure? I'm not talking about the fringe players like Hooper, who has gone through schools in rapid succession, or court failures like Nurideen Lindsay. I'm not being argumentative. Why of note has Lavin lost?

It hasn't just been the transfers though. It's been suspensions, players ineligible, players recruited that never made it to campus. All of this has added up to an extreme amount of instability that has never been smoothed over. Now we're left with 6 serviceable players this year, and way less next year.

So there have or haven't been transfer of note? I'm just responding to your claim, not everything else that has happened here.

Amir

Garrett's transfer had nothing to do with bad feelings about this program. He had to devote more time to baseball but wanted to compete in basketball at some level. You want to put THAT on Lavin? Come on.

If you think there were no "transfers of note" then perhaps that reveals a bigger problem, as to why these players were ever recruited?