Tulane

[Section3]

J

Another great, dominating win. This team is playing incredible basketball right now.

One small item that could give us an additional boost offensively is PGIV buying into the extra pass and improving his overall offensive efficiency. It's weird, because he is clearly one of the most team-oriented kids we have, so it's not from a place of selfishness. But our (often elite) ball movement stops on him too much, he drives with his head down (especially on the break), and he is mostly just looking to shoot.

Unfortunately the numbers back this up, and don't support it as an effective approach. Of our first 6, only Obekpa has less assists. On the flip side, of those 6, PGIV has the lowest FG%, the only one in the rotation below 40% (by a pretty wide margin, 44% to 38%), but yet has the second most shot attempts on the team.

Phil does a lot of things well, and even if he's not going to shoot it at a high %, we need him to be a threat to shoot it (especially from 3) to keep defenses as honest as we can. But if these numbers continue this needs to be reeled in. With the strength of some of the defenses we are going to play the next 2.5 months (and hopefully beyond), offensive efficiency is critical and this is an inefficiency for us right now. I don't think we are far off on it, just an area to fine-tune.

Outstanding observation on Phil. His shooting over the past four games has been dreadful & he gets a ton of shots. I appreciate what he did at Syracuse, but net of those final makes, he was having a poor shooting night. As you noted, he must improve on the perimeter or take less shots. I am not a Phill hater, but question why he merits so many attempts in light of his performance to date. With the team doing a better job penetrating and kicking to open perimeter guys, he will have his opportunities. Hopefully he takes advantage of them in BE play. If not, it is not heresy to suggest he get less minutes.

Phile needs to find a spot and wait for the ball to find him...when he has his feet set, he shoots it well...when he is moving, not so much...he does a lot of good things...finishing at rim is not on of them...probably because, as noted, he dribbles with head down

 

[monte]

Will be interesting to see if The Torch lobby's for an extension on their web site (www.torchonline.com) after the team's 7th straight win.

Saw Roger Rubin and Kieran Lynch, among others, state on Twitter, that this is our best start since '85-6


http://www.rumbleinthegarden.com/st...-final-st-johns-82-57-dom-pointer-career-high

http://zagsblog.com/articles/st-joh...n-last-game-before-big-east-play/#more-126527

Still too early to talk about that JSJ.
But I'll admit he's doing his best to deserve an extension. Not there yet though.

In whose mind? You and Otis for sure Desco, however maybe this brings you around.
The tie,
[attachment]Coach_Lavin_of_St._Johns_University_2010.jpg[/attachment]

Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves. The results this yearnare great but if Jordan and Obekpa leave as expected, our future is scary. We need recruiting results badly. Although I'm not confident we get someone better anyway

From one neurotic worrier to another: Can we just enjoy this year, and worry about next year when it comes?

Oh I'm fully enjoying this season. But we can't just blindly base the future on this year's results and start handing out extensions. Lavin's job is to produce results on the court and also recruit.

Wish we could just drop the whole extension talk till after the season is over. That would make me feel so much better.

 

[OLV72]

Dom's playing really really well, but I think handling the ball on the break is still his weakness.

Finishing on the break? Not a problem.
But he's still good for two turnovers on the break per game.

Simply not true as he averages just 1.6 TO playing 33 minutes a game while leading the team with 3.3 assists per game.

That doesn't mean he's best at running the break as you also mentioned in a post above. When he grabs a rebound and dribbles it's downright frightening. Pretty safe that the vast majority of his 1.6 per game come from those ill advised coast to coast and his 3.3 come from sweet dishes in a half court set where he is being utilized properly for the first time in his career.

Frightening to you and to opponents. Pretty safe that many of his nice dishes are in transition. Completely safe that this staff has full confidence in him when he has the ball.

You are completely wrong here and sorry to be the bearer of that news. If you can't see when he dribbles up the middle of the floor he get it *poked from behind or dribbles directly INTO a defender.

Dom is frightening when barreling down the lane without the ball or receiving it to a defender.

But congrats on bringing me out to make the kid look bad after the best game of his career. Mission accomplished. But I know what I see when I watch a game.

No harm intended. Perhaps his play during the remainder of the season will prove your point, but I'll stand by my my response to the original post. He can't possibly be "good for two turnovers on the break per game", when he has had one or no TO's in half the games he's played in this season and averages less than 2 per game. I realize that my comment that he's best at running the break is what probably prompted your post. I may be wrong on that, but I probably won't see it that way. And I know I'm in the minority on this point as many in my section make nervous noises (accompanied by four letter words) when Dom is flying down the court with ball in hand.

 

[Russ2374]

so um why can't you hand out a contract extension based on this year's results?

Imagine Lavin were a cook. In his first season he threw the already prepared dinner in the oven and heated it up. Maybe added some salt. It was pretty good, but not quite satisfying. In the second season he served excrement sandwich. In the third season he made a presentable main course but the Robert Morris Humble Pie for dessert left a bad taste. This year he's made a delicious appetizer. Why not eat the meal before judging the chef. Because looking at next year's ingredients this will be the last good meal for a while, the cupboard is looking bare.

You can't give an extension based on this year's results simply because the year is not over yet. We haven't played a conference game yet so we've accomplished nothing. If we start off 0-5 in the Big East again it won't matter that we started 11-1. If we go to the final four though the guy should get a lifetime contract even if he rolls out Amar, Felix and the Del A Rosas next year.

At the same time the recruiting year is not over yet either. There are plenty of good players out there regardless of whether the experts here have heard of them or have a clue that we are involved with them. Transfers are a huge part of the game as well. Look at Gonzaga.

People also conveniently always leave out that we inherited 10 seniors so the next year was going to be a rebuilding year no matter who we signed. Coach happened to sign a great class including one special player who was 1 and done. When was the last time St John's had a 1 and done type talent prior to that? People also conveniently leave out that coach got cancer and didn't really coach year 2. Who knows the impact that year had on recruiting but coach gets no slack for that. And year 1 was incredible. Norm would not have beaten Duke, Pitt, ND, Nova, and the eventual national champs the way we did. If DJ doesn't get hurt and we dont get a terrible 1st round draw, we probably make a lot of noise in the tourney.

Regardless in 5 years coach has signed pros Harkless, Sampson, our 5th all time leading scorer, and 2 guys that everyone already have leaving us for the pros. Yet everyone is so worried that he has somehow forgot how to recruit. Who are we replacing him with that gets us better talent? Why is changing coaches every 4-5 years the answer? Can we not deal with 1 down year considering we've had almost 3 decades of it? We need to sign 3-4 good players this year and repeat every year. No more 10 player classes that lead to what we've seen the past 5 years. I think coach understands that and we'll see a more balanced approach should we be lucky enough to keep coach here for an extended period.

If we fall apart from here and don't make the dance, I'm for a change as well. I just don't see that happening and hopefully our "fans" will be rooting for it not to happen. It appears that many are instead hoping things fall apart so they can say "I told you so."

 

[beast of the east]

J

Another great, dominating win. This team is playing incredible basketball right now.

One small item that could give us an additional boost offensively is PGIV buying into the extra pass and improving his overall offensive efficiency. It's weird, because he is clearly one of the most team-oriented kids we have, so it's not from a place of selfishness. But our (often elite) ball movement stops on him too much, he drives with his head down (especially on the break), and he is mostly just looking to shoot.

Unfortunately the numbers back this up, and don't support it as an effective approach. Of our first 6, only Obekpa has less assists. On the flip side, of those 6, PGIV has the lowest FG%, the only one in the rotation below 40% (by a pretty wide margin, 44% to 38%), but yet has the second most shot attempts on the team.

Phil does a lot of things well, and even if he's not going to shoot it at a high %, we need him to be a threat to shoot it (especially from 3) to keep defenses as honest as we can. But if these numbers continue this needs to be reeled in. With the strength of some of the defenses we are going to play the next 2.5 months (and hopefully beyond), offensive efficiency is critical and this is an inefficiency for us right now. I don't think we are far off on it, just an area to fine-tune.

Outstanding observation on Phil. His shooting over the past four games has been dreadful & he gets a ton of shots. I appreciate what he did at Syracuse, but net of those final makes, he was having a poor shooting night. As you noted, he must improve on the perimeter or take less shots. I am not a Phill hater, but question why he merits so many attempts in light of his performance to date. With the team doing a better job penetrating and kicking to open perimeter guys, he will have his opportunities. Hopefully he takes advantage of them in BE play. If not, it is not heresy to suggest he get less minutes.

Phile needs to find a spot and wait for the ball to find him...when he has his feet set, he shoots it well...when he is moving, not so much...he does a lot of good things...finishing at rim is not on of them...probably because, as noted, he dribbles with head down

Question: Who doesn't shoot better when he receives the ball with his feet set, shoulders squared to the basket, and ready to catch and shoot (except maybe Walter Berry)?

 

[beast of the east]

Dom's playing really really well, but I think handling the ball on the break is still his weakness.

Finishing on the break? Not a problem.
But he's still good for two turnovers on the break per game.

Simply not true as he averages just 1.6 TO playing 33 minutes a game while leading the team with 3.3 assists per game.

That doesn't mean he's best at running the break as you also mentioned in a post above. When he grabs a rebound and dribbles it's downright frightening. Pretty safe that the vast majority of his 1.6 per game come from those ill advised coast to coast and his 3.3 come from sweet dishes in a half court set where he is being utilized properly for the first time in his career.

Frightening to you and to opponents. Pretty safe that many of his nice dishes are in transition. Completely safe that this staff has full confidence in him when he has the ball.

You are completely wrong here and sorry to be the bearer of that news. If you can't see when he dribbles up the middle of the floor he get it *poked from behind or dribbles directly INTO a defender.

Dom is frightening when barreling down the lane without the ball or receiving it to a defender.

But congrats on bringing me out to make the kid look bad after the best game of his career. Mission accomplished. But I know what I see when I watch a game.

No harm intended. Perhaps his play during the remainder of the season will prove your point, but I'll stand by my my response to the original post. He can't possibly be "good for two turnovers on the break per game", when he has had one or no TO's in half the games he's played in this season and averages less than 2 per game. I realize that my comment that he's best at running the break is what probably prompted your post. I may be wrong on that, but I probably won't see it that way. And I know I'm in the minority on this point as many in my section make nervous noises (accompanied by four letter words) when Dom is flying down the court with ball in hand.

Maybe I've set a low bar, but after watching the human natural disaster Sean Evans taking off down the court with ball in hands, Sir Dom looks more to be like Jason Kidd. With all the energy and productivity he brings to the court lately, right now I wouldn't refine too much in his game, and would live with an occasional transgression.

 

[Section3]

J

Another great, dominating win. This team is playing incredible basketball right now.

One small item that could give us an additional boost offensively is PGIV buying into the extra pass and improving his overall offensive efficiency. It's weird, because he is clearly one of the most team-oriented kids we have, so it's not from a place of selfishness. But our (often elite) ball movement stops on him too much, he drives with his head down (especially on the break), and he is mostly just looking to shoot.

Unfortunately the numbers back this up, and don't support it as an effective approach. Of our first 6, only Obekpa has less assists. On the flip side, of those 6, PGIV has the lowest FG%, the only one in the rotation below 40% (by a pretty wide margin, 44% to 38%), but yet has the second most shot attempts on the team.

Phil does a lot of things well, and even if he's not going to shoot it at a high %, we need him to be a threat to shoot it (especially from 3) to keep defenses as honest as we can. But if these numbers continue this needs to be reeled in. With the strength of some of the defenses we are going to play the next 2.5 months (and hopefully beyond), offensive efficiency is critical and this is an inefficiency for us right now. I don't think we are far off on it, just an area to fine-tune.

Outstanding observation on Phil. His shooting over the past four games has been dreadful & he gets a ton of shots. I appreciate what he did at Syracuse, but net of those final makes, he was having a poor shooting night. As you noted, he must improve on the perimeter or take less shots. I am not a Phill hater, but question why he merits so many attempts in light of his performance to date. With the team doing a better job penetrating and kicking to open perimeter guys, he will have his opportunities. Hopefully he takes advantage of them in BE play. If not, it is not heresy to suggest he get less minutes.

Phile needs to find a spot and wait for the ball to find him...when he has his feet set, he shoots it well...when he is moving, not so much...he does a lot of good things...finishing at rim is not on of them...probably because, as noted, he dribbles with head down

Question: Who doesn't shoot better when he receives the ball with his feet set, shoulders squared to the basket, and ready to catch and shoot (except maybe Walter Berry)?

Plenty...Dom for one shoots much better when he takes few dribbles left as it seems to square him up

 

[monte]

so um why can't you hand out a contract extension based on this year's results?

Imagine Lavin were a cook. In his first season he threw the already prepared dinner in the oven and heated it up. Maybe added some salt. It was pretty good, but not quite satisfying. In the second season he served excrement sandwich. In the third season he made a presentable main course but the Robert Morris Humble Pie for dessert left a bad taste. This year he's made a delicious appetizer. Why not eat the meal before judging the chef. Because looking at next year's ingredients this will be the last good meal for a while, the cupboard is looking bare.

You can't give an extension based on this year's results simply because the year is not over yet. We haven't played a conference game yet so we've accomplished nothing. If we start off 0-5 in the Big East again it won't matter that we started 11-1. If we go to the final four though the guy should get a lifetime contract even if he rolls out Amar, Felix and the Del A Rosas next year.

At the same time the recruiting year is not over yet either. There are plenty of good players out there regardless of whether the experts here have heard of them or have a clue that we are involved with them. Transfers are a huge part of the game as well. Look at Gonzaga.

People also conveniently always leave out that we inherited 10 seniors so the next year was going to be a rebuilding year no matter who we signed. Coach happened to sign a great class including one special player who was 1 and done. When was the last time St John's had a 1 and done type talent prior to that? People also conveniently leave out that coach got cancer and didn't really coach year 2. Who knows the impact that year had on recruiting but coach gets no slack for that. And year 1 was incredible. Norm would not have beaten Duke, Pitt, ND, Nova, and the eventual national champs the way we did. If DJ doesn't get hurt and we dont get a terrible 1st round draw, we probably make a lot of noise in the tourney.

Regardless in 5 years coach has signed pros Harkless, Sampson, our 5th all time leading scorer, and 2 guys that everyone already have leaving us for the pros. Yet everyone is so worried that he has somehow forgot how to recruit. Who are we replacing him with that gets us better talent? Why is changing coaches every 4-5 years the answer? Can we not deal with 1 down year considering we've had almost 3 decades of it? We need to sign 3-4 good players this year and repeat every year. No more 10 player classes that lead to what we've seen the past 5 years. I think coach understands that and we'll see a more balanced approach should we be lucky enough to keep coach here for an extended period.

If we fall apart from here and don't make the dance, I'm for a change as well. I just don't see that happening and hopefully our "fans" will be rooting for it not to happen. It appears that many are instead hoping things fall apart so they can say "I told you so."

Russ while Lavin did not coach in year 2, we were told that he was spending his time focusing on recruiting. And what about this year's recruiting class? If he had done his job on this year's class, then next year wouldn't be such a huge ?. Changing coaches every 4 or 5 years might not be the answer, but making the tourny every 4 or 5 years is simply not acceptable. I was as down on Lavin as anyone, and I'm as high on this team as anyone. That doesn't mean I think Lavin has all of a sudden turned in to the second coming of Coach K. But I will give credit where credit is due, and I think he's done an excellent job having this team prepared, playing hard and staying focused for 40 minutes game in and game out.. His in-game coaching has also been very good. Having said that, IMO we should just let this season play out before we start debating whether or not an extension is in order. Lets judge him on a complete body of work, not a selective one.

 

[paultzman]

so um why can't you hand out a contract extension based on this year's results?

Imagine Lavin were a cook. In his first season he threw the already prepared dinner in the oven and heated it up. Maybe added some salt. It was pretty good, but not quite satisfying. In the second season he served excrement sandwich. In the third season he made a presentable main course but the Robert Morris Humble Pie for dessert left a bad taste. This year he's made a delicious appetizer. Why not eat the meal before judging the chef. Because looking at next year's ingredients this will be the last good meal for a while, the cupboard is looking bare.

You can't give an extension based on this year's results simply because the year is not over yet. We haven't played a conference game yet so we've accomplished nothing. If we start off 0-5 in the Big East again it won't matter that we started 11-1. If we go to the final four though the guy should get a lifetime contract even if he rolls out Amar, Felix and the Del A Rosas next year.

At the same time the recruiting year is not over yet either. There are plenty of good players out there regardless of whether the experts here have heard of them or have a clue that we are involved with them. Transfers are a huge part of the game as well. Look at Gonzaga.

People also conveniently always leave out that we inherited 10 seniors so the next year was going to be a rebuilding year no matter who we signed. Coach happened to sign a great class including one special player who was 1 and done. When was the last time St John's had a 1 and done type talent prior to that? People also conveniently leave out that coach got cancer and didn't really coach year 2. Who knows the impact that year had on recruiting but coach gets no slack for that. And year 1 was incredible. Norm would not have beaten Duke, Pitt, ND, Nova, and the eventual national champs the way we did. If DJ doesn't get hurt and we dont get a terrible 1st round draw, we probably make a lot of noise in the tourney.

Regardless in 5 years coach has signed pros Harkless, Sampson, our 5th all time leading scorer, and 2 guys that everyone already have leaving us for the pros. Yet everyone is so worried that he has somehow forgot how to recruit. Who are we replacing him with that gets us better talent? Why is changing coaches every 4-5 years the answer? Can we not deal with 1 down year considering we've had almost 3 decades of it? We need to sign 3-4 good players this year and repeat every year. No more 10 player classes that lead to what we've seen the past 5 years. I think coach understands that and we'll see a more balanced approach should we be lucky enough to keep coach here for an extended period.

If we fall apart from here and don't make the dance, I'm for a change as well. I just don't see that happening and hopefully our "fans" will be rooting for it not to happen. It appears that many are instead hoping things fall apart so they can say "I told you so."

Russ while Lavin did not coach in year 2, we were told that he was spending his time focusing on recruiting. And what about this year's recruiting class? If he had done his job on this year's class, then next year wouldn't be such a huge ?. Changing coaches every 4 or 5 years might not be the answer, but making the tourny every 4 or 5 years is simply not acceptable. I was as down on Lavin as anyone, and I'm as high on this team as anyone. That doesn't mean I think Lavin has all of a sudden turned in to the second coming of Coach K. But I will give credit where credit is due, and I think he's done an excellent job having this team prepared, playing hard and staying focused for 40 minutes game in and game out.. His in-game coaching has also been very good. Having said that, IMO we should just let this season play out before we start debating whether or not an extension is in order. Lets judge him on a complete body of work, not a selective one.

Agree completely.

 

[austour]

Interestingly the only place I've read about an extension the past couple of months is here. However, can't totally complain about recruiting when the admin was putting him out there like a lame duck the past 8 months, even if it was rightfully so. Hopefully these early season results will make potential recruits take notice and also feel better about the fact they are likely to play for Lavin if they sign for him.

 

[monte]

Interestingly the only place I've read about an extension the past couple of months is here. However, can't totally complain about recruiting when the admin was putting him out there like a lame duck the past 8 months, even if it was rightfully so. Hopefully these early season results will make potential recruits take notice and also feel better about the fact they are likely to play for Lavin if they sign for him.

That's all good and well, but the 2014 recruiting cycle, and to a lesser degree the 2015 recruiting cycle, begin well before Lavin had the 'lame duck" title bestowed upon him. That really only happened after the late season melt down and the Robert Morris debacle. Besides that concern didn't seem to scare away IB, Samson , Diallo, or any of the other 2015 recruits. So frankly IMO it's had little or no negative impact on recruiting.

 

[ipd200]

This board is awesome - filed with a bunch of neurotic sports nuts. I'm one too and can't help but get excited about the season, but it's not even January. I give the team an A for the first part of the season, an A+ if they were undefeated. Definitely look better then I thought they would or probably anyone thought. Let's worry about next year and extending Lavin later and enjoy this now.

I hope these guys can keep this level of play up for the whole season but that is a lot to ask and also probably not realistic. College hoops can be broken down into three parts, non conference, beginning of conference to mid late February, and late February into postseason jockeying for postseason eligibility and/or seedlings and getting the team peaking heading into postseason play.
Four years ago we peaked in the middle of the season, probably partly because of DJ getting injured but we were not playing our best hoops at the end of the year.
The way we've been playing if we keep it up we should make the tourney easy. Here's hoping we peak at the right time this year, I'm worried that we may be peaking before conference play even begins. I'm not sure how the coach gets a team to peak at the right time. What I'm saying is I'm a bit worried worth all the hype I hope it doesn't go to their heads. I think a good start to conference play followed by a whopping from a lesser team in early February may be the recipe were looking for.
So far these guys seem very hungry though, especially D'Lo. Here's to a good start to conference play

 

[logen]

This board is awesome - filed with a bunch of neurotic sports nuts. I'm one too and can't help but get excited about the season, but it's not even January. I give the team an A for the first part of the season, an A+ if they were undefeated. Definitely look better then I thought they would or probably anyone thought. Let's worry about next year and extending Lavin later and enjoy this now.

I hope these guys can keep this level of play up for the whole season but that is a lot to ask and also probably not realistic. College hoops can be broken down into three parts, non conference, beginning of conference to mid late February, and late February into postseason jockeying for postseason eligibility and/or seedlings and getting the team peaking heading into postseason play.
Four years ago we peaked in the middle of the season, probably partly because of DJ getting injured but we were not playing our best hoops at the end of the year.
The way we've been playing if we keep it up we should make the tourney easy. Here's hoping we peak at the right time this year, I'm worried that we may be peaking before conference play even begins. I'm not sure how the coach gets a team to peak at the right time. What I'm saying is I'm a bit worried worth all the hype I hope it doesn't go to their heads. I think a good start to conference play followed by a whopping from a lesser team in early February may be the recipe were looking for.
So far these guys seem very hungry though, especially D'Lo. Here's to a good start to conference play

Defense never sleeps or peaks. I have been questioning this groups effort and commitment to playing winning ball since they came. Well effort is not a question with this team and if the effort remains, and there is no reason to think it won't, they will be fine. We don't win with offense and offense peaks, ebbs and flows. Continue to play defense, share the ball and the record will take care of itself. Injuries are our biggest risk as it is with most good teams.