St. John's 10 best all time NBA players

[MainMan]

When was Marcus Camby ever a SJU target?

1991 92? Whenever he was in HS. Supposedly Calipari told him Lou had cancer or some other illness.
Admittedly I was 9 at the time, so I've only heard the story via third person accounts. But it's something that people around the program have said for years.
Maybe someone else who remembers more can fill in the details

I don't believe the recruit(s) in question were Camby but a couple of other kids including one by the name of Branch. This goes back to when Cal was an assistant at Pitt. Others claim that it was Pitino who made up the story about Calipari and thus hurting both programs at the same time (Pitt and SJU). Supposedly it was Pitino who called Calipari out on this issue, not Looie. At the very least it has been confirmed by multiple people that the accusation was made against Cal at the Big East conf meetings at the time. 1986? But as I said, the way I heard it was that it was Pitino who was stirring up the accusations, not anyone from St. John's. As I recall, Jim Calhoun also made veiled allegations against Calipari as well during later dates where he used this issue to throw mud at Calipari even years later.

Funny, I've never heard Pitino's name as disparaging Calipari. It would surprise me, since Calipari was a Pitino assistant, and like Donovan, a Pitino disciple. Supposedly it was Pitino who advised Calipari not to consider the SJU vacancy while at UMASS, telling him, you already have a better job than SJU.

Cal never worked for Pitino.

 

[beast of the east]

When was Marcus Camby ever a SJU target?

1991 92? Whenever he was in HS. Supposedly Calipari told him Lou had cancer or some other illness.
Admittedly I was 9 at the time, so I've only heard the story via third person accounts. But it's something that people around the program have said for years.
Maybe someone else who remembers more can fill in the details

I don't believe the recruit(s) in question were Camby but a couple of other kids including one by the name of Branch. This goes back to when Cal was an assistant at Pitt. Others claim that it was Pitino who made up the story about Calipari and thus hurting both programs at the same time (Pitt and SJU). Supposedly it was Pitino who called Calipari out on this issue, not Looie. At the very least it has been confirmed by multiple people that the accusation was made against Cal at the Big East conf meetings at the time. 1986? But as I said, the way I heard it was that it was Pitino who was stirring up the accusations, not anyone from St. John's. As I recall, Jim Calhoun also made veiled allegations against Calipari as well during later dates where he used this issue to throw mud at Calipari even years later.

Funny, I've never heard Pitino's name as disparaging Calipari. It would surprise me, since Calipari was a Pitino assistant, and like Donovan, a Pitino disciple. Supposedly it was Pitino who advised Calipari not to consider the SJU vacancy while at UMASS, telling him, you already have a better job than SJU.

Cal never worked for Pitino.

I stand corrected. I gues she just followed Pitino at UMASS and were once close. Thank you.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...oesnt-take-much-to-fuel-a-caliparipitino-fire

 

[Red.Fans]

There is more to the Pitino/Cal UMASS thing as well. There was a popular story that not only did Pitino push for Cal get the job but that he put up his own money to ensure it. Contrary to this are denials and more allegations against Pitino orchestrating, and at best these two are "frenemies" Either way there is a lot of smoke around these two. Pitino definitely wins the battle of mythology where he is the good guy in the popular myths.

 

[monte]

There is more to the Pitino/Cal UMASS thing as well. There was a popular story that not only did Pitino push for Cal get the job but that he put up his own money to ensure it. Contrary to this are denials and more allegations against Pitino orchestrating, and at best these two are "frenemies" Either way there is a lot of smoke around these two. Pitino definitely wins the battle of mythology where he is the good guy in the popular myths.

His sexcapade definitely tarnished his image somewhat. Prior to that, he and his PR machine did a great job of keeping that up that good guy image..

 

[beast of the east]

There is more to the Pitino/Cal UMASS thing as well. There was a popular story that not only did Pitino push for Cal get the job but that he put up his own money to ensure it. Contrary to this are denials and more allegations against Pitino orchestrating, and at best these two are "frenemies" Either way there is a lot of smoke around these two. Pitino definitely wins the battle of mythology where he is the good guy in the popular myths.

Well, at least that story lends some credence to my assertion that Pitino advised Cal against considering the SJU vacancy while Cal was at UMASS. Good job.

 

[jerseyshorejohnny]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

 

[beast of the east]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

I never heard anything about him as a player - perhaps older fans could weigh in here. His shooting % and FT % was low, but don't know how it ranked against other period NBA players. He did have an NBA coaching resume.

The definitive coach of this team would have to be Lapchick. Perhaps he'd be on the bench as an assistant with Coach C.

 

[beast of the east]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

I never heard anything about him as a player - perhaps older fans could weigh in here. His shooting % and FT % was low, but don't know how it ranked against other period NBA players. He did have an NBA coaching resume.

The definitive coach of this team would have to be Lapchick. Perhaps he'd be on the bench as an assistant with Coach C.

Statistically, and perhaps talent wise, one player who wouldn't belong on this team, but one who I'd want on my squad would be Kevin Williams. Williams was a late second round pick, made the Spurs, and played some valuable NBA minutes over 5 seasons. At one point he put together a pretty good run in a series of games, prompting Looie to declare that he must not have been much of a coach not to value Williams more.


His street toughness and fearless nature immortalizes him among SJU players. Many of us remember how he stood up to Patrick Ewing at MSG, perhaps after a misplaced elbow by Ewing. Standing alone on the court at a packed MSG, he waved his arms at Ewing, taunting him to stand up and hit him to his face if Ewing was man enough to do it. Ewing declined, the Garden roared, and we knew from that moment on that the Redmen would stand up to Georgetown thugs and not be intimidated. Few of us doubted that had Ewing answered Williams challenge that Kevin would have whupped him pretty good.

 

[Amaseinyourface]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

I never heard anything about him as a player - perhaps older fans could weigh in here. His shooting % and FT % was low, but don't know how it ranked against other period NBA players. He did have an NBA coaching resume.

The definitive coach of this team would have to be Lapchick. Perhaps he'd be on the bench as an assistant with Coach C.

Statistically, and perhaps talent wise, one player who wouldn't belong on this team, but one who I'd want on my squad would be Kevin Williams. Williams was a late second round pick, made the Spurs, and played some valuable NBA minutes over 5 seasons. At one point he put together a pretty good run in a series of games, prompting Looie to declare that he must not have been much of a coach not to value Williams more.


His street toughness and fearless nature immortalizes him among SJU players. Many of us remember how he stood up to Patrick Ewing at MSG, perhaps after a misplaced elbow by Ewing. Standing alone on the court at a packed MSG, he waved his arms at Ewing, taunting him to stand up and hit him to his face if Ewing was man enough to do it. Ewing declined, the Garden roared, and we knew from that moment on that the Redmen would stand up to Georgetown thugs and not be intimidated. Few of us doubted that had Ewing answered Williams challenge that Kevin would have whupped him pretty good.

That sounds like an awesome story!

 

[ctstorm]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

I never heard anything about him as a player - perhaps older fans could weigh in here. His shooting % and FT % was low, but don't know how it ranked against other period NBA players. He did have an NBA coaching resume.

The definitive coach of this team would have to be Lapchick. Perhaps he'd be on the bench as an assistant with Coach C.

Statistically, and perhaps talent wise, one player who wouldn't belong on this team, but one who I'd want on my squad would be Kevin Williams. Williams was a late second round pick, made the Spurs, and played some valuable NBA minutes over 5 seasons. At one point he put together a pretty good run in a series of games, prompting Looie to declare that he must not have been much of a coach not to value Williams more.


His street toughness and fearless nature immortalizes him among SJU players. Many of us remember how he stood up to Patrick Ewing at MSG, perhaps after a misplaced elbow by Ewing. Standing alone on the court at a packed MSG, he waved his arms at Ewing, taunting him to stand up and hit him to his face if Ewing was man enough to do it. Ewing declined, the Garden roared, and we knew from that moment on that the Redmen would stand up to Georgetown thugs and not be intimidated. Few of us doubted that had Ewing answered Williams challenge that Kevin would have whupped him pretty good.

I thought about adding Kevin Williams also, but you absolutely nailed it Beast.

 

[redken]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

JSJ, move Mullin to the 2 guard (over Loughery), and Sonny Dove into Mullin's vacated forward spot; have Leroy Ellis over Paultz at center; and (based solely on what I've heard and read about him) Tony Jackson over Artest (who I'd rank behind Malik Sealy among players I did see play) ... and then we'd be in perfect agreement on the starting five.

 

[beast of the east]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

JSJ, move Mullin to the 2 guard (over Loughery), and Sonny Dove into Mullin's vacated forward spot; have Leroy Ellis over Paultz at center; and (based solely on what I've heard and read about him) Tony Jackson over Artest (who I'd rank behind Malik Sealy among players I did see play) ... and then we'd be in perfect agreement on the starting five.

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

 

[Red.Fans]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

 

[bamafan]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

Over Alonzo Mourning who played the same 4 years?

 

[Red.Fans]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

Over Alonzo Mourning who played the same 4 years?

Mourning got all the hype. He deserved it but Sealy didn't get as much as he deserved. He could shut down anyone he was guarding and sometimes they were bigger or smaller. He wasn't a flashy player and just got the job done on both ends.

 

[redken]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

JSJ, move Mullin to the 2 guard (over Loughery), and Sonny Dove into Mullin's vacated forward spot; have Leroy Ellis over Paultz at center; and (based solely on what I've heard and read about him) Tony Jackson over Artest (who I'd rank behind Malik Sealy among players I did see play) ... and then we'd be in perfect agreement on the starting five.

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

:blush: Duh! Beast, I'm red-faced embarrassed. Guess I should have taken the time to read the title of the thread (I was wondering why no one had Tony Jackson on his list) ... although I'd still take Ellis over Paultz. Reasons why were addressed in a Paultz vs. Ellis thread about a year ago. Other than that, I agree with JSJ's choices.

 

[bamafan]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

Over Alonzo Mourning who played the same 4 years?

Mourning got all the hype. He deserved it but Sealy didn't get as much as he deserved. He could shut down anyone he was guarding and sometimes they were bigger or smaller. He wasn't a flashy player and just got the job done on both ends.

Don't get me wrong I always loved Malik. He was ultra quick and smooth and could do it all. Mourning was a center who was a rebounding and shot blocking demon. I remember reading about a game where Malik played head to head against Mourning before their college days and Malik score 27 pts on him.

 

[Andrew]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

Over Alonzo Mourning who played the same 4 years?

Mourning got all the hype. He deserved it but Sealy didn't get as much as he deserved. He could shut down anyone he was guarding and sometimes they were bigger or smaller. He wasn't a flashy player and just got the job done on both ends.

Don't get me wrong I always loved Malik. He was ultra quick and smooth and could do it all. Mourning was a center who was a rebounding and shot blocking demon. I remember reading about a game where Malik played head to head against Mourning before their college days and Malik score 27 pts on him.

Mourning was the better player but Sealy was really good as well. A great competitor.

 

[beast of the east]

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

Perhaps he was confused by Sealy's time on the Knicks as superstar franchise player, under head coach Whoopie Goldberg? In any event I'd give Sealy the nod over Artest as a college player. Artest was like a man among boys and uniquely versatile, but not nearly as polished or court-smart as Sealy. Sealy was very efficient on offense and a total beast on defense. IMHO man to man, he was the best defensive player in college basketball during his time.

Over Alonzo Mourning who played the same 4 years?

Mourning got all the hype. He deserved it but Sealy didn't get as much as he deserved. He could shut down anyone he was guarding and sometimes they were bigger or smaller. He wasn't a flashy player and just got the job done on both ends.

Don't get me wrong I always loved Malik. He was ultra quick and smooth and could do it all. Mourning was a center who was a rebounding and shot blocking demon. I remember reading about a game where Malik played head to head against Mourning before their college days and Malik score 27 pts on him.

Mourning was the better player but Sealy was really good as well. A great competitor.

I liked Mourning as a player and he showed great toughness battling kidney disease while still playing after a transplant. Incredibly, he is still just 43 years old.

 

[MarkRedman]

How about:

Starting team

Artest F
Mullin F
Paultz C
Loughery G
M. Jackson G

Bench:

Leroy Ellis
Max Zaslofsky
Dick McGuire
Jayson WIlliams
Malik Sealy
George Johnson
Bill Wennington

Jack McMahon would be another member of the squad IMO.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mcmahja01.html

JSJ, move Mullin to the 2 guard (over Loughery), and Sonny Dove into Mullin's vacated forward spot; have Leroy Ellis over Paultz at center; and (based solely on what I've heard and read about him) Tony Jackson over Artest (who I'd rank behind Malik Sealy among players I did see play) ... and then we'd be in perfect agreement on the starting five.

Just keep in time, this isn't the best all time SJU team. It's evaluating SJU alums performance in the NBA. So, Sonny Dove, who was highly touted but washed out in the NBA, doesn't make the squad, and Paultz who became a solid long time NBA (and ABA) starting center after a so-so SJU career, makes it. Leroy Ellis is definitely on the squad, but Tony Jackson (arguably our best player ever from those who saw him) can't make it. Artest has been heralded at points in his career as the best defender in the NBA, so he has to start over Sealy.

It's all great fun when you look at how our guys performed in the NBA, and then choosing the best among them.

:blush: Duh! Beast, I'm red-faced embarrassed. Guess I should have taken the time to read the title of the thread (I was wondering why no one had Tony Jackson on his list) ... although I'd still take Ellis over Paultz. Reasons why were addressed in a Paultz vs. Ellis thread about a year ago. Other than that, I agree with JSJ's choices.

IMO, Ellis was definitely a better basketball player but Paultz had a more successful career as a pro
Paultz set a record for being on a playoff team for 15 consecutive seasons