jerseyshorejohnny
Well-known member
Rich Aurilla had a nice career with The S.F. Giants.
Mike Proly pitched for The White Sox.
St. John's 10 best all time NBA players
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Rich Aurilla had a nice career with The S.F. Giants.
Mike Proly pitched for The White Sox.
jerseyshorejohnny
Well-known member
Billy Schaefer played 3 seasons for The Nets in the mid-late 1970's.
Fuzzy Levane played for a number of years in the early days of The NBA in late 1940's.
Al McGuire played for 3-4 seasons in the early 1950's.
Zeke Zawoluk in the mid 1950's payed a couple of years .
Johnny Warren played on the 1969-70 Knick team that won The NBA Championship. Also played for Cleveland.
Jack McMahon played in The NBA from 1952-60
Joe DePre played in the ABA for 5-6 years.
Fuzzy Levane played for a number of years in the early days of The NBA in late 1940's.
Al McGuire played for 3-4 seasons in the early 1950's.
Zeke Zawoluk in the mid 1950's payed a couple of years .
Johnny Warren played on the 1969-70 Knick team that won The NBA Championship. Also played for Cleveland.
Jack McMahon played in The NBA from 1952-60
Joe DePre played in the ABA for 5-6 years.
beast of the east
Active member
Like many of you seeing Berry play two years at SJU, just about every home game and a bunch on the road, I wondered how he wasn't a better NBA player. Then Auerbach said pre-draft that he wouldn't touch him because he didn't play defense. He tumbled in the draft to mid first round, and three seasons isn't long enough to say he was one of our all time best NBA players.
Tony Jackson gets a pass - he was banned, and probably unjustly. Man, I would have loved to have seen him played.
Tony Jackson gets a pass - he was banned, and probably unjustly. Man, I would have loved to have seen him played.
I believe Tony Jackson still holds the three point record in the ABA and, until Mullin, was THE BEST OUTSIDE SHOOTER IN OUR HISTORY. From outside, he was as good as Mullin. Dick McGuire would start on many NBA teams today. Through the 60's, the best two backcourt players in the history of the NBA were McGuire and Bob Cousy.
Leroy Ellis seemed to play in the NBA forever. He was with LA, I think I remember him with Buffalo and I saw him play in Baltimore either against Loughery or against a LOUGHERY coached team. Leroy never went away. At 7 feet he was fast up and down the court and he played with a smile 100% of the time. He loved the game. I tutored both he and Tony Jackson. Tony was smart and was a much better athlete but didn't put in the effort with the books. He got by on his native smarts. Leroy was slower but enthusiastic and full of goals and accomplishments. He was an inspiration to me as a guy who maximized his strengths and never complained or gave excuses. I watched Coach Lapchick rip into him and he just stayed calm and went out and smiled. BTW, the anniversary of his last game ever was in MSG where they will play the NCAA regionals once again in 2014. We lost that game50 + years ago to a Wake Forest team with Billy Packer ( the one and only) at guard for the Deacons..
I was the statistician for rebounds at Leroy's first game away at Bridgeport in Conn. I recall I credited him with about 30 rebounds, a record that stood for many years until they found someone who could really count. I saw Wilt dunk in the Palestra in the 50's against St. Joe's but Leroy was the first SJU player that I ever saw really dunk from under the basket. In those early 60's he was phenomenon in NY.. In the warm ups at Bridgeport every one stood around and gaped at his prowess. I think he might have been the biggest guy we ever had who could play every game, all game.
The bouts between him and NYU at the Garden were fabulous with Leroy winning most of the challenges. My lasting image of him is him holding a fist full of violets in a famous photo of him with the cheerleaders after a win over a ranked NYU team in his senior year. he was really a Big Man on Campus.
Leroy Ellis seemed to play in the NBA forever. He was with LA, I think I remember him with Buffalo and I saw him play in Baltimore either against Loughery or against a LOUGHERY coached team. Leroy never went away. At 7 feet he was fast up and down the court and he played with a smile 100% of the time. He loved the game. I tutored both he and Tony Jackson. Tony was smart and was a much better athlete but didn't put in the effort with the books. He got by on his native smarts. Leroy was slower but enthusiastic and full of goals and accomplishments. He was an inspiration to me as a guy who maximized his strengths and never complained or gave excuses. I watched Coach Lapchick rip into him and he just stayed calm and went out and smiled. BTW, the anniversary of his last game ever was in MSG where they will play the NCAA regionals once again in 2014. We lost that game50 + years ago to a Wake Forest team with Billy Packer ( the one and only) at guard for the Deacons..
I was the statistician for rebounds at Leroy's first game away at Bridgeport in Conn. I recall I credited him with about 30 rebounds, a record that stood for many years until they found someone who could really count. I saw Wilt dunk in the Palestra in the 50's against St. Joe's but Leroy was the first SJU player that I ever saw really dunk from under the basket. In those early 60's he was phenomenon in NY.. In the warm ups at Bridgeport every one stood around and gaped at his prowess. I think he might have been the biggest guy we ever had who could play every game, all game.
The bouts between him and NYU at the Garden were fabulous with Leroy winning most of the challenges. My lasting image of him is him holding a fist full of violets in a famous photo of him with the cheerleaders after a win over a ranked NYU team in his senior year. he was really a Big Man on Campus.
jerseyshorejohnny
Well-known member
Rob Werdan played parts of 3 NBA seasons.
Bob McIntyre played 3 seasons,1967-70, for The Nets.
Omar Cook played some 20 regular season NBA games in his career with Toronto and Portland.
Kevin Cleuss made it to the last cut of the then KC Kings. Nate Archibald said he was the best guard in basketball not in The NBA. His older brother Greg was drafted by The Knicks.
Craig Hansen had a cup of coffee in The Major Leagues
beast of the east
Active member
Oldfan,
Having seen both play at St. John's and in the NBA, who do you think was the better pro - Ellis or Paultz?
Ellis AVERAGED 16.5 RPG one season at St. John's. Wow! I began following the Knicks during Ellis' NBA career, but I never heard mention that he was an SJU product. The local papers never celebrated him as such, but then again there wasn't the incredible media coverage there is today.
Paultz really improved after college. Big Body, soft jumped within 16-18 feet, not a bad rebounder - the Whopper. They said he was a total clown off the court, once showing up at a bar for Halloween (10 Downing St? Salty Dog?) dressed as a 7 foot pumpkin.
Wikipedia bio on Ellis:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LeRoy_Ellis
This list can't be complete. I believe Hank Cluess played a handful of games for the ABA Nets, but I could be wrong. These are the players listed as St. John's NBA/ABA players:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/colleges.cgi?college=stjohns
Well if your gonna put Hamilton in there you gotta throw DJ kennedy in. It's a shame if it wasn't for that torn acl in the big east tourney he def would of went late first round to early 2 nod round in that weak draft class. I think DJ would be signed today instead of struggling getting minutes in pre season .
beast of the east
Active member
The rumors were that Berry turned down invitations to NBA camps because he wanted a guaranteed contract to come back to the NBA, and one in the range of the reportedly $5 million per he was making in Europe.
If the "golden handcuffs" kept him out of the NBA, it's a little sad. An athlete should always play on the biggest stage possible. It brings to be mind some athletes who were denied. Teofilo Stevenson, the great Cuban boxer, never got a chance to turn professional because of Castro's oppression. Just 40 years before Berry's time, perhaps the greatest pitcher of all time entered the major leagues at age 42. Satchel Paige, despite being long past his time, started 7 games for the 1949 Cleveland Indians, completed 3 with 2 shutouts, and appeared in 14 others, with a 2.48 ERA. He played in the bigs until age 46, and as a publicity stunt, started a game for Finley's A's at the age of 59, tossing three shutout innings.
I completely understand money, and probably would have made the same decision that Berry purportedly did, but if true, that decision denied him the chance to be immortalized as one of the best ever to play the game. And that's the Truth.
Ray Morgan
Well-known member
To sum it up-one great pro, a handful of good pros, and mostly cameo appearances. It's not hard to see why there were only two final fours since 1950. Wasn't around in the early 50's to see the team that went to the finals. As for 1985, we had 5 players from that final four team taste life in the NBA. Some for a few games, and two for very long and successful careers. As Louie always said, you need great players.
Beast wrote:
Paultz really improved after college. Big Body, soft jumped within 16-18 feet, not a bad rebounder - the Whopper. They said he was a total clown off the court, once showing up at a bar for Halloween (10 Downing St? Salty Dog?) dressed as a 7 foot pumpkin.
I remember Paultz having a lot of "fun" in the Hamptons during the summer. One great feat was jumping of the Ponquogue bridge into the Shinnecock Bay. Use your imagination to describe the condition he was in.
Paultz really improved after college. Big Body, soft jumped within 16-18 feet, not a bad rebounder - the Whopper. They said he was a total clown off the court, once showing up at a bar for Halloween (10 Downing St? Salty Dog?) dressed as a 7 foot pumpkin.
I remember Paultz having a lot of "fun" in the Hamptons during the summer. One great feat was jumping of the Ponquogue bridge into the Shinnecock Bay. Use your imagination to describe the condition he was in.
Through Looie's career we were the 4th winningest team in NCAA history. As I recall only Kentucky, Kansas, UNC were higher. The lack of success (final 4) goes to a series of ridiculous blunders in choosing the right leadership to carry on that tradition. Not coincidentally corresponding to the name change IMHO. All part of a flawed mentality.
I would say however that Mark Jackson was ROY as well as 3rd all time assists leader in the NBA. Definitely a "great" pro. Jayson Williams early NBA was not special but 2nd Act was. 2 or 3 All Star selections and Defensive POY.
we looked at schools>recruits>NBA success about 10 years ago. It was interesting to look at both UNC and Duke Alumni. While UNC has had the Lion's Share of McD AA (nobody else is close) and they have had several great NBA, they have not had a commensurate ratio of NBA players to their recruiting. Duke also has had a very large share of McD while even lower NBA success- in proportion. Pete Gillen had a great line when he was at VA where he said of one of the guys rotting on the Duke bench that they had recruited that went something like, not only would he be a star at UVA, we'd erect a statue of him here.
Ray Morgan
Well-known member
It would be interesting to see the number of players that made the NBA from final 4 teams over the past 25 years, which coincides more or less with the explosion in the popularity of college basketball. My guess would be very few national champs without several future pros. Probably very few runners up without future pros, although Butler's recent run may be an exception. Our most recent elite eight run included Barkley and Artest, one good pro and one cup of coffee pro. If Barkley doesn't leave early, he may have had a decent career. Bottom line is you need NBA talent to get to the final four. Good news is that this team may have 3 future NBA players. Bad news is that the team next year may not have any.
beast of the east
Active member
Lefties are always notoriously difficult to stop. So much of basketball is muscle memory, I think it has to do with the fact that everything is opposite. head fake right, and a defender is much more likely to commit that way even when he knows you are a lefty.
Berry may have been one of the best players ever in Europe but it still doesn't compare to an NBA resume - not even close. Dick Stuart (baseball player from the 60s) once hit 66 homeruns in the minor leagues, some presumably off future MLB pitchers. Still that hardly qualified him to be considered among MLB stars. Also proved to be one of the worst fielding first basemen in baseball, earning him the title Dr. Strangeglove.
beast of the east
Active member
Do you think that Dean Smith, Roy Williams, and Coach K recruit to a system, that necessarily doesn't translate into NBA superstardom? Could it be that because those schools are stacked and go deep into the tournament continually that their players are overvalued?
What do you think?
There's a handful of players that we swung and missed at for different reasons, we land any one of them and the St Johns program would be seen in a very different light.
Camby, Kareem, Olajuwon etc.
Because, the numbers are there and the history is what it is. But we need another Final Four and a second star with a truly great nba career to point to.
Camby, Kareem, Olajuwon etc.
Because, the numbers are there and the history is what it is. But we need another Final Four and a second star with a truly great nba career to point to.