Roster

I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.
 
[quote="Logen" post=359027][quote="JohnnyFan" post=359022][quote="Steve Knortz" post=358976]If I'm reading the chart correctly. I think it includes LJ playing as a senior. Maybe the staff knows, LJ will be "moving on " at the end of this season? That would bring the scholarships to the limit rather than over the limit.[/quote]

I think LJ has to leave after this year. After all, Redman.com has already packed his bags.[/quote]

This site has packed several bags already; disingenuous and classless IMO.[/quote]

Too be fair, "this site" has done nothing of the sort. A couple of posters (some with insider perspective) have suggested there will be more than 4, and as many as 7, openings for next year. Others have been speculating on who those 2-3 extra spots will come from.
 
cappy105 wrote: No, I see it as THIS staff is being prepared! Compared to our last staffs that were left shorthanded year after year, this staff is preparing for college basketballs inevitable transfers. Now, which players? Lets not start speculating players names until we at least see how they perform under new management, not to mention the kids reading this and sense they are not wanted before it even starts.

+1
 
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I'm so sorry for suggesting the staff may have anticipated/prepared for a departure when a recent offer was made and then accepted. I know nothing about any possible transfers. My comment about LJ leaving was based on my recollection (faulty perhaps) that when Chris M. left, there was rampant speculation that M. Herron and LJ were rumored to be leaving, possibly going pro. I believe LJ was rumored to be pursued/considering Uconn. Let the season play out.
 
[quote="Steve Knortz" post=359044]I'm so sorry for suggesting the staff may have anticipated/prepared for a departure when a recent offer was made and then accepted. I know nothing about any possible transfers. My comment about LJ leaving was based on my recollection (faulty perhaps) that when Chris M. left, there was rampant speculation that M. Herron and LJ were rumored to be leaving, possibly going pro. I believe LJ was rumored to be pursued/considering Uconn. Let the season play out.[/quote]

There's nothing to apologize for Steve. You're entitled to speculate. Its not like you were claiming to be reporting news. LJ is 22 in a few months and has expectations (I'm sure) of getting paid to play at some point. Its not a revelation that he could be out of here at the end of this season just based on his age and skillset, but since he considered leaving at the end of the last season, it seems like fair game to me to plan for him moving on in May.
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=359043]cappy105 wrote: No, I see it as THIS staff is being prepared! Compared to our last staffs that were left shorthanded year after year, this staff is preparing for college basketballs inevitable transfers. Now, which players? Lets not start speculating players names until we at least see how they perform under new management, not to mention the kids reading this and sense they are not wanted before it even starts.

+1[/quote]

It has nothing to do with not being wanted. Some of our guys played limited minutes last year and looked like they had a very long way to go in that time. Yes their time was limited, but I think it’s fair to have concerns over ability to play at this level. I don’t think there’s any harm in saying that some guys will need to show more to get any serious PT here. I don’t see that as blasphemous at all.
 
[quote="MCNPA" post=359048][quote="NCJohnnie" post=359043]cappy105 wrote: No, I see it as THIS staff is being prepared! Compared to our last staffs that were left shorthanded year after year, this staff is preparing for college basketballs inevitable transfers. Now, which players? Lets not start speculating players names until we at least see how they perform under new management, not to mention the kids reading this and sense they are not wanted before it even starts.

+1[/quote]

It has nothing to do with not being wanted. Some of our guys played limited minutes last year and looked like they had a very long way to go in that time. Yes their time was limited, but I think it’s fair to have concerns over ability to play at this level. I don’t think there’s any harm in saying that some guys will need to show more to get any serious PT here. I don’t see that as blasphemous at all.[/quote]

To add to your point, this is all a part of the circle of life for college basketball. Just like Dunn who is trying to get a waiver, transferred because of a coaching change, players will leave because of the lack of PT and the new guys coming in. Some of these guys just aren’t supposed to be on this level. These things always work themselves out naturally.
 
If we cannot get predominately top 75-200 kids here who also fit in to CMA's system and who buy in to the new culture, then we are never ever going to compete with even the Seton Hall's and PC's of the Big East, let alone the Nova's. If we are relying on a coach(any coach) to "coach up" a group of very low ranked and unranked kids and turn them in to a NCAA tourney team, then we might as well be waiting for godot. I have long been an advocate of going after 2nd and sometimes 3rd tier NYC area(that includes NJ) kids, but as secondary players and solid 4 year kids. IE Billy Singleton, etc. Occasionally one will blow up after he gets here, but that's the exception not the norm. Currently there is more top tier talent in this area then there has been in a long time, and the staff seems to be working really hard on local recruiting. It's early in CMA's tenure and clearly he has a master plan, so that's reassuring. But regardless of how good a track record he has, how hard he works and how good a coach he is, his success will be determined by the level of talent that he can consistently bring here.
 
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[quote="Monte" post=359056]If we cannot get predominately top 75-200 kids here who also fit in to CMA's system and who buy in to the new culture, then we are never ever going to compete with even the Seton Hall's and PC's of the Big East, let alone the Nova's. If we are relying on a coach(any coach) to "coach up" a group of very low ranked and unranked kids and turn them in to a NCAA tourney team, then we might as well be waiting for godot. I have long been an advocate of going after 2nd and sometimes 3rd tier NYC area(that includes NJ) kids, but as secondary players and solid 4 year kids. IE Billy Singleton, etc. Occasionally one will blow up after he gets here, but that's the exception not the norm. Currently there is more top tier talent in this area then there has been in a long time, and the staff seems to be working really hard on local recruiting. It's early in CMA's tenure and clearly he has a master plan, so that's reassuring. But regardless of how good a track record he has, how hard he works and how good a coach he is, his success will be determined by the level of talent that he can consistently bring here.[/quote]

I agree, Monte. And, for that reason, I am hoping that (as suggested) some scholarships open up after this year. IMHO.....there are currently too many "reaches" on the 2020 roster .
 
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[quote="MCNPA" post=359039]I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.[/quote]

I have close friends whose very livelihood depends primarily on their ability to evaluate players. So it is not rare they scout them for years, see them play in tens of games, break down tapes of those games and they still get it wrong. All the baseball expert “evaluators of talent” swore the Mets farm system was barren, yet they had one young player lead the league in hitting for a portion of the year and another smash team and league records galore.
But you and others think you can look at players for a couple of minutes in mop up time and evaluate them. You are wasting a very rare and potentially lucrative talent posting such infallible insight on a forum. As for speculation on a general talent gap, that is one thing; to name names based on nothing but that speculation is quite another. IMO, that is classless. You think otherwise, you are entitled. We just disagree.
 
[quote="Logen" post=359071][quote="MCNPA" post=359039]I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.[/quote]

I have close friends whose very livelihood depends primarily on their ability to evaluate players. So it is not rare they scout them for years, see them play in tens of games, break down tapes of those games and they still get it wrong. All the baseball expert “evaluators of talent” swore the Mets farm system was barren, yet they had one young player lead the league in hitting for a portion of the year and another smash team and league records galore.
But you and others think you can look at players for a couple of minutes in mop up time and evaluate them. You are wasting a very rare and potentially lucrative talent posting such infallible insight on a forum. As for speculation on a general talent gap, that is one thing; to name names based on nothing but that speculation is quite another. IMO, that is classless. You think otherwise, you are entitled. We just disagree.[/quote]

The only names I mentioned played for SJU last season. In limited time they didn’t show much in the way of becoming players that are going to have impact anywhere near the likes of Figueroa, Heron etc. We are also offering more scholarships right now than it seems we have available so you do the math. It’s not gonna be Posh or one of the new guys leaving. I could also be wrong but have been going to recruiting events for decades and of course I’m plenty wrong too. Doesn’t mean we can’t have opinions. This is a message board, and fans speculating about playing time etc. or ability is not “classless”. I take offense to that because it is likely directed at me and we can agree to disagree but I think you’re using the term just to be insulting and get personal.
 
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The day posters stop giving their own evaluations of players will be the day message boards die.
 
UNLV is in a very similar coaching transition. New coach and staff have retained about six plyers from Menzies' roster, three or four encouraged to move on. The recruits include grad transfers, regular transfers, jucos and high school players. They are at 13 scholarships now, with three scheduled to graduate. He already has commitments from five and is still recruiting for '20.
The season will play out and then more players will be encouraged to find another school. The ethics of recruiting have changed, and the sharp coaches understand and are adjusting.
 
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[quote="MCNPA" post=359073][quote="Logen" post=359071][quote="MCNPA" post=359039]I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.[/quote]

I have close friends whose very livelihood depends primarily on their ability to evaluate players. So it is not rare they scout them for years, see them play in tens of games, break down tapes of those games and they still get it wrong. All the baseball expert “evaluators of talent” swore the Mets farm system was barren, yet they had one young player lead the league in hitting for a portion of the year and another smash team and league records galore.
But you and others think you can look at players for a couple of minutes in mop up time and evaluate them. You are wasting a very rare and potentially lucrative talent posting such infallible insight on a forum. As for speculation on a general talent gap, that is one thing; to name names based on nothing but that speculation is quite another. IMO, that is classless. You think otherwise, you are entitled. We just disagree.[/quote]

The only names I mentioned played for SJU last season. In limited time they didn’t show much in the way of becoming players that are going to have impact anywhere near the likes of Figueroa, Heron etc. We are also offering more scholarships right now than it seems we have available so you do the math. It’s not gonna be Posh or one of the new guys leaving. I could also be wrong but have been going to recruiting events for decades and of course I’m plenty wrong too. Doesn’t mean we can’t have opinions. This is a message board, and fans speculating about playing time etc. or ability is not “classless”. I take offense to that because it is likely directed at me and we can agree to disagree but I think you’re using the term just to be insulting and get personal.[/quote]

Sorry you feel that way but my comments are directed at anyone who chooses to name names as candidates. Take it however you want, I don’t care. I am outspoken and upfront, anyone on this board for any length of time knows that. So your “speculations” regarding players and naming them is ok, but my opinion on that practice is insulting because you feel it is directed at you? How do you think they and theirs might feel about your opinions? But that’s ok, right? I guess their feelings don’t count but yours do..........
 
[quote="Logen" post=359095][quote="MCNPA" post=359073][quote="Logen" post=359071][quote="MCNPA" post=359039]I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.[/quote]

I have close friends whose very livelihood depends primarily on their ability to evaluate players. So it is not rare they scout them for years, see them play in tens of games, break down tapes of those games and they still get it wrong. All the baseball expert “evaluators of talent” swore the Mets farm system was barren, yet they had one young player lead the league in hitting for a portion of the year and another smash team and league records galore.
But you and others think you can look at players for a couple of minutes in mop up time and evaluate them. You are wasting a very rare and potentially lucrative talent posting such infallible insight on a forum. As for speculation on a general talent gap, that is one thing; to name names based on nothing but that speculation is quite another. IMO, that is classless. You think otherwise, you are entitled. We just disagree.[/quote]

The only names I mentioned played for SJU last season. In limited time they didn’t show much in the way of becoming players that are going to have impact anywhere near the likes of Figueroa, Heron etc. We are also offering more scholarships right now than it seems we have available so you do the math. It’s not gonna be Posh or one of the new guys leaving. I could also be wrong but have been going to recruiting events for decades and of course I’m plenty wrong too. Doesn’t mean we can’t have opinions. This is a message board, and fans speculating about playing time etc. or ability is not “classless”. I take offense to that because it is likely directed at me and we can agree to disagree but I think you’re using the term just to be insulting and get personal.[/quote]

Sorry you feel that way but my comments are directed at anyone who chooses to name names as candidates. Take it however you want, I don’t care. I am outspoken and upfront, anyone on this board for any length of time knows that. So your “speculations” regarding players and naming them is ok, but my opinion on that practice is insulting because you feel it is directed at you? How do you think they and theirs might feel about your opinions? But that’s ok, right? I guess their feelings don’t count but yours do..........[/quote]

I didn’t call anybody classless. You did. I’m just talking basketball, not attacking anybody’s character.
 
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[quote="MCNPA" post=359096][quote="Logen" post=359095][quote="MCNPA" post=359073][quote="Logen" post=359071][quote="MCNPA" post=359039]I don’t think it’s classless, it’s just speculation. Speculating doesn’t make something true. The scholarships are going to come from somewhere and I’ve seen some of the guys we have off the bench from last season and I’m wondering where they’ll all fit in. The fans can’t pack anybody’s bags, but denying there are talent gaps is disingenuous.[/quote]

I have close friends whose very livelihood depends primarily on their ability to evaluate players. So it is not rare they scout them for years, see them play in tens of games, break down tapes of those games and they still get it wrong. All the baseball expert “evaluators of talent” swore the Mets farm system was barren, yet they had one young player lead the league in hitting for a portion of the year and another smash team and league records galore.
But you and others think you can look at players for a couple of minutes in mop up time and evaluate them. You are wasting a very rare and potentially lucrative talent posting such infallible insight on a forum. As for speculation on a general talent gap, that is one thing; to name names based on nothing but that speculation is quite another. IMO, that is classless. You think otherwise, you are entitled. We just disagree.[/quote]

The only names I mentioned played for SJU last season. In limited time they didn’t show much in the way of becoming players that are going to have impact anywhere near the likes of Figueroa, Heron etc. We are also offering more scholarships right now than it seems we have available so you do the math. It’s not gonna be Posh or one of the new guys leaving. I could also be wrong but have been going to recruiting events for decades and of course I’m plenty wrong too. Doesn’t mean we can’t have opinions. This is a message board, and fans speculating about playing time etc. or ability is not “classless”. I take offense to that because it is likely directed at me and we can agree to disagree but I think you’re using the term just to be insulting and get personal.[/quote]

Sorry you feel that way but my comments are directed at anyone who chooses to name names as candidates. Take it however you want, I don’t care. I am outspoken and upfront, anyone on this board for any length of time knows that. So your “speculations” regarding players and naming them is ok, but my opinion on that practice is insulting because you feel it is directed at you? How do you think they and theirs might feel about your opinions? But that’s ok, right? I guess their feelings don’t count but yours do..........[/quote]

I didn’t call anybody classless. You did. I’m just talking basketball, not attacking anybody’s character.[/quote]

Neither did I, my original post regarding this referred to “this site” not any individual. You chose to reply. If you think speculating on players on the team you root for leaving because you feel they are not good enough to stay, fine, you are entitled. But I think it is classless mainly for the reason I cited; I wonder how you would feel, if say, you were one of the players “speculated” on and your 10 year old brother who worships the ground you walk on asked why people were posting you might not be on the team anymore?
This is my last post on the subject, we disagree.
 
[quote="Monte" post=359056]If we cannot get predominately top 75-200 kids here who also fit in to CMA's system and who buy in to the new culture, then we are never ever going to compete with even the Seton Hall's and PC's of the Big East, let alone the Nova's. If we are relying on a coach(any coach) to "coach up" a group of very low ranked and unranked kids and turn them in to a NCAA tourney team, then we might as well be waiting for godot. I have long been an advocate of going after 2nd and sometimes 3rd tier NYC area(that includes NJ) kids, but as secondary players and solid 4 year kids. IE Billy Singleton, etc. Occasionally one will blow up after he gets here, but that's the exception not the norm. Currently there is more top tier talent in this area then there has been in a long time, and the staff seems to be working really hard on local recruiting. It's early in CMA's tenure and clearly he has a master plan, so that's reassuring. But regardless of how good a track record he has, how hard he works and how good a coach he is, his success will be determined by the level of talent that he can consistently bring here.[/quote]

He did say that he wants to win a NC here, do you honestly think that he believes that he can win that with 2*-3*? I gotta believe that he knows the only way to achieve that is with big time talent.
But wtf is SJU at this moment? Nothing that the big talent wants apart of right now.
So I'm good with the way CMA and staff are building this team, with all 4 year players.

Lavin and Mullin had a few 4* players, but why haven't they won an ncaa game since 01, even with those 4* recruits? I'm just good with letting cma build the roster his way to start his era?
Trust me I hate that we haven't won an ncaa game since 01. I want to beat the living blank out of everyone, f waiting, but it doesn't look like we have a choice.
Don't know about this year or next, but I'm expecting a very very fun year in year 3, and into the top 25, and hopefully get that 1 NCAA win that we so badly want.
But, I'm expecting the real fun to begin in year 4 with loads of 4* talent, maybe 2-3 5* kids.

Just give him a chance.
 
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Jay Wright's first 5 years at Villanova.

2001–02 Villanova 19–13 7–9 5th NIT Quarterfinal
2002–03 Villanova 15–16 8–8 T–3rd NIT First Round
2003–04 Villanova 18–17 6–10 11th NIT Quarterfinal
2004–05 Villanova 24–8 11–5 T–3rd NCAA Division I Sweet 16
2005–06 Villanova 28–5 14–2 T–1st NCAA Division I Elite Eight

In year 4 they really took off, anyone here would take that in a heartbeat.
Took 8 years to get Villanova to the F4, and 15 for his first NC.
 
[quote="oldschool Redmen" post=359104]Jay Wright's first 5 years at Villanova.

2001–02 Villanova 19–13 7–9 5th NIT Quarterfinal
2002–03 Villanova 15–16 8–8 T–3rd NIT First Round
2003–04 Villanova 18–17 6–10 11th NIT Quarterfinal
2004–05 Villanova 24–8 11–5 T–3rd NCAA Division I Sweet 16
2005–06 Villanova 28–5 14–2 T–1st NCAA Division I Elite Eight

In year 4 they really took off, anyone here would take that in a heartbeat.
Took 8 years to get Villanova to the F4, and 15 for his first NC.[/quote]

I've had this discussion with a few people previously. I think well over the majority here feels Anderson will do a sufficient job, and are willing to give him the opportunity and time to do so.

But if you're not aware, here are Wright's recruiting classes during his first three seasons at Villanova:

Villanova’s 2002 recruiting class consisted of Jason Fraser (#5 RSCI), Alan Ray (#39), Curtis Sumpter (#42), Randy Foye (#56), Baker Dunleavy and Mike Claxton. A five-star in Fraser, and three 4-star recruits in Ray, Sumpter and Foye. This class was basically finalized before he ever coached his first game at Villanova.

Villanova’s 2003 recruiting class consisted of Will Sheridan (#45 RSCI), Mike Nardi (#65) and Ross Condon. Two four-star recruits in Sheridan and Nardi.

Villanova’s 2004 recruiting class consisted of Kyle Lowry (#29 RSCI) who was considered a five-star recruit per Rivals (and a 4-star per Scout.com).

The groundwork was being laid by the caliber of talent Wright was garnering. I've outlined the level of players we should be capable of landing, and I believe in the long-run that is what we'll need to do in order to achieve our goals as a program in the Big East and nationally.
 
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[quote="Logen" post=359037][quote="Class of 72" post=359035][quote="Logen" post=359027][quote="JohnnyFan" post=359022][quote="Steve Knortz" post=358976]If I'm reading the chart correctly. I think it includes LJ playing as a senior. Maybe the staff knows, LJ will be "moving on " at the end of this season? That would bring the scholarships to the limit rather than over the limit.[/quote]

I think LJ has to leave after this year. After all, Redman.com has already packed his bags.[/quote]

This site has packed several bags already; disingenuous and classless IMO.[/quote]

The bottom line is all of the previous staff’s recruits are subject to speculation. Unless they impress they likely will be recruited over.[/quote]

Who said they weren’t? But to speculate by naming names when the posters haven’t a clue of who is playing well or impressing the staff is classless. One of the Arkansas posters, who has shared a lot of good insight into Anderson, posted he looked at tape which apparently qualified him to suggest who would or wouldn’t fit into Anderson’s system. There isn’t enough meaningful tape available for anyone outside of Heron or Figueroa to decide which players should be picked choosing sides in a park never mind fitting into a “system”.[/quote]

I don't see how it's classless to project what the roster looks like in the future. I was just giving my opinion based on what I've seen and what I've heard from other posters. If we only let people who are "qualified" give an opinion, don't think you'd have many posters, because I don't know a whole lot of coaches and scouts that hang around on messages boards.

IMO, it's naive to act like there won't be roster movement or act like transfers is not a major part of college basketball these days. You're acting like kids are sitting around going through message board posts looking to see if some random fan thinks they will transfer and it just completely kills their confidence when they read it. Fans are going to speculate and project the future, that's what we do. You go to any college basketball team message board, if their coaching staff is recruiting over their scholarship limit, and it's leaking they are going to sign even more, you can bet fans are going to speculate on who's possibly leaving. Same way fans speculate on trade rumors at the professional level. It's the nature of the business, none of these kids are losing sleep over what you or I say on here.
 
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