QueensBall
Member
Back for Vermont would be ideal in the given situation. Fingers crossed!
Rasheem Dunn Waiver Denied (APPEAL WON)
- Thread starter P1NSTR1PEZ
- Start date
WillyDilly
Member
[quote="Red2395" post=362304]If a coach is fired any player from that team should be able to transfer and not have to sit out a year.
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.
It’s the Wild West out there right now. But if kids get a free pass regarding transfers, there would be even more. We are thinking about the Dunn situation where immediate eligibility will help us. But it works both ways. If a coaching change allows immediate transfers, we could have lost both Heron and Figgy.
[quote="Moose" post=362270][quote="Eric Williamson" post=362267][quote="L J S A" post=362265][quote="firestorm" post=362255][quote="L J S A" post=362250][quote="Moose" post=362249][quote="Paultzman" post=362248]https://twitter.com/goodmanhoops/status/1186702261659099139?s=21[/quote]
I don’t know what’s worse. That only four were denied or over 70 still in limbo[/quote]
How many of these guys do they have? How ever many they have is apparently not enough.[/quote]
Things are a little tight in Indy these. A few billions dollars doesn't go as far as it used to.[/quote]
Hire 15 people with common sense and randomly assign them 23 schools each. Pull a guy with a light caseload to help others who are swamped. It's really not tough. I can't imagine reading through waivers is like reading through the Mueller Report. How long can it really take?[/quote]
So you want one person making the final decision on all these cases? That doesn't seem efficient or practical at all. You are also putting alot of faith into finding people with common sense....that may not be as easy as you think. It seems like most cases should be common sense because, in our case with Dunn, it should be common sense. However, not every case is as cut and dry as ours appears to be. And I think you do want them to do a thorough reading and have a solid understanding of each case, because every case is different....the last thing you want is to have hundreds of kids transferring every year and becoming immediately eligible just because.[/quote]
Hundreds of kids are transferring every year regardless. I don't see any harm allowing everyone 1 transfer. No mid-season crap. You leave a school one year you can play the next year but thats it. 5 minutes into the 1st game of your college career or after 3 years because you graduated early. Its the wild west now I don't see how it would be any worse when kids and coaches both know there is only one bullet for a kid to use.[/quote]
Allowing every player 1 transfer without having to sit out a year would be a nightmare. Especially for teams like SJU trying to rebuild.
Under that scenario, Figueroa would have just gone out to the highest bidder after last season. Ditto for Heron...or Ponds the year before, or Jakarr Sampson before that....I could go on and on. Just look at how disappointed we all were when Tariq Owens left us as a graduate transfer. Imagine that happening on a yearly basis with the non-graduates. Nightmare!
I don’t know what’s worse. That only four were denied or over 70 still in limbo[/quote]
How many of these guys do they have? How ever many they have is apparently not enough.[/quote]
Things are a little tight in Indy these. A few billions dollars doesn't go as far as it used to.[/quote]
Hire 15 people with common sense and randomly assign them 23 schools each. Pull a guy with a light caseload to help others who are swamped. It's really not tough. I can't imagine reading through waivers is like reading through the Mueller Report. How long can it really take?[/quote]
So you want one person making the final decision on all these cases? That doesn't seem efficient or practical at all. You are also putting alot of faith into finding people with common sense....that may not be as easy as you think. It seems like most cases should be common sense because, in our case with Dunn, it should be common sense. However, not every case is as cut and dry as ours appears to be. And I think you do want them to do a thorough reading and have a solid understanding of each case, because every case is different....the last thing you want is to have hundreds of kids transferring every year and becoming immediately eligible just because.[/quote]
Hundreds of kids are transferring every year regardless. I don't see any harm allowing everyone 1 transfer. No mid-season crap. You leave a school one year you can play the next year but thats it. 5 minutes into the 1st game of your college career or after 3 years because you graduated early. Its the wild west now I don't see how it would be any worse when kids and coaches both know there is only one bullet for a kid to use.[/quote]
Allowing every player 1 transfer without having to sit out a year would be a nightmare. Especially for teams like SJU trying to rebuild.
Under that scenario, Figueroa would have just gone out to the highest bidder after last season. Ditto for Heron...or Ponds the year before, or Jakarr Sampson before that....I could go on and on. Just look at how disappointed we all were when Tariq Owens left us as a graduate transfer. Imagine that happening on a yearly basis with the non-graduates. Nightmare!
[quote="Eric Williamson" post=362320][quote="Red2395" post=362304]If a coach is fired any player from that team should be able to transfer and not have to sit out a year.
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.[/quote]
2 weeks before the season kids are already going to classes so NO they can’t transfer and play right away. I would using the signing periods as a guideline
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.[/quote]
2 weeks before the season kids are already going to classes so NO they can’t transfer and play right away. I would using the signing periods as a guideline
Free transfer without restriction if a coach is fired. The school is essentially breaking the contract with the player because it was understood, when the player was signed, that he would play for the coach that recruited him.
If a coach leaves for another job, it is not the school’s fault. Player should have to sit if he transfers.
If a coach leaves for another job, it is not the school’s fault. Player should have to sit if he transfers.
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Moose
Well-known member
[quote="P Simmons" post=362327][quote="Moose" post=362270][quote="Eric Williamson" post=362267][quote="L J S A" post=362265][quote="firestorm" post=362255][quote="L J S A" post=362250][quote="Moose" post=362249][quote="Paultzman" post=362248]https://twitter.com/goodmanhoops/status/1186702261659099139?s=21[/quote]
I don’t know what’s worse. That only four were denied or over 70 still in limbo[/quote]
How many of these guys do they have? How ever many they have is apparently not enough.[/quote]
Things are a little tight in Indy these. A few billions dollars doesn't go as far as it used to.[/quote]
Hire 15 people with common sense and randomly assign them 23 schools each. Pull a guy with a light caseload to help others who are swamped. It's really not tough. I can't imagine reading through waivers is like reading through the Mueller Report. How long can it really take?[/quote]
So you want one person making the final decision on all these cases? That doesn't seem efficient or practical at all. You are also putting alot of faith into finding people with common sense....that may not be as easy as you think. It seems like most cases should be common sense because, in our case with Dunn, it should be common sense. However, not every case is as cut and dry as ours appears to be. And I think you do want them to do a thorough reading and have a solid understanding of each case, because every case is different....the last thing you want is to have hundreds of kids transferring every year and becoming immediately eligible just because.[/quote]
Hundreds of kids are transferring every year regardless. I don't see any harm allowing everyone 1 transfer. No mid-season crap. You leave a school one year you can play the next year but thats it. 5 minutes into the 1st game of your college career or after 3 years because you graduated early. Its the wild west now I don't see how it would be any worse when kids and coaches both know there is only one bullet for a kid to use.[/quote]
Allowing every player 1 transfer without having to sit out a year would be a nightmare. Especially for teams like SJU trying to rebuild.
Under that scenario, Figueroa would have just gone out to the highest bidder after last season. Ditto for Heron...or Ponds the year before, or Jakarr Sampson before that....I could go on and on. Just look at how disappointed we all were when Tariq Owens left us as a graduate transfer. Imagine that happening on a yearly basis with the non-graduates. Nightmare![/quote]
Feel free to think that but its pretty much that now.
And knowing you only have one bullet is a lot different than right now when many of these kids like Tariq and Dunn are transferring twice.
This is simply a concept. I would say the NCAA puts some restrictions on timing too. Would likely cut down on mid year transfers knowing they can still start Day 1.
Maybe even a period of two weeks after a coach is let go allowing a new coach to re-recruit players. Of course then onus is on the school to fill the job. Just spitballing here because right not its simply not objective.
I don’t know what’s worse. That only four were denied or over 70 still in limbo[/quote]
How many of these guys do they have? How ever many they have is apparently not enough.[/quote]
Things are a little tight in Indy these. A few billions dollars doesn't go as far as it used to.[/quote]
Hire 15 people with common sense and randomly assign them 23 schools each. Pull a guy with a light caseload to help others who are swamped. It's really not tough. I can't imagine reading through waivers is like reading through the Mueller Report. How long can it really take?[/quote]
So you want one person making the final decision on all these cases? That doesn't seem efficient or practical at all. You are also putting alot of faith into finding people with common sense....that may not be as easy as you think. It seems like most cases should be common sense because, in our case with Dunn, it should be common sense. However, not every case is as cut and dry as ours appears to be. And I think you do want them to do a thorough reading and have a solid understanding of each case, because every case is different....the last thing you want is to have hundreds of kids transferring every year and becoming immediately eligible just because.[/quote]
Hundreds of kids are transferring every year regardless. I don't see any harm allowing everyone 1 transfer. No mid-season crap. You leave a school one year you can play the next year but thats it. 5 minutes into the 1st game of your college career or after 3 years because you graduated early. Its the wild west now I don't see how it would be any worse when kids and coaches both know there is only one bullet for a kid to use.[/quote]
Allowing every player 1 transfer without having to sit out a year would be a nightmare. Especially for teams like SJU trying to rebuild.
Under that scenario, Figueroa would have just gone out to the highest bidder after last season. Ditto for Heron...or Ponds the year before, or Jakarr Sampson before that....I could go on and on. Just look at how disappointed we all were when Tariq Owens left us as a graduate transfer. Imagine that happening on a yearly basis with the non-graduates. Nightmare![/quote]
Feel free to think that but its pretty much that now.
And knowing you only have one bullet is a lot different than right now when many of these kids like Tariq and Dunn are transferring twice.
This is simply a concept. I would say the NCAA puts some restrictions on timing too. Would likely cut down on mid year transfers knowing they can still start Day 1.
Maybe even a period of two weeks after a coach is let go allowing a new coach to re-recruit players. Of course then onus is on the school to fill the job. Just spitballing here because right not its simply not objective.
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Moose
Well-known member
I know Dunn is getting all the attention but the Steere situation is just as big of a joke.
A kid left TCU and transferred to some school in California. Forgot the exact school. Kid is from New Zealand. Played in 2 games last year for TCU. Immediately eligible. Where is the consistency.
A kid left TCU and transferred to some school in California. Forgot the exact school. Kid is from New Zealand. Played in 2 games last year for TCU. Immediately eligible. Where is the consistency.
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Why not just pull a Memphis and play Dunn. But FU to the NCAA. So what they take away the wins from the year. Who cares, flex some muscle.
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html
[quote="Eric Williamson" post=362320][quote="Red2395" post=362304]If a coach is fired any player from that team should be able to transfer and not have to sit out a year.
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.[/quote]
I stated that a coach was fired which would be a University decision.
A coach quitting is very different in that he is quitting on the players he recruited to the School. Wrong but not the same as the University firing a coach.
Dismissing a coach during the season opens up so many different Scenarios. For me it would depend on at what point the coach was fired. But a player should not be able to play for two different schools in the same season.
Fair is Fair.[/quote]
Sounds reasonable. But what would you do in situations like Niagara this year? Their coach quit two weeks before the season starts? If the kids transfer, when are they eligible? Should they be eligible to play the 2nd semester this year considering they hadn't played a game yet when their coach left? Do they lose any eligibility considering they were on the team and practicing this entire time? What happens if its a Mike Jarvis scenario and a coach is fired mid-season? When are those players eligible after they transfer? Would an athlete ever be allowed to play for two different schools in the same year?
I understand that those situations are outliers and not the norm, but they are very real situations like can occur. Then you start playing the 'what if' game, which is where we are at now. So I don't think its that easy to just say if a coach is fired they don't have to sit.[/quote]
I stated that a coach was fired which would be a University decision.
A coach quitting is very different in that he is quitting on the players he recruited to the School. Wrong but not the same as the University firing a coach.
Dismissing a coach during the season opens up so many different Scenarios. For me it would depend on at what point the coach was fired. But a player should not be able to play for two different schools in the same season.
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[quote="gman" post=362355]Why not just pull a Memphis and play Dunn. But FU to the NCAA. So what they take away the wins from the year. Who cares, flex some muscle.
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html[/quote]
Just listening to Jay Bilas and he has indicated their is a rule that Memphis could be “ineligible” for post season play for playing said ineligible player. Sounds like a rule that would be vigorously applied to SJU but doubtful that NCAA would apply to Memphis given that Wiseman is the number one prospect. Not sure we are worried about post season play.....yet.
Edit: So this potentially is not only vacating wins but Memphis or any school that plays an ineligible player may be barred for postseason play. Memphis has imperiled their entire season by playing Wiseman.
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html[/quote]
Just listening to Jay Bilas and he has indicated their is a rule that Memphis could be “ineligible” for post season play for playing said ineligible player. Sounds like a rule that would be vigorously applied to SJU but doubtful that NCAA would apply to Memphis given that Wiseman is the number one prospect. Not sure we are worried about post season play.....yet.
Edit: So this potentially is not only vacating wins but Memphis or any school that plays an ineligible player may be barred for postseason play. Memphis has imperiled their entire season by playing Wiseman.
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[quote="gman" post=362355]Why not just pull a Memphis and play Dunn. But FU to the NCAA. So what they take away the wins from the year. Who cares, flex some muscle.
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html[/quote]
Could be wrong but I think there is a difference in that the NCAA initially cleared Wiseman to be eligible and then informed Memphis recently that he may be ruled ineligible and advised them not to play him while under the rules we know Dunn is ineligible unless granted a waiver.
https://sports.yahoo.com/james-wiseman-memphis-ncaa-ruled-ineligible-224758449.html[/quote]
Could be wrong but I think there is a difference in that the NCAA initially cleared Wiseman to be eligible and then informed Memphis recently that he may be ruled ineligible and advised them not to play him while under the rules we know Dunn is ineligible unless granted a waiver.
[quote="MCNPA" post=362545][quote="Paultzman" post=362459]Sense SJ expects to hear something early next week. Of course we’ll see.[/quote]
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
I don’t get all of this Vermont talk, they are in the friggin American East. I would certainly hope we can beat them without Dunn, if we can’t then we might not beat Albany without Dunn. Vermont should be a win with or without Dunn.
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
I don’t get all of this Vermont talk, they are in the friggin American East. I would certainly hope we can beat them without Dunn, if we can’t then we might not beat Albany without Dunn. Vermont should be a win with or without Dunn.
[quote="MCNPA" post=362545][quote="Paultzman" post=362459]Sense SJ expects to hear something early next week. Of course we’ll see.[/quote]
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
Paultzman wrote that on Saturday so at the time it probably referred to this week so all may not be lost for Vermont. If someone wrote something in 2005 referencing "next week" would you think he meant after the Vermont game? JK
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
Paultzman wrote that on Saturday so at the time it probably referred to this week so all may not be lost for Vermont. If someone wrote something in 2005 referencing "next week" would you think he meant after the Vermont game? JK
[quote="Mike" post=362548][quote="MCNPA" post=362545][quote="Paultzman" post=362459]Sense SJ expects to hear something early next week. Of course we’ll see.[/quote]
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
I don’t get all of this Vermont talk, they are in the friggin American East. I would certainly hope we can beat them without Dunn, if we can’t then we might not beat Albany without Dunn. Vermont should be a win with or without Dunn.[/quote] pretty sure Paultz said" Perhaps we should all have some syrup on our toast "
I was hoping to get him beck before Vermont but If he’s getting cleared, beggars can’t be choosers. Sounds promising.[/quote]
I don’t get all of this Vermont talk, they are in the friggin American East. I would certainly hope we can beat them without Dunn, if we can’t then we might not beat Albany without Dunn. Vermont should be a win with or without Dunn.[/quote] pretty sure Paultz said" Perhaps we should all have some syrup on our toast "
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