(PRE-GAME) Georgetown (MSG), Sun. Jan. 27, NOON, FOX / 570AM

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[quote="oldschool Redmen" post=316787][quote="Beast of the East" post=316775][quote="oldschool Redmen" post=316747][quote="Beast of the East" post=316727][quote="Class of 72" post=316709][quote="Paultzman" post=316698]Big team with ever improving young guards v our undersized, talented squared. I’ll go with Johnnies at home.

If one stands back objectively & looks at SJU performances to date inconsistency is legitimate concern. I only recall three or four A game performances thus far & it seems time for another before the three challenging road games around the corner.[/quote]

This is absolutely a must win game to avoid what could be a season changing losing streak. I'm not sure getting just 4 or 5 points from the combination of Keita, Williams and Trimble off the bench will be enough to offset any possible bad games by any of the starters. We will need some creative coaching and key substitutions.[/quote]

Well its a must win because it's an important opportunity to sweep their first series. This will not be easy. I'd rather be playing them in CA.

The toughest one to swallow rn is getting whipped at home to depaul. That will hurt if we don't return the favor.[/quote]

It's a must win because of the following 3 games.
If they go 2-2 that would be good.
1-3 and they'll be on life support.
0-4 dead[/quote]

I look at the season as 9 home and homes. Right now we have 3 opportunities to sweep, 4 to be swept. The real pressure games are beating seton hall at home, villanova at home and butler at home. Logic dictates we win two of those 3. The away games at marquette and Creighton are chances to steal a series. The real must win at this point is beating dePaul away, since a sweep by them hurts us immensely.[/quote]

We're losing at Duke, we'll probaby go 1-1 at Creighton and Marquetter.
That's 4-5 15-7.
So you don't think G-Town is a must win? You're kidding yourself then.
4-6 is a big hole to get out of.[/quote]

It's a must win if you are prone to panic. I would call it a great opportunity to sweep a series. It's a very important game because road wins are precious in this league and you don't want to just hand that back to them. Like I said, when you view the season as 9 sets of home and home series, your perspective changes.

If we began the season with 9 road games and were 4-5, we would right the right to be ecstatic. If it were 9 home games and 4-5, reason to be very worried.

We have a game in hand with Georgetown, and it's really important to close them out. As I said though, winning at Depaul may may be more important
 
I wouldn't say they forget about him. When the ball is moving, Figgy gets his opportunities. One thing I notice is that he always hustles to get out in front of the break and calls for the ball. Since he is a highly skilled finisher, I think our guys can reward him there a little more often. We have missed a few.
 
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[quote="JohnnyFan" post=316837]When the ball is moving, Figgy gets his opportunities. One thing I notice is that he always hustles to get out in front of the break and call for the ball. Since he is a highly skilled finisher, I think our guys can reward him on the break a little more often. WE have missed a few.[/quote]
Excellent point. Figgy has that uncanny ability to read opportunities by moving to right spot to receive ball and make plays. He really has a heady, old school game. He’s also very dangerous at foul line v zones passing quickly or hitting floater.
 
That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

I think that's more of a Simon problem than a team-wide problem. Other guys that we have are excellent finishers. Simon has always struggled at the rim.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

This was a funny post.
 
SJU11Redmen wrote:Mike Zaun wrote: That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.

I think that's more of a Simon problem than a team-wide problem. Other guys that we have are excellent finishers. Simon has always struggled at the rim.


Agree 100%. I am a big Simon fan, but it is a little bewildering that Justin's free throw and finishing woes have gotten worse rather than better this year.Finished last year at 66% and this year only 58% from line and seems to miss even more bunnies. Would have thought these would be obvious areas for improvement this year, but it hasn't happened; continuing free throw woes especially puzzling since two of our coaches were absolutely superior from the line their whole career. Sometimes when Justin gets to the hoop it almost looks like he tosses it up to avoid contact and having to go to the foul line. He did finish strong from line last year, hoping for same this year.
 
It's usually Simon but there have been a few games where even Ponds and Heron were missing bunnies. I know Ponds is dealing with a bad back right now, but no excuse for Heron and Simon IMO. Maybe they just need to work on their touch.
 
The evidence is growing that if this team continues to perform as it has then the NCAA will be a coin flip. So hopefully this week is about implementing change that will drive improved results and a record that will put us squarely in on Selection Sunday.

In 11 games against high-major teams we've dominated 3, squarely lost 2, and 6 could have gone either way (and I'm being generous including @Nova here given we were -10 in the last 3:15, which isn't going to win a lot of conference games).

There's definitely an optimistic view here in 3 double-digit wins vs. 0 double-digit losses in this population, the only home loss was without Ponds, 5 of our final 8 are at home with the other 3 (Prov, DePaul, Xavier) being winnable road games, and the first 30 minutes against Butler was the most extended period in 19 games where team didn't show which is incredible consistency in effort.

But I'm not willing to bank on any of that as the consistency in production has not been there, it's mostly been too close for comfort and unless something changes I don't see that changing.

We have become one of the worst things a team can be which is predictable. We are the easiest game prep in the conference right now and if I'm Ewing and staff I haven't seen anything since the last time we played to think they are going to see anything different, and it's usually a lot easier to beat the same thing a second time around. Which is perhaps the perfect time for Mullin & Co. to show new look.

Things that were major advantages earlier in the season strategically have become disadvantages as teams have adjusted to their obviousness. Three jump off the page, all defensive:

1. We switch everything which earlier in the year was very effective in taking away action teams were trying to get directly from screens on and off ball. Now teams don't use screens to generate immediate action, they use them (often lazily) to get switches onto matchups they want. Watch how often Keita's or Clark's man screens Ponds so that they get Keita/Clark on the point and Ponds on the big. It's probably 20x possessions a game. You can't let teams get not one but two mismatches that easily in ~1/3 of possessions. That's not defense.

2. Related, after watching Simon and Figgy destroy Powell and Howard, teams aren't going at them nearly as much. Difficult thing to solve for, and with a stronger team defensively overall you might be happy enough to let Simon/Figgy take 2 guys away and let the rest play 3v3, but I'm not sure Ponds, Heron, and Clark/Keita is a strong enough group defensively to make that a winning strategy. So in some ways Simon/Figgy which might be the biggest 2 person defensive monster in conference (certainly at the wing) are being indirectly mitigated.

3. Something, anything has to change with regard to single post defense. We were fronting and helping more effectively earlier in the year. Now there are a lot of easy 3-quarter or even worse straight up catches, and they either wait for a double to come with an easy pass out of it or go to work 1v1 in what is often a mismatch. I don't know why we would expect anything other than the incredibly ineffective results that have mostly stemmed from this beginning with Georgetown.

We are scoring PLENTY. Not one game below 71 in 19 tries which is crazy. 5 guys averaging double figures. Although not surprisingly all 4 losses have been below 74. Offense stalled late in 3 of those 4 games and there are clearly things that can be done earlier in game between rotation and timeout usage to have more legs for offense late. But separate from that reality is sometimes you have to be good enough defensively to win a conference game in the high 60s or low 70s and playing as we have I don't like our chances in those spots.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

More often than not, we miss runners that are off balance. There have been a few where we have missed going toward the rim, but most of the time it occurs with momentum away from the rim. This can occur when contact that isn't called is absorbed, but usually has been because the dribble has been picked up further from the rim than you would like. I think its because most of the time our opportunities present themselves as a result of one on one penetration from the perimeter instead of a pass into someone cutting into the lane. When you receive a pass on the move within 15 feet, it allows you to bounce it once and then explode to the rim. That leaves little opportunity for help defenders to react to draw charges and/or reach in to try to steal the ball.

This happens a lot to Simon since he usually starts a drive from the three point line and seems to only want to take one or two dribbles in traffic. So, the result is taking off from further away from the rim and usually not at a trajectory toward the rim. That increases the degree of difficulty even though the shot may only be from 5 feet. We also have a habit of not using glass all the time. This also makes the shot more difficult.
 
[quote="weathermannyc" post=316866][quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

More often than not, we miss runners that are off balance. There have been a few where we have missed going toward the rim, but most of the time it occurs with momentum away from the rim. This can occur when contact that isn't called is absorbed, but usually has been because the dribble has been picked up further from the rim than you would like. I think its because most of the time our opportunities present themselves as a result of one on one penetration from the perimeter instead of a pass into someone cutting into the lane. When you receive a pass on the move within 15 feet, it allows you to bounce it once and then explode to the rim. That leaves little opportunity for help defenders to react to draw charges and/or reach in to try to steal the ball.

This happens a lot to Simon since he usually starts a drive from the three point line and seems to only want to take one or two dribbles in traffic. So, the result is taking off from further away from the rim and usually not at a trajectory toward the rim. That increases the degree of difficulty even though the shot may only be from 5 feet. We also have a habit of not using glass all the time. This also makes the shot more difficult.[/quote]

Agree with your post. Most drives to the basket late have been contested, and by multiple defenders. Missed shots by and large have been makeable, some a little wild, and a few that appeared to be easy deuces. For certain teams pack it in a little more late in the game, which means taking it to the hole is going to be more difficult. IT has led to our guys extending being the zone and taking the type of shots opponents want us taking late. IT makes it more difficult to drive and dish since the defense is already packed in. Seems that when we push the ball in transition late, we are much more effective than half court offense late. The absence of a big post up player hurts us more late than earlier in games. In that regard, Owens would not have helped one iota.
 
Hate to break up the thread but was wondering when SJU plays at the garden is the SJU bench in front of section 108?
 
[quote="RJGBOOTSY" post=316887]Hate to break up the thread but was wondering when SJU plays at the garden is the SJU bench in front of section 108?[/quote]

Yes it is
 
[quote="Beast of the East" post=316874][quote="weathermannyc" post=316866][quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

More often than not, we miss runners that are off balance. There have been a few where we have missed going toward the rim, but most of the time it occurs with momentum away from the rim. This can occur when contact that isn't called is absorbed, but usually has been because the dribble has been picked up further from the rim than you would like. I think its because most of the time our opportunities present themselves as a result of one on one penetration from the perimeter instead of a pass into someone cutting into the lane. When you receive a pass on the move within 15 feet, it allows you to bounce it once and then explode to the rim. That leaves little opportunity for help defenders to react to draw charges and/or reach in to try to steal the ball.

This happens a lot to Simon since he usually starts a drive from the three point line and seems to only want to take one or two dribbles in traffic. So, the result is taking off from further away from the rim and usually not at a trajectory toward the rim. That increases the degree of difficulty even though the shot may only be from 5 feet. We also have a habit of not using glass all the time. This also makes the shot more difficult.[/quote]

Agree with your post. Most drives to the basket late have been contested, and by multiple defenders. Missed shots by and large have been makeable, some a little wild, and a few that appeared to be easy deuces. For certain teams pack it in a little more late in the game, which means taking it to the hole is going to be more difficult. IT has led to our guys extending being the zone and taking the type of shots opponents want us taking late. IT makes it more difficult to drive and dish since the defense is already packed in. Seems that when we push the ball in transition late, we are much more effective than half court offense late. The absence of a big post up player hurts us more late than earlier in games. In that regard, Owens would not have helped one iota.[/quote]

I think we all agree about the absence of the big post player. Keita is still in recovery mode though.
I don't agree about Owen's. To date our entire starting 5 has a counted for 37 blocked shots. Owens has 47 at TT all by his lonesome. He was a deterrent to guys driving. Opponents have been driving at will this year.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=316967][quote="Beast of the East" post=316874][quote="weathermannyc" post=316866][quote="Mike Zaun" post=316841]That's one thing that's most frustrating to watch especially in tight games...the inability to finish at the rim. Each game it seems we leave at least 10-12 points on the board due to missing floaters, alley-oops, and layups. This may sound like a stupid question, but is this stuff being addressed in practice? We need to practice fast breaks and when to keep the ball and when to pass it. We need to have a good idea of what we want to do with the ball before getting to the rim. Seems like guys like Simon get there but then hesitate. I watch all other Big East teams and I have not seen anywhere near the same issue that we do with the misses at the rim. I get that no one will be 100% and rims can be unforgiving, but we need to finish most of these. If I'm Mullin, I'm telling them to stop trying to make CA or MSG Rucker Park and settle for the easy points. How many times do we turn the ball over on fast breaks trying to rush especially on alley-oops? Also, FT shooting should not be a coin flip and that's what it feels like watching us. I'm very confused why we can't shoot FT's easily when we have some good shooters. Hard to watch in tight games.[/quote]

More often than not, we miss runners that are off balance. There have been a few where we have missed going toward the rim, but most of the time it occurs with momentum away from the rim. This can occur when contact that isn't called is absorbed, but usually has been because the dribble has been picked up further from the rim than you would like. I think its because most of the time our opportunities present themselves as a result of one on one penetration from the perimeter instead of a pass into someone cutting into the lane. When you receive a pass on the move within 15 feet, it allows you to bounce it once and then explode to the rim. That leaves little opportunity for help defenders to react to draw charges and/or reach in to try to steal the ball.

This happens a lot to Simon since he usually starts a drive from the three point line and seems to only want to take one or two dribbles in traffic. So, the result is taking off from further away from the rim and usually not at a trajectory toward the rim. That increases the degree of difficulty even though the shot may only be from 5 feet. We also have a habit of not using glass all the time. This also makes the shot more difficult.[/quote]

Agree with your post. Most drives to the basket late have been contested, and by multiple defenders. Missed shots by and large have been makeable, some a little wild, and a few that appeared to be easy deuces. For certain teams pack it in a little more late in the game, which means taking it to the hole is going to be more difficult. IT has led to our guys extending being the zone and taking the type of shots opponents want us taking late. IT makes it more difficult to drive and dish since the defense is already packed in. Seems that when we push the ball in transition late, we are much more effective than half court offense late. The absence of a big post up player hurts us more late than earlier in games. In that regard, Owens would not have helped one iota.[/quote]

I think we all agree about the absence of the big post player. Keita is still in recovery mode though.
I don't agree about Owen's. To date our entire starting 5 has a counted for 37 blocked shots. Owens has 47 at TT all by his lonesome. He was a deterrent to guys driving. Opponents have been driving at will this year.[/quote]

I was speaking about offense. Owens has a horrible post player and could not play with his back to the basket. SUPPOSEDLY, Keita can do this, but I was told this and haven't seen good evidence of it.

Owens was definitely long and blocked a lot of shots. From my recollection, most of them were not the man he was guarding, and he got tossed around like a rag doll. I'm not even sure he altered a lot of shots. It seemed to me his blocks were of a surprising nature, like swooping in from higher in the paint to swat a guards shot.

I see the end of game problems as mostly occurring when the defense sets up, packs it in and dares us to shoot over the zone, which we attempted to do. It plays into their hands, taking the shots they will give us. In transition we are much more difficult to stop, so as soon as we stop running late in games, we have been in trouble.
 
Watching a great game Xavier and providence. Do not want to be negative but it is going to be extremely hard to beat either one of theses team. Prov up by 5 with 1.03 to go
 
[quote="usguard" post=316984]Watching a great game Xavier and providence. Do not want to be negative but it is going to be extremely hard to beat either one of theses team. Prov up by 5 with 1.03 to go[/quote]

Really? Watching down the stretch, it looked like both teams were trying to lose, but only Xavier was successful.
 
[quote="mjmaherjr" post=316268][attachment=641]bronx-brewery-pale-ale.gif.png[/attachment][/quote]

mjmaherjr- what time do the taps open at MSG? Is it still noon or do they open earlier now?
 
[quote="ipd200" post=317019][quote="mjmaherjr" post=316268][attachment=641]bronx-brewery-pale-ale.gif.png[/attachment][/quote]

mjmaherjr- what time do the taps open at MSG? Is it still noon or do they open earlier now?[/quote]noon
 
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