Mount St. Mary's, Wed. Dec. 5, 6:30p, FS-2 / 970 WNYM

A win is a win. They played sloppy street ball again. Crowd wanted a blow out.
Interesting ,we started year #38 on KenPom and after 8-0 we are #52. That definitely says something about our schedule and how we are really playing.
 
[quote="Jack Williams" post=306602]There are two things I advise a lot of people on this board should do.

1) Accept we are not well coached and probably never will be - it makes the kool aid go down a lot easier. Just accept it guys. All I've seen in my life is Roberts, Lavin, and Mullin coached teams, I don't even know what a well coached st johns team looks like. Just accept it and enjoy life a little bit. Which brings me to my next point

2) Enjoy the little things - We are 8-0 right now and one of the last 11 undefeated teams in Division 1 college basketball. This is St. John's, we are not a consistently great program, we haven't been for a long, long time. I understand and respect people sharing their views and the negatives they see out on the court. But come on guys. We have won every game we have played so far. Even if it comes crashing down in Big East play like soooooooo many of you are predicting, can we please just not have a "sky is falling" attitude right now? On December 29th when Seton Hall kicks our teeth in by 35 points, then we can all collectively lose our shit together. :)

I just read a post from guiness saying I hate to say it but we are probably a one and done in the tournament. We will get into the NCAA and maybe win one and thats it. Okay? You guys do realize that would be the most successful St. John's basketball season in (checks notes), EIGHTEEN YEARS.

I understand my perspective is different because a lot of you were able to actually see the glory days so you hold this program to that esteem. But Mike Zaun, you are like 26 right? How long have you been following this team? Surely you've seen the last 15 years of our team right?

This is my main issue with the doom and gloom. A lot of people think we have a good roster so the expectations are at a level that the program hasn't even delivered on such George W was serving his first term.

We were what, 4-14 in the Big East last year? And we added Mustapha and LJ and lost Bashir. Clear improvement, but why are we world beaters now? We are a good team and nothing more. I hope you can enjoy the wins when they do come. Have a great night[/quote]

I'm not willing to accept that we are poorly coached at this point. I am keeping an open mind and will evaluate at the end of the season.

I knew 2011 and Lavin's final year were one and dones. We didn't have an NBA player on either roster and we didn't hit the offensive glass. Same thing with Hatten's 2002 NCAA appearance after Willie Shaw was suspended, but because they couldn't score.

I don't get the same feeling with this team. They can score and they have the ability to own the offensive glass. But these guys have to be good first before they can be very good or great. I think they will need to learn from a few conference losses to really come together.
 
I wish the powers that be be would do something about the three point shot. Over the years players have gotten stronger and now just about every player on the floor is capable of making them. Fifty eight attempts tonight. Move the line further out to discourage some of these attempts.
 
[quote="Johnnie Drama" post=306601][quote="Marillac" post=306597][quote="fordham96" post=306583]BTW quick, the posters who said that in these last few games before conference play they wanted to see Roberts, Earlington , Williams etc get time to see what they have because we all assumed blowouts, is that still your wish?[/quote]

Who cares? Williams played 4 minutes in the middle of a tight game tonight and it's pretty clear he is not only the 9th man after Keita comes back, but he is also the only freshman that will play in comference games. Roberts obviously isn't ready and Keita comes back within the next two weeks.[/quote]

Makes me wonder why Roberts can't get on the court. When your playing garbage squads, why not get him some court time? There is no shot blocking threat whatsoever. 5'8 dudes are attacking the rim.[/quote]

Roberts can't get on the court because we aren't as good a team as expected. There are many warts. The staff thought Keita was the only big needed. They were wrong. They took Caraher and a guard when they needed two Mooses.
Again, the recruiting has been haphazard. Fordham hit it on the head by pointing out we have 5 players not able to contribute. Even in a game against a freshman team of unranked players!!!!
Folks are exited about Ian Steere as if Bol Bol or Moses Brown or even Jordan Brown were transferring. Steere was the 34th ranked center in that class. Josh Roberts was ranked 46th. Other than Ponds we have been lucky to have gotten some talented players via transfer but none are impact players. Mustapha Heron is a better player than he has shown but playing for a less disciplined coach (s) may not be the best for him.
There is ample reason to be a worried fan base even after going 8-0.
 
[quote="terrificboss" post=306606]A win is a win. They played sloppy street ball again. Crowd wanted a blow out.
Interesting ,we started year #38 on KenPom and after 8-0 we are #52. That definitely says something about our schedule and how we are really playing.[/quote]

KenPom has never been kind to us. They count our games at Barclays as semi-home games while the NET and RPI count them as neutral. It's also b.s. to use the prior year to rank teams before the season instead of evaluating each season alone.
 
[quote="Jack Williams" post=306602]There are two things I advise a lot of people on this board should do.

1) Accept we are not well coached and probably never will be - it makes the kool aid go down a lot easier. Just accept it guys. All I've seen in my life is Roberts, Lavin, and Mullin coached teams, I don't even know what a well coached st johns team looks like. Just accept it and enjoy life a little bit. Which brings me to my next point

2) Enjoy the little things - We are 8-0 right now and one of the last 11 undefeated teams in Division 1 college basketball. This is St. John's, we are not a consistently great program, we haven't been for a long, long time. I understand and respect people sharing their views and the negatives they see out on the court. But come on guys. We have won every game we have played so far. Even if it comes crashing down in Big East play like soooooooo many of you are predicting, can we please just not have a "sky is falling" attitude right now? On December 29th when Seton Hall kicks our teeth in by 35 points, then we can all collectively lose our shit together. :)

I just read a post from guiness saying I hate to say it but we are probably a one and done in the tournament. We will get into the NCAA and maybe win one and thats it. Okay? You guys do realize that would be the most successful St. John's basketball season in (checks notes), EIGHTEEN YEARS.

I understand my perspective is different because a lot of you were able to actually see the glory days so you hold this program to that esteem. But Mike Zaun, you are like 26 right? How long have you been following this team? Surely you've seen the last 15 years of our team right?

This is my main issue with the doom and gloom. A lot of people think we have a good roster so the expectations are at a level that the program hasn't even delivered on such George W was serving his first term.

We were what, 4-14 in the Big East last year? And we added Mustapha and LJ and lost Bashir. Clear improvement, but why are we world beaters now? We are a good team and nothing more. I hope you can enjoy the wins when they do come. Have a great night[/quote]

Yikes, I wish. 29 now...been following closely since Lavin and I know that's not very long but we've had a ton of talent come through our doors in that span anyhow. It's not doom and gloom IMO it's having high hopes and then watching the team struggle to beat absolutely terrible teams. Is it so wrong to be discouraged by that? Again, no one would be praising a huge jacked boxer that just went 8-0 against midgets not to mention the midgets had him on the ropes in almost every match. You can be optimistic, but for most people in order to be optimistic, you need real reasons for optimism. Of course many will roll their eyes and say "we are 8-0 stupid!" but it's seriously misleading. If we actually covered in these games and performed about as expected with occasional struggle but smacking most of these bums around, I'd be much more optimistic. We are not playing nearly as well as expected, thus the negative response from fans. My hope is that everything will change suddenly in conference play.
 
As I've said many times before... this teams is going no where with Chris Mullin as coach. Anyone with half a brain can see a major collapse coming once we start playing Big East teams. We could barley beat an 0-8 team that loses by an average margin of 20 points per game! NC State beat this team by 50. Just an embarrassing performance all around. 8-0 is nice, but unless major changes are made this team's going no where.
 
Most of us have begged for a " x and o" assistant coach, well I would prefer a defensive assistant coach. We just allowed a 29% three point team shoot open threes.
Unselfish seems to be the key word for Ponds now a days, however I was not impressed as he passed up open layups with 4 minutes and one minute remaining in the game.
I was particularly happy seeing Williams get some opportunity in the first half.
The Mount had some quick guards as evidenced by our defense trailing and watching them finish with easy layups.
I'll take the win. God knows I've seen too many losses against the likes of Mount St. Mary's.
 
Tonight was a step backward, especially defensively. Still got the win!!!!! Clarke played very well. Continue to show we can score the ball and score from all areas of the court. This will be very important as the season progresses. Lets have a good couple of days of practice, coaching staff included and come out and beat Princeton at the Garden!!!
 
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[quote="Class of 72" post=306565][quote="guinness77" post=306549]I don’t get this criticism. Ponds is trying to put his teammates in good positions and show them some confidence. If there was ever a game to try that, it was against this winless team. He’s more than capable of taking over games against the upper echelon teams, I don’t have a problem with him doing this against teams like Mount St Mary’s. If we ever trailed in this game, I’m sure he would have changed his strategy.[/quote]

Sorry, your analysis is faulty. Ponds took most if the night off. Played little defense and rarely looked for his shot. MSM was in thus game until the last few minutes. So, if you have no problem "with him doing this against teams like Mount St Mary’s and you think "If we ever trailed in this game, I’m sure he would have changed his strategy", you weren't paying attention.
Mullin sat him in the first half for playing lackadaisically. His MSM counterpart Dee Barnes is a freshman who averages 2 fat points per game. Tonight he scored a career high 26. Did I say he was a freshman like our Greg Williams?
He changed his toon only when Greg St. Jean asked Mullin to put him back in the game at a point where we needed him but Mullin definitely was not happy with his strategy as you described his lazy play.[/quote]

72, aren't the 2 points per game from Barnes due to his recovery from an early season injury? He was a DNP the first two games and played under a minute in game three. He only played just 4 minutes in his last game. I know he's going to shoot one for ten next week, but I bet as he gets heathy he scores a lot of points for this team this season.

I'm not disagreeing that Ponds took much of the night off. He won't be taking any BE games lightly.

As stated often here, this OOC schedule sucks as there is nothing gained by winning and much to lose when a team like MSM lights it up with unheralded freshmen playing with chips on the shoulders.
 
[quote="johnny redman" post=306620]Texas just lost to VCU at home! Rankings are BS[/quote]

Texas also lost at home to Radford last Friday.
 
[quote="SJU11phd" post=306614]As I've said many times before... this teams is going no where with Chris Mullin as coach. Anyone with half a brain can see a major collapse coming once we start playing Big East teams. We could barley beat an 0-8 team that loses by an average margin of 20 points per game! NC State beat this team by 50. Just an embarrassing performance all around. 8-0 is nice, but unless major changes are made this team's going no where.[/quote]

There are no major changes to come. Unless you think getting Keita back is a change. Reality is that the freshman and soph backcourt of Mount Saint Mary's played better than Dixon, Williams and Trimble. THAT is our bench. PERIOD.
MOST teams, even MSM, have a mixed roster of size and speed. We have one and it is going to get smaller as we get to the Big East unless our game prep imoroves.
 
I know we aren't Duke and I totally understand if we play a few of these games where we lay an egg against a terrible team and they play the game of their lives. But that's not the problem. The problem is that this happens almost every time we play awful teams.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=306621][quote="johnny redman" post=306620]Texas just lost to VCU at home! Rankings are BS[/quote]

Texas also lost at home to Radford last Friday.[/quote]


And Radford beat ND on the road too. They are higher ranked in the NET than PC or Xavier.
 
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[quote="OLV72" post=306624][quote="MJDinkins" post=306621][quote="johnny redman" post=306620]Texas just lost to VCU at home! Rankings are BS[/quote]

Texas also lost at home to Radford last Friday.[/quote]


And Radford beat ND on the road too. They are higher ranked in the NET than PC or Xavier.[/quote]

Radford also lost to Duquesne (A-10) and James Madison (CAA) who both are predicted to finish 11th and 6th in their respective conferences.

Frankly, I don't care about some NET at this juncture.
 
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[quote="we are sju" post=306592]
I will say this again though. One positive of us playing poorly and still winning is we have gained experience playing in close games. If we would have won all these games by 20 would have not gained anything.[/quote]

The problem is that if we play poorly against Big East teams, we may not be in a close one at the end in order to utilize this experience.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=306621][quote="johnny redman" post=306620]Texas just lost to VCU at home! Rankings are BS[/quote]

Texas also lost at home to Radford last Friday.[/quote]

Texas also beat North Carolina and Arkansas on neutral courts. It's hard to be undefeated.

Radford is 6-2 with wins over Notre Dame and Texas. They aren't a cupcake.
 
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