Lavin parting ways with St.John's

[redfan259999888]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

Agreed!

Either fire him immediately or make a statement in support of him immediately and explain that an extension is being worked on.

This guy is meeting with Diallo this week. He should already have an extension in place or be unemployed prior.

Don't you have to be smart to run a university? Well where's the brains?

 

[redfan259999888]

I'm hoping it comes with the stipulation that Rico, Martin, and Whitesell need to go. Not enough production from any of them to warrant staying. Chiles actually seemed to be working, so I can live with him. Bring in Davis from Manhattan and an X's and O's guy. If it's a high school coach from a successful program, so be it.

If it wasn't for Whitesell we would still be in the tournament. I am also pretty sure Rico obstructed Lavin from recruiting in 2014.

Was Whitesell supplying Obekpa?

Yeah.....let's go with it. Anything to absolve Lavin from responsibility.

So tired of the endless excuses from both him and his supporters. I will give it a rest soon, but right now I am having a tantrum as I realize we will have another 5 years of nonsense.

Why stay on board this mess with Lavin as coach? You know there will always be drama with him here, you want misery? God bless you then.
Just wait for that year 2 or 3yrs down the line, when he stops recruiting for a whole year.

 

[mjmaherjr]

Word on the street is that Maher got Lavin to forego a guaranteed buyout by offering him a piece of Charlotte caramel cake instead.

lol. It was so good I'd only give up a piece if Norm was still here to get him out

 

[mjmaherjr]

I'm hoping it comes with the stipulation that Rico, Martin, and Whitesell need to go. Not enough production from any of them to warrant staying. Chiles actually seemed to be working, so I can live with him. Bring in Davis from Manhattan and an X's and O's guy. If it's a high school coach from a successful program, so be it.

If it wasn't for Whitesell we would still be in the tournament. I am also pretty sure Rico obstructed Lavin from recruiting in 2014.

Johnny Fan, can you elaborate on that pls? How did Whitesell hurt us in the tournament? How did Rico obstruct recruiting? Thanks

wasn't whitesell specialty working with big men ? that's like being unemployed on our undersized team

 

[mjmaherjr]

As best as I can figure it out, the DOBO is the teams traveling secretary and he schedules practices. He is not allowed to recruit. Why does he have to be a NY guy? If there is something special about the DOBO position, let me know.

you're right. we should get a hot girl instead

 

[L J S A]

I'm hoping it comes with the stipulation that Rico, Martin, and Whitesell need to go. Not enough production from any of them to warrant staying. Chiles actually seemed to be working, so I can live with him. Bring in Davis from Manhattan and an X's and O's guy. If it's a high school coach from a successful program, so be it.

If it wasn't for Whitesell we would still be in the tournament. I am also pretty sure Rico obstructed Lavin from recruiting in 2014.

Johnny Fan, can you elaborate on that pls? How did Whitesell hurt us in the tournament? How did Rico obstruct recruiting? Thanks

wasn't whitesell specialty working with big men ? that's like being unemployed on our undersized team

That's what I thought I heard initially, but Moose refuted it a couple times, so I went with what I knew for certain. I remember he was praised at the architect of a big win against VCU.

 

[L J S A]

As best as I can figure it out, the DOBO is the teams traveling secretary and he schedules practices. He is not allowed to recruit. Why does he have to be a NY guy? If there is something special about the DOBO position, let me know.

you're right. we should get a hot girl instead

Surely there must be an Asian girl with dyed blonde hair and huge boobs who is knowledgeable about basketball out there somewhere. NYC is a big place.

 

[simplyred]

JohnnyFan was employing a device known as sarcasm. His point was that blame is being deflected off Lavin and unto the assistant coaches. To that point, I agree. The head coach gets the praise and he should also get the blame.

 

[L J S A]

JohnnyFan was employing a device known as sarcasm. His point was that blame is being deflected off Lavin and unto the assistant coaches. To that point, I agree. The head coach gets the praise and he should also get the blame.

I recognize that, but in my post I was not blaming the assistants for Lavin's shortcomings. I know Lavin is a crappy coach. But if Lavin is staying, other changes need to be made to compensate for his crappiness.

 

[simplyred]

JohnnyFan was employing a device known as sarcasm. His point was that blame is being deflected off Lavin and unto the assistant coaches. To that point, I agree. The head coach gets the praise and he should also get the blame.

I recognize that, but in my post I was not blaming the assistants for Lavin's shortcomings. I know Lavin is a crappy coach. But if Lavin is staying, other changes need to be made to compensate for his crappiness.

I was really answering Boo Harvey's post asking Johnny Fan to explain his post. I should have been clearer.

 

[L J S A]

No worries. There's so much going on in the thread I replied just in case it was referring to my initial post.

 

[Marillac]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

 

[JohnnyFan]

JohnnyFan was employing a device known as sarcasm. His point was that blame is being deflected off Lavin and unto the assistant coaches. To that point, I agree. The head coach gets the praise and he should also get the blame.

I recognize that, but in my post I was not blaming the assistants for Lavin's shortcomings. I know Lavin is a crappy coach. But if Lavin is staying, other changes need to be made to compensate for his crappiness.

LJSA....I did miss understand your post. Guess I jumped the gun there.......my bad. As mentioned, I am admittedly cranky about the recent developments.

SimplyRed.....Thank you, I was indeed being sarcastic.

 

[redfan259999888]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

If they fire him but decide to wait until F4 weekend then I hope they have their intended target locked down. That's still over a week away and he could be gone by then.

 

[L J S A]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

If they fire him but decide to wait until F4 weekend then I hope they have their intended target locked down. That's still over a week away and he could be gone by then.

I think you are better off bracing yourself for him being extended. At this point I'd be shocked if he isn't.

 

[Ray Morgan]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

"Can St. John's do better" is the most sensible sentence I have read in the last few days. No hysteria, no predictions, no freaking out. That's what it should come down to. With Norm, you couldn't help but do better. With Lavin, it's hard to say. When it comes to recruiting, he could get hot again. I hope the admin has evaluated what is out there, and will extend if there are no better options.

 

[beast of the east]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

"Can St. John's do better" is the most sensible sentence I have read in the last few days. No hysteria, no predictions, no freaking out. That's what it should come down to. With Norm, you couldn't help but do better. With Lavin, it's hard to say. When it comes to recruiting, he could get hot again. I hope the admin has evaluated what is out there, and will extend if there are no better options.

To me, a realistic goal is, "Can we annually reside in the top 4 places of the Big East, and top 3 in most years?" If we are in the top 4 annually, even 8 out of 10 years, we'd get 8 bids in 10 years. From what we've seen of Lavin, can he deliver that?

Forget about becming one of the top teams in the country for a minute. Do any of us believe that Lavin can consistently make us one of the top teams in our conference?

 

[Marillac]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

If they fire him but decide to wait until F4 weekend then I hope they have their intended target locked down. That's still over a week away and he could be gone by then.

I think you are better off bracing yourself for him being extended. At this point I'd be shocked if he isn't.

I actually pictured him bracing himself. He's hobbit-like in my imagination.

 

[redfan259999888]

So Marillac, first you had your love affair with Lavin, recently you almost broke it off with him. Guess it's back huh, for another 5 years?

 

[RedmanMike]

This is amateur hour. The school should be absolutely be ashamed of itself. Honestly, there is a reason why our program has been the pits for years and it extends well beyond the head coach.

The University should have been prepared to make a decision immediately following the end of the season. Whether or not the team beat SDSU should have had no bearing on the decision. These conflicting reports about Lavin's future are an embarrassment.

If in fact Lavin is retained, there is little doubt in my mind that the relationship will be strained. Notwithstanding his public pronouncements, we will have a head coach that is resentful for how this is being handled. And whether you like Lavin or not, who could blame him for being peeved.

With all due respect, St. John's doesn't have to do anything. Lavin is under contract for one more season. Schools do not have to announce annually they intend to bring back coaches still under contract. In most cases it would actually be very weird. If his contract was up after this season, it would be a different story.

Our season ended less than a week ago. You guys need to relax. If they intent to let Lavin go, they'll announce it. If they extend him, they'll announce it. A reasonable time frame for a decision is Final Four weekend.

This is not an easy decision. Lavin didn't go 10-20 or 28-3. He didn't do anything awful to embarrass the school unlike some want everyone to believe. He graduated all of his seniors and his senior spoke glowingly about him the relationship they have with him. This call comes down to one question "Can St. John's do better?"

"Can St. John's do better" is the most sensible sentence I have read in the last few days. No hysteria, no predictions, no freaking out. That's what it should come down to. With Norm, you couldn't help but do better. With Lavin, it's hard to say. When it comes to recruiting, he could get hot again. I hope the admin has evaluated what is out there, and will extend if there are no better options.

To me, a realistic goal is, "Can we annually reside in the top 4 places of the Big East, and top 3 in most years?" If we are in the top 4 annually, even 8 out of 10 years, we'd get 8 bids in 10 years. From what we've seen of Lavin, can he deliver that?

Forget about becming one of the top teams in the country for a minute. Do any of us believe that Lavin can consistently make us one of the top teams in our conference?

The answer to that question is obviously no.

I'm torn about this entire issue, because while I think we can do better than Lavin I also know from our recent experience (Norm, Mahoney) that we can do worse.

Here is the troubling thing in my mind... The season that just ended (21-12, not a factor in the BE regular season or BET, one and done in the Dance) would have been considered mediocre to SJ fans not too long ago. Looie had those kind of seasons almost every year -- and every few years he put together better teams that actually made a little noise.

With Lavin, I truly believe that the season we just had was the high water mark. We will not do better than this. These were all his players, mostly seniors, and were the remnants of his supposedly signature recruiting class. I do not believe he is capable of putting together a Final Four caliber team even one time (his recruiting is not nearly as good as advertised), and if he did get that level of talent to commit to SJ and actually get them eligible and on the court, I do not believe he is a good enough coach to actually get them there.

SO by extending Lavin, I believe we are signing on for an extended run of mediocrity. Some years we'll be pretty good and we'll be in the top half of the BE, and have the kind of year we just had, and some years (when the cupboard is bare, like next year will be) we will be in the bottom half of the BE and will be an afterthought.