July Evaluation Periods

[quote="redmannorth" post=291245][quote="MJDinkins" post=291244][quote="redmannorth" post=291242][quote="NCJohnnie" post=291226]With Greg Williams as a 4 star, that makes 2 on the squad signed out of high school. Having said that agree it would be nice to depend a bit less on transfers going forward[/quote]

We never have , nor will we ever be , a top destination for high school recruits. [/quote]

Not true. We may have not be a destination ala the blue bloods, but we've actually been a destination and have had lots of dogs in the fight for those type of players.

I can't even definitively say, we won't "ever be" a destination for 5-star players. Is it likely? Probably not. But you also never know. I'm sure UConn fans probably once thought the same prior to the Jim Calhoun era.[/quote]

I Saïd top destination , not destination. Of course we are a destination but I stand by what I said that we will never be a top destination, like the blue bloods as you referenced.
And UConn was not a destination for MCAAS under coach Calhoun. Check how many he signed over a 25 odd year runand 3 national titles. Not too many. He won with 3 and 4 star players whom he coached up over 3 and 4 years and the occasional 5 star. That is why I refer to him as the greatest coach of his time frame as won with less than UNC, Duke ,Kentucky etc.[/quote]

I won't definitively say we won't ever be a destination.

I believe Calhoun had 10 McDonald's AA's. Once, Calhoun got on a roll, he was majority winning with 4-star recruits. A handful may have been the 3-star variety, but they were mainly 4-star tiered recruits.
 
[quote="MJDinkins" post=291250][quote="redmannorth" post=291245][quote="MJDinkins" post=291244][quote="redmannorth" post=291242][quote="NCJohnnie" post=291226]With Greg Williams as a 4 star, that makes 2 on the squad signed out of high school. Having said that agree it would be nice to depend a bit less on transfers going forward[/quote]

We never have , nor will we ever be , a top destination for high school recruits. [/quote]

Not true. We may have not be a destination ala the blue bloods, but we've actually been a destination and have had lots of dogs in the fight for those type of players.

I can't even definitively say, we won't "ever be" a destination for 5-star players. Is it likely? Probably not. But you also never know. I'm sure UConn fans probably once thought the same prior to the Jim Calhoun era.[/quote]

I Saïd top destination , not destination. Of course we are a destination but I stand by what I said that we will never be a top destination, like the blue bloods as you referenced.
And UConn was not a destination for MCAAS under coach Calhoun. Check how many he signed over a 25 odd year runand 3 national titles. Not too many. He won with 3 and 4 star players whom he coached up over 3 and 4 years and the occasional 5 star. That is why I refer to him as the greatest coach of his time frame as won with less than UNC, Duke ,Kentucky etc.[/quote]

I won't definitively say we won't ever be a destination.

I believe Calhoun had 10 McDonald's AA's. Once, Calhoun got on a roll, he was majority winning with 4-star recruits. A handful may have been the 3-star variety, but they were mainly 4-star tiered recruits.[/quote]

He stole every NY area recruit from right under our noses. Given the level of success at UConn that was not hard to do.
Memphis wasn't a top destination until Calipari. Gonzaga was not a top destination until Mark Few. Baylor, GaTech, Wisconsin, Iowa State and a bunch of other football schools were not destinations for top basketball players until they hired the right coach to make them relevant.
Unlike football, college basketball programs can be turned around in a couple of seasons with big recruiting classes.
Unfortunately we have had only one top 10 class in the past 15 years.
 
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[quote="Class of 72" post=291251]
Unlike football, college basketball programs can be turned around in a couple of seasons with big recruiting classes.
Unfortunately we have had only one top 10 class in the past 15 years.[/quote]

I think we're going to be great this season. The problem is that if all the top kids sign early, they won't witness the greatness. And then if we lose all our studs after this season, it's back to rebuild. We're potentially in a really tough spot.
 
[quote="L J S A" post=291253][quote="Class of 72" post=291251]
Unlike football, college basketball programs can be turned around in a couple of seasons with big recruiting classes.
Unfortunately we have had only one top 10 class in the past 15 years.[/quote]

I think we're going to be great this season. The problem is that if all the top kids sign early, they won't witness the greatness. And then if we lose all our studs after this season, it's back to rebuild. We're potentially in a really tough spot.[/quote]

I 'think' a few of our top targets have commented they may decide in the Spring: Kofi, Lester Q, Precious(?), Scottie(?)...?
 
[quote="Paul Massell" post=291231][quote="austour" post=291227]
I did not say similar starting point, I said similar starting from scratch point. Year 2 for Lavin.

That's also why I mentioned the one year lag. Lavin had 1 player return for his second year yet by his third had a winning record again. Mullin had more returning his first year but less recruiting time. That said three years in we're still waiting for a winning record.[/quote]

nonsensical quibbling. There is no comparison even with the one year lag bs. If you want to compare the results of this season to Lavin's first season that is a similar though still advantage Lavin, starting point and Mullin deserves extra credit for getting us here under way more difficult circumstances. that is accurate. Mahoney, Fraschilla, Jarvis, Lavin, Roberts all inherited good to great teams. Mullin not only inherited zero players but also a very disenfranchised recruiting base. That is not Lavin bashing or Mullin blind love, That is accurate.[/quote]

Wait, now you're given Mullin a pass for his entire first 3 years and giving him extra credit for almost having a winning record? LOL Mediocrity breeds acceptance I guess.
 
[quote="austour" post=291260]


Wait, now you're given Mullin a pass for his entire first 3 years and giving him extra credit for almost having a winning record? LOL Mediocrity breeds acceptance I guess.[/quote]

I post facts and you just post hyperbole about what I didn't say when you can't back up nonsense. I did not give anyone a pass or say anything about records. You said that Mullin's first year and Lavins were similar. Or to hedge "starting point" whatever. Neither option are true. I called you on it now you're attributing stuff to me that I didn't say to hedge further. So where is this fair and balanced approach that you are calling other people on when it comes to your own claims?
 
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In any comparison of Lavin vs Mullin keep in mind the big east seemed to be a lot tougher in the Mullin years.
 
[quote="Enright" post=291271]In any comparison of Lavin vs Mullin keep in mind the big east seemed to be a lot tougher in the Mullin years.[/quote]

Not sure if you meant to say "Mullin years" but it would be nice to stop the Mullin/Lavin comparison and just start with a clean slate this season for Mully and everyone associated with the program.
I, for one, am tired of rehashing the past.
Who's with me???
URL]
[/quote]
 
[quote="Paul Massell" post=291266][quote="austour" post=291260]


Wait, now you're given Mullin a pass for his entire first 3 years and giving him extra credit for almost having a winning record? LOL Mediocrity breeds acceptance I guess.[/quote]

I post facts and you just post hyperbole about what I didn't say when you can't back up nonsense. I did not give anyone a pass or say anything about records. You said that Mullin's first year and Lavins were similar. Or to hedge "starting point" whatever. Neither option are true. I called you on it now you're attributing stuff to me that I didn't say to hedge further. So where is this fair and balanced approach that you are calling other people on when it comes to your own claims?[/quote]

What did I misunderstand. You're giving Mullin extra credit, your words, must mean you're satisfied. I remain not.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=291272][quote="Enright" post=291271]In any comparison of Lavin vs Mullin keep in mind the big east seemed to be a lot tougher in the Mullin years.[/quote]

Not sure if you meant to say "Mullin years" but it would be nice to stop the Mullin/Lavin comparison and just start with a clean slate this season for Mully and everyone associated with the program.
I, for one, am tired of rehashing the past.
Who's with me???
URL]
[/quote][/quote]


LOL. Luv that movie! That's the "Germans bombed Pear Harbor" scene! Priceless.
 
[quote="Class of 72" post=291272][quote="Enright" post=291271]In any comparison of Lavin vs Mullin keep in mind the big east seemed to be a lot tougher in the Mullin years.[/quote]

Not sure if you meant to say "Mullin years" but it would be nice to stop the Mullin/Lavin comparison and just start with a clean slate this season for Mully and everyone associated with the program.
I, for one, am tired of rehashing the past.
Who's with me???
URL]
[/quote][/quote]

To be fair, your posts have been the most right on as they identify the problem. STJ hasn't made a good hire since Louie came back from the Nets. As the game became more national the University did not respond appropriately, assuming they even care if the program is good. I shudder to think what kind of approach they will take when the inaugural Fox TV contract expires in 2025, assuming the next deal is more in line with going market rates.
 
WCJF wrote: The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.

I believe it is Clemson rather than Colorado, but could be wrong.
 
[quote="NCJohnnie" post=291993]WCJF wrote: The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.

I believe it is Clemson rather than Colorado, but could be wrong.[/quote]
Colorado
 
[quote="austour" post=291277] ... I shudder to think what kind of approach they will take when the inaugural Fox TV contract expires in 2025, assuming the next deal is more in line with going market rates.[/quote]
Jeez, that's seven years from now, austour ... and here I thought I was an inveterate worrywart. :(
 
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Paultzman wrote: NCJohnnie wrote: WCJF wrote: The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.

I believe it is Clemson rather than Colorado, but could be wrong.
Colorado

Thanks, my mistake. I saw Clemson was mentioned as a school recruiting him in prior story. I'd be more afraid of Clemson than Colorado, so happy to be wrong.
 
[quote="Windy City Johnny Fan" post=291989]The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.[/quote]

Not sure if you were being sarcastic implying "See? We are not in the friend zone!", so forgive me if I misinterpreted but if we're being unbiased and honest, making a recruit's top 6, top 10, top 25 means nothing. We need to start closing, because the last big time HS recruit we got was Ponds I believe. That's why we need Rice so badly...he should help with that. Even if we don't get Lewis, he should have some 4 stars looking at us seriously. How many times do we see the list of schools recruiting a certain recruit and there are some random teams in the mix? If Marist makes a 5 star recruit's top 6, is that really cause for puffing their chest out? My point is that if we are satisfied just being "in the mix" for recruits, then it's time for a major cultural change. No one expects to land 5 stars consistently (if at all currently) and no one expects to land every 4 star recruit, but we should be landing some and that's not really debatable if you look at a team like DePaul that still finds a way somehow and they have been as bad as any program ever. Hell, even Western Kentucky finds a way. Time for us to find one as well.

Remember, coffee is for closers. You don't get coffee for having a customer consider your product. Let's start closing fellas!

 
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[quote="Mike Zaun" post=292018][quote="Windy City Johnny Fan" post=291989]The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.[/quote]

Not sure if you were being sarcastic implying "See? We are not in the friend zone!", so forgive me if I misinterpreted but if we're being unbiased and honest, making a recruit's top 6, top 10, top 25 means nothing. We need to start closing, because the last big time HS recruit we got was Ponds I believe. That's why we need Rice so badly...he should help with that. Even if we don't get Lewis, he should have some 4 stars looking at us seriously. How many times do we see the list of schools recruiting a certain recruit and there are some random teams in the mix? If Marist makes a 5 star recruit's top 6, is that really cause for puffing their chest out? My point is that if we are satisfied just being "in the mix" for recruits, then it's time for a major cultural change. No one expects to land 5 stars consistently (if at all currently) and no one expects to land every 4 star recruit, but we should be landing some and that's not really debatable if you look at a team like DePaul that still finds a way somehow and they have been as bad as any program ever. Hell, even Western Kentucky finds a way. Time for us to find one as well.

Remember, coffee is for closers. You don't get coffee for having a customer consider your product. Let's start closing fellas!

[/quote]

I was being very sarcastic. As Paultz will tell you, I am very unimpressed with anything short of #closing on a few of these kids.
 
[quote="Mike Zaun" post=292018][quote="Windy City Johnny Fan" post=291989]The Friend Zone Champs made James Bishop's Top 6 along with the Hall, Marquette, LSU, VCU and Colorado.[/quote]

Not sure if you were being sarcastic implying "See? We are not in the friend zone!", so forgive me if I misinterpreted but if we're being unbiased and honest, making a recruit's top 6, top 10, top 25 means nothing. We need to start closing, because the last big time HS recruit we got was Ponds I believe. That's why we need Rice so badly...he should help with that. Even if we don't get Lewis, he should have some 4 stars looking at us seriously. How many times do we see the list of schools recruiting a certain recruit and there are some random teams in the mix? If Marist makes a 5 star recruit's top 6, is that really cause for puffing their chest out? My point is that if we are satisfied just being "in the mix" for recruits, then it's time for a major cultural change. No one expects to land 5 stars consistently (if at all currently) and no one expects to land every 4 star recruit, but we should be landing some and that's not really debatable if you look at a team like DePaul that still finds a way somehow and they have been as bad as any program ever. Hell, even Western Kentucky finds a way. Time for us to find one as well.

Remember, coffee is for closers. You don't get coffee for having a customer consider your product. Let's start closing fellas!

[/quote]

perseverate
[per-sev-uh-reyt]

verb (used without object), per·sev·er·at·ed, per·sev·er·at·ing.

to repeat something insistently or redundantly:
 
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