I don't think Lavin is the answer...

[beast of the east]

It's hard not sound elitist when I say that a large number of our fans have very little knowledge of basketball and basically only count wins and losses, period.

It's a fair thing to do that, but when we played pretty miserably and beat a DePaul in overtime, many on here were elated at how well we played. In relaity we played like garbage on our home court against one of the worst teams in the Big East, who also played like garbage, but still managed to take us to OT.

In Providence we lost a very close game to a team that had won 5 of 6, and was playing in its home gym. As Providence nailed shot after shot in the stretch, we matched them basket for basket and just came up short, even without our high scorer. Against Marquette we took a team that won a share of the Big East title to overtime, and on that particular day there was no discernible talent gap between us and them depsite their lofty status and despite the fact we were down two guys.

Atg times we looked downright horrible, and others pretty damned competitive. It was clear against Georgetown and Syracuse to name a couple, that we just weren't that good. When the matchups were right, we played some really good basketball if the stars aligned.

The facts are that we didn't have enough offensive firepower, our zone defense was horrible and porous, but we have a talented group of kids. Anyone here want to bet against Obekpa or Sampson making it to the NBA? Not saying both will, but it looks like there could be aplace for both of them at the next level. Nearly all of the others in the rotation this season, except maybe #24, would have contributed well on an NCAA team. There is a lot of quality on this roster, and adding some reliable offensive players, another couple of rebounders, and a backup center could change things dramatically.

I'm not going to trash a coach for coashing an undermanned team of underclassmen. Frankly, neither should anyone else with an ounce of basketball IQ

 

[westchesterjoe]

The Villanova game was a good representation of this team's performance and the level it is at right now.

The team finished 10th in the league, ahead of only such dire programs as USF, DePaul, Rutgers,Seton Hall.That's a fact because your record says that's what it is. 8and 10 in the Conference. 16 and 15 overall with more bad losses than good wins..

Last night's game demonstrated several things that a few of the faithful don't want to acknowledge exist in this program.

Exception being Sampson this year and Harkless last year, the rest of the players are woefully overated. Let's leave Harrison out of the equation for just a moment.
Branch is not going to be the answer at PG playing against BE competition.. Ryan A blew past him and Greene at will. Sorry, Lavin playing Greene so much at the point with Branch standing around , tells me he has no confidence in Jamal's PG game. To any fan watching last night , Branch was just awful.

Greene should be a 6th or 7th man, inserted into the lineup for a quick scoring burst. Playing him 36 or so minutes a game is a guarantee to lose the game. His game of incessant dribbling, without a purpose plus throwing up prayers when he drives to the basket and, he shoots way to much for someone who can't make 40%. I dislike his game almost as much as Geno Lawrences's game.

Pointer is not offensively skilled, period the end. Another slasher, athlete with no real offensive game. He plays hard, often out of control and again, is a 7th or 8th man, coming off the bench.
Garrett, has shown in 2 years why he plays Baseball for a soon to be living. At best, a role player against BE level competition.

Sampson will be a pro. When is the question. He needs a better handle and more consistent jump shot plus could use better form on his free throws. He cannot carry a team by himself , when the rest of the cast is so flawed. And, they are flawed in most aspects of the game.

Except to those on this board who believe only they are the chosen ones to comment on the team and, argue and insult people who disagree about this team's performance.. If Roberts were Coaching this group of players, Lavin's players, the majority of posters here would be calling for his head.. In retrospect, Hardy, Kennedy, Horne, Burrell, Evans,Brownlee were much better players than this group...And, don't throw out the line about inexperience or the bilgewater about only being frosh and sophs , as if that negates the poor play of these current players.

I'm not a Roberts fan but, I'm not seeing much better things on the Court with Lavin..I'm sure I'll be lectured by you know who again . Who cares..

Pointer, Greene, Garrett, Branch are not going to appreciably improve their games , whether in year 3 or year 10! They are what they are now and, will continue to be.

Harrison? We might not know how divisive he was and may still be to this team, on and off the Court. It's a legitimate question. Sure, he's good but, not great enough to offset his liabilities.. And, even the strongest of his supporters have to agree his play deteriorated over the 2nd half of the season.

CO is a project and only time will tell if he will become a complete player and not just 1 dimensional. He has lots of work to do offensively and rebounding wise.

Lavin? I wonder what he's going to do? There are many holes in this team, shooting a major one for openers.Who can be counted on to be a 3 point threat or even, just a decent 42% fg shooter? Certainly no one currently on the roster can be expected to improve to that level, since we haven't seen it yet..

I hope Lavin, svengali that he is, can improve this team for next year because if he puts these same players on the Court again, the record will be remarkably the same.. Mediocre at best.

If Sampson leaves, subtract 3 or 4 wins from next year's season.

I fully expect those who drink kool aid to berate me for speaking plainly and expressing my opinion. If you disagree fine, don't pick apart my comments like Fun does. 1 Fun on any site is quite enough. Express your opinions and I will respect yours and not argue with you.

 

[MJDinkins]

The Villanova game was a good representation of this team's performance and the level it is at right now.

The team finished 10th in the league, ahead of only such dire programs as USF, DePaul, Rutgers,Seton Hall.That's a fact because your record says that's what it is. 8and 10 in the Conference. 16 and 15 overall with more bad losses than good wins..

Last night's game demonstrated several things that a few of the faithful don't want to acknowledge exist in this program.

Exception being Sampson this year and Harkless last year, the rest of the players are woefully overated. Let's leave Harrison out of the equation for just a moment.
Branch is not going to be the answer at PG playing against BE competition.. Ryan A blew past him and Greene at will. Sorry, Lavin playing Greene so much at the point with Branch standing around , tells me he has no confidence in Jamal's PG game. To any fan watching last night , Branch was just awful.

Greene should be a 6th or 7th man, inserted into the lineup for a quick scoring burst. Playing him 36 or so minutes a game is a guarantee to lose the game. His game of incessant dribbling, without a purpose plus throwing up prayers when he drives to the basket and, he shoots way to much for someone who can't make 40%. I dislike his game almost as much as Geno Lawrences's game.

Pointer is not offensively skilled, period the end. Another slasher, athlete with no real offensive game. He plays hard, often out of control and again, is a 7th or 8th man, coming off the bench.
Garrett, has shown in 2 years why he plays Baseball for a soon to be living. At best, a role player against BE level competition.

Sampson will be a pro. When is the question. He needs a better handle and more consistent jump shot plus could use better form on his free throws. He cannot carry a team by himself , when the rest of the cast is so flawed. And, they are flawed in most aspects of the game.

Except to those on this board who believe only they are the chosen ones to comment on the team and, argue and insult people who disagree about this team's performance.. If Roberts were Coaching this group of players, Lavin's players, the majority of posters here would be calling for his head.. In retrospect, Hardy, Kennedy, Horne, Burrell, Evans,Brownlee were much better players than this group...And, don't throw out the line about inexperience or the bilgewater about only being frosh and sophs , as if that negates the poor play of these current players.

I'm not a Roberts fan but, I'm not seeing much better things on the Court with Lavin..I'm sure I'll be lectured by you know who again . Who cares..

Pointer, Greene, Garrett, Branch are not going to appreciably improve their games , whether in year 3 or year 10! They are what they are now and, will continue to be.

Harrison? We might not know how divisive he was and may still be to this team, on and off the Court. It's a legitimate question. Sure, he's good but, not great enough to offset his liabilities.. And, even the strongest of his supporters have to agree his play deteriorated over the 2nd half of the season.

CO is a project and only time will tell if he will become a complete player and not just 1 dimensional. He has lots of work to do offensively and rebounding wise.

Lavin? I wonder what he's going to do? There are many holes in this team, shooting a major one for openers.Who can be counted on to be a 3 point threat or even, just a decent 42% fg shooter? Certainly no one currently on the roster can be expected to improve to that level, since we haven't seen it yet..

I hope Lavin, svengali that he is, can improve this team for next year because if he puts these same players on the Court again, the record will be remarkably the same.. Mediocre at best.

If Sampson leaves, subtract 3 or 4 wins from next year's season.

I fully expect those who drink kool aid to berate me for speaking plainly and expressing my opinion. If you disagree fine, don't pick apart my comments like Fun does. 1 Fun on any site is quite enough. Express your opinions and I will respect yours and not argue with you.

Lecturing; picking apart your posts like Fun; expressing opinons (which, I do) or whatever you wanna call it.... If you can't handle dialogue, then do not post. It's that simple. Like I said, if a poster complains after a team wins 5 consecutive games, then it makes one look like they have an ax to grind.

Any time you post, then you're opening up someone to respond to or challenge your post.

 

[kred]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...

In bold: No doubt about it! We certainly missed the skills of Harkless. Imagine, Harkless and Sanchez both on the floor.

That's why I could never understand why so many posters on this site were excited to see Harkless make the NBA after one season when we desperately needed him ths year to reach the next level. We are not at the level of a Kentucky or Duke who can go out and replace a great player with another high school AA. I think that this years recruiting woes are a reality check for many who believed that the staff could consistantly recruit against the likes of the Kentuckys, Dukes or even UCLAs of the world. Losing Harless was a big hit to this program.

It's not difficult to understand. We had no choice in the matter. There were a lot more fans who were excited after he declared, then when there was just speculation. No one thought we would be better without Harkless. Was Harkless, an in the flesh player in his sophomore year, more coveted by us then a Harkless who we could claim as ours in an NBA uniform. Of course.

 

[westchesterjoe]

MJD, your response, surprisingly did not mention anything about basketball.

 

[41ndone]

Don't usually listen to Francessa, but did earlier because Jay Wright was on. I was surprised by how they they both raved about Lavin and the "very young" team.

 

[MJDinkins]

MJD, your response, surprisingly did not mention anything about basketball.

I've responded to your posts before. It's a repeat of the others. But you were attempting to call me out without using my name. So, you can stop the deflection.

 

[bobre45]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

Don't play the victim.... Your posts are dismissed because it's usually filled with hyperbole and obfuscation. Not to mention, you like to pass off your wonderful imagination as facts.

Poor planning was actually made by the coach who preceded Lavin. The person who left the staff with 10 roster spots that needed to be filled in one season. If Lavin had gone out and used 4 or 5 of those scholarships on kids who couldn't contribute 'til their junior and/or senior seasons, then you'd still be complaining.

Part of why Cook left was because he didn't get along with Jarvis. If you think every player that leaves early is due to them getting a ton of minutes, then I can show you a few situations where players have left early without logging a boatload of minutes.

Sometimes it sucks to right, huh? LOL Please! Another thing: Do not use objectivity and your name in the same sentence.

So, the staff should just allow Harrison (who had been disciplined a couple of times) to continue his behavior at all costs, huh? Are you that inadequate? Just curious.

How do you know what Harrison's gradmother knows mistakes were made on both sides?

How do you know the outcome was avoidable? Like I said a week ago, I've practically stayed out of the Harrison debacle, as it'll eventually play itself out. But I recall Harrison cursing at Gift last season during our game versus West Virginia. Something happened between a WVU player and Harrison, and Harrison was livid. Gift was trying to calm him down, and he was getting ticked at Gift, started tossing out explicit language. Most folks know Gift comes off as mild-mannered, and I felt Harrison was being over-the-top in his defense that particular night. I like Harrison and his fiery spirit, but if he has some other issues that is holding back himself and the team, then the suspension probably was warranted.

Hopefully, he'll rectify the situation next season.

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG. If Ron Roberts had been retained he could have split time with Moe and cut down the minutes which were the main reason he was able to leave. You don't score 32 in half a game. I don't see why you don't have enough intellect to understand these points. Harrison's grandmother was quoted in the newspaper and on this website saying mistakes were made on both sides. Do you really think you know more than she does about the situation? I'm also sick and tired of guys who invent things about DLO. You've never attended a Saint Johns home game and are hardly in a position to dictate to guys who go to all the games. I watched the guy carefully all year and did not see anything that warranted a suspension during games. His fellow players never appeared to have a problem with him. What goes on behind closed doors is another matter and I'll bow to the coach on that. All I do know is that there is more than one way to skin a cat and the day it was announced I stated we wouldn't win another game without him. Like I said it sucks to be right and the end of the season was very disappointing as a result of the whole thing. So keep on jawflapping but try to throw in a fact or two occasionally.

 

[L J S A]

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG.

He averaged 8 apg as a result of being one of the best passers to come out of NYC in recent memory. There have been plenty of guys with no backup playing lots of minutes who never sniff that many assists.

 

[MJDinkins]

Don't play the victim.... Your posts are dismissed because it's usually filled with hyperbole and obfuscation. Not to mention, you like to pass off your wonderful imagination as facts.

Poor planning was actually made by the coach who preceded Lavin. The person who left the staff with 10 roster spots that needed to be filled in one season. If Lavin had gone out and used 4 or 5 of those scholarships on kids who couldn't contribute 'til their junior and/or senior seasons, then you'd still be complaining.

Part of why Cook left was because he didn't get along with Jarvis. If you think every player that leaves early is due to them getting a ton of minutes, then I can show you a few situations where players have left early without logging a boatload of minutes.

Sometimes it sucks to right, huh? LOL Please! Another thing: Do not use objectivity and your name in the same sentence.

So, the staff should just allow Harrison (who had been disciplined a couple of times) to continue his behavior at all costs, huh? Are you that inadequate? Just curious.

How do you know what Harrison's gradmother knows mistakes were made on both sides?

How do you know the outcome was avoidable? Like I said a week ago, I've practically stayed out of the Harrison debacle, as it'll eventually play itself out. But I recall Harrison cursing at Gift last season during our game versus West Virginia. Something happened between a WVU player and Harrison, and Harrison was livid. Gift was trying to calm him down, and he was getting ticked at Gift, started tossing out explicit language. Most folks know Gift comes off as mild-mannered, and I felt Harrison was being over-the-top in his defense that particular night. I like Harrison and his fiery spirit, but if he has some other issues that is holding back himself and the team, then the suspension probably was warranted.

Hopefully, he'll rectify the situation next season.

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG. If Ron Roberts had been retained he could have split time with Moe and cut down the minutes which were the main reason he was able to leave. You don't score 32 in half a game. I don't see why you don't have enough intellect to understand these points. Harrison's grandmother was quoted in the newspaper and on this website saying mistakes were made on both sides. Do you really think you know more than she does about the situation? I'm also sick and tired of guys who invent things about DLO. You've never attended a Saint Johns home game and are hardly in a position to dictate to guys who go to all the games. I watched the guy carefully all year and did not see anything that warranted a suspension during games. His fellow players never appeared to have a problem with him. What goes on behind closed doors is another matter and I'll bow to the coach on that. All I do know is that there is more than one way to skin a cat and the day it was announced I stated we wouldn't win another game without him. Like I said it sucks to be right and the end of the season was very disappointing as a result of the whole thing. So keep on jawflapping but try to throw in a fact or two occasionally.

I see you conveniently ignored something you brought up that was sandblasted with facts, in reference to poor roster management. Oh, well! What else should I expect from someone like you who manipulates a discussion with BS and hyperbole....

Corey Maggette averaged a little over 17 minutes per game during his freshmen season; entered the draft; and became a first round draft pick.

Daniel Orton averaged 13 minutes per game during his freshmen campaign; entered the draft; and became a first round draft pick.

I guess those players lack of playing time didn't deter them from heading off to the draft after their freshmen seasons, huh? Maybe, Ron Roberts would've taken some time away from Harkless. But we don't know that nor do we know it would've deterred him from entering the draft. Once again, you used an opinion and vehemently passed it off as a fact that he wouldn't have entered the draft because of it. By the way, when did Harkless score 32 points in a half?

Okay.... Harrison's grandmother said mistakes were made on both sides. She might've been speaking what she believed was true; she may have not wanted to place all blame on her grandson. Maybe, she was being vague. But since she said it, I'll take her word it. No problem.

What does me attending a St. John's game have to do with what I see on the floor or on the sidelines, per tv? You continue to use that argument, simpleton. You go to games all the time and still don't know jack. So, what?!

I know exactly what I saw Harrison say to Gift in a game versus West Virginia from a season ago. Just because you didn't see anything that didn't warrant a suspension doesn't mean he didn't warrant one.

Wow! You said the team wouldn't win another game when he was suspended. Great for you! What do you want an award? Most fans knew there was a chance we wouldn't win another game with Harrison gone. We played Providence and Notre Dame on the road, and Marquette at home. It's not like that was a chop-liver remaining schedule, either. You're so bright.... Yeah, right, obtuse one.

 

[MJDinkins]

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG.

He averaged 8 apg as a result of being one of the best passers to come out of NYC in recent memory. There have been plenty of guys with no backup playing lots of minutes who never sniff that many assists.

Stop, LJSA! You're making too much sense.

He'll eventually criticize Lavin because he allowed Obekpa to block too many shots.

 

[beast of the east]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

Don't play the victim.... Your posts are dismissed because it's usually filled with hyperbole and obfuscation. Not to mention, you like to pass off your wonderful imagination as facts.

Poor planning was actually made by the coach who preceded Lavin. The person who left the staff with 10 roster spots that needed to be filled in one season. If Lavin had gone out and used 4 or 5 of those scholarships on kids who couldn't contribute 'til their junior and/or senior seasons, then you'd still be complaining.

Part of why Cook left was because he didn't get along with Jarvis. If you think every player that leaves early is due to them getting a ton of minutes, then I can show you a few situations where players have left early without logging a boatload of minutes.

Sometimes it sucks to right, huh? LOL Please! Another thing: Do not use objectivity and your name in the same sentence.

So, the staff should just allow Harrison (who had been disciplined a couple of times) to continue his behavior at all costs, huh? Are you that inadequate? Just curious.

How do you know what Harrison's gradmother knows mistakes were made on both sides?

How do you know the outcome was avoidable? Like I said a week ago, I've practically stayed out of the Harrison debacle, as it'll eventually play itself out. But I recall Harrison cursing at Gift last season during our game versus West Virginia. Something happened between a WVU player and Harrison, and Harrison was livid. Gift was trying to calm him down, and he was getting ticked at Gift, started tossing out explicit language. Most folks know Gift comes off as mild-mannered, and I felt Harrison was being over-the-top in his defense that particular night. I like Harrison and his fiery spirit, but if he has some other issues that is holding back himself and the team, then the suspension probably was warranted.

Hopefully, he'll rectify the situation next season.

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG. If Ron Roberts had been retained he could have split time with Moe and cut down the minutes which were the main reason he was able to leave. You don't score 32 in half a game. I don't see why you don't have enough intellect to understand these points. Harrison's grandmother was quoted in the newspaper and on this website saying mistakes were made on both sides. Do you really think you know more than she does about the situation? I'm also sick and tired of guys who invent things about DLO. You've never attended a Saint Johns home game and are hardly in a position to dictate to guys who go to all the games. I watched the guy carefully all year and did not see anything that warranted a suspension during games. His fellow players never appeared to have a problem with him. What goes on behind closed doors is another matter and I'll bow to the coach on that. All I do know is that there is more than one way to skin a cat and the day it was announced I stated we wouldn't win another game without him. Like I said it sucks to be right and the end of the season was very disappointing as a result of the whole thing. So keep on jawflapping but try to throw in a fact or two occasionally.

This is just about your most ridiculous assertion among many. Now you have an NBA player in Harkless and you assert he should have played less so that he wouldn't have developed so he would be forced to stay??? Geez.. Call Calipari, Coach K - those idiots are producing too many one and dones by - my gosh - playing these kids. Maybe we should have them play under assumed names, change their numbers every game, and bench our best players for a couple of seasons. Maybe suspending Harrison was a ploy to keep him from jumping to the NBA.

 

[ZanMan]

I agree 100% with you Queesbridge. I know we all go thru events in our lives like Lavin, but until he shows he is in it 100% st johns is not getting their moneys worth. He acts like st johns is lucky to have him and his television name.

Please provide some examples where Coach Lavin has "acted" like this? I have never, ever heard him say a thing to even hint that he feels this way. I have never seen anything from him showing less than 100%. Examples please!

 

[Section3]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

Hard to say if Moe would have helped tonight. Ain't blamin Lavin. Who could figure #15 on Nova is Hercules compared to Branch. Lavs needs some guys to put in when regular rotation ain't in the mood. We got some help next year with Sanchez but ya can't invent a point guard and we in big trouble there. Ya can't be getting hard because Branch makes a nice pass every once in a while. Biggest spot of year and he show nothing. He 's not out of high school yesterday. Not only cant he take over game, he passes up open shots on a team that can't shoot. I trust Steve to get most stuff fixed, but PG tough to fix.

I think Harkless would've definitely helped. Harkless has a skill set that was missed by this team. IMO, Harkless would've contended with Porter for Big East POY, if he had returned.

Agree...He would have been the best player on the court last night by leaps and bounds and would have had a great impact on the game and the results...a prime example...Jakarr (and I think he will be great) drove to the hoop out of control, threw up a shot that was slammed out of bounds...Harkless would have dunked it right in the defenders and his help's face...

 

[logen]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

So you, who inundated the board about what a great player Cook was and how he was going to take the NBA by storm because of those 8 assissts and his "tude" now shouldn't have been playing? Comically comical even for you!!

 

[kranmars]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

So you, who inundated the board about what a great player Cook was and how he was going to take the NBA by storm because of those 8 assissts and his "tude" now shouldn't have been playing? Comically comical even for you!!

Shame on you Logan. You have been here long enough to know bobre has every right to contradict himself after every third word. You are Beast of the East just highlighted his latest redmen.com folly.

Of course, there certainly will be more where that came from.

 

[bobre45]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

So you, who inundated the board about what a great player Cook was and how he was going to take the NBA by storm because of those 8 assissts and his "tude" now shouldn't have been playing? Comically comical even for you!!

Shame on you Logan. You have been here long enough to know bobre has every right to contradict himself after every third word. You are Beast of the East just highlighted his latest redmen.com folly.

Of course, there certainly will be more where that came from.

For all the geniuses out there boil it down to it's unwise to play prized freshmen 35 minutes plus if you're looking to get more than one year out of them. I don't know how much clearer I can make it. Lavin's recruiting broke down and left us with six bodies two years ago. Moe got to show what he had big time and the rest is history. I'm not going to get into Cook except to say I wish he was in the league along with Bootsy, Hatten, Hardy etc. Sh** happens. This year Lavin took a risk red shirting Gift and using Sampson for big minutes. We'll see how it works out but I don't think he emerged like Moe did. If he did decide to leave it would sure put a damper on next year so these are big decisions. Back to your Mensa meetings.

 

[bobre45]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

Don't play the victim.... Your posts are dismissed because it's usually filled with hyperbole and obfuscation. Not to mention, you like to pass off your wonderful imagination as facts.

Poor planning was actually made by the coach who preceded Lavin. The person who left the staff with 10 roster spots that needed to be filled in one season. If Lavin had gone out and used 4 or 5 of those scholarships on kids who couldn't contribute 'til their junior and/or senior seasons, then you'd still be complaining.

Part of why Cook left was because he didn't get along with Jarvis. If you think every player that leaves early is due to them getting a ton of minutes, then I can show you a few situations where players have left early without logging a boatload of minutes.

Sometimes it sucks to right, huh? LOL Please! Another thing: Do not use objectivity and your name in the same sentence.

So, the staff should just allow Harrison (who had been disciplined a couple of times) to continue his behavior at all costs, huh? Are you that inadequate? Just curious.

How do you know what Harrison's gradmother knows mistakes were made on both sides?

How do you know the outcome was avoidable? Like I said a week ago, I've practically stayed out of the Harrison debacle, as it'll eventually play itself out. But I recall Harrison cursing at Gift last season during our game versus West Virginia. Something happened between a WVU player and Harrison, and Harrison was livid. Gift was trying to calm him down, and he was getting ticked at Gift, started tossing out explicit language. Most folks know Gift comes off as mild-mannered, and I felt Harrison was being over-the-top in his defense that particular night. I like Harrison and his fiery spirit, but if he has some other issues that is holding back himself and the team, then the suspension probably was warranted.

Hopefully, he'll rectify the situation next season.

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG. If Ron Roberts had been retained he could have split time with Moe and cut down the minutes which were the main reason he was able to leave. You don't score 32 in half a game. I don't see why you don't have enough intellect to understand these points. Harrison's grandmother was quoted in the newspaper and on this website saying mistakes were made on both sides. Do you really think you know more than she does about the situation? I'm also sick and tired of guys who invent things about DLO. You've never attended a Saint Johns home game and are hardly in a position to dictate to guys who go to all the games. I watched the guy carefully all year and did not see anything that warranted a suspension during games. His fellow players never appeared to have a problem with him. What goes on behind closed doors is another matter and I'll bow to the coach on that. All I do know is that there is more than one way to skin a cat and the day it was announced I stated we wouldn't win another game without him. Like I said it sucks to be right and the end of the season was very disappointing as a result of the whole thing. So keep on jawflapping but try to throw in a fact or two occasionally.

This is just about your most ridiculous assertion among many. Now you have an NBA player in Harkless and you assert he should have played less so that he wouldn't have developed so he would be forced to stay??? Geez.. Call Calipari, Coach K - those idiots are producing too many one and dones by - my gosh - playing these kids. Maybe we should have them play under assumed names, change their numbers every game, and bench our best players for a couple of seasons. Maybe suspending Harrison was a ploy to keep him from jumping to the NBA.

We had no choice but to play everyone huge minutes with six players on the court. How many teams wind up like that? Who's fault was that? And how did Calipari do this year? Using one and dones is OK but it helps if you can replace them quickly. I don't see that happening at SJU do you?

 

[tred]

I think coach Lavin is doing a good job and will get better. Next year we will make the tourney and the following year we win 24 games and make the elite 8.

 

[beast of the east]

What an idiotic post. If Moe stayed we would be a Sweet 16 team and Lavin would be a genius. There is a lack of skill on this team...let Lavin have one freaking season with a junior he had for three years.

Of course Lavin deserves more time. I'm just skeptical that he can deliver, especially in the new league (which is ironic, since it won't be as tough as the old league).

Not sure we would have been Sweet 16 (or NCAA Tournament) with Moe here. Still lack outside shooting, and would still have no point guard to give these guys the ball in the right positions.

WE win 20 games or more if MO stayed

Moe couldn't have left if he had gotten a normal freshman introduction and appropriate minutes. When you have six guys however there's little choice. Same thing happened with Omar Cook when Jarvis handed him the ball. You can get 8 apg when you play 35 minutes. This crap is nothing new for SJU and it wouldn't shock me if Sampson flew if a bird gets in his year. This is all the tragedy of poor planning and roster mismanagement. Lavin has somehow managed to attain untouchable status and a cult following here. To date any real doubts about the coach subjected posters to ridicule and insults. Sometimes it sucks to be right but all you have to do is watch objectively to see what's really going on. To me the Harrison thing was the last straw. Not because he probably didn't deserve it but because it amounted to throwing in the season for everyone who still had some hope for a decent finish. Things like that don't happen overnight and even DLos' grandma knows mistakes were made on both sides. I refuse to believe that this outcome wasn't unavoidable but with the customary silence that surrounds Lavin's program we'll never know. I'm sure if there was a way to disguise the 16 win total it would be done. I'm sure I'll be attacked for this post too but what else is new?

Don't play the victim.... Your posts are dismissed because it's usually filled with hyperbole and obfuscation. Not to mention, you like to pass off your wonderful imagination as facts.

Poor planning was actually made by the coach who preceded Lavin. The person who left the staff with 10 roster spots that needed to be filled in one season. If Lavin had gone out and used 4 or 5 of those scholarships on kids who couldn't contribute 'til their junior and/or senior seasons, then you'd still be complaining.

Part of why Cook left was because he didn't get along with Jarvis. If you think every player that leaves early is due to them getting a ton of minutes, then I can show you a few situations where players have left early without logging a boatload of minutes.

Sometimes it sucks to right, huh? LOL Please! Another thing: Do not use objectivity and your name in the same sentence.

So, the staff should just allow Harrison (who had been disciplined a couple of times) to continue his behavior at all costs, huh? Are you that inadequate? Just curious.

How do you know what Harrison's gradmother knows mistakes were made on both sides?

How do you know the outcome was avoidable? Like I said a week ago, I've practically stayed out of the Harrison debacle, as it'll eventually play itself out. But I recall Harrison cursing at Gift last season during our game versus West Virginia. Something happened between a WVU player and Harrison, and Harrison was livid. Gift was trying to calm him down, and he was getting ticked at Gift, started tossing out explicit language. Most folks know Gift comes off as mild-mannered, and I felt Harrison was being over-the-top in his defense that particular night. I like Harrison and his fiery spirit, but if he has some other issues that is holding back himself and the team, then the suspension probably was warranted.

Hopefully, he'll rectify the situation next season.

A lot of players don't like their coaches but not many of them are able to average 8 apg as a result of playing too damn many minutes for the lack of a backup PG. If Ron Roberts had been retained he could have split time with Moe and cut down the minutes which were the main reason he was able to leave. You don't score 32 in half a game. I don't see why you don't have enough intellect to understand these points. Harrison's grandmother was quoted in the newspaper and on this website saying mistakes were made on both sides. Do you really think you know more than she does about the situation? I'm also sick and tired of guys who invent things about DLO. You've never attended a Saint Johns home game and are hardly in a position to dictate to guys who go to all the games. I watched the guy carefully all year and did not see anything that warranted a suspension during games. His fellow players never appeared to have a problem with him. What goes on behind closed doors is another matter and I'll bow to the coach on that. All I do know is that there is more than one way to skin a cat and the day it was announced I stated we wouldn't win another game without him. Like I said it sucks to be right and the end of the season was very disappointing as a result of the whole thing. So keep on jawflapping but try to throw in a fact or two occasionally.

This is just about your most ridiculous assertion among many. Now you have an NBA player in Harkless and you assert he should have played less so that he wouldn't have developed so he would be forced to stay??? Geez.. Call Calipari, Coach K - those idiots are producing too many one and dones by - my gosh - playing these kids. Maybe we should have them play under assumed names, change their numbers every game, and bench our best players for a couple of seasons. Maybe suspending Harrison was a ploy to keep him from jumping to the NBA.

We had no choice but to play everyone huge minutes with six players on the court. How many teams wind up like that? Who's fault was that? And how did Calipari do this year? Using one and dones is OK but it helps if you can replace them quickly. I don't see that happening at SJU do you?

Lavin had an entire roster to fill, possibly unprecedented in the history of the Big East (or any other major conference team no beset by the plague). He offered some risky scholarships (Nurideen) and took a gamble. Polee wasn't the player Polee thought he was, and left. Why wouldn't you play your best player 35 minutes a game - this is exactly what Harrison was loggin this year with a much deeper bench (check the records). I did just hear that Lavin thought Evans had one more year of eligibility and was trying to keep him out of the NBA by limiting his playing time. I also heard LeBron James HS coach say that he regrets playing him so much and encouraging teachers to give him passing grades. He was hoping for one more year out of him before the NBA took notice.