Gtown rematch game thread...

[montyaloofah]

On the bright side, Obekpa was 2-2 from the line

 

[newsman13]

you can blame the coaches all you want. on some level you'd be right. they brought in some very athletic guys who don't have high basketball iq's.

obviously, pointer is an exception. there may be one or two other's i've missed.

bottom line is we can brick shots at our usual 30 percent rate...miss free throws...be outrebounded...etc, and still win against syracuse and louisville while losing to asheville at home and ekeing out a win against holy cross.

the game plans work...it's the players who need to continue to improve.

 

[Class of 72]

I know after we win many on the board are ready for The Dance and when we lose "Let's show Lavin the door" becomes the emotion of the moment. The bottom line is it is about the players. We got out-rebounded, yes, by 6. Both teams had 15 offensive rebounds. The difference is GT finished. Lubick scored on his offensive putbacks, we didn't. Greene and Harrison shot 5 for 25. They took almost half our shots and shot 2o%, enough said. Having said that, we are just not there yet, we are a middle of the road BE team, which I think is real, genuine progress. As fans we tend to overrate our players and think every loss is reversible if only the coach did this or that. But we we need more players, more depth, more versatility, more experience. Experience not just in years, but in chemistry, in handing down program goals, expectations, practice habits, etc. We are a young program, not necessarily a young team.
Two ancillary comments, my high school coach used to always get really pissed by after game confrontations; you want to show you're tough, knock someone down in the game. We don't have any players willing to play that physical, so spare me the after game nonsense; it means nothing. Finally, Branch's injury was a shame but part of the game, there was nothing dirty about it.
Actually, one last comment, I really wish we would stop with the "white boy" comments every time one has a good game against us. The best player ever to don an SJU uniform happened to be white the last time I looked. Were I to come on here commenting about "black" players as stereotypes (which I would never do) I could only imagine the backlash. The truth is, Jerry West, Rick Barry, Larry Bird, Chris Mullin, etc. were all white and could play with anyone. Yes, blacks dominate the sport but whites can play too. Racism works both ways and I for one am offended by the allowance of the comments on the board.

I agree with all your comments except the "racism" card you want to inject. You are much too experienced a poster to misinterpret the reference to the movie "White Men Can't Jump" with Woody Harrelson. Next time we play the Hoyas, I think Lavin will impress on our players that they should not underestimate that player......the way the street ballers underestimated Woody Harrelson in the movie. Other than you and a couple of altar boys here, I do not think anyone was looking to reference "reverse" discrimination.
I would be more worried about Marco getting the ball in open situations if you are going to reference every white player that comes to mind in your reference above. That he scored 12 points in 13 minutes was the only reason this game was not a 20+ point loss.

 

[MJDinkins]

Nobody asked me but,.....

6. I loved your being selected as our Coach and you have done a good job restoring some credibility to our program. You are a classy, likeable guy and a great ambassador for our team but, perhaps you are better suited to be the GM role you self selected last year? JT3 HAS outcoached you twice now in humiliating fashion. His team is only slightly more experienced than ours. He took a quick timeout yesterday a few minutes into the game when we opened up our only lead and made adjustments. In comparison, your timeouts yielded nothing positive on the Court.

Hmmmmmmm.... JT3 is known not to adjust too well during games. Maybe, his team executed better than our group. Have you thought that might've been the case?

You do more moaning than someone a toddler with a bellyache. Rarely, do you have something positive to say. The worst part is I've seen you consistently bitch during our winning streak. You could've stopped at "Nobody asked me."

 

[Class of 72]

On the bright side, Obekpa was 2-2 from the line

True that! LOL!
Now all he needs is a baby hook and 20 extra pounds to compete inside in D1 ball. One duck at a time.

 

[Arteurasia]

I thought that this was a great post. It seems harsh, but the points are accurate. At the very least, why were we not dribble penetrating the press yesterday, why do we have shooters shoot 2 feet inside the 3, and why was GG redshirted!! If we want to compete, we need bigger bodies: see yesterday's 1st half. And now we lost out on Jermaine Lawrence -- what's plan B? How about force Jakarr Sampson to stay another year (hopefully he does--no Moe Harkless).
I hope Marcos takes the starting position from Branch (I assume he's injured for UCONN game). That's a huge blow but so was not getting Jermaine Lawrence. Nobody ever looks for Marcos shot -- they ignore him!! There has to be a mindset of dribble-pentetrate, looking to pass, and no more just 1-1 or screen and shoot. Half-court set -work on it!!!

Other teams should be 2-3 zoning us every time because we are no good at breaking it.

 

[SJUISBACK]

Sorry about the double posts. After my first post I didn`t see it posted so I figured something happened so I posted it again. Same thing happened then I was like forget it.
Came on today and I seen them.

 

[Class of 72]

As Lav says "Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery".

Let's hope we can rebound from this loss and beat UConn.

Realize it's a waste of time but wonder what this season would have been like with Sanchez.

Very difficult to se where the wins are going to come from the rest of the way.

Our best chance lies with UConn, USF and PC and none of those are going to be a snap.

I, too wonder what this season would look like with Sanchez, but it's unfortunate that is all we can do.

How many times did we hear this from the board after losing to 'Nova and Rutgers at the beginning of the season.... "Very difficult to se where the wins are going to come from the rest of the way." Guess what? We're 6-4 in the conference now. I guess we found a way to "stumble" into 6 wins. Amazing, huh?!

I'm not sure about the extent of Branch's injury, I'm hoping he's able to make it back within 2 or 3 weeks. We need him.

Yes, six conference wins is remarkable when you consider what a horrible offensive team we are, how we shoot worse than the Lady Storm at the foul line and how we play without a center most of the game against bigger teams that outbound us (I won't mention Gift).
The soft part of the schedule is over and now, with the big boys coming to town, as our luck would have it, we lose Branch, Harrison is shooting below 40%, we are condemned to watch Greene dribble the ball for 25 seconds without passing to the shooter,etc.
Anything is possible! Syracuse lost without their big man and Sotherland, Nova went from beating 2 top 5 teams in one week to losing to Providence at home today, DePaul almost beat the Irish, etc., but without a 20 win season, there is no NCAA post-season.
I think most of us will be happy with an NIT invitation at this point.

 

[jerseyshorejohnny]

As Lav says "Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery".

Let's hope we can rebound from this loss and beat UConn.

Realize it's a waste of time but wonder what this season would have been like with Sanchez.

Very difficult to se where the wins are going to come from the rest of the way.

Our best chance lies with UConn, USF and PC and none of those are going to be a snap.

I, too wonder what this season would look like with Sanchez, but it's unfortunate that is all we can do.

How many times did we hear this from the board after losing to 'Nova and Rutgers at the beginning of the season.... "Very difficult to se where the wins are going to come from the rest of the way." Guess what? We're 6-4 in the conference now. I guess we found a way to "stumble" into 6 wins. Amazing, huh?!

I'm not sure about the extent of Branch's injury, I'm hoping he's able to make it back within 2 or 3 weeks. We need him.[/quote. As you know, we earned 4 of those wins off weak opponents. I have a difficult time believing we can win 3 more games but I would sure lie to be proven wrong. Arguably, our weakest foe is USF and they beat the Hoyas. PC may be the next weakest and they just knocked off Vanilla-Nova and we play them up at The Dunk. Have to get my mother in law to work overtime working the beads !!!

 

[Section3]

I would've pressed and sped up the game against G'town. I would've done it in increments. You can't consistently press with our bunch, as overall they have a low hoops IQ, and it probably would've led to breakdowns (a few easy buckets) and fouls.

No way. With the modiefied Princeton offense that JT3 runs, there passing would be too good for that. Would also have lead to easy buckets, IMO. His old man tried to do that against Princeton in the NCAA tournament many years ago, and nearly became the first ever 1 seed to lose to a 16.

Quite frankly, the Princeton offense is irrelevant to what they do in the backcourt. G'town really doesn't have good ballhandlers, and that is what they would have to do in the backcourt. They aren't gonna be running the Princeton offense in the backcourt. What happened nearly 25 years ago with different players doesn't have anything to do at the moment. I don't remember whole lot about that particular game, but I do recall Princeton having some fairly, decent ballhandlers.

I saw Marquette press this SAME GROUP last season, and they were wreaking havoc. The only problem I thought may have occurred was our low hoops IQ biting us in the butt by breaking down, and giving up easy baskets or committing silly fouls in the process.

By pressing them, you either make them take plenty of time getting the ball into the frontcourt, and give them less time to run their offense when and if they do get it across halfcourt or you could do better than that by creating turnovers. I would've taken my chance pressing, in hopes of speeding them up.

At minimum, you have to press, at times, to disrupt the rhytm...

Would love to have had a Lamont Middleton today...He would have banged Lubick around...Lubick plays with no reservations against us because he knows he can out-physical anyone on the team...type of guy you hate unless he is on your team

 

[Class of 72]

Nobody asked me but,.....

1. Steve Lavin gets a F grade for the Orlando Sanchez fiasco. Steve, you're suppose to be a big time Coach. How about somebody vetting recruits before hand?

2. Steve, for REDSHIRTING GG you also get a F! Unless he was injured how can you not let a senior play, especially, since he provided some beef inside? CO is not a complete player yet and has much to learn about playing basketball besides swatting away shots. Right now, that's the only dimension he provides.This is the BE Steve, not the pac 10.

3.Athletes.. Every team in the BE has them.. Building a team takes blending the skills of its players. If all of them essentially are the same skill set, you wind up with the look of our team. Poor FG shooters, awful free throw shooters and no one with a inside game. And, how about some tough D STEVE, IT'S BEEN ABSENT pretty much all year.

3.How does Gene Keady watch this team and be happy? He must have 3 double Maker's Mark before practice and games. And, a couple more at half time. The Purdue Keady would have reamed out nearly all our players during play stoppages for poor play!
4. How does a Coach keep a accurate shooter on the bench all season, Marc A., and not use him? Who cares if he has trouble defending or, isn't quick.. We need a zone buster and he's the only one you've got right now.

5.Why has Phil Greene been allowed to dribble obsessively with no penetration into the scoring area? Tv commentators were saying yesterday you need dribble penetration to break G'town's ZONE. IF Ian Eagle and Clark Kellogg saw it, why don't you? Coaching lapses like this for most of the season, make us think about the UCLA FANS BELIEF THAT YOU CAN'T COACH DURING A GAME.
And, some of us are thinking, can you Coach at all? Coaching is more than just recruiting.

6. I loved your being selected as our Coach and you have done a good job restoring some credibility to our program. You are a classy, likeable guy and a great ambassador for our team but, perhaps you are better suited to be the GM role you self selected last year? JT3 HAS outcoached you twice now in humiliating fashion. His team is only slightly more experienced than ours. He took a quick timeout yesterday a few minutes into the game when we opened up our only lead and made adjustments. In comparison, your timeouts yielded nothing positive on the Court.



6. Branch's injury. If he can't play, are we doomed to see PG run the point again? I'd rather watch overhead subway trains in motion.

Are you and me related? LOL!

 

[Section3]

Collectively, St. John's fans have to be the most mecurial in all of college basketball. I don't think this was a bad loss at all. G'town hit most of its threes from beyond NBA range. You really can't defend that. They are taller, wider, and more experienced up front. They killed us on second chance points.

Bourgault showed a lot today. He needs more minutes, and I'd like to see both him and Harrison in at the same time. Bourgault is marked at all times by the opposition pointing as he goes through zone, yelling "shooter!" You can't do that with two guys for 35 seconds.

I have to say that I'm a little fed up with Obekpa at this point. He offers nothing on the offensive end, and he's an all or nothing defender. He really should not be playing more than 15 mpg, but there really is no alternative without Sanchez. I thought Garret should have played more than Pointer tonight. He's the second best rebounder on this team and offers more offensively.

Let's hope Branch is okay, and we pretty much have to beat Uconn next! I'm not too worried.

For the most part, I agree with with you've stated.... with the exception of one thing. I know you pumped up Garrett earlier, so I figured you would be in his corner, per se'. He seems to be a better rebounder (which, we sorely lack) than Pointer, but it seems Pointer has surpassed him, if you wanna go by the last several games, in the offensive department. Lately, he hasn't shown he offers more offensively.

Agree, Pointer has eclipsed Garrett...Garrett needs to have his left hand tied behind his back until he learns to use his right...Good hustle guy and probably our best "scrapper" but limited offensively...Hoepfully, he will have the same sort of Epiphany that Dom has experienced

 

[usguard]

On the bright side, Obekpa was 2-2 from the line

How many fouls shots did we take and how many did we make?

 

[MJDinkins]

Nobody asked me but,.....

1. Steve Lavin gets a F grade for the Orlando Sanchez fiasco. Steve, you're suppose to be a big time Coach. How about somebody vetting recruits before hand?

2. Steve, for REDSHIRTING GG you also get a F! Unless he was injured how can you not let a senior play, especially, since he provided some beef inside? CO is not a complete player yet and has much to learn about playing basketball besides swatting away shots. Right now, that's the only dimension he provides.This is the BE Steve, not the pac 10.

3.Athletes.. Every team in the BE has them.. Building a team takes blending the skills of its players. If all of them essentially are the same skill set, you wind up with the look of our team. Poor FG shooters, awful free throw shooters and no one with a inside game. And, how about some tough D STEVE, IT'S BEEN ABSENT pretty much all year.

3.How does Gene Keady watch this team and be happy? He must have 3 double Maker's Mark before practice and games. And, a couple more at half time. The Purdue Keady would have reamed out nearly all our players during play stoppages for poor play!
4. How does a Coach keep a accurate shooter on the bench all season, Marc A., and not use him? Who cares if he has trouble defending or, isn't quick.. We need a zone buster and he's the only one you've got right now.

5.Why has Phil Greene been allowed to dribble obsessively with no penetration into the scoring area? Tv commentators were saying yesterday you need dribble penetration to break G'town's ZONE. IF Ian Eagle and Clark Kellogg saw it, why don't you? Coaching lapses like this for most of the season, make us think about the UCLA FANS BELIEF THAT YOU CAN'T COACH DURING A GAME.
And, some of us are thinking, can you Coach at all? Coaching is more than just recruiting.

6. I loved your being selected as our Coach and you have done a good job restoring some credibility to our program. You are a classy, likeable guy and a great ambassador for our team but, perhaps you are better suited to be the GM role you self selected last year? JT3 HAS outcoached you twice now in humiliating fashion. His team is only slightly more experienced than ours. He took a quick timeout yesterday a few minutes into the game when we opened up our only lead and made adjustments. In comparison, your timeouts yielded nothing positive on the Court.



6. Branch's injury. If he can't play, are we doomed to see PG run the point again? I'd rather watch overhead subway trains in motion.

Are you and me related? LOL!

I hope this is more tongue in cheek. I wouldn't want to claim such a thing.

 

[Jack Williams]

UConn should be a win. AT MSG. Uconn tired. They are playing in OT at home against USF. Second OT game in a row for them. They will be tired, we need to be hungry.

 

[fuchsia]

I would've pressed and sped up the game against G'town. I would've done it in increments. You can't consistently press with our bunch, as overall they have a low hoops IQ, and it probably would've led to breakdowns (a few easy buckets) and fouls.

No way. With the modiefied Princeton offense that JT3 runs, there passing would be too good for that. Would also have lead to easy buckets, IMO. His old man tried to do that against Princeton in the NCAA tournament many years ago, and nearly became the first ever 1 seed to lose to a 16.

Quite frankly, the Princeton offense is irrelevant to what they do in the backcourt. G'town really doesn't have good ballhandlers, and that is what they would have to do in the backcourt. They aren't gonna be running the Princeton offense in the backcourt. What happened nearly 25 years ago with different players doesn't have anything to do at the moment. I don't remember whole lot about that particular game, but I do recall Princeton having some fairly, decent ballhandlers.

I saw Marquette press this SAME GROUP last season, and they were wreaking havoc. The only problem I thought may have occurred was our low hoops IQ biting us in the butt by breaking down, and giving up easy baskets or committing silly fouls in the process.

By pressing them, you either make them take plenty of time getting the ball into the frontcourt, and give them less time to run their offense when and if they do get it across halfcourt or you could do better than that by creating turnovers. I would've taken my chance pressing, in hopes of speeding them up.

At minimum, you have to press, at times, to disrupt the rhytm...

Would love to have had a Lamont Middleton today...He would have banged Lubick around...Lubick plays with no reservations against us because he knows he can out-physical anyone on the team...type of guy you hate unless he is on your team

Lamont, Heck, I wanted Mel Davis or Jason Williams and have Lubick losing his lunch after about ten minutes. I remember Kapchick teams with no size that never seemed to get muscled by bigger opponents and Coach Keady's Purdue teams were superb at moving people away from where they didn't want them on both offense and defense. Let's hope we get there soon.

 

[westchesterjoe]

Nobody asked me but,.....

1. Steve Lavin gets a F grade for the Orlando Sanchez fiasco. Steve, you're suppose to be a big time Coach. How about somebody vetting recruits before hand?

2. Steve, for REDSHIRTING GG you also get a F! Unless he was injured how can you not let a senior play, especially, since he provided some beef inside? CO is not a complete player yet and has much to learn about playing basketball besides swatting away shots. Right now, that's the only dimension he provides.This is the BE Steve, not the pac 10.

3.Athletes.. Every team in the BE has them.. Building a team takes blending the skills of its players. If all of them essentially are the same skill set, you wind up with the look of our team. Poor FG shooters, awful free throw shooters and no one with a inside game. And, how about some tough D STEVE, IT'S BEEN ABSENT pretty much all year.

3.How does Gene Keady watch this team and be happy? He must have 3 double Maker's Mark before practice and games. And, a couple more at half time. The Purdue Keady would have reamed out nearly all our players during play stoppages for poor play!
4. How does a Coach keep a accurate shooter on the bench all season, Marc A., and not use him? Who cares if he has trouble defending or, isn't quick.. We need a zone buster and he's the only one you've got right now.

5.Why has Phil Greene been allowed to dribble obsessively with no penetration into the scoring area? Tv commentators were saying yesterday you need dribble penetration to break G'town's ZONE. IF Ian Eagle and Clark Kellogg saw it, why don't you? Coaching lapses like this for most of the season, make us think about the UCLA FANS BELIEF THAT YOU CAN'T COACH DURING A GAME.
And, some of us are thinking, can you Coach at all? Coaching is more than just recruiting.

6. I loved your being selected as our Coach and you have done a good job restoring some credibility to our program. You are a classy, likeable guy and a great ambassador for our team but, perhaps you are better suited to be the GM role you self selected last year? JT3 HAS outcoached you twice now in humiliating fashion. His team is only slightly more experienced than ours. He took a quick timeout yesterday a few minutes into the game when we opened up our only lead and made adjustments. In comparison, your timeouts yielded nothing positive on the Court.



6. Branch's injury. If he can't play, are we doomed to see PG run the point again? I'd rather watch overhead subway trains in motion.

Are you and me related? LOL!

Probably Twins.. Like Arnold and Danny DeVito in the movie. I graduated in 68.

 

[usguard]

Nobody asked me but,.....

6. I loved your being selected as our Coach and you have done a good job restoring some credibility to our program. You are a classy, likeable guy and a great ambassador for our team but, perhaps you are better suited to be the GM role you self selected last year? JT3 HAS outcoached you twice now in humiliating fashion. His team is only slightly more experienced than ours. He took a quick timeout yesterday a few minutes into the game when we opened up our only lead and made adjustments. In comparison, your timeouts yielded nothing positive on the Court.

Hmmmmmmm.... JT3 is known not to adjust too well during games. Maybe, his team executed better than our group. Have you thought that might've been the case?

Wondering with branch out if Marco gets at least 10-15 mins This game. feeds on confidence He needs more then 2 mins and being yanked This kid has 20 pt per game ability if in the whole game What he lacks
on d his team mates should back him Thats why CO is here just about every player we have gets beat off the dribble So lets give.him a chance Now With Lawrence going to cinci. WE better be recruiting a 6-9 or above ..enforcer with offensive talent and a guard with a handle who can shoot

 

[simplyred]

I know after we win many on the board are ready for The Dance and when we lose "Let's show Lavin the door" becomes the emotion of the moment. The bottom line is it is about the players. We got out-rebounded, yes, by 6. Both teams had 15 offensive rebounds. The difference is GT finished. Lubick scored on his offensive putbacks, we didn't. Greene and Harrison shot 5 for 25. They took almost half our shots and shot 2o%, enough said. Having said that, we are just not there yet, we are a middle of the road BE team, which I think is real, genuine progress. As fans we tend to overrate our players and think every loss is reversible if only the coach did this or that. But we we need more players, more depth, more versatility, more experience. Experience not just in years, but in chemistry, in handing down program goals, expectations, practice habits, etc. We are a young program, not necessarily a young team.
Two ancillary comments, my high school coach used to always get really pissed by after game confrontations; you want to show you're tough, knock someone down in the game. We don't have any players willing to play that physical, so spare me the after game nonsense; it means nothing. Finally, Branch's injury was a shame but part of the game, there was nothing dirty about it.
Actually, one last comment, I really wish we would stop with the "white boy" comments every time one has a good game against us. The best player ever to don an SJU uniform happened to be white the last time I looked. Were I to come on here commenting about "black" players as stereotypes (which I would never do) I could only imagine the backlash. The truth is, Jerry West, Rick Barry, Larry Bird, Chris Mullin, etc. were all white and could play with anyone. Yes, blacks dominate the sport but whites can play too. Racism works both ways and I for one am offended by the allowance of the comments on the board.

I agree with all your comments except the "racism" card you want to inject. You are much too experienced a poster to misinterpret the reference to the movie "White Men Can't Jump" with Woody Harrelson. Next time we play the Hoyas, I think Lavin will impress on our players that they should not underestimate that player......the way the street ballers underestimated Woody Harrelson in the movie. Other than you and a couple of altar boys here, I do not think anyone was looking to reference "reverse" discrimination.
I would be more worried about Marco getting the ball in open situations if you are going to reference every white player that comes to mind in your reference above. That he scored 12 points in 13 minutes was the only reason this game was not a 20+ point loss.

I'm black and I agree with 72. Why are we always referring to "white boys" beating us. A player is a player, irrespective of race. The reason basketball in the US is dominated by black kids is because, living in inner cities, we have more access to basketball courts than football and baseball fields. There are many factors, besides genetics, that cause basketball to be dominated by black players.

 

[simplyred]

I know after we win many on the board are ready for The Dance and when we lose "Let's show Lavin the door" becomes the emotion of the moment. The bottom line is it is about the players. We got out-rebounded, yes, by 6. Both teams had 15 offensive rebounds. The difference is GT finished. Lubick scored on his offensive putbacks, we didn't. Greene and Harrison shot 5 for 25. They took almost half our shots and shot 2o%, enough said. Having said that, we are just not there yet, we are a middle of the road BE team, which I think is real, genuine progress. As fans we tend to overrate our players and think every loss is reversible if only the coach did this or that. But we we need more players, more depth, more versatility, more experience. Experience not just in years, but in chemistry, in handing down program goals, expectations, practice habits, etc. We are a young program, not necessarily a young team.
Two ancillary comments, my high school coach used to always get really pissed by after game confrontations; you want to show you're tough, knock someone down in the game. We don't have any players willing to play that physical, so spare me the after game nonsense; it means nothing. Finally, Branch's injury was a shame but part of the game, there was nothing dirty about it.
Actually, one last comment, I really wish we would stop with the "white boy" comments every time one has a good game against us. The best player ever to don an SJU uniform happened to be white the last time I looked. Were I to come on here commenting about "black" players as stereotypes (which I would never do) I could only imagine the backlash. The truth is, Jerry West, Rick Barry, Larry Bird, Chris Mullin, etc. were all white and could play with anyone. Yes, blacks dominate the sport but whites can play too. Racism works both ways and I for one am offended by the allowance of the comments on the board.

I agree with all your comments except the "racism" card you want to inject. You are much too experienced a poster to misinterpret the reference to the movie "White Men Can't Jump" with Woody Harrelson. Next time we play the Hoyas, I think Lavin will impress on our players that they should not underestimate that player......the way the street ballers underestimated Woody Harrelson in the movie. Other than you and a couple of altar boys here, I do not think anyone was looking to reference "reverse" discrimination.
I would be more worried about Marco getting the ball in open situations if you are going to reference every white player that comes to mind in your reference above. That he scored 12 points in 13 minutes was the only reason this game was not a 20+ point loss.

I'm black and I agree with Logen. Why are we always referring to "white boys" beating us. A player is a player, irrespective of race. The reason basketball in the US is dominated by black kids is because, living in inner cities, we have more access to basketball courts than football and baseball fields. There are many factors, besides genetics, that cause basketball to be dominated by black players.