Fire Mullin!

This whole thread is making me feel like Burt Reynolds character in Boogie Nights, when his backers told him they were switching from film to videotape. He looked all confused and finally said "we are going around in circles here". I'm confused, too. Lavin, Norm, Mahoney- every name except Buck Freeman has come up.

I don't know if Mullin is going to end up a success here or not. He certainly doesn't look like a guy that has been waiting for this moment since he was a player. He never expressed an interest in coaching, never had his name mentioned for any openings that I can recall. His demeanor on the sidelines, and deferring to St. Jean is a source of concern, especially because of the product on the floor. The whole Slice mess is another warning sign.

As for the number of wins, some posters are ready to accept a 5 win season and chalk it up to inexperience. This year's team should be light years ahead of last year's, based on the back-court upgrade alone. And that team was in a number of close games in conference, and somehow upset Cuse. If this team doesn't win about 6 Big East games, then something is seriously amiss. In a long season, you are bound to catch 2 or 3 teams, even good ones, that come out flat, or with a star injured or fighting with his girlfriend, and beat them. This team is bound to have some lights out shooting games where build a lead and survive for a win. If this team doesn't get to that point, the season will be a major embarrassment for Mullin. If you think 2 transfers with tons of ring rust and limited success before that will change anything, then you are indeed wearing rose colored glasses.
 
As for the number of wins, some posters are ready to accept a 5 win season and chalk it up to inexperience... If you think 2 transfers with tons of ring rust and limited success before that will change anything, then you are indeed wearing rose colored glasses.
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Who said that exactly?
 
As for the number of wins, some posters are ready to accept a 5 win season and chalk it up to inexperience... If you think 2 transfers with tons of ring rust and limited success before that will change anything, then you are indeed wearing rose colored glasses.
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Who said that exactly?
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A long time poster that you may recognize. An excerpt of that post is below. I'm not ready to accept 5 wins as a sign of anything but another low point among the many low points since the real disaster in Pittsburgh.

"After the last game it is hard to find a single win on the remaining schedule and realistically we could end up with a 5 win season. I could survive that and even look to next season with some optimism considering the guys coming in but only if I saw the effort on the court."
 
As for the number of wins, some posters are ready to accept a 5 win season and chalk it up to inexperience... If you think 2 transfers with tons of ring rust and limited success before that will change anything, then you are indeed wearing rose colored glasses.
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Who said that exactly?
Click to expand...

A long time poster that you may recognize. An excerpt of that post is below. I'm not ready to accept 5 wins as a sign of anything but another low point among the many low points since the real disaster in Pittsburgh.

"After the last game it is hard to find a single win on the remaining schedule and realistically we could end up with a 5 win season. I could survive that and even look to next season with some optimism considering the guys coming in but only if I saw the effort on the court."
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yeah I hate being misquoted or taken out of context like the morons that come to my door with Bible in hand. I used to enjoy using that same Bible to show them how wrong they were all puffed up with their nonsense straw man arguments ...but I'm too old and early onset Dementia is probably at least in part due to a ridiculous amount of my life spent on redmen.com

I never said I was willing to accept 5 wins and nothing about chalking anything up to inexperience. In context the statement was a criticism and hope that we can see something in the rest of the season worthwhile, not accepting the unacceptable. Surviving as a long time fan that has been through an enormous amount of bs, is not the same as accepting.
 
As for the number of wins, some posters are ready to accept a 5 win season and chalk it up to inexperience... If you think 2 transfers with tons of ring rust and limited success before that will change anything, then you are indeed wearing rose colored glasses.
Click to expand...

Who said that exactly?
Click to expand...

A long time poster that you may recognize. An excerpt of that post is below. I'm not ready to accept 5 wins as a sign of anything but another low point among the many low points since the real disaster in Pittsburgh.

"After the last game it is hard to find a single win on the remaining schedule and realistically we could end up with a 5 win season. I could survive that and even look to next season with some optimism considering the guys coming in but only if I saw the effort on the court."
Click to expand...

yeah I hate being misquoted or taken out of context like the morons that come to my door with Bible in hand. I used to enjoy using that same Bible to show them how wrong they were all puffed up with their nonsense straw man arguments ...but I'm too old and early onset Dementia is probably at least in part due to a ridiculous amount of my life spent on redmen.com

I never said I was willing to accept 5 wins and nothing about chalking anything up to inexperience. In context the statement was a criticism and hope that we can see something in the rest of the season worthwhile, not accepting the unacceptable. Surviving as a long time fan that has been through an enormous amount of bs, is not the same as accepting.
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If tempers are getting short here, I can only imagine what is going on with the team. Since I misquoted you, which I acknowledge, I will put forth the following. A 9 win season,which will require 4 B.E. wins, is an embarrassment. Every fan should be raging mad, and the media should, and will, be asking for explanations from Mullin. He had a pass last year. The point of year 2 is that it should be significantly better than year one, especially since year one was a disaster. Maybe Mullin gets these guys to gel. Not looking good, but you never know
 
"Trust the Process", the last words of ......


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If tempers are getting short here, I can only imagine what is going on with the team. Since I misquoted you, which I acknowledge, I will put forth the following. A 9 win season,which will require 4 B.E. wins, is an embarrassment. Every fan should be raging mad, and the media should, and will, be asking for explanations from Mullin. He had a pass last year. The point of year 2 is that it should be significantly better than year one, especially since year one was a disaster. Maybe Mullin gets these guys to gel. Not looking good, but you never know
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anyone that misquotes me from here out, I will simply refer to rawdog's post early in this thread.
 
If tempers are getting short here, I can only imagine what is going on with the team. Since I misquoted you, which I acknowledge, I will put forth the following. A 9 win season,which will require 4 B.E. wins, is an embarrassment. Every fan should be raging mad, and the media should, and will, be asking for explanations from Mullin. He had a pass last year. The point of year 2 is that it should be significantly better than year one, especially since year one was a disaster. Maybe Mullin gets these guys to gel. Not looking good, but you never know
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anyone that misquotes me from here out, I will simply refer to rawdog's post early in this thread.
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Geez, hope it not me! :p

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im torn on firing Mullin. Im not happy with any results so far and some of the signs we see from Mully. I have zero complaints about Matt A. That guys has been recruiting his tail off for us. Whether they produce...thats not on him. They were all quality recruits that we were all pumped to ink. As far as the next coach ( if there is one ). We need to go with a young proven basketball IQ guy that eat sleeps and breathes hoops. I haven't researched all the names but Hurley come to my mind. Im ( like many on here ) are just so frustrated and we are starving for some success. Come on guys, turn thing thing around. Bring us back!
 
One of the things I like about Mullin is he is the anti-Lavin when it comes to post game. He addresses a lot of the exact same criticisms that are expressed here, in a direct manner. But the trusting the process stuff is getting Lavinesque and I wish he'd throw us a bone. After the last game it is hard to find a single win on the remaining schedule and realistically we could end up with a 5 win season. I could survive that and even look to next season with some optimism considering the guys coming in but only if I saw the effort on the court. Effort is really the only thing I need to root for my guys. I will root win or lose but lack of effort simply disgusts me. There are only a couple of guys in the history of SJU ball that fall into that category for me. Even when we were playing with the devastated rosters under the Norm crew and last season, we saw guys playing hard. What I find really discouraging is the complete lack of pride on defense and guys literally jogging on the court or standing still on both offense and defense.
I would Trust the Process if I saw 100% hustle on the court every second of the game and all the players diving for 50/50 and guys like Ellison were hustling for rebounds. I think I've only seen Owens and Ponds put in that kind of effort consistently and very discouraging that Ponds didn't show it consistently in the last game. Anything less than every player on the floor at any moment being 100% committed is unacceptable and if a guy is jogging or standing still, that to me is a yank him immediately moment. Let me see that and I will trust.
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Can't be more on point Paul. It's the tolerance that gets folks riled up.
 
Understand why former coaches come up all the time from a comparative standpoint, varied opinions, etc., but with Lavin isn't it more clear cut than most?

He didn't have the foggiest idea how to coach, identify player roles or combinations that worked/didn't work, or develop players or teams intra-year or from year to year. You almost have to go out of your way to not make the tournament with Harrison, Sampson, Greene, Sanchez, Pointer, Branch, Achiuwa, Jordan, and Obekpa, most of whom were Sophomores or Juniors. Think about that roster and experience level compared to what we currently have.

However he was an effective recruiter, elite early in his time here. Then for whatever reason he first started swinging for the fences with 5 stars with little/no back-up plan, and then he apparently mostly stopped working.

If he had kept recruiting the way he did his first 2.5 years, he'd probably still be here even despite the 2nd paragraph and the volatility around the program (although he's far from the only SJU coach to have been associated with that).
 
Understand why former coaches come up all the time from a comparative standpoint, varied opinions, etc., but with Lavin isn't it more clear cut than most?

He didn't have the foggiest idea how to coach, identify player roles or combinations that worked/didn't work, or develop players or teams intra-year or from year to year. You almost have to go out of your way to not make the tournament with Harrison, Sampson, Greene, Sanchez, Pointer, Branch, Achiuwa, Jordan, and Obekpa, most of whom were Sophomores or Juniors. Think about that roster and experience level compared to what we currently have.

However he was an effective recruiter, elite early in his time here. Then for whatever reason he first started swinging for the fences with 5 stars with little/no back-up plan, and then he apparently mostly stopped working.

If he had kept recruiting the way he did his first 2.5 years, he'd probably still be here even despite the 2nd paragraph and the volatility around the program (although he's far from the only SJU coach to have been associated with that).
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If he worked harder, he would have recruited deeper and more well balanced rosters, and he would still be here. His teams would have always underachieved but he likely would have had us in tourney 7-8 out of every 10 years, which would have been acceptable to most of the fan base and to the administration. But he didn't work, for reasons known only to him, so he became yet another in long line of bad coaching hires at SJU.
 
Very Impressive game. Team looked motivated and confident - credit to the coaching staff for having the kids ready for the game in a tough environment even though students were off. Still tough to go into the dome.

I heard on the broadcast they did individual film study I hope that continues.

The coaching staff was extremely engaged and I hope they keep that going for each game. They need to have a consistent approach.

Good win and happy for the program.
 
Very Impressive game. Team looked motivated and confident - credit to the coaching staff for having the kids ready for the game in a tough environment even though students were off. Still tough to go into the dome.

I heard on the broadcast they did individual film study I hope that continues.

The coaching staff was extremely engaged and I hope they keep that going for each game. They need to have a consistent approach.

Good win and happy for the program.
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Actually, if you remember my post from last week, I commented that Mullin appeared to have taken the reigns more firmly and was actively engaged with players and coaching staff totally during the course of action. I would say there is nothing different about how the coaching staff approached this win compared to the LIU loss, BUT I would also say that my earlier comments apply. Namely, that before you coach well, you have to begin to coach, and that to me, over the past few games, Mullin was clearly coaching the team. I also commented that while I was okay with St. Jean handling the clipboard, that the timeout leadership should also belong to Mullin as well. Hopefully that will happen over time, and perhaps Mullin is indeed growing in his role of coach. However, expect more than our share of lopsided losses and questionable coaching lapses as he learns.
 
I think the optics are bad when Fox zooms into our huddle and St. Jean is leading it. Hopefully that changes as he gets more comfortable.

A consistent approach is important so hopefully this is the start of something.
 
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